Balance patch notes - 3.12

[Ruufio.1496]

I suppose the resistance change will at least be a decent buff to the tools traitline passive stunbreak. I can't see the resistance being any longer than like 2 seconds, though.

[Chaith.8256]

Bringing Utility goggles is a pretty strong self imposed nerf by itself. I think 4 seconds base resistance would be fair for a dedicated utility slot. We'll see if ArenaNet agrees tomorrow - everyone is pessimistic but I don't think there's strong evidence to speculate any duration right now.

[PeLi.5498]

Idk if is right or a bug but, the new Utlity Goggles is only active when you play Scrapper and if you dont use the Gadgeteer - Tools trait. I didnt read in the game update notes that this only works with scrapper. I thought that this will happen in all engis with or without scrapper spec

[Aetatis.5418]

@PeLi.5498 said:Idk if is right or a bug but, the new Utlity Goggles is only active when you play Scrapper and if you dont use the Gadgeteer - Tools trait. I didnt read in the game update notes that this only works with scrapper. I thought that this will happen in all engis with or without scrapper spec

works fine for me. core, scrapper and holo.edit: gadgeteer overwrites the new effect with the old one. thats true though. i assume they forgot about that trait. incoming fix... soon.

now something nobody mentioned beforehand. the reveal is now available to every engineer-spec - which isnt too bad. right? right?!

[PeLi.5498]

Now that happends for me. Maybe my game didnt update (?) And yes, fixes incoming! Lesser Utility Goggles trait is too the old use :V

[Hynax.9536]

And as expected, we lost a lot of good boons to get useless 2 seconds of resistance... Ty anet, why don't you just delete the utility already? :'(

[Chaith.8256]

Yup, I'm not sold on bringing a utility slot for 2s resistance and simple stunbreak.

A cross-profession comparison is never a perfect apples to apples. However, Core Engineer's utility slots are prime real estate. Why on god's green earth would you ever slot Utility Goggles for a simple stunbreak and 2s resistance over Elixir S... going Invulnerable for a longer period, and a way better Toolbelt skill than an AoE reveal

Utility Goggles is hilariously underpowered atm.. it'd be considered pathetic in 2012. Let alone stunbreaks that come out in 2017 with the purpose of a simple stunbreak and resistance:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Featherfoot_Grace

Stunbreak, base 5s resistance, 5 seconds of super speed for good measure. Omg

[Ruufio.1496]

Makes sense. They cant really make it anything more than 2s because 100% boon duration is a thing. 3s base would be 6s and you can trait that for a 24s cooldown. Revenant runes would be 4s resistance with 10s cooldown (or durability or that rune that gives resistance on elite) you could basically achieve permanent resistance.

The real tragedy is tools trait is unchanged.

[Hynax.9536]

@Ruufio.1496 said:Makes sense. They cant really make it anything more than 2s because 100% boon duration is a thing. 3s base would be 6s and you can trait that for a 24s cooldown. Revenant runes would be 4s resistance with 10s cooldown (or durability or that rune that gives resistance on elite) you could basically achieve permanent resistance.

The real tragedy is tools trait is unchanged.

Even if you say that, as stated by Chaith they are just giving us a very weak version of other skills that can be abused the same way with 100% boon duration so this is not an excuse.Utility Goggles deserves an improvement.

[warherox.7943]

My engineer build was already hard to play in WvW/PvP due to the massive power creep. Now there is no reason to ever play it again since they completely destroyed Utility Goggles.

[Dawdler.8521]

@"Ruufio.1496" said:Makes sense. They cant really make it anything more than 2s because 100% boon duration is a thing. 3s base would be 6s and you can trait that for a 24s cooldown. Revenant runes would be 4s resistance with 10s cooldown (or durability or that rune that gives resistance on elite) you could basically achieve permanent resistance.

The real tragedy is tools trait is unchanged.Which build would be able to do that, run 100% boon and tools? A minstrel scrapper healer without mdf?

Either way I took a quick look at the skill yesterday (my roamer do run tools so technically I could easily run gadgeteer) and was just nah this is way too weak. I got 3 skills on my bar - toolkit, elixir c and elixir s. Cant drop the toolkit, I need a kit for speed. Cant drop c, 2s of resistance is nothing when you got 10 condis over 10s+ on you from a scourge burst. Cant drop s either, need that to safe stomp or emergency invoulns.

