[Speculation] Spirits of the Wild and Jormag

NorthernRedStar.3054 · November 28, 2019

Spirits of the Wild are manifestations of Jormag's psyche and/or the magic they've consumed over the cycles of awakening they've lived through.

Off-note: it's been recounted that Owl was 'consumed' by Jormag. What if this process was just them recollecting all the haywire aspects of their lost magical energies.

Stephen.6312 · November 28, 2019

@"NorthernRedStar.3054" said:Spirits of the Wild are manifestations of Jormag's psyche and/or the magic they've consumed over the cycles of awakening they've lived through.
Off-note: it's been recounted that Owl was 'consumed' by Jormag. What if this process was just them recollecting all the haywire aspects of their lost magical energies.

That's a great idea! You may be right.

Such a conclusion would rewrite everything, including the human gods, who the norn consider spirits too.

I think the lore community really needs to hash out the difference between Spirits of the Wild and the human gods. (This isn't the wiki - speculation is permissible.) The reason I say this is that the norn don't have "gods" that look like them. Why? Come to think of it, aside from humankind the only other race that acknowledges a higher being that resembles themselves are the dwarves, with their "Great Dwarf".

Surely someone has creative insights into this.

Konig Des Todes.2086 · November 28, 2019

There are Spirits of the Wild that are unrelated to the Shiverpeaks, such as Otter and Gorilla. And there's also non-animal nature spirits like Mountain, Seasons, Darkness, and most importantly, Fire, which makes an appearance to be counter to Jormag's magic in S3E3. There are even nature spirits as far flung as Cantha such as Urgoz and Zhu Hanuku.

So the likelihood of the Spirits of the Wild being related to Jormag's magic is very slim, imo.

@"Stephen.6312" said:I think the lore community really needs to hash out the difference between Spirits of the Wild and the human gods. (This isn't the wiki - speculation is permissible.)

Well if the Kodan are correct then the Spirits of the Wild and other nature spirits are simply:

In the beginning, the spirits of the world were wild and untamed. In time, many took physical form: spirits of stone, spirits of water, spirits of wind, spirits of soil, spirits of plants and birds and creeping things. All things with form have spirits... as do many formless things.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Wisdom_and_Power_of_the_Kodan

Which does fall in line with what Egil Fireteller told us in GW1:

The Norn do not know gods, at least not in the way humans do. But we do revere the spirits of the animals upon whom we depend for food and shelter. There are many such spirits. Bear is the mightiest of course, but Raven, Owl, Wolf, Wurm, and Ox all have their place in the world and in our hearts. While we hunt and slay these creatures, we also praise their spirit, and thank them for their sacrifice. The animals are our brethren; their spirits guide us as we live and hunt.There are more hostile, even malicious, spirits in the world...spirits of the mountains, seasons, fire, and darkness. The animal spirits are our allies against these foes, and we thank them for their aid, singing the praises of all beasts as we hunt. This is the Norn way.https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Egil_Fireteller

Which effectively means, as my interpretation, is that spirits are mystical manifestations of aspects of the world. Anything and everything in nature has a related nature spirit. Ranger spirits are likely summoning the power of these nature spirits, just as this bear spirit is a representation of, but not the actual, Bear Spirit.

And when we add in other dialogue, such as that from the Flamebearers in Bitterfrost, and bear in mind the existence of partiality, we get that spirits do more than just represent something, they permeate it. When Owl died, all owls became weaker, and Owl wasn't the first Spirit of the Wild to die either; and (from the same source) there either is or used to be a Spirit of the Wild for every animal species (or so the norn believe).

What's interesting is that by this theory, there actually should be / have been a "Spirit of Dragon" out in the world that existed before the Elder Dragons (if such is possible). That for any species (native to Tyria), there must first exist a nature spirit of that species, and it must flourish enough for that species to become a flesh and blood thing. Thus, by this understanding, somewhere out there, there are Spirits of Hydra, Hylek (Frog?), Centaur, etc.

What distinguishes the Spirits of the Wild from the so-called "Spirits of Action" is that the latter are foreigners, and thus the rules applied to Tyrian nature spirits may not apply to the Six Gods - and vice versa, any rules that apply to the Six won't/may not apply to the Spirits of the Wild. There are theories - one which I adhere to - that the Six Gods were the human homeworld's equivalent of the Elder Dragons, thus explaining the semi-perfect overlap between the two's magical domains. But again, being of different planets, the rules that apply to one group may not apply to the other. In addition, I theorize that the Six Gods were likely a little too greedy with hoarding magic on the human homeworld without knowing the consequences (as the human homeworld was stated to be with little to no magic, low enough that humans could not use magic on that world, but high enough so that when humans came to Tyria, they believed the Six Gods created magic in Tyria rather than it being a pre-existing source).

The reason I say this is that the norn don't have "gods" that look like them. Why? Come to think of it, aside from humankind the only other race that acknowledges a higher being that resembles themselves are the dwarves, with their "Great Dwarf".

We don't really know how hylek depict Zintl or Ameyalli, or how the quaggans depict Mellaggan. I wouldn't say that the only race to have "gods that look like themselves" are dwarves and humans. On top of that, I don't see why races need gods that resemble themselves.

It should be noted that there are a lot of races who's religious views aren't entirely clear to us. Tengu, for example - they believe in the Sky Above the Sky afterlife but... what else? Do they believe in a god like kodan, or many gods like humans, or revere spirits like norn, or just revere the world or sun and personify them, like hylek and centaurs? Mursaat, harpies, pre-fall jotun, largos, Seers are also all Tyrian races with unknown faiths. Who's to say they don't have some god that they are "made in the image of"?

And I do think the Krait view their Prophet(s) as being in their image, so there's them as well as dwarves and humans.

Teratus.2859 · November 28, 2019

Was gonna comment but Konig said everything I was going to in far more detail xD

One thing of note i'd like to reference though.

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:What's interesting is that by this theory, there actually should be / have been a "Spirit of Dragon" out in the world that existed before the Elder Dragons (if such is possible).

I wonder if this Spirit of the Dragon you mention is potentially this "Mother" that Kralkatorrik spoke of..

Scraggy.3814 · November 28, 2019

@"Teratus.2859" said:I wonder if this Spirit of the Dragon you mention is potentially this "Mother" that Kralkatorrik spoke of..