Chances of Druid pets getting a rework like Chrono did?

[Lazze.9870]

@anduriell.6280 said:

@Lazze.9870 said:

@Lalary.3561 said:But they already did, Druids are just as dead as Chronos are.

On a serious note, I believe Anet needs to undo 20% nerf on pets and add new druid trait that changes CA skills to offensive ones.Give us more options for builds.

Wouldn't do druid any good to give it offensive CA skills. It would just add to the pile of mediocrity. Mediocre healing, mediocre pets, and its new shiny toy; mediocre offensive skills.

At this point they should remove the pet from the spec all together and make druid a proper support spec. Something it can excell in. Pet should be traded in for new F skills that work similarly to a merged Soulbeast. That way you enable the druid to act as a proper support while eliminating the pet which helped it act both as a duellist/sidenoder and as a damage spec back when it was still meta. Entering the avatar procs pet swap traits. Glyphs gets proper PBAoE effects around the druid, like scrapper gyros/wells. The staff needs a rework to basically all of its skill except Ancestral Grace. Traits can be reworked accordingly.

Keep Grace of the Land as it is so the PvE crowd doesn't flip out.

Or to have some support oriented pets instead...

The druids could use the pets always in passive to make the best use of the F2. The pets gets that -20% in toughtness, power, precision, condition damage, ferocity and vitality but they could get an extra 25% in healing and concentration.

I suggested this back when they did the pet stat nerf. The trade off could be lowering offensive stats and increasing supportive ones, and then further adding pet functionalities to the spec on top of what it has.

But at this point I would rather just have the pet permanently merged when you pick druid. I have played enough firebrand and scrapper at this point to know that a druid with pet will never amount to the support capabilities those two classes can do in WvW and PvP. It will also mostly if not entirely remove the problem of druid being a capable duellist, which is one of the reasons it got so heavily nerfed to begin with.

[Revolution.5409]

Well they could make pets a Celestial Avatar or Spirits Unable to attack and subdivide them into families, bears get 3 defensive skills for example to apply protection and stability, felines get offensive abilities like applying fury and other pets could also get control skills or debuffs, the exchange on f4 would allow the use of different families and various skills so as not to lose the versatility of the profession.

I would prefer that these pets were summoned, this would not be OP in Spvp because they could not use skills if the Ranger was interrupted.

[Dante.1508]

@kharmin.7683 said:I play OPvE and druid CA is basically worthless for me. I wish that any changes would address this play style at some point.

/me shrugs

Same here Druid is atrocious, they nerfed it into the ground and now its useless.

[Thornwolf.9721]

Well this comes down to theme and their desire to stick to it, they made it all about the celestial cycle when druidism both inside and outside of the game is SOOO much more than that. Frankly what needs to be done is a complete remake of the spec, Glyphs kinda suck now and really don't feel good and its class mechanic really doesn't feel good either. Celestial avatar sucks and Id give it FOR ANYTHING ELSE; That and how they shafted our pets litterally make us clunky compared to anyone else who is on the team, and our support power pales in comparison to firebrand

1. Medicore condi/power damage
2. Medicore support
3. Medicore pets
4. Terrible utilities that really don't work in any sense within wvw and pvp (Without getting lucky.)
5. The theme litterally makes zero sense, and they could of done anything.
6. Staff as a weapon while fun needs serious work, a lot of it doesn't feel good.. (Wisp form and the line of vines is cool, the line of vines offers little however.)

They need to bring in more nature into the druid, make it about plants and animals and focus us around more than just the celestial cycle. As a practicing druid and someone who loves to play as druids in all the games I play this is by far the weakest interpretation. If they want us to have a trade-off then so be it, but so far all we have is medicore everything and lack luster mechanics.

