Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Speaking of Instant Cast CC's...


shadowpass.4236

Recommended Posts

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@DonkeyHaxor.4052 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

You're trying to be sarcastic to make a point, but Point Blank Shot is easier to avoid in melee range and eons more fair than Overcharged Shot because of the fact that it actually has a cast time, and said cast time is very noticeable. An engineer in melee range with stability i basically running a mantrta blow out in effectiveness.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

You're trying to be sarcastic to make a point, but Point Blank Shot is easier to avoid in melee range and eons more fair than Overcharged Shot because of the fact that it actually has a cast time, and said cast time is very noticeable. An engineer in melee range with stability i basically running a mantrta blow out in effectiveness.

Both of them are easy to dodge, neither of them should be changed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@DonkeyHaxor.4052 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Warriors, a mid-close leaper bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, bull's charge is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@SeikeNz.3526 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Warriors, a mid-close leaper bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, bull's charge is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

big agree

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

in other words, nerf core to nerf elite spec. cool story.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

About Engi rifle knockback i first was the same opinion about it should have more cast time. It is a cc the target cannot dodge or move freely anymore when get hit by it and this kind of cc should not be instant no matter if from range or melee. The only exceptions (aside from Daze what doesn't require a stunbreak to move freely and dodge anyway) are hybrids like Fear and Taunt because they can be removed by stunbreak OR condiremove and for that are less problematic than stun, knockback, knockdown, floating etc. when instant.But the problem is, you also cannot compare Enigs rifle knockback to Rangers bow knockback because Rangers bow knockback does not punish the Ranger like the Rifle knockback does also knockback the Engi himself. If you make rifle knockback too easy to dodge Engi is left with a skill will most likely only cc himself. Means i am not that sure anymore that giving it a longer cast time so it is also dodgeable in close range is a fair move. The animation could get a bit more visible though, even in range it is kind of hard to see sometimes, in particular with all the visual clutter around in teamfights.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

in other words, nerf core to nerf elite spec. cool story.

It doesn't matter if something is core or not. When something is op it needs nerf, no matter what traitline or skill! And the funny thing is, that the most passive, low skill ceiling/floor and op stuff you find in core defensive traitlines and not that much in elite traitlines.

Also: All traitlines correlate with each other just like the core lines did in core gw2. Stop seeing elite traitlines as something special, they are traitlines just as all others. Otherwise we get so bad ideas like adding a double trade off (the general trade off, all traitline have already: trade off by the other traitline you cannot pick instead anymore). For most (not all) classes elite specs clearly add different and active, interesting mechanics which are not op itself. For example Holo, could be a high skill ceiling spec just from its mechanics, if some Holostuff would just have longer cds and if the taken core defensive traitline would not overperform in general. What makes Holo forgiving and easy spam playstyle is not the Holomechanic itself, it is the general powercreep. And you can nerf that powercreep in dmg and sustain by nerfing the real roots without killing the Holo mechanic or make it clunky to play (tweak access to boons and boon duration, tweak dmg and cd numbers etc).

So pls i can't hear this standard propaganda about "don't nerf core lines to balance elite specs" anymore. Elite specs use 2 core lines, they all correlate, they all matter in terms of balance and performance and as said, often its not even the elite traitlines mainly overperforming, the most passive and forgiving stuff you find in the core defensive traitlines. And the few things overperforming in elites like too short cds for Holomode skills or too passive condi ambush skilldesign on Mirage or pre-nerf too short cd on Fullcounter you can balance by tweaks without killing the new and active gameplay mechanics we got with elites. Punishing them by giving them unnecessary double trade off... in particular when done so bad that you make the whole class or elite mechanic clunky, unfun and killing gameplay flow or even completely kill the spec. Only change mechanics when the mechanic itself is the problem and in that case change them to something more skillbased not something still broken but nerfed to death or clunky as hell.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@bravan.3876 said:snips

except no one ever complained about it before holo cuz its fine with scrapper and core. every class has strong stuff. should we remove teef sword 2 immob since it sets up both sword 3 dual attacks? maybe rangers knockback is contributing too much to the burst of rapid fire. how about stop whining and let every class have strong aspects to them so combat isn't decided by a 20 sided die.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said:Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

No there's a spinning wind animation before lb 4 casts. Look at this

of me dodging PBS in melee range.

Unlike ranger longbow's knockback, rifle 4 has NO animation whatsoever in melee range.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:in other words, nerf core to nerf elite spec. cool story.

If Point Blank Shot on ranger didn't have a cast time I'd have an issue with it too.

