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Mesmer Pistol - 1200 Range?


FalsePromises.6398

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@Leonidrex.5649 said:@"FalsePromises.6398"you have shown yet again that you cant read properly, dont understand or straight up troll.1 Warrior is supposed to be countered by condi mes, not the other way around2 Weaver counters cmes3 Thief counters cmesIm being disrespectful becouse you go on forums, and ask for nerfs for something you dont play or understand, becouse .... I honestly dont even know why, for kitten and giggles I guess.You are the one being disrespectful here. The fact that almost nobody even bothers commenting on the nonsense you posted would be enough for most people, but you keep going.Here is a thing for you mate, CMIRAGE doesnt get to pin his target.Every single meta or nonmeta playable build, has more. I repeat MORE tools to escape CC/lockdown then cmirage has CC.Let me repeat it for you.As Cmirage, you can land every single lockdown ability you have you will STILL not lock down ANYONE.As for you mate to put it into simplicity so you can understand.IF I use p4 from range, and phantasms spawns at 700 units away from you, you have to move 500 units to get out of range.If the nerf goes throught you would have to move 200 unints, meaning you wouldnt take any damage from phantasms, ever. EVER due how phantasms work.The only way Cmirage kills anything is when that "thing" kills itself on it.have a good day and hopefully you wills top posting nonsense like this in the future

Who said warrior was supposed to be countered by condition mesmer? They have rather numerous methods of damage evasion and at the very least decent cleanses or resistance uptime depending on build. Weaver for the most part probably only counters condi mirage because of the absurdity of their kit, likely pinning on sheer cleanse power, barrier values, and primordial stance. And thief as mentioned in a previous message possibly not part of this chain (can't keep track at this point because I've bounced with so many people) has an unhealthy kit designed around damaging evade based skills and absurd rewards for their resultant near inevitable evasion, and honestly is overdue for some changes in that respect because it is far too rewarding to them against enemies that can't strictly control and/or immediately disable all their skills that have multiple hits or pulsing fields. Furthermore, you can probably blame the lack of lockdown on the taking of staff and scepter, both defensively oriented condition weapons (which I justify with staff being based on teleports, auras, and boon fields with most all damage being based on the clones, autos, and ambushes, and scepter being oriented around the block ability and a ranged damage beam with no lockdown in either). I could argue to take other weapons, or you could argue that he scepter and staff should be buffed in that respect, which I wouldn't fully disagree nor agree with. As for "STILL not (locking) down ANYONE" I raise you necromancers who have... 2 stunbreaks? Usually 2 stunbreaks, sometimes 3, which pans out with at least one having long cooldowns in comparison to mesmer's CC abilities. Also, tack on their sheer lack of mobility skills, which is further compounded if you strip their swiftness with arcane thievery if they run speed runes. Furthermore, the idea of phantasms being spawned at specific range thresholds (and thusly being limited so) is based largely on cast origin/placement of the phantasm, which honestly feels like something that should be considered when casting the ability at all, as you can have someone walk out of range of your 1200 range duelist if casted from 1200 range if they walk less than 100 units or conversely have them have to walk 900 units if casted from 300 range, etc., so the idea of people walking out of range of the phantasm just becomes a fault of you placing your phantasms at too far of a range, or placing them in inopportune areas that are too favorable towards environmental cover or quick escape. Anyway, I think that was the intended change I had in mind towards that phantasm as per the start of the post, having range restricted so it's more a duelist and less a sniper. As towards the idea of mirage only killing things unless they kill themselves on it, that's not strictly a unique idea to mesmer and doesn't even stay consistent across all enemies they face.

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@"FalsePromises.6398"Cmirage used to HARD counter warrior.Numerous nerfs and nerfs and nerfs on no end make it more and more even.Cmirage has no lockdown. Its not becouse we take staff, no condi weapon other then pistol has CC.CC from mesmer is fair. More fair then the other classes, thats why mesmer struggles.Our p5 doesnt hit for 5k like other classes, we dont have 3s stuns on low cooldown with mobility and evasion attached to it. We dont have heroic with 3 hard CC.We just dont.Mesmer has ALOT of counterplay, from reflect blocks LoS, cleanses and many many others.If you had any clue you would know that phantasms are retarded , torch 5 always misses, phantasm can spawn 1pixel away from wall and immidietly LoS itself.IT happens every game, EVERY GAME.Let me repeat it for you. Every single meta class has more ways to remove/ignore CC then mesmer has CC.Even if I land every single p5, it will take me over 1min of fighting a necro to actually have the stun do anything.And if necro runs 3x stun removing tools I will never, NEVER stun him. EVER.Why did you even made this post? there is alot of other bullshit on other more broken classes.The only reason mesmer is playable even is stealth and ambush attacks.Most of our abilities are garbage, and mesmer lacks win conditions.Most classes have bullshit win conditions, do you know what that is?its bullshit like this -> https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Whirling_Defenseand this -> https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Soul_Spiralits the abilities, 1 ability. land half of it and you win.If you wanna win you gotta land 10-15 hits in a row. Others land half and thats it.I dont see you going about whining about actually broken things like bullscharge, you complain about shitty cmirage build.