Ideas they could go with :

1. Shapeshifting is a big portion of druidism at least depending on what you wish to achieve, whether that is turning into an animal or a plant or something else its entirely up to the person. Typically however the idea of changing shape and becoming closer to nature is something many druids aspire to, They could have us take over the bodies of our pets and play as the animal OR they could have us shape-shift into different forms when we switch pets ONTOP OF our celestial avatar.
2. They could bring in summons such as wicker creatures, whom can't be killed but offer support and cc for the druid. These creatures paired with our pet could make us a force to he reckoned with on the battlefield and could be themed in unique ways. When you go into celestial avatar they too get the appearance and your skills come from them as well, so no matter where you are in a fight your team can benefit from it.
3. They could focus on grasping roots and will-o-wisps to be used as attacks in either utiltiies or in staff skills, Druid should be a condition focused spec as bleeds, poisons and magic damage all comes to mind. The idea should be you basically out-last your foe and beat them down with your knowledge and primal power; The one time WoW got this right was when malfurion in the novels managed to do some outlandish feats. (As well the dark shore trailer where he murders a ton of horde.)
4. The elements should play a small role in your existence, perhaps not a full thing but for example imagine calling down celestial imbued winds to push enemies? Something interesting that could work in the theme of the spec.
5. Perhaps they could also work insects into the spec? I mean druidism is not limited to mammals, we have reptilian and insect focused druids as well and if you pair insects with the wicker creatures + Plant based skills it really brings the class together. But it should focus on all of what druidism is, it is the beliefe of being connected to all things and being one with it. You are one with your nature, one with your world and those in it.

! Sacredness of all life: A philosophy which deals with the sacredness and divinity of all life in which all life is equal in value. Therefore, humanity is on the same level of importance as plants and animals.! The Otherworld: A place of existence beyond our physical senses. It is a place we are supposed to go to when we die but can be visited with the help of meditation, altered states of consciousness, visualizations, chanting, hypnosis, and shamanic trances.! Reincarnation: Ancient Druidic practices taught a type of reincarnation in which the soul went to "The Otherworld" between incarnations, which could be in human or animal forms. Most modern Druids hold to this as well.! Nature: It reconnects us with nature, our ancestors, and ourselves, by "working with plants, trees, animals, stones, and ancestral stories."! Healing: It brings healing using holistic means for both body and spirit.! Journey: Life is a journey from one stage to another; birth, marriage, children, death, etc.! Potential: Developing one's potential for the development of our creative, psychic, intellectual, and intuitive abilities.! Magic: Where ideas are brought into manifestation and divination is used to predict the future.

! ^ These are all of what real life druids work around and with, parameters to consider but yet and still there is a vast array more. I suggest actually doing some research on the celts, and druidism as a whole. Im sure there are more druids who game than just myself and im sure there are plenty who would gladly feed information to A-net if they wanted to know, the fact that we have this shameless generic mess is appalling.

[alain.1659]

The problem is not the pets but the avatar mode itself. We wouldn't been searching for other places to buff if the class mechanic worked tolerably enough. CA ends before you can say Celestial Avatar Mode, and its skills are widely meh (in spvp and wvw). On top of that CA lacks boons and stability which is a must in this boon meta (or reducing the boonspam can solve it but i doubt anyone will believe that). Staff also lacks a proper role, it is neither a good support weapon, nor a good dps weapon. Its utilities are good (ancestral grace nerf was a kitten move really) but it cannot give druid what it needs. I will not even bother about druid skills.

Even if they made CA form a permanent one like beast mode of soulbeast, it would not be enough for druid to surpass the firebrand, tempest or even ventari in competitive modes.

ps: in pve, I have no opinion and no knowledge.

[anduriell.6280]

I dont understand the trade off stuff for the druid. When the druid gets into avatar, as such when activates the spec mechanic it lose all the dps, all the offensive capabilites.That should be enough trade off already.

But anyway, if the people in charge of the balance decided the pet has to be weaker because roleplay reason i guess im ok.

Im asking just to be consistent: You make the pet do less damage and in exchange the pet is tankier\better support. So druid moves from offensive pets to tanky\supportive pets instead, making the class better defined in its function.

That is a fair tradeoff not the half crap they did.

[Lazze.9870]

@"Thornwolf.9721" said:

5. The theme litterally makes zero sense, and they could of done anything.

The theme is perfectly fine and lore friendly. Changing it isn't something they should waste their time with.

The way you talk about druid isn't resembling what a druid is in Guild Wars. What WoW did, or what druid actual were in the real world is kinda irrelevant.

[Lazze.9870]

@alain.1659 said:The problem is not the pets but the avatar mode itself.

Except it is a part of the problem when access to pets is one of the reasons druid has gotten several nerfs, while at the same time being one of the reasons it's currently mediocre at everything it does (bar being a spirit bot for PvE, which is mostly core ranger anyway).

