1 Shot out of stealth is a toxic/unhealthy mechanic

[Eddbopkins.2630]

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:some of these classes need to be caught with their pants down unaware, otherwise they can draw the fight out far too long.

assassination is healthy when you got high sustain, bunkerish classes that still can deal some dps.

stealth helps catch these fools unaware.

i vote stealth assassination stays.

You don't need stealth for high dps/"assassination" type game play. Look at fa ele same dps role but no invis to cheat with.Stealth is a cheat mechanic and doing 15k+ damage from a no tell advantage like stealth ruins the game play for everyone.

[Burnfall.9573]

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:some of these classes need to be caught with their pants down unaware, otherwise they can draw the fight out far too long.

assassination is healthy when you got high sustain, bunkerish classes that still can deal some dps.

stealth helps catch these fools unaware.

i vote stealth assassination stays.

You don't need stealth for high dps/"assassination" type game play. Look at fa ele same dps role but no invis to cheat with.Stealth is a cheat mechanic and doing 15k+ damage from a no tell advantage ruins the game play for everyone.

+1

i was moved once again by this player we were playing a healthy competitive game during my temp. stay away from this Toxic game. Posting this on his behalf.

2012>>2020>>beyond>>

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:some of these classes need to be caught with their pants down unaware, otherwise they can draw the fight out far too long.

assassination is healthy when you got high sustain, bunkerish classes that still can deal some dps.

stealth helps catch these fools unaware.

i vote stealth assassination stays.

You don't need stealth for high dps/"assassination" type game play. Look at fa ele same dps role but no invis to cheat with.Stealth is a cheat mechanic and doing 15k+ damage from a no tell advantage like stealth ruins the game play for everyone.

Yeah, so is precasting invuln and porting to someone to blow them up.

Get out of here.

[Eddbopkins.2630]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:some of these classes need to be caught with their pants down unaware, otherwise they can draw the fight out far too long.

assassination is healthy when you got high sustain, bunkerish classes that still can deal some dps.

stealth helps catch these fools unaware.

i vote stealth assassination stays.

You don't need stealth for high dps/"assassination" type game play. Look at fa ele same dps role but no invis to cheat with.Stealth is a cheat mechanic and doing 15k+ damage from a no tell advantage like stealth ruins the game play for everyone.

Yeah, so is precasting invuln and porting to someone to blow them up.

Get out of here.

O no 1single 40 second teleport, and a 3 second invuln on a 50 second cd, or ur endless evades on top of stealth and sword and steal teleports.Come what are you on that you don't see the supremacy of thf right now.

Also that strategy doesn't really work anymore with all the blocks and evades out there. Fa ele can not 1 shot teleport anymore successfully. Better off keeping ur distance, kitting and bombing with plasma beam and other stuffs.imo

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:some of these classes need to be caught with their pants down unaware, otherwise they can draw the fight out far too long.

assassination is healthy when you got high sustain, bunkerish classes that still can deal some dps.

stealth helps catch these fools unaware.

i vote stealth assassination stays.

You don't need stealth for high dps/"assassination" type game play. Look at fa ele same dps role but no invis to cheat with.Stealth is a cheat mechanic and doing 15k+ damage from a no tell advantage like stealth ruins the game play for everyone.

Yeah, so is precasting invuln and porting to someone to blow them up.

Get out of here.

O no 1single 40 second teleport, and a 3 second invuln on a 50 second cd, or ur endless evades on top of stealth and sword and steal teleports.Come what are you on that you don't see the supremacy of thf right now.

You know what, I know that burnie is probably gonna be reading our bickering, so I'm gonna just forfeit this argument.

You gonna get at the 1 thumbs regardless of my points.

Besides, I don't really want to make a bitter rapport between us, as I recall we have agreed on many things in the forums in the past.

You win.

[Eddbopkins.2630]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Eddbopkins.2630 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:some of these classes need to be caught with their pants down unaware, otherwise they can draw the fight out far too long.

assassination is healthy when you got high sustain, bunkerish classes that still can deal some dps.

stealth helps catch these fools unaware.

i vote stealth assassination stays.

You don't need stealth for high dps/"assassination" type game play. Look at fa ele same dps role but no invis to cheat with.Stealth is a cheat mechanic and doing 15k+ damage from a no tell advantage like stealth ruins the game play for everyone.

Yeah, so is precasting invuln and porting to someone to blow them up.

Get out of here.

O no 1single 40 second teleport, and a 3 second invuln on a 50 second cd, or ur endless evades on top of stealth and sword and steal teleports.Come what are you on that you don't see the supremacy of thf right now.

You know what, I know that burnie is probably gonna be reading our bickering, so I'm gonna just forfeit this argument.

You gonna get at the 1 thumbs regardless of my points.

Besides, I don't really want to make a bitter rapport between us, as I recall we have agreed on many things in the forums in the past.

You win.

