Balance-proposal for conditions — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Balance-proposal for conditions

Arzurag.7506Arzurag.7506 Member ✭✭✭

Most issues with conditions could be resolved by simply putting conditions into two categories:
-Inhibiting Conditions (all soft-cc conditions)
-Damage-Conditions (all conditions that inflict damage)
Every ability that removes conditions, now cleanses one of each type.
Also, which condition is removed first depends on its intensity (duration of soft-cc) or lethality (amount of inflicted damage)

This would severly reduce the power of most condition-build that apply both types frequently and make condition-application more managable.

"I´m not big on sermons nor words, Broken bones teach better lessons and speak for themselves."

Comments

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This idea was once a legit one but now it's kind of pointless since condi was nerfed so bad. Oddly it's power people complain about nowadays rofl.

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • Mogwai.4015Mogwai.4015 Member ✭✭✭

    Sounds like you want to completely invalidate conditions as a damage type.

  • Arzurag.7506Arzurag.7506 Member ✭✭✭

    @Justine.6351 said:
    This idea was once a legit one but now it's kind of pointless since condi was nerfed so bad. Oddly it's power people complain about nowadays rofl.

    There´s a "conditions are too strong" thread once in a while but it seems it has shifted from conditions to power being "overpowered".^^

    "I´m not big on sermons nor words, Broken bones teach better lessons and speak for themselves."

  • Arzurag.7506Arzurag.7506 Member ✭✭✭

    @Mogwai.4015 said:
    Sounds like you want to completely invalidate conditions as a damage type.

    Not at all, conditions would still do damage but they would simply become easier to manage when facing too many different conditions at once.
    Covering up damage-conditions wouldn´t be a thing anymore, reducing power without touching the damage-component.

    "I´m not big on sermons nor words, Broken bones teach better lessons and speak for themselves."

  • DeadlySynz.3471DeadlySynz.3471 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Arzurag.7506 said:

    @Mogwai.4015 said:
    Sounds like you want to completely invalidate conditions as a damage type.

    Not at all, conditions would still do damage but they would simply become easier to manage when facing too many different conditions at once.
    Covering up damage-conditions wouldn´t be a thing anymore, reducing power without touching the damage-component.

    This is a numbers problem, not a condition problem. Facing too many conditions at once is because conditions are being applied to someone by many people at once. This is no different than players complaining that damage is too high when being hit by several players at once.

    Take what people think is the biggest offender.. the scourge. The scourge on it's own doesn't apply that many (or even that many stacks of conditions). They don't even do that much damage which is bad considering they are so slow and easy to kill. If a player is attacked by 5 scourges at once, that changes the game, and now the player thinks conditions are a problem because they have over 20 stacks of torment on them, bleeding, cripple, and poison that comes back the second they clear it. Well you're being hit by 5 scourges.. what does one expect? I'm beginning to think many players think that because they run melee and run with several boons, they should be able to run into a giant battle with minimal conditions applied to them, and what ever is applied, should be able to be fully cleared by them and them alone. This is not how this works.

    Remember, conditions must do the same amount of damage as physical over a set period of time. If we start screwing with how much damage they do, what's applied, and when it's applied (or cleared), this goes all out the window.

  • Arzurag.7506Arzurag.7506 Member ✭✭✭

    @DeadlySynz.3471 said:

    @Arzurag.7506 said:

    @Mogwai.4015 said:
    Sounds like you want to completely invalidate conditions as a damage type.

    Not at all, conditions would still do damage but they would simply become easier to manage when facing too many different conditions at once.
    Covering up damage-conditions wouldn´t be a thing anymore, reducing power without touching the damage-component.

    This is a numbers problem, not a condition problem. Facing too many conditions at once is because conditions are being applied to someone by many people at once. This is no different than players complaining that damage is too high when being hit by several players at once.

    Take what people think is the biggest offender.. the scourge. The scourge on it's own doesn't apply that many (or even that many stacks of conditions). They don't even do that much damage which is bad considering they are so slow and easy to kill. If a player is attacked by 5 scourges at once, that changes the game, and now the player thinks conditions are a problem because they have over 20 stacks of torment on them, bleeding, cripple, and poison that comes back the second they clear it. Well you're being hit by 5 scourges.. what does one expect? I'm beginning to think many players think that because they run melee and run with several boons, they should be able to run into a giant battle with minimal conditions applied to them, and what ever is applied, should be able to be fully cleared by them and them alone. This is not how this works.

    Remember, conditions must do the same amount of damage as physical over a set period of time. If we start screwing with how much damage they do, what's applied, and when it's applied (or cleared), this goes all out the window.

    I won´t argue that when a zerg or groups of players fight each other, one shouldn´t expect to get rid of all conditions at once, let alone survive the encounter on his own. GW2 becomes a teamgame when fighting in a group, thus each team-member relies on others and all must work together. When loking at it like this, it´s quite balanced.

    But I´m more about making solo-encounters more fun, especially fights against condition-builds. Actually, I just noticed that I posted my proposal in the wrong section.

    Anyway, when fighting against condition-builds, the damage itself is not an issue but rather the lack of agency one has when facing one.
    Being rooted, slowed, crippled whilst being tormented, poisened and burned is not a fun experience. So I would shift the agency away from being dependant on in which order a condition is applied, to the player so that he has partial control over the incoming conditions and thus, failing and dying becomes entirely his fault.

    It´s just a suggestion, there´s obviously much more thought necessary for improving the combat in this game.

    "I´m not big on sermons nor words, Broken bones teach better lessons and speak for themselves."

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    There is no valid balance proposal for condi unless its combined with a balance proposal for power.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Arzurag.7506 said:

    @Mogwai.4015 said:
    Sounds like you want to completely invalidate conditions as a damage type.

    Not at all, conditions would still do damage but they would simply become easier to manage when facing too many different conditions at once.
    Covering up damage-conditions wouldn´t be a thing anymore, reducing power without touching the damage-component.

    I don't think you understand the situation. Condition cleansing is so strong currently that the only viable condi builds are those builds that are able to overwhelm opponents either via intensity (fire weaver) or variety (scourge, mirage) of conditions. If you completely remove cover conditions by massively increasing the power of cleansing, even these builds will be unable to survive.

    As others have pointed out, we're in a power meta. This is an odd request.

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The easier it is to remove conditions the stronger they have to be to remain valid. This just makes things worse as it becomes more binary between them not impacting you at all to completely destroying you without question.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2020

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    There is no valid balance proposal for condi unless its combined with a balance proposal for power.

    This is what I can intérprete from it:

    That means boons converted to condi damage need to make same damage as melee skill.

    But imo that m8 be a mistake due how classes and damage works.

    Careful thinking that way that’s what putted gw2 the way it is now.

    There should be no correlation about power and condi, they are not equal, so treatment should not be equal, nor the result should be equal.

    This something that gw1 did pretty well.