Slotting utility goggles would be suicide. I dont meet thieves that much so a reveal would help. And I've seen deadeyes literally just restealth all the time in a capped keep, so what use in combat is a single reveal for anything but instantanous zerg reveal anyway, or popping an aegis.

At least on the purge gyro or sneak gyro I got it "for free".

[bambi.6214]

As I predicted. Utility goggles will be used before gvg engage only for the toolbelt skill and instantly swapped to different skill.Also, they made elixir R better than elite spec mechanic that requires entire trait line. Laughable.

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

Utility goggles remove blind... How useless can u get. First off we hve resistance which make us immune to blind in the first place. Then with the next hit we do we'll remove the blind anyways. And if we by chance are standing in a blinding field removign 1 blind does jack shit... Why not jsut give us back the blind immunity?

[Ruufio.1496]

Yeah I'm not saying utility goggles is a good choice. It's just better than it was - but still bad.

If utility goggles also granted 3s unblockable attacks it would be a viable choice for certain situations.

[bambi.6214]

@Ruufio.1496 said:Yeah I'm not saying utility goggles is a good choice. It's just better than it was - but still bad.

If utility goggles also granted 3s unblockable attacks it would be a viable choice for certain situations.

Oh man, with that and the old toolbelt skill SD engi would probably see a comeback

[Hynax.9536]

@Samug.6512 said:

@Ruufio.1496 said:Yeah I'm not saying utility goggles is a good choice. It's just better than it was - but still bad.

If utility goggles also granted 3s unblockable attacks it would be a viable choice for certain situations.

Oh man, with that and the old toolbelt skill SD engi would probably see a comeback

A holosmith with 3s of unblockable hits is something to worry about. :#

[Chaith.8256]

@Hynax.9536 said:A holosmith with 3s of unblockable hits is something to worry about. :#

Opportunity cost is a foreign idea for some. Do you give up Elixir S, Photon Wall? Elixir U? Hard Light Arena? All incredibly powerful utilities.

It's not really a new concept either, nobody bats an eye at Signet of Might or Nothing Can Save You, probably because any class using a utility slot purely for an unblockable window instead of a life saving or another life ending utility is quite high risk, depending on your opponent to rely on blocks, and such.

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

@Chaith.8256 said:

@Hynax.9536 said:A holosmith with 3s of unblockable hits is something to worry about. :#

Opportunity cost is a foreign idea for some. Do you give up Elixir S, Photon Wall? Elixir U? Hard Light Arena? All incredibly powerful utilities.

It's not really a new concept either, nobody bats an eye at Signet of Might or Nothing Can Save You, probably because any class using a utility slot purely for an unblockable window instead of a life saving or another life ending utility is quite high risk, depending on your opponent to rely on blocks, and such.

To me its rly weird that engis havnt gotten a skill that provides the unblockable buff yet. Especially thinking about how projectile heavy the class is compared to how much potential projectile hate there is. I imagine thats one of the reasons they went ahead and made 2 melee elite specs tho.

[Hynax.9536]

@Chaith.8256 said:

@Hynax.9536 said:A holosmith with 3s of unblockable hits is something to worry about. :#

Opportunity cost is a foreign idea for some. Do you give up Elixir S, Photon Wall? Elixir U? Hard Light Arena? All incredibly powerful utilities.

It's not really a new concept either, nobody bats an eye at Signet of Might or Nothing Can Save You, probably because any class using a utility slot purely for an unblockable window instead of a life saving or another life ending utility is quite high risk, depending on your opponent to rely on blocks, and such.

Don't get me wrong, even if Utility Goggles was like that i can't see myself using it if not through Reactive Lenses, but even so Tools is not my favourite spec and i would never give up on elixir S/U or hard ligh arena (a must have on prot holo). However, people are so sure that holosmith is in god levels that any straight improvement like this right now would bring only another wave of haters asking for nerfs, in any case my position stays that Utility Goggles deserves improvement., be it on a defensive or offensive way.

[Dediggefedde.4961]

@Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:To me its rly weird that engis havnt gotten a skill that provides the unblockable buff yet. Especially thinking about how projectile heavy the class is compared to how much potential projectile hate there is. I imagine thats one of the reasons they went ahead and made 2 melee elite specs tho.

I think it's the other way around.We have a lot of unblockable skills, that are unblockable by default. However, they do ton's of stuff, highly situational and always non-spammable.Hunters can trigger their unblockable skill and spam whatever rapidfire/smokescale skills they have at the moment.