O geez no bitterness at all. I'm assuming u know thf top down, I feel I know fa ele top down I feel. And in terms of each respective roll as a dps burst assassination, thf definitely is way way strong right now for that roll.I'm just giving my point of view. I'm not getting bitter at all. If I was I wouldn't of messaged in the first place.What are you so worried about thumbs crabby? You got 3.5k of them already!

But hay I'll take them thumbs

[Skyronight.6370]

dodging dosent work, using blocks dosent work, using anything dosent work because of perma stealth mechanic you can stealth until the enemy has nothing then one shot. theres 0 counterplay to it. Something needs to be done about stealth.

[Bladestrom.6425]

There's a lot of noise around this topic re overpowered builds etc but the fundemental issue is that in pvp a fight where 1 player spends a significant time invisible and as a result has control of engagement is poor gameplay. , this creates 2 sets of behaviours 1) invisible guy is constantly seeking deadly from invis and 2). Non invis player has to spend significant game time trying to find a target to engage and avoiding this deadly from an invisible player.

Poor gameplay pure and simple - invis should be a pve concern only, or a long cool down get out of jail free skill in pvp.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:There's a lot of noise around this topic re overpowered builds etc but the fundemental issue is that in pvp a fight where 1 player spends a significant time invisible and as a result has control of engagement is poor gameplay. , this creates 2 sets of behaviours 1) invisible guy is constantly seeking deadly from invis and 2). Non invis player has to spend significant game time trying to find a target to engage and avoiding this deadly from an invisible player.

Poor gameplay pure and simple - invis should be a pve concern only, or a long cool down get out of jail free skill in pvp.

it wont happen untill all other better get out of jail free cards get nerfed,like daggerstormglint heal and many many others.

[Bazsi.2734]

@Skyronight.6370 said:dodging dosent work, using blocks dosent work, using anything dosent work because of perma stealth mechanic you can stealth until the enemy has nothing then one shot. theres 0 counterplay to it. Something needs to be done about stealth.

So when I block/evade the incoming oneshot, then reveal the target and roflstomp them with 2 attacks, did I find a flaw in the matrix or are you just trying to change the game instead of learning how to deal with mechanics?

I'm playing since the betas, oneshot builds were out of control several times during the last 7 years. Not one time were they fixed by altering the core mechanics around them. Why would we need to do it now?

[DeceiverX.8361]

TL;DR: PeopleAre new-or-Got comfortable playing builds and classes that couldn't be punished-or-Don't recognize why sustained stealth and only sustained stealth (and not 1-shot-kill damage) is generally not amazing design for PvP.

Here's a fun fact, though: This burst has existed forever (it was actually even higher before). It's just had less utility to be viable and wasn't utilized by players who are as good. Massive damage/1-shot killing has existed in low ranks for like... ever. Because it's all people really play down there.Which honestly just kind of screams "you'd have gotten outplayed regardless." You wouldn't think the damage is strong if you were better.

[Burnfall.9573]

quickly stopping by; the game is getting a lot of public streaming awareness and its increasingly advertisements of guild wars 2 Toxicity. Especially with a class who can +1 shot you while in stealth. It's unbelievable of how many increasingly words of mouth including posted steaming videos spreading of how the game allows you to do that.

Every game i play, there's the talk about a guild wars 2 class who can +1 shot you in stealth. There are now increasingly more posted streaming social media tools including words of mouth exposing Thief Profession.

Its a tragedy knowing that the majority of us only wanted the best interest for the game but Unhealthy Experience was chosen instead.

So many red flags warning by the majority of concerning caring community that by increasing Power-Creep with unhealthy mechanics and its designs would only result in the game being Toxic, were ignored and continually being ignored. Also in resulting us being left unvalued and unworthy.

Our values and our worth continually being trampled over each day, each time, each moment of trying to get Anet attention that guild wars 2 health-well-being needs urgent help.

Well....

continual consequences...

After 8 years of advertising how 'competitive' guild wars 2 is, has reach new height-its result- are backfiring. Social Media and Word-of-Mouth advertisement has finally caught up with the game claims by proving its authenticity as false.

Guild Wars 2 has lost it core values, its respect to the core root of its predator-Guild Wars,, its meaningfulness, its mission to continue Guild Wars Legacy and its reputation to back up the Truth

[Skyronight.6370]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:There's a lot of noise around this topic re overpowered builds etc but the fundemental issue is that in pvp a fight where 1 player spends a significant time invisible and as a result has control of engagement is poor gameplay. , this creates 2 sets of behaviours 1) invisible guy is constantly seeking deadly from invis and 2). Non invis player has to spend significant game time trying to find a target to engage and avoiding this deadly from an invisible player.

Poor gameplay pure and simple - invis should be a pve concern only, or a long cool down get out of jail free skill in pvp.