The avatar itself doesn't need that much of a rework (numbers, cast time, radius) if they actually gave the pet a role that works with what the spec is supposed to do (merged or otherwise), and gave the glyphs some meaningfull buffs to provide PBAoE support.

[Thornwolf.9721]

@Lazze.9870 said:

@"Thornwolf.9721" said:

5. The theme litterally makes zero sense, and they could of done anything.

The theme is perfectly fine and lore friendly. Changing it isn't something they should waste their time with.

Then don't waste the time trying to get them to rework it, the theme is not fine and I couldn't care less about how its "Lore" appropriate and frankly its not. In guild wars 1 all the druids we met were in a form based around plants, they never were once shown to have anything to do with the celestial cycle. And to top that off IN GUILD WARS 2 we meet druid spirits which are ALSO TREE PEOPLE and use different magic when compared to the druid spec we have.

This was an asinine theme, built with some bs themed around what I can only assume is WoW fever. They have a celestial druid too that uses the stars to kill people while being a giant turkey; It's not ok there and its not ok here. They have to change the theme slightly to fit in new mechanics and make it worth playing, its a mess right now but the theme is part of it as it doesn't in the least "Feel" like a druid.

[anduriell.6280]

@Lazze.9870 said:

@alain.1659 said:The problem is not the pets but the avatar mode itself.

Except it is a part of the problem when access to pets is one of the reasons druid has gotten several nerfs, while at the same time being one of the reasons it's currently mediocre at everything it does (bar being a spirit bot for PvE, which is mostly core ranger anyway).

The avatar itself doesn't need that much of a rework (numbers, cast time, radius) if they actually gave the pet a role that works with what the spec is supposed to do (merged or otherwise), and gave the glyphs some meaningfull buffs to provide PBAoE support.

Nah thats not the problem. IMO avatar should be reworked so all the skills are PbAoE and buff the secondary effects, because right now its only mediocre heals.

Nobody at anet has ever said pets are the reason of the nerfs or clunky mechanics. The last nerf to the pets was because of a role play reasons.

[Lazze.9870]

@Thornwolf.9721 said:

@Lazze.9870 said:

@Thornwolf.9721 said:

5. The theme litterally makes zero sense, and they could of done anything.

The theme is perfectly fine and lore friendly. Changing it isn't something they should waste their time with.

Then don't waste the time trying to get them to rework it, the theme is not fine and I couldn't care less about how its "Lore" appropriate and frankly its not. In guild wars 1 all the druids we met were in a form based around plants, they never were once shown to have anything to do with the celestial cycle. And to top that off IN GUILD WARS 2 we meet druid spirits which are ALSO TREE PEOPLE and use different magic when compared to the druid spec we have.

This was an asinine theme, built with some bs themed around what I can only assume is WoW fever. They have a celestial druid too that uses the stars to kill people while being a giant turkey; It's not ok there and its not ok here. They have to change the theme slightly to fit in new mechanics and make it worth playing, its a mess right now but the theme is part of it as it doesn't in the least "Feel" like a druid.

Great. Not only am I wasting my time on someone that is hung up about what druid is in WoW, IRL and whatnot, but I'm also talking to someone that thinks it is necessarily to scrap the entire theme of what druid is to do MECHANICAL reworks and changes.

The celestial avatar has "water healing spells". The druids in GW1 literally imbued the waters with healing magic. Sorry, but the connection is right there in front of you. Four years after the launch of HoT, I frankly don't care how deep that is (deeper than most other HoT specs, that's for sure), it doesn't matter if they want mechanic changes. They don't need a lore reason to give the spec some stability so it can work in a WvW zerg.

[Lazze.9870]

@anduriell.6280 said:

@Lazze.9870 said:

@"alain.1659" said:The problem is not the pets but the avatar mode itself.

Except it is a part of the problem when access to pets is one of the reasons druid has gotten several nerfs, while at the same time being one of the reasons it's currently mediocre at everything it does (bar being a spirit bot for PvE, which is mostly core ranger anyway).

The avatar itself doesn't need that much of a rework (numbers, cast time, radius) if they actually gave the pet a role that works with what the spec is supposed to do (merged or otherwise), and gave the glyphs some meaningfull buffs to provide PBAoE support.

Nah thats not the problem. IMO avatar should be reworked so all the skills are PbAoE and buff the secondary effects, because right now its only mediocre heals.