Overcharged Shot has no cast time, hard CCs, and is impossible to react to in melee range. Increasing the cast time so there's a visible animation (even 1/2 a second is okay) is perfectly fine and the weapon will be as functional and strong as it is now. Don't lie to yourself.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@"bravan.3876" said:snips

except no one ever complained about it before holo cuz its fine with scrapper and core. every class has strong stuff. should we remove teef sword 2 immob since it sets up both sword 3 dual attacks? maybe rangers knockback is contributing too much to the burst of rapid fire. how about stop whining and let every class have strong aspects to them so combat isn't decided by a 20 sided die.

Not true that no one complained before. In core/ HoT days there clearly where complains about Condikit Coreengi sustain and also about Scrapper sustain (how i love these "in old days everything was better", but forgetting that there were just as much complains about meta builds as today. Just as every problematic Mesmerbuild always needed to use either Inspiration or Chaos or even both, see Bunkerchrono, to be a problem. Warriors 100% passive defense traitline since game release another example).

Ofc the problems got worse though but elites are not the main reason for that. Most defensive traitlines are too passively (and for that mistake- and newbie friendly) designed, Anet was bad in balancing the dmg-sustain relation since game release. Traitline rework before Hot release started powercreep already (deleting traitlines nature-specific stat boni, making a lot of powerful traits baseline etc.) and lowered opportunity costs in dmg for defensive traitlines even more. The problem with low skill ceiling/floor defensive core traitlines exist since game release and it got worse duo to general power creep (incl changes in these traitlines themself making them more powerful). There is some overperforming stuff in elite specs too ofc (i mentioned some already), like too short cds on Holo skills or a still too hard hitting PoF Gazelle Ranger pet which can be tweaked but only very few elite mechanics itself are problematic, even more, the gameplay mechanics itself added by elite traitlines are in most cases not op and more important: not passive or low skill ceiling. Quite the opposite often they clearly add skill ceiling and difficulty to a class, they just need to be tweaked to remove the power creep just like in every other traitline. The only few mechanics which are problematic itself and need a rework are for example EM on Mirage which got nerfed to death so no one can use it anymore (instead reworking it into something useful but not broken), or too passive designed condi (clone) ambushes (which should get reworked, lower their dmg part and give that back to Mesmers active ways of condi application and add useful effects instead, effects the player can active work with to outplay opponents, similar to sword ambush). DE is another elite spec with a problematic mechanic, it is pretty near to be either broken or useless.

On the other side i don't see a problem that Firebrand got more skills but Anet forgot to balance them in a way that the whole ensemble of available skills is not more powerful than a whole ensemble with overall less skills available. Means most FB skills are just as powerful as if the class would have less skills available. So on classes with more skills available each single skill needs to be a bit weaker than skills on classes with lower amount of skills (or higher cds). Simple tweaks in effects and numbers are enough we don't need to delete some tomes. I see the Firebrand trade off coming deleting one or two f-skill for FB, gosh that would be so bad...

So no, most elites are overperforming because of the since game release (!) bad designed defensive core traitlines and ofc because of some power creep dmg and cd numberes in elites themself, not because of the new gameplay mechanics added by elites (with very few exceptions).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@DonkeyHaxor.4052 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

You're trying to be sarcastic to make a point, but Point Blank Shot is easier to avoid in melee range and eons more fair than Overcharged Shot because of the fact that it actually has a cast time, and said cast time is very noticeable. An engineer in melee range with stability i basically running a mantrta blow out in effectiveness.

Both of them are easy to dodge, neither of them should be changed.

If the engineer has stability and gets in melee range Overcharged shot is literally instant cast blow out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@SeikeNz.3526 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Warriors, a mid-close leaper bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, bull's charge is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

Bull's Charge isn't anywhere near as fast as Overcharged Shot. For starters the warrior does a very noticeable spin before they rush you. Massively more fair than Overcharge Shot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:it does have a travel time tho.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Holo, a melee-oriented bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, rifle 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Ranger, a mid-close ranged bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, longbow 4 is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

In sPvP the majority of fights take place in melee range on a node.

Warriors, a mid-close leaper bruiser, will usually be very close to their targets. In other words, bull's charge is effectively an instant cast, very powerful hard cc that can only be reactively dodged at longer ranges.

Bull's Charge isn't anywhere near as fast as Overcharged Shot. For starters the warrior does a very noticeable spin before they rush you. Massively more fair than Overcharge Shot.

even in melee range they "hover" next to you for split sec. giving time to react

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...