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Soulbeast is quite OP ( wvw balance )


bigo.9037

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I'm kinda starting to dislike soulbeast because of how OP and easy it is to get good results with (wvw roaming) despite the fact that I've been maining the class for years.Obviously this isn't only soulbeast, it's the game balance as a whole. Too much sustain, too much dmg. Health as a ranger is hardly relevant as long as you don't get low enough to risk getting downed in a single hit. Always have heals, blocks, evades, dmg immunity, stealth, stunbreakers, stab, condi cleanse or gap openers available.

For a while now I've felt as though I'm good at playing ranger/soulbeast (and druid before pof), and I do still believe i am ( never afraid of fighting other soulbeasts, always assuming I'm going to win a 1v1) but recently I've started to occasionally question whether I'm actually that good or I'm just being carried by my build. It just feels so easy to get really good results. Like it's not supposed to be THAT easy. The only time I ever get in trouble is if there's 3+ people. If not, I can sustain/get away unless they are thief or mesmers.

The low cooldowns on everything is just making it so spammable. This has been an issue for a while obviously.Used block at the wrong time? Np just swoop into smokefield, lb#4, #2,#3 and now it's ready again. Used heal even tho your hp was 100%, just for boons? Np. Use the same combo I just mentioned and heal will be ready again except you also have a 3s block as well unless you also screwing that up.

See what I mean? You can screw up so much and still have LOTS of options to come back on top. There's hardly any punishment for mistakes. I didn't even mention merge skills that can improve sustain like smoke assault evade, siamoth dmg immunity.

Obviously, fighting a really good holo or warrior will limit your options. But even then, everything is too spammable.About 2 months ago I dueled a guildmate holo who is currently top 15 on EU leaderboard. Obviously I couldn't win. But the amount of sustain my build has despite not having all too much toughness or healing power is just crazy. Holo is ofc also spammy in the same way but.. the point of this post is that we as ranger mains need to acknowledge our soulbeasts are pretty busted and spammy.Keep in mind, this is mostly an issue in wvw balance.

TLDR, SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.

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I used to think this but people kept telling me that soulbeast is the least competitive class in the game, I have a lot of nerve coming into "another classes" forum, sounds like a L2P issue, and I must have been killed by a soulbeast.

I am sure a bunch of people will be here to inform you of these things soon.

In all seriousness though, the sustain is pretty OP in my opinion as well. Boon beast specifically is too durable.The constant 25 might and constant protection basically allows soulbeasts to be protect holos with pets.I tried condi boonbeast and hybrid boonbeast for awhile to see how they would do. Condi boonbeast is very strong as well (hybrid didn't do as great).The stealth + 1200 range movement skills + boon spam is pretty insane. Cal Cohen mentioned some pretty big changes needed to balance competitive gameplay, hopefully those come.

I think that nerfing the ability to self boon spam would be overall good for all classes (Especially SB and holo).

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@"knite.1542" said:I used to think this but people kept telling me that soulbeast is the least competitive class in the game, I have a lot of nerve coming into "another classes" forum, sounds like a L2P issue, and I must have been killed by a soulbeast.

I am sure a bunch of people will be here to inform you of these things soon.

In all seriousness though, the sustain is pretty OP in my opinion as well. Boon beast specifically is too durable.The constant 25 might and constant protection basically allows soulbeasts to be protect holos with pets.I tried condi boonbeast and hybrid boonbeast for awhile to see how they would do. Condi boonbeast is very strong as well (hybrid didn't do as great).The stealth + 1200 range movement skills + boon spam is pretty insane. Cal Cohen mentioned some pretty big changes needed to balance competitive gameplay, hopefully those come.

I think that nerfing the ability to self boon spam would be overall good for all classes (Especially SB and holo).