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@Leonidrex.5649 said:@"FalsePromises.6398"Cmirage used to HARD counter warrior.Numerous nerfs and nerfs and nerfs on no end make it more and more even.Cmirage has no lockdown. Its not becouse we take staff, no condi weapon other then pistol has CC.CC from mesmer is fair. More fair then the other classes, thats why mesmer struggles.Our p5 doesnt hit for 5k like other classes, we dont have 3s stuns on low cooldown with mobility and evasion attached to it. We dont have heroic with 3 hard CC.We just dont.Mesmer has ALOT of counterplay, from reflect blocks LoS, cleanses and many many others.If you had any clue you would know that phantasms are kitten , torch 5 always misses, phantasm can spawn 1pixel away from wall and immidietly LoS itself.IT happens every game, EVERY GAME.Let me repeat it for you. Every single meta class has more ways to remove/ignore CC then mesmer has CC.Even if I land every single p5, it will take me over 1min of fighting a necro to actually have the stun do anything.And if necro runs 3x stun removing tools I will never, NEVER stun him. EVER.Why did you even made this post? there is alot of other kitten on other more broken classes.The only reason mesmer is playable even is stealth and ambush attacks.Most of our abilities are garbage, and mesmer lacks win conditions.Most classes have kitten win conditions, do you know what that is?its kitten like this -> https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Whirling_Defenseand this -> https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Soul_Spiralits the abilities, 1 ability. land half of it and you win.If you wanna win you gotta land 10-15 hits in a row. Others land half and thats it.I dont see you going about whining about actually broken things like bullscharge, you complain about kitten cmirage build.

I created discussion to discuss, and discussion is occurring. You bring up a lot of points that would bring a fair argument to the table had I said this was the only instance of slightly overtuned skills in the game. Unfortunately, I did not say that. If I wanted to make another run of the mill, carbon copy post complaining about warrior bullcharge or a one sided vent about the damage values of skills highly dependent on close range for their effects, I would. If you ask me, it sounds like you're forgetting just what condi mirage has in their kit in terms of cc. The amount of daze becomes staggering if placed right: it's not about lockdown so much as it's about disruption. The main reason that's not fully sufficing in the end is because anet poorly handled CI if you ask me, should've just removed might and immobilization and called it a day. You do seem to enjoy bringing up a lot of the less favorable aspects of mesmer and point to them as if I'm saying those are overpowered. That is in no way what I'm saying, and if you weren't just pulling things out of your rear end half the time in some mixture of venting and falling down unrelated rabbit holes, this'd be better off. Torch phantasm is weak? Make a discussion about it. Mesmer power is unplayable without crutching on stealth? Make a discussion about it. You seem to be getting mad at me for doing what you're not doing: having concerns and voicing them instead of self pity partying. Let's consider the idea of other classes having more CC counters in the game than CC on mesmer. What stuns do warrior have? Core tactics has two. Two stuns will be broken. Fire weaver has... two again? Maybe 3 depending on build? Ranger has... varying amounts, ranging between 2-4 it seems? Even necromancer, the class that gives up damage mitigation abilities for superior offensive lockdown gets four direct CC's at the high end, which they usually are obligated to take. I don't even think pistol whip can spam enough CC immediately to have a surefire success. Only one class I know can stunchain and overpower any number of stunbreaks near immediately, and that's sagebrand, and that's because of a myriad of other problematic things like mantra mashing for quickness and might on demand, free weakness/cripple/blind on demand, chill/slowness on every single CC that lands, etc. Mirage, assuming condi meta, has... let's see, chaos storm, chaos storm traited on heal, pistol 5, and diversion being a staggerable triple chain daze. Really the only issue mirage faces CC-wise is they rely too much on daze, which doesn't necessitate a stunbreak if you dodge or take cover, but still grants them disruption capabilities. You talk a lot about few "win condition" abilities, but mirage has some rather powerful abilities that compound nonetheless, specifically in phantasmal duelist stacking, what, 11 bleeds assuming it doesn't critically hit once? And it only goes up? And then you have scepter ambush being that second and a half window (AKA two times the duration of a dodge roll and thus not truly counterable by dodging) where every clone casts 5 bolts that apply conditions and can also stack bleeding on each crit themselves too? Then you have staff's whole defensive kit of RNG boons, no-cast teleports, and bouncing autoattacks from staff clones? Mesmer might not be in a tippy top dog spot any more, but that's certainly no reason to say it's pitifully weak. You talk about counterplay, but most any class decently balanced has counterplay. Weaver, even as broken as it is, has counterplay from kiting. Necromancer's counterplay is ranged, mobility, CC, or debilitating conditions. Thief's counterplay is controlling your strikes to avoid granting them benefits during their absurd evade uptimes, etc. Warrior's counterplay is interruption, because they run no stability nowadays. Mesmer's counterplay is AoE and varyingly adding reflects, retaliatory abilities, or high melee reverse pressure depending on build. LoS'ing is not unique to mesmer as a counterplay, nor are cleanses. Saying cleanses are a counter to conditions is like saying evades are a counter to all damage because it can mitigate a select few abilities per fight. If you ask me, I'd certainly love to buff mesmer, but in ways that would better fix them as a whole instead of tacking on more effects to their rickety kit that's been hammered like a broken nail for the right reasons but in the wrong ways.