Nobody at anet has ever said pets are the reason of the nerfs or clunky mechanics. The last nerf to the pets was because of a role play reasons.

No, no one at Anet has ever said "reducing base healing of Lunar Impact because pet too stronk". But that isn't exactly what I have been saying either. And it is not that Anet has been reasoning their nerfs very well at all over the years for that matter either.

If druid has capable pets, it suddenly has a role that goes beyond "pure support". It can duel better and be a better sidenoder. Some of the nerfs ranger/druid has gotten over the years has been to combat this very thing, sometimes by straight up nerfing the pets as they were considered "too strong" in combination with druid (namely the BM/NM/Druid builds, which are now completely dead).

Pets in the state they were in before all the nerfs hurt druid's purity of purpose. They provided pretty much anything except support abilities. Now they're just a mediocre utility meat bag. Which is why I say scrap the meatbag, make the druid a permamerged spec and give it some useful F skills in place of the pet. Then you remove all the problems of having a pet to begin with. Traits, skills and whatnot can work similarly to a merged soulbeast. They can go as far as they want with it, perhaps utilize the archtypes they introduced with SB and give the druid different support skills depending on what the type of pet. To not tread on SB's way of merging too much, the pets can be represented as whisps or something floating around you.

Two out of three avatar skills are already PBAoE. One is ranged, but can be cast as a PBAoE skill. Skill 1 and 2 need work and skill 5 should be something instant and not channeled, but other than that, it is just as important to work on the the glyphs and staff and the support they provide. And if you want strong support skills, you can say goodbye to strong offensive pets. At least that's the trade off they should go for. Which again is why I say pets are a part of the problem.

[Thornwolf.9721]

@Lazze.9870 said:

@Thornwolf.9721 said:

@Lazze.9870 said:

@Thornwolf.9721 said:

5. The theme litterally makes zero sense, and they could of done anything.

The theme is perfectly fine and lore friendly. Changing it isn't something they should waste their time with.

Then don't waste the time trying to get them to rework it, the theme is not fine and I couldn't care less about how its "Lore" appropriate and frankly its not. In guild wars 1 all the druids we met were in a form based around plants, they never were once shown to have anything to do with the celestial cycle. And to top that off IN GUILD WARS 2 we meet druid spirits which are ALSO TREE PEOPLE and use different magic when compared to the druid spec we have.

This was an asinine theme, built with some bs themed around what I can only assume is WoW fever. They have a celestial druid too that uses the stars to kill people while being a giant turkey; It's not ok there and its not ok here. They have to change the theme slightly to fit in new mechanics and make it worth playing, its a mess right now but the theme is part of it as it doesn't in the least "Feel" like a druid.

Great. Not only am I wasting my time on someone that is hung up about what druid is in WoW, IRL and whatnot, but I'm also talking to someone that thinks it is necessarily to scrap the entire theme of what druid is to do MECHANICAL reworks and changes.

The celestial avatar has "water healing spells". The druids in GW1 literally imbued the waters with healing magic. Sorry, but the connection is right there in front of you. Four years after the launch of HoT, I frankly don't care how deep that is (deeper than most other HoT specs, that's for sure), it doesn't matter if they want mechanic changes. They don't need a lore reason to give the spec some stability so it can work in a WvW zerg.

Clearly Im dealing with someone who is too close minded to see that the theme is why they have built it the way they have. Do you honestly believe for a single shred of a second that they will not use the theme as an excuse to NOT do anything to druid? Spare me. We will agree to disagree and refrain from speaking again because clearly we are on two different wave lengths and it is impossible for us to co-exist. Im not hung up on it I was merely stating the WoW as well has a druid which also uses celestial magic, its a trope and its overdone. But thats guild wars 2 in a nut shell right? Tropes beaten to death by people who refuse to make something unique, without widdling it down to a watered down dumpster fire. (See Rev.) As for the real life thing? Yea I am hung up because no one, and I MEAN NO ONE has ever gotten it correct or even given enough care to make a druid that feels like a druid. Outside of maybe diablo 2...