Yea I'm hoping that will be good and sooner rather than later.The problem is that all these sustain boons, rotations etc. Scale WAYY too well with toughness stats. Which is exactly why healing needs to be toned down significantly.As I've mentioned in other threads the reason soulbeast isn't seen as competitive ( ik it's not the best in spvp, but I'm talking about wvw roaming here) is because word of mouth. But most people don't get the opportunity to fight really good rangers tbh. Obviously I agree soulbeast is a little bit too niche right now as it doesn't fill any roles in any game mode other than wvw roaming but still.

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It's only due to the pet merging with smokescale or arctodus, really. If you compare soulbeast to other classes, that's the largest difference besides the damage increase from leader of the pack used with One Wolf Pack or oppressive superiority. +200 power and +100 ferocity is a large boost along with the additional +150 power and +300 ferocity from beast mastery.

WvW roaming is a different animal because you can actually spike things down with a soulbeast.

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@Infusion.7149 said:It's only due to the pet merging with smokescale or arctodus, really. If you compare soulbeast to other classes, that's the largest difference besides the damage increase from leader of the pack used with One Wolf Pack or oppressive superiority. +200 power and +100 ferocity is a large boost along with the additional +150 power and +300 ferocity from beast mastery.

WvW roaming is a different animal because you can actually spike things down with a soulbeast.

This is one reason why I've suggested that part of the 'drawback' for Soulbeast be to include a stat penalty for being in Beast Mode, much like the -300 toughness for being in Berserk Mode. That would go a long way to balancing Soulbeast. I'd even let the stat penalty be relevant to the pet archetype merged with.

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People underestimate Ranger in general, since its the shaggy dog class.

For example, there's certain builds that play very similar to the current Mesmer meme build, where you can kill someone from a mount all the way to defeated in a single volley if they can't react in time with a reflect.

The problem is, while this was the purpose of the Ranger, it becomes kind of broken on Soulbeast because then you can run (almost) all the same builds except also take sustain with it, and in some cases even support allies while losing very little. But this isn't a problem with SB in particular, but the game as a whole; everyone has become Superman, now complete with capes and flight.

For years I've played every class and subclass at max level and fully geared, and SB is actually one of the weaker ones I think.

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@"bigo.9037" said:I'm kinda starting to dislike soulbeast because of how OP and easy it is to get good results with (wvw roaming) despite the fact that I've been maining the class for years.Obviously this isn't only soulbeast, it's the game balance as a whole. Too much sustain, too much dmg. Health as a ranger is hardly relevant as long as you don't get low enough to risk getting downed in a single hit. Always have heals, blocks, evades, dmg immunity, stealth, stunbreakers, stab, condi cleanse or gap openers available.

For a while now I've felt as though I'm good at playing ranger/soulbeast (and druid before pof), and I do still believe i am ( never afraid of fighting other soulbeasts, always assuming I'm going to win a 1v1) but recently I've started to occasionally question whether I'm actually that good or I'm just being carried by my build. It just feels so easy to get really good results. Like it's not supposed to be THAT easy. The only time I ever get in trouble is if there's 3+ people. If not, I can sustain/get away unless they are thief or mesmers.

The low cooldowns on everything is just making it so spammable. This has been an issue for a while obviously.Used block at the wrong time? Np just swoop into smokefield, lb#4, #2,#3 and now it's ready again. Used heal even tho your hp was 100%, just for boons? Np. Use the same combo I just mentioned and heal will be ready again except you also have a 3s block as well unless you also screwing that up.

See what I mean? You can screw up so much and still have LOTS of options to come back on top. There's hardly any punishment for mistakes. I didn't even mention merge skills that can improve sustain like smoke assault evade, siamoth dmg immunity.

Obviously, fighting a really good holo or warrior will limit your options. But even then, everything is too spammable.About 2 months ago I dueled a guildmate holo who is currently top 15 on EU leaderboard. Obviously I couldn't win. But the amount of sustain my build has despite not having all too much toughness or healing power is just crazy. Holo is ofc also spammy in the same way but.. the point of this post is that we as ranger mains need to acknowledge our soulbeasts are pretty busted and spammy.Keep in mind, this is mostly an issue in wvw balance.