Throw Mine can not be blocked, as long as the enemy steps on it.An unblockable invisible AoE trap that removes a boon, knocks back, is a blast finisher and does some damage sounds pretty strong. Also, the CD running while the trap is down to give gadgeteers 4 of them at the same time is pretty strong.The holo-5 was something similar. Not simply a targeted unblockable strike, but a huge AoE that knocks down, does damage, is blast and unblockable.blast gyro is an AoE empower, firefield, blast-finisher, damage launch and also unblockable.Orbital strike (core-engi mortar F5) and command (explosives, hit targets with < 50% HP) are also unblockable and blast finishers.Acid bomb (EG-4) is a leap-back, blast finisher, ticking damage and unblockable.Glue bomb , glue shot (pistol-5), box of nails , slick shoes , net wall (underwater), poison-grenade , magnet , and Prime-Light-Beam are all unblockable, too.

So, if we get a skill to make projectiles unblockable to improve pistols/grenades/mortar/static discharge against projectile hate, it will also improve melee-based power holo/scrappers further.

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

@Dediggefedde.4961 said:

@Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365 said:To me its rly weird that engis havnt gotten a skill that provides the unblockable buff yet. Especially thinking about how projectile heavy the class is compared to how much potential projectile hate there is. I imagine thats one of the reasons they went ahead and made 2 melee elite specs tho.

I think it's the other way around.We have a lot of unblockable skills, that are unblockable by default. However, they do ton's of stuff, highly situational and always non-spammable.Hunters can trigger their unblockable skill and spam whatever rapidfire/smokescale skills they have at the moment.

Throw Mine

can not be blocked, as long as the enemy steps on it.An unblockable invisible AoE trap that removes a boon, knocks back, is a blast finisher and does some damage sounds pretty strong. Also, the CD running while the trap is down to give gadgeteers 4 of them at the same time is pretty strong.

The holo-5

was something similar. Not simply a targeted unblockable strike, but a huge AoE that knocks down, does damage, is blast and unblockable.

blast gyro

is an AoE empower, firefield, blast-finisher, damage launch and also unblockable.

Orbital strike

(core-engi mortar F5) and

command

(explosives, hit targets with < 50% HP) are also unblockable and blast finishers.

Acid bomb

(EG-4) is a leap-back, blast finisher, ticking damage and unblockable.

Glue bomb

,

glue shot

(pistol-5),

box of nails

,

slick shoes

,

net wall

(underwater),

poison-grenade

,

magnet

, and

Prime-Light-Beam

are all unblockable, too.

So, if we get a skill to make projectiles unblockable to improve pistols/grenades/mortar/static discharge against projectile hate, it will also improve melee-based power holo/scrappers further.

I guess thats true. Although im pretty sure holo 5 is not unblockable. In any case, I dont know how many of these skills are used in competitive game modes especially the ones tied to kits such as grenade kit, e-gun or toolkit. Trying to clam as many unblockable skills into ur build as possible prob wont result in a high performing build. They are spread among several skill options and engineer isnt the only prof whith several skills that are unblockable. Personally I dont think making a list of the pool to choose form is a good way to determine if having an 'unblockable buff' skill would be too strong.That said I can think of several combos that would make engineer pretty strong with such a skill.

edit: poor wording: having a list of the pool is very helpful, but I dont think the sheer number of unblockable skills make a good argument for not adding an unblockable buff skill. All the skills do different things after all.

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

double post How do I delete?

[santenal.1054]

I have to start using prepper sigils to get the maximum performance out of my build?! But I'm way too lazy to use those :'(

[Dawdler.8521]

@"santenal.1054" said:I have to start using prepper sigils to get the maximum performance out of my build?! But I'm way too lazy to use those :'(Its funny... I've found that I've become highly ineffective at sigil stacking. Why? Because I use weapon swap to exit kits. With 2x p/p there's no accidental melee/ranged swaps sure, but I still end up with the "wrong" pistols half the time because I was kitswapping on engage.

[santenal.1054]

@"HnRkLnXqZ.1870" said:Grenadier "Lesser Grenade Barrage on your location when using a healing skill."Thoughts: promoting unattended farming, unintentionally entering combat state , unintentionally suicide due to retaliation/projectile reflects upon using a heal-skill on low health.

Also losing stealth when using heal skill near enemies.WHAHAHA ... such a horrible addition to the trait.

They Just have to make the velocity increase and explosion radius baseline (like me and others have been telling them for years now) and get rid of the silly/horrible effect.