So what do you all want Specifically to be changed about Firebrand?

[RisenHowl.2419]

Locking utilities could work if they removed the cast time and pages from tomes, so they functioned as kits. They would need adjusted but that would be an interesting playstyle

[alain.1659]

Firebrand is not the problem at this point. Ofc it needs to tune down but also other support specs need to go up. Druid, ventari rev, tempest they all need a bump to compete with firebrand. All you need is to reduce the boonspam and let other supports have access to proper boons.

The key part is to do all these without destroying the profession altogether like anet did in every single one in the past.

[RUNICBLACK.7630]

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:Locking utilities could work if they removed the cast time and pages from tomes, so they functioned as kits. They would need adjusted but that would be an interesting playstyle

It sounds great in theory but the problem when this was done with the old guardian elites or for that matter you use the Norn elites as another example is you were left without any alternative actions , you only had what the "kit" left you with and if you absolutely had to swap out of it you now have lost access to it for a really long cool down and the difference in this case that would actually make it even worse is that at least with the old elites you would still have access to your virtues but with this you would have to obviously put the Tome into cool down. Just as a side note no "kits" function this way , they still allow access to all of your other utilities so to even consider this option you need stop thinking of them as "kits" and they would definitely need some reworking/redesign to give you any real chance of survival. Granted this is just my opinion but I really remember how worthless the old guardian elites were so from my own personal view I don't see any value in forcing this ability to become a broken wheel just to fix a problem that isn't really coming from the FB but is really coming from nerfing the other support builds to aggressively.

[RisenHowl.2419]

@RUNICBLACK.7630 said:

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:Locking utilities could work if they removed the cast time and pages from tomes, so they functioned as kits. They would need adjusted but that would be an interesting playstyle

It sounds great in theory but the problem when this was done with the old guardian elites or for that matter you use the Norn elites as another example is you were left without any alternative actions , you only had what the "kit" left you with and if you absolutely had to swap out of it you now have lost access to it for a really long cool down and the difference in this case that would actually make it even worse is that at least with the old elites you would still have access to your virtues but with this you would have to obviously put the Tome into cool down. Just as a side note no "kits" function this way , they still allow access to all of your other utilities so to even consider this option you need stop thinking of them as "kits" and they would definitely need some reworking/redesign to give you any real chance of survival. Granted this is just my opinion but I really remember how worthless the old guardian elites were so from my own personal view I don't see any value in forcing this ability to become a broken wheel just to fix a problem that isn't really coming from the FB but is really coming from nerfing the other support builds to aggressively.

Which is why I said treat it like a kit, remove the pages and cooldowns completely :>

[RUNICBLACK.7630]

Yes I saw that but that still leaves you as a one trick pony as swap into the various Tomes (Justice: all attack with no heals and no defense, Resolve: all heals and nothing else etc.. ) maybe you can function in a PvP match like that and if so you are rare individual but I don't know of many that could.

Ok wait a second are you talking about removing the cast time on the individual pages and their cool downs or remove cast time and cool downs off everything ...the pages and the tomes themselves?Hmmm if you are talking about the pages and the Tomes themselves while it sounds awesome I can already hear the torches being lit and other players grabbing the pitchforks about how over powered it is and I try to avoid being on the receiving end of mob violence so I wouldn't say that idea to loudly afterall we already a lot of FB hate going on as it is.Just saying.

[RisenHowl.2419]

@RUNICBLACK.7630 said:Yes I saw that but that still leaves you as a one trick pony as swap into the various Tomes (Justice: all attack with no heals and no defense, Resolve: all heals and nothing else etc.. ) maybe you can function in a PvP match like that and if so you are rare individual but I don't know of many that could.

Ok wait a second are you talking about removing the cast time on the individual pages and their cool downs or remove cast time and cool downs off everything ...the pages and the tomes themselves?Hmmm if you are talking about the pages and the Tomes themselves while it sounds awesome I can already hear the torches being lit and other players grabbing the pitchforks about how over powered it is and I try to avoid being on the receiving end of mob violence so I wouldn't say that idea to loudly afterall we already a lot of FB hate going on as it is.Just saying.

Just removing the cd and cast on the tomes, so you can swap into any tome at any time, maybe a 5-10s cd per tome after you leave it. That allows for counterplay and adds a tradeoff. Literally the function of kits, each skill has an individual CD but no resource mechanic.

So if you drop f2, you can't access any of the healing skills in it for 5-10s. But while it's active, you can camp it as long as you like and you lose access to your utilities while it's open.

[RUNICBLACK.7630]

Under the restrictions your describing (CD, Cast Times, and the loss of access to utilities) it could work but honestly I really don't see it happening because everybody else would view it as over powered. It would lead to some very interesting game play and counter play but unfortunately I really doubt that they would allow it to happen.As a side note just think of what it would be like facing a duo in PvP of 2 FB running this, they would really hard to beat.

[RisenHowl.2419]

@RUNICBLACK.7630 said:Under the restrictions your describing (CD, Cast Times, and the loss of access to utilities) it could work but honestly I really don't see it happening because everybody else would view it as over powered. It would lead to some very interesting game play and counter play but unfortunately I really doubt that they would allow it to happen.As a side note just think of what it would be like facing a duo in PvP of 2 FB running this, they would really hard to beat.

Loss of utilities makes a big impact, no more blind/block/stun break/stab access while healing or dpsing. Makes it easy to tunnel an fb in the wrong tome

[SkyshaAdbinderMoonshard.70]

Firebrand Specific

Revert shouts to 5 targets (dumbest change I've ever seen)Change resistance to either be 33% less condi dmg taken and/or immunity to debilitating conditionsLower the tome cooldowns (either directly or through a trait), Ideally remove cast timeMake the default pages 6 and rework the extra pages trait to something different (like lower tome cooldowns), lowering the potency but not the frequencyLower access to groupwide condi clearing (for more builds than just firebrand, increase personal clear for classes that need it)

Non-firebrand specific but topic relevant

Buff up tempest to compete (needs access to AoE stability)Lower overall damage in the gameRemove AoE caps for offensive (but not defensive/supportive) skills of all classes to discourage constant stacking (which is why firebrand/scourge etc is overpowered)

Absolutely do not

Raise cooldowns of tomes (problem is the potency, not the frequency)Increase the targets of more defensive/supportive skills to 10

[Acyk.9671]

deleted

Edited April 3, 2022 by Acyk.9671

[Lonewolf Kai.3682]

@RisenHowl.2419 said:Locking utilities could work if they removed the cast time and pages from tomes, so they functioned as kits. They would need adjusted but that would be an interesting playstyle

Like Engineer kits? I like this line of thinking! But, the kit switch still needs that 1 second cast time, only cause of the animation aesthetics. Some of the tome skills would need a CD increase though.