TLDR, SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.

Title- “wvw”

Post complaint- “duel”

Nobody cares about your duels in wvw, stick to 1v1 complaints for spvp. And sometimes there are better players using a profession, and sometimes not.

The devs will be blowing up professions and tackling major issues across the board, so participate in those threads instead of making another qq Ranger duel thread for wvw play no less. There is a lot that’s “busted and spammy” in the game, but I don’t see you posting in all the other professions sections...

Here I’ll help you... Post your profession complaints here...

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/categories/professions

And read these and post there about professions...

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/90774/lets-talk-about-wvw-balance

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/90773/lets-talk-about-pvp-balance

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/93817/big-update-news

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@Swagger.1459 said:

@"bigo.9037" said:I'm kinda starting to dislike soulbeast because of how OP and easy it is to get good results with (wvw roaming) despite the fact that I've been maining the class for years.Obviously this isn't only soulbeast, it's the game balance as a whole. Too much sustain, too much dmg. Health as a ranger is hardly relevant as long as you don't get low enough to risk getting downed in a single hit. Always have heals, blocks, evades, dmg immunity, stealth, stunbreakers, stab, condi cleanse or gap openers available.

For a while now I've felt as though I'm good at playing ranger/soulbeast (and druid before pof), and I do still believe i am ( never afraid of fighting other soulbeasts, always assuming I'm going to win a 1v1) but recently I've started to occasionally question whether I'm actually that good or I'm just being carried by my build. It just feels so easy to get really good results. Like it's not supposed to be THAT easy. The only time I ever get in trouble is if there's 3+ people. If not, I can sustain/get away unless they are thief or mesmers.

The low cooldowns on everything is just making it so spammable. This has been an issue for a while obviously.Used block at the wrong time? Np just swoop into smokefield, lb#4, #2,#3 and now it's ready again. Used heal even tho your hp was 100%, just for boons? Np. Use the same combo I just mentioned and heal will be ready again except you also have a 3s block as well unless you also screwing that up.

See what I mean? You can screw up so much and still have LOTS of options to come back on top. There's hardly any punishment for mistakes. I didn't even mention merge skills that can improve sustain like smoke assault evade, siamoth dmg immunity.

Obviously, fighting a really good holo or warrior will limit your options. But even then, everything is too spammable.About 2 months ago I dueled a guildmate holo who is currently top 15 on EU leaderboard. Obviously I couldn't win. But the amount of sustain my build has despite not having all too much toughness or healing power is just crazy. Holo is ofc also spammy in the same way but.. the point of this post is that we as ranger mains need to acknowledge our soulbeasts are pretty busted and spammy.Keep in mind, this is mostly an issue in wvw balance.

TLDR, SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.

Title- “wvw”

Post complaint- “duel”

Nobody cares about your duels in wvw, stick to 1v1 complaints for spvp. And sometimes there are better players using a profession, and sometimes not.

The devs will be blowing up professions and tackling major issues across the board, so participate in those threads instead of making another qq Ranger duel thread for wvw play no less. There is a lot that’s “busted and spammy” in the game, but I don’t see you posting in all the other professions sections...

Here I’ll help you... Post your profession complaints here...

And read these and post there about professions...

I obviously stated that I know the other specs are spammy too, it's just that I don't hear a lot of people in ranger community or ranger players acknowledge that soulbeast actually needs to be toned down. The only people who agree with me are in my small guild. So I decided to post here.Also it's not duels per se it's nearly any small fight.

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@bigo.9037 said:

@bigo.9037 said:I'm kinda starting to dislike soulbeast because of how OP and easy it is to get good results with (wvw roaming) despite the fact that I've been maining the class for years.Obviously this isn't only soulbeast, it's the game balance as a whole. Too much sustain, too much dmg. Health as a ranger is hardly relevant as long as you don't get low enough to risk getting downed in a single hit. Always have heals, blocks, evades, dmg immunity, stealth, stunbreakers, stab, condi cleanse or gap openers available.