This druid feels like a typical healer and druids are so much more than some healer, they can do so much more and the fact that they chose the weakest of what they could of done? Pathetic. Oh it uses water? So does wow's healing druid, and shaman. So does EVERY SINGLE NATURE BASED HEALER IN EVERY SINGLE FREAK'N GAME. Literally the #1 trope of all nature classes; They could of tied it to more than just "Durp durp, me use water with celestial stuff in it. It do aoe healing... but not good healing" because literally every other support spec in the game outweighs druid, so yea you're wasting your time because you lack vision. You lack the willpower and the knowledge to understand that A-net will refrain and push back using the theme as a deflect whenever criticism is made... as they have done countless times before. (See renegade.)

Hell ventari revenant feels more like a druid, that the druid spec.

[alain.1659]

Lets chill guys. There are several druid themes that can be implemented. But they are not. What we have in gw2 is what we will continue to have. You can discuss Ogam's or even the ancient ways of the oak tree, yet it will not help us :)

To summarize, I think druid needs 4 things;

• Celestial avatar rework. By rework I am talking about making it like a beastmode, or at least ike necro shroud. And adding some, not many, boons to it. So many good ideas have been shared in the forums on CA. Any one of them might be better than what we have now. But the theme and visuals are so good, so I would keep them intact mostly :)
• Staff. There are a lot of good ideas on staff from more experienced players so I will not list anything. But staff needs a rework also.
• Pets. Yes they are not that important for me as the other two, but you are right they need a synergy.
• Traitline. After all these changes trait reworks might not be needed yet I wanted to put it here.

Please keep in mind that I am speaking from wvw perspective mostly. I am still trying several builds to make druid acceptable in wvw, as I am in love with the thematic concept (especially the celestial visuals).

[anduriell.6280]

@alain.1659 said:Lets chill guys. There are several druid themes that can be implemented. But they are not. What we have in gw2 is what we will continue to have. You can discuss Ogam's or even the ancient ways of the oak tree, yet it will not help us :)

To summarize, I think druid needs 4 things;

• Celestial avatar rework. By rework I am talking about making it like a beastmode, or at least ike necro shroud. And adding some, not many, boons to it. So many good ideas have been shared in the forums on CA. Any one of them might be better than what we have now. But the theme and visuals are so good, so I would keep them intact mostly :)
• Staff. There are a lot of good ideas on staff from more experienced players so I will not list anything. But staff needs a rework also.
• Pets. Yes they are not that important for me as the other two, but you are right they need a synergy.
• Traitline. After all these changes trait reworks might not be needed yet I wanted to put it here.

Please keep in mind that I am speaking from wvw perspective mostly. I am still trying several builds to make druid acceptable in wvw, as I am in love with the thematic concept (especially the celestial visuals).

From a wvw perspective maybe a seraph mix with trappers runes and abusing the stealth, survival and skirmish could work. The trailblazers variant lacks any healing to it and does not damage as it totally depends on shortbow output.

As side note, also glyphs needs the clunky dual mechanic reworked. When was the last time you meant to use an avatar glyph for anything else than the healing\trait?

[alain.1659]

@anduriell.6280 said:

@alain.1659 said:Lets chill guys. There are several druid themes that can be implemented. But they are not. What we have in gw2 is what we will continue to have. You can discuss Ogam's or even the ancient ways of the oak tree, yet it will not help us :)

To summarize, I think druid needs 4 things;

• Celestial avatar rework. By rework I am talking about making it like a beastmode, or at least ike necro shroud. And adding some, not many, boons to it. So many good ideas have been shared in the forums on CA. Any one of them might be better than what we have now. But the theme and visuals are so good, so I would keep them intact mostly :)
• Staff. There are a lot of good ideas on staff from more experienced players so I will not list anything. But staff needs a rework also.
• Pets. Yes they are not that important for me as the other two, but you are right they need a synergy.
• Traitline. After all these changes trait reworks might not be needed yet I wanted to put it here.

Please keep in mind that I am speaking from wvw perspective mostly. I am still trying several builds to make druid acceptable in wvw, as I am in love with the thematic concept (especially the celestial visuals).

From a wvw perspective maybe a seraph mix with trappers runes and abusing the stealth, survival and skirmish could work. The trailblazers variant lacks any healing to it and does not damage as it totally depends on shortbow output.

As side note, also glyphs needs the clunky dual mechanic reworked. When was the last time you meant to use an avatar glyph for anything else than the healing\trait?