Theres just need to be a cap to stealth that way blocking or dodging would actually work because i know sooner or later they will come out of stealth, if the duration is too long you cant do anything because they can just wait till you waste everything to one shot out of stealth, thats the issue, its the duration not stealth itself

[MrFrusciante.2438]

@"Skyronight.6370" said:Before people say " just dodge" its not that simple considering you can keep reapplying stealth over and over until the enemy is out of cooldowns or you just catch them by surprise for the 1 shot. Even top tier teams are now just restealthing over and over to gain the upperhand in the first engage until they one shot someone. So who ever stays in stealth longer wins? That seems like a perfectly healthy and esports worthy game design right? its why this game has millions of viewers on twitch. Obviously not for those that didn't get this sarcasm, but toxic mechanics like 1 shot out of stealth / passive traits / passive CCs ( rangers pets) and etc has to go.

This is not the only thing that made people quit over the years but its one of them hopefully anet does something about it in the upcoming balance patch, dont just tweak numbers, tweak toxic unhealthy mechanics things like overcharged shot for example, a long CC with no animation, or a gazelle hitting people for 12k + passive the CC or thiefs pistol whip being a stun and a evade at the same time. Theres alot of unhealthy game mechanics that need to change with the balance patch but stealth is a big issue right now and is gonna be even a bigger issue after they nerf pistol whip and every1 will go back to 1 shot DP thief/ mesmer combo.

Just cap stealth duration to 3-5 seconds and after that people get automatically revealed for 5 seconds until they can gain acces to stealth again. this would alrdy help this game mode by a lot with a simple change like that, so 2 teams wouldnt be able to just perma stealth for 30 secs until the other runs out so they can 1 shot them first.

the second you used "toxic" inappropriately I …..

kids throwing around this word so much to justify mehness

[Skyronight.6370]

they said over 800 skills are being changed? i hope something will be done about stealth

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Skyronight.6370 said:

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:There's a lot of noise around this topic re overpowered builds etc but the fundemental issue is that in pvp a fight where 1 player spends a significant time invisible and as a result has control of engagement is poor gameplay. , this creates 2 sets of behaviours 1) invisible guy is constantly seeking deadly from invis and 2). Non invis player has to spend significant game time trying to find a target to engage and avoiding this deadly from an invisible player.

Poor gameplay pure and simple - invis should be a pve concern only, or a long cool down get out of jail free skill in pvp.

Theres just need to be a cap to stealth that way blocking or dodging would actually work because i know sooner or later they will come out of stealth, if the duration is too long you cant do anything because they can just wait till you waste everything to one shot out of stealth, thats the issue, its the duration not stealth itself

depends, speaking of current 1shot core mes, it devotes ALOT of traits to get that ¬¬40% stealth uptime.Whats problematic is alot of shit designed abilities overlaping.gs3 having 1/4s casttime -> move it to 1/2, up the damage and boon remove to 2 to compensatemantra of pain -> make it apply vuln when someone is casting, instead of when someone is NOT casting. also make it give might when it regains charge and not when its charge, make it give less might for longer duration.

this suddenly means-12 might ( 360 power )-5% vulnerability ( 5% dmg + 2,5% from trait )

• gs3 damage, ( 3-4k )Suddenly mesmer cant 1shot out of stealth, and is compensated with sustained damage, without gutting skills ( f1,mantra) and without gutting stealth.Im sure D/P can be changed in similar fashion too.

[Skyronight.6370]

i dont even think the damage is the issue its the duration itself, being invisible for an extended period of time is just not good for the game, its fine if you can 1 shot some1 when you only got like 3-5 seconds to perform the one shot but if you got a century like in the current perma stealth meta then its very problematic thats why a cap of 3-5 seconds would make a lot of sense

[Psycoprophet.8107]

@Skyronight.6370 said:i dont even think the damage is the issue its the duration itself, being invisible for an extended period of time is just not good for the game, its fine if you can 1 shot some1 when you only got like 3-5 seconds to perform the one shot but if you got a century like in the current perma stealth meta then its very problematic thats why a cap of 3-5 seconds would make a lot of sense

I see ur point 100% but in today's game with defensive skills being what they are, sustain being what it is and burst of all specs being as high as they are stealth one shots or any attacks out of stealth would lose all forms of surprise and would be utterly useless. No good player will be surprised by a stealth attack if the stealth player is capped at 3-5 ec stealth and would just be swatted to downstate unless disengagment was utilized resulting in class can just attack and safely run posts lol. Maybe a cap of 10 secs followed by2 sec revealed would be more appropriate I donno.Also all classes should have at least 1 reveal utility skill with decent range as a option for more counterplay. Just add its effect onto a existing utility.

[Skyronight.6370]

it looks like the upcoming balance patch also had 0 nerfs to stealth? which is very very interesting to say the least

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Skyronight.6370 said:it looks like the upcoming balance patch also had 0 nerfs to stealth? which is very very interesting to say the least

Decoy: Increased cooldown from 40 seconds to 45 secondsSignet of Midnight: Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 35 secondsMass Invisibility: Increased cooldown from 60 seconds to 75 secondsDesperate Decoy: Increased cooldown from 40 seconds to 120 secondsMesmer stealth got fucked.Thief can still perma stealth.