For a while now I've felt as though I'm good at playing ranger/soulbeast (and druid before pof), and I do still believe i am ( never afraid of fighting other soulbeasts, always assuming I'm going to win a 1v1) but recently I've started to occasionally question whether I'm actually that good or I'm just being carried by my build. It just feels so easy to get really good results. Like it's not supposed to be THAT easy. The only time I ever get in trouble is if there's 3+ people. If not, I can sustain/get away unless they are thief or mesmers.

The low cooldowns on everything is just making it so spammable. This has been an issue for a while obviously.Used block at the wrong time? Np just swoop into smokefield, lb#4, #2,#3 and now it's ready again. Used heal even tho your hp was 100%, just for boons? Np. Use the same combo I just mentioned and heal will be ready again except you also have a 3s block as well unless you also screwing that up.

See what I mean? You can screw up so much and still have LOTS of options to come back on top. There's hardly any punishment for mistakes. I didn't even mention merge skills that can improve sustain like smoke assault evade, siamoth dmg immunity.

Obviously, fighting a really good holo or warrior will limit your options. But even then, everything is too spammable.About 2 months ago I dueled a guildmate holo who is currently top 15 on EU leaderboard. Obviously I couldn't win. But the amount of sustain my build has despite not having all too much toughness or healing power is just crazy. Holo is ofc also spammy in the same way but.. the point of this post is that we as ranger mains need to acknowledge our soulbeasts are pretty busted and spammy.Keep in mind, this is mostly an issue in wvw balance.

TLDR, SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.

Title- “wvw”

Post complaint- “duel”

Nobody cares about your duels in wvw, stick to 1v1 complaints for spvp. And sometimes there are better players using a profession, and sometimes not.

The devs will be blowing up professions and tackling major issues across the board, so participate in those threads instead of making another qq Ranger duel thread for wvw play no less. There is a lot that’s “busted and spammy” in the game, but I don’t see you posting in all the other professions sections...

Here I’ll help you... Post your profession complaints here...

And read these and post there about professions...

I obviously stated that I know the other specs are spammy too, it's just that I don't hear a lot of people in ranger community or ranger players acknowledge that soulbeast actually needs to be toned down. The only people who agree with me are in my small guild. So I decided to post here.Also it's not duels per se it's nearly any small fight.

Then post your duel complaints about professions in the profession section. And make sure to include what you'd buff on classes to make every spec, on every profession, better for wvw group play, bc there is more to wvw, and the game, than duels.

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@Swagger.1459 said:

@bigo.9037 said:I'm kinda starting to dislike soulbeast because of how OP and easy it is to get good results with (wvw roaming) despite the fact that I've been maining the class for years.Obviously this isn't only soulbeast, it's the game balance as a whole. Too much sustain, too much dmg. Health as a ranger is hardly relevant as long as you don't get low enough to risk getting downed in a single hit. Always have heals, blocks, evades, dmg immunity, stealth, stunbreakers, stab, condi cleanse or gap openers available.

For a while now I've felt as though I'm good at playing ranger/soulbeast (and druid before pof), and I do still believe i am ( never afraid of fighting other soulbeasts, always assuming I'm going to win a 1v1) but recently I've started to occasionally question whether I'm actually that good or I'm just being carried by my build. It just feels so easy to get really good results. Like it's not supposed to be THAT easy. The only time I ever get in trouble is if there's 3+ people. If not, I can sustain/get away unless they are thief or mesmers.

The low cooldowns on everything is just making it so spammable. This has been an issue for a while obviously.Used block at the wrong time? Np just swoop into smokefield, lb#4, #2,#3 and now it's ready again. Used heal even tho your hp was 100%, just for boons? Np. Use the same combo I just mentioned and heal will be ready again except you also have a 3s block as well unless you also screwing that up.