Actually apothecary mix really worked really well :) Abusing stealth with trapper runes was fun for 20 mins. And yes glyphs... I forgot to mention them because I really dont use them except 1-2 situations. I still dont understand why druid is nerfed to the ground and did not get a compensation at least as a healer/support. But after all these years I really doubt that things will get better fast enough. Still maybe new balance team can work something (fingers crossed).

[anduriell.6280]

@alain.1659 said:

@anduriell.6280 said:

@alain.1659 said:Lets chill guys. There are several druid themes that can be implemented. But they are not. What we have in gw2 is what we will continue to have. You can discuss Ogam's or even the ancient ways of the oak tree, yet it will not help us :)

To summarize, I think druid needs 4 things;

• Celestial avatar rework. By rework I am talking about making it like a beastmode, or at least ike necro shroud. And adding some, not many, boons to it. So many good ideas have been shared in the forums on CA. Any one of them might be better than what we have now. But the theme and visuals are so good, so I would keep them intact mostly :)
• Staff. There are a lot of good ideas on staff from more experienced players so I will not list anything. But staff needs a rework also.
• Pets. Yes they are not that important for me as the other two, but you are right they need a synergy.
• Traitline. After all these changes trait reworks might not be needed yet I wanted to put it here.

Please keep in mind that I am speaking from wvw perspective mostly. I am still trying several builds to make druid acceptable in wvw, as I am in love with the thematic concept (especially the celestial visuals).

From a wvw perspective maybe a seraph mix with trappers runes and abusing the stealth, survival and skirmish could work. The trailblazers variant lacks any healing to it and does not damage as it totally depends on shortbow output.

As side note, also glyphs needs the clunky dual mechanic reworked. When was the last time you meant to use an avatar glyph for anything else than the healing\trait?

Actually apothecary mix really worked really well :) Abusing stealth with trapper runes was fun for 20 mins. And yes glyphs... I forgot to mention them because I really dont use them except 1-2 situations. I still dont understand why druid is nerfed to the ground and did not get a compensation at least as a healer/support. But after all these years I really doubt that things will get better fast enough. Still maybe new balance team can work something (fingers crossed).

Well within the context of this game makes sense I mean Druid was developed with raids in mind but there wasn't any though put into pvp. That could explain why the class was nerfed blindly and we still have the same troll builds available from the first day.I sure your hopes the new distribution of the balance team will do better. But I would not expect any reworks.

[Ehecatl.9172]

Personally I've always felt it would've made sense for celestial avatar to replace pet swap, but in return the pet becomes a focus for the druid's healing abilities. Both being healed itself and becoming a secondary source for celestial form skills.

Pet swap skills would then be activated upon entering celestial avatar. Pets would get a strong passive healing pulse while you are in your avatar form along with their own celestial skin so that they can recover from heavy damage without the pet swap. Possibly have celestial avatar revive a downed pet as well. Pets acting as a conduit for the celestial spells would also allow the druid to support their allies from a distance through their pet or double up with the pet's heals when both are in melee for a burst of healing around the pair. Rejuvenating Tides and Natural Convergence in particular would pulse from both the pet and the druid and would overlap for a doubled effect when the pet and druid's AoE ranges overlapped. Pet could also leave a Seed of Life on their location whenever the player casts their own Seed of Life. Maybe Cosmic Rays could come down every time the pet lands an auto attack too.

This would intrinsically tie the pet to the druid in a way where the pet not only benefits from the druid's healing but also gives the druid more versatile use of their healing and allows for bursts of healing achieved only through careful positioning of the druid and their pet. It would also mean the druid loses the versatility of having two pets as a trade off. Rather than having two weaker pets (as is now) the druid would have a single pet of normal strength they can use to enhance their own druidic powers.

[AsiraasiB.7165]

Strange tread... I can zerg surf in wvw and still get kills solo(I only roam, in zerkers/muarders and firework runes). And i can hold far all match in pvp in muarders. Staff axe/war...

I dont pve so ya...

So addressing some points.. Using avatar mode is purely for condi clear, quick heals, quick cc.. And stealth... And u can hit a heavy damage on the way out.. That and combined with ur pet skills.. Like avatar 3 and smoke scale stealth, then u can 1 1 1 1 unpop avatar gain stealth again(traited)

Druid is really a fun class...Tho I use none of the utility skills that's about the only changes needed... And interaction with spirits would ld be dope