See what I mean? You can screw up so much and still have LOTS of options to come back on top. There's hardly any punishment for mistakes. I didn't even mention merge skills that can improve sustain like smoke assault evade, siamoth dmg immunity.

Obviously, fighting a really good holo or warrior will limit your options. But even then, everything is too spammable.About 2 months ago I dueled a guildmate holo who is currently top 15 on EU leaderboard. Obviously I couldn't win. But the amount of sustain my build has despite not having all too much toughness or healing power is just crazy. Holo is ofc also spammy in the same way but.. the point of this post is that we as ranger mains need to acknowledge our soulbeasts are pretty busted and spammy.Keep in mind, this is mostly an issue in wvw balance.

TLDR, SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.

Title- “wvw”

Post complaint- “duel”

Nobody cares about your duels in wvw, stick to 1v1 complaints for spvp. And sometimes there are better players using a profession, and sometimes not.

The devs will be blowing up professions and tackling major issues across the board, so participate in those threads instead of making another qq Ranger duel thread for wvw play no less. There is a lot that’s “busted and spammy” in the game, but I don’t see you posting in all the other professions sections...

Here I’ll help you... Post your profession complaints here...

And read these and post there about professions...

I obviously stated that I know the other specs are spammy too, it's just that I don't hear a lot of people in ranger community or ranger players acknowledge that soulbeast actually needs to be toned down. The only people who agree with me are in my small guild. So I decided to post here.Also it's not duels per se it's nearly any small fight.

Then post your duel complaints about professions in the profession section. And make sure to include what you'd buff on classes to make every spec, on every profession, better for wvw group play, bc there is more to wvw, and the game, than duels.

Uhm.. this IS the profession section..Why should I call out every class and what needs to be changed on every class in a ranger section forum post? That doesn't make sense. I was calling for the ranger community to acknowledge we also have a spec that needs to be toned down.

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@bigo.9037 said:

@bigo.9037 said:I'm kinda starting to dislike soulbeast because of how OP and easy it is to get good results with (wvw roaming) despite the fact that I've been maining the class for years.Obviously this isn't only soulbeast, it's the game balance as a whole. Too much sustain, too much dmg. Health as a ranger is hardly relevant as long as you don't get low enough to risk getting downed in a single hit. Always have heals, blocks, evades, dmg immunity, stealth, stunbreakers, stab, condi cleanse or gap openers available.

For a while now I've felt as though I'm good at playing ranger/soulbeast (and druid before pof), and I do still believe i am ( never afraid of fighting other soulbeasts, always assuming I'm going to win a 1v1) but recently I've started to occasionally question whether I'm actually that good or I'm just being carried by my build. It just feels so easy to get really good results. Like it's not supposed to be THAT easy. The only time I ever get in trouble is if there's 3+ people. If not, I can sustain/get away unless they are thief or mesmers.

The low cooldowns on everything is just making it so spammable. This has been an issue for a while obviously.Used block at the wrong time? Np just swoop into smokefield, lb#4, #2,#3 and now it's ready again. Used heal even tho your hp was 100%, just for boons? Np. Use the same combo I just mentioned and heal will be ready again except you also have a 3s block as well unless you also screwing that up.

See what I mean? You can screw up so much and still have LOTS of options to come back on top. There's hardly any punishment for mistakes. I didn't even mention merge skills that can improve sustain like smoke assault evade, siamoth dmg immunity.

Obviously, fighting a really good holo or warrior will limit your options. But even then, everything is too spammable.About 2 months ago I dueled a guildmate holo who is currently top 15 on EU leaderboard. Obviously I couldn't win. But the amount of sustain my build has despite not having all too much toughness or healing power is just crazy. Holo is ofc also spammy in the same way but.. the point of this post is that we as ranger mains need to acknowledge our soulbeasts are pretty busted and spammy.Keep in mind, this is mostly an issue in wvw balance.

TLDR, SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.

Title- “wvw”

Post complaint- “duel”

Nobody cares about your duels in wvw, stick to 1v1 complaints for spvp. And sometimes there are better players using a profession, and sometimes not.

The devs will be blowing up professions and tackling major issues across the board, so participate in those threads instead of making another qq Ranger duel thread for wvw play no less. There is a lot that’s “busted and spammy” in the game, but I don’t see you posting in all the other professions sections...

Here I’ll help you... Post your profession complaints here...

And read these and post there about professions...

I obviously stated that I know the other specs are spammy too, it's just that I don't hear a lot of people in ranger community or ranger players acknowledge that soulbeast actually needs to be toned down. The only people who agree with me are in my small guild. So I decided to post here.Also it's not duels per se it's nearly any small fight.

Then post your duel complaints about professions in the profession section. And make sure to include what you'd buff on classes to make every spec, on every profession, better for wvw group play, bc there is more to wvw, and the game, than duels.

Uhm.. this IS the profession section..Why should I call out every class and what needs to be changed on every class in a ranger section forum post? That doesn't make sense. I was calling for the ranger community to acknowledge we also have a spec that needs to be toned down.

He meant the professions forum, not the specific Ranger forum.

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@bigo.9037

“ SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.”

Post your duel complaints about professions in the general section then, but keep in mind that wvw was primarily designed as an RvR mode for large groups of players, not dueling.

GL!

Edit- And you might want to pay attention to what Cal has talked about before you make your duel balance post.

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its not soulbeast, or the build, its that most wvw players are bad. players in general are bad and continually get worse due to the shrinking vet pool. also, yes, soulbeast like every other pof spec is op and should be nerfed. I think they should start with game wide nerfs tho like damage and sustain, then get class specific. I think they are actually doing that which sounds sweet, so we will see where this new balance team takes us.

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@Stand The Wall.6987 said:its not soulbeast, or the build, its that most wvw players are bad. players in general are bad and continually get worse due to the shrinking vet pool. also, yes, soulbeast like every other pof spec is op and should be nerfed. I think they should start with game wide nerfs tho like damage and sustain, then get class specific. I think they are actually doing that which sounds sweet, so we will see where this new balance team takes us.

Yea I'm very hopeful for this as well. I just hope it won't be until the end of 2020 that this actually happens.

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@Swagger.1459 said:@bigo.9037

“ SOULBEAST LIKE OTHER ELITE SPECS SHOULD BE NERFED ALONG WITH OTHER SPECS.”

Post your duel complaints about professions in the general section then, but keep in mind that wvw was primarily designed as an RvR mode for large groups of players, not dueling.

GL!

Edit- And you might want to pay attention to what Cal has talked about before you make your duel balance post.

Calm down, lol.

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@Stand The Wall.6987 said:its not soulbeast, or the build, its that most wvw players are bad. players in general are bad and continually get worse due to the shrinking vet pool. also, yes, soulbeast like every other pof spec is op and should be nerfed. I think they should start with game wide nerfs tho like damage and sustain, then get class specific. I think they are actually doing that which sounds sweet, so we will see where this new balance team takes us.

I second this. Most rangers I fight with my Reaper I kill, and its because they never notice the Corrosive Poison Cloud I put at their feet...

On a serious note, there is a fair bit that does need to be ramped down. Specific to Ranger, Rapid Fire is one of them. They nerfed Sic'em but it was no where near enough. They should have had the player damage modifier been 10%, ditto for Attacks of Opportunity for the player. As it stands you can hit someone not even in a glass setup for 20k in one rapid fire from max range.

I'm sure every class is going to get hit hard on the damage output whenever this grand balance patch hits, I just hope it leaves everyone on somewhat of an equal footing in the end. Some classes would get harder as a result, but as long as the final balance is fair then I think we'll all cope and adjust.

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