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In last mAt,Misha who is one of the best mesmer in this game was the first to die on a condi mirage build with the top survival tools we can have currently. And with pistol.He then die regulary.So @leonidrex say truth when he say that other class have more cheesy tools and more efficients tools.Mean give it 5k damage to be on pair with some other CC then we can talk about range.

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@viquing.8254 said:In last mAt,Misha who is one of the best mesmer in this game was the first to die on a condi mirage build with the top survival tools we can have currently. And with pistol.He then die regulary.So @leonidrex say truth when he say that other class have more cheesy tools and more efficients tools.Mean give it 5k damage to be on pair with some other CC then we can talk about range.

This is the truth of the mesmer, we have stealth we have burst if we use all glass and we have IH. SUPER cheese.Problem is, everything else is far. Far too fair.sword 3 deals 1 damage, any other class would do 3k+fouc 4 deals no damage, other classes would deal alot with ittorch 5 always missesgs 5 deals almost no damage and has insane cd, other classes would hit 3 times as hard and have half the CD for such a skill.and dont evens tart me on sword 4 and 5all our skills are far too fair, and thats why mesmer struggles now.

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@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@viquing.8254 said:In last mAt,Misha who is one of the best mesmer in this game was the first to die on a condi mirage build with the top survival tools we can have currently. And with pistol.He then die regulary.So @leonidrex say truth when he say that other class have more cheesy tools and more efficients tools.Mean give it 5k damage to be on pair with some other CC then we can talk about range.

This is the truth of the mesmer, we have stealth we have burst if we use all glass and we have IH. SUPER cheese.Problem is, everything else is far. Far too fair.sword 3 deals 1 damage, any other class would do 3k+fouc 4 deals no damage, other classes would deal alot with ittorch 5 always missesgs 5 deals almost no damage and has insane cd, other classes would hit 3 times as hard and have half the CD for such a skill.and dont evens tart me on sword 4 and 5all our skills are far too fair, and thats why mesmer struggles now.

I can definitely agree there: there's decent condi capability that bleeds across many weapons, but not a lot of good power capabilities bleeding across multiple weapons, and that certainly is something worth changing to allow a healthier variety of build styles on mesmer. The problem largely lies at anet's reluctance to allow clones to deal power damage despite allowing them rather strong condi damage in comparison. In my opinion, that should at least change for skills where clones are commanded to cast abilities and similar instances. I can definitely also agree on the lack of power damage tied to CC abilities and such, except maybe on greatsword 5 because that's basically a frontal cone version of ranger's point blank shot for close range, and they seem to do similar damage values. I'd much rather see greatsword reworked to instead focus on casted/channeled high damage abilities instead of remaining in its current state of one of the most burnout style weapons in the game that casts four skills in succession and just resorts to autoattacks. Also focus 4 wouldn't deal a lot of damage on other classes: similar roundup abilities (firebrand tome of courage 3, necromancer chilling grasp, soulbeast weird vine/immobilize roundup beast skill, etc.) do very little power damage if any damage at all, and focus 4 actually has benefits over those skills due to not being projectiles, having no cast, and being 600 radius iirc? I will agree though that sword and torch phantasms are due for some sort of rework, due to their poor ability to make sure their effects hit. I think the issue is anet doesn't know how to make those phantasms have adaptable casts without either turning phantasmal mage into a burning phantasmal duelist or turning phantasmal swordsman into phantasmal rogue.

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@"FalsePromises.6398"https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Wavehttps://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Point_Blank_ShotPBS has half the cooldown of Iwave, and almost 3 times as much damage.The damage values are not close, not by a long shot. And this is what I mean.Its with every weapon and every CC.sword 4 daze? 100 dmg.curtain 4? 0 dmg.f3? 0 dmg.p5? 100 dmg.Meanwhile other classes boom you with light beam for 5k-9k.blank shots for 3-5kbullscharge for 5-8kand other cancer, mesmer lack low cooldown hard to land STRONG AS FUCK abilities that other classes throw at them.bullshit like this happenshttps://imgur.com/gallery/c9Dqy28where ability that can hit 12 times hits for 4k with each tick.for grand total of 48k damage.And phantasms have additional counterplay no other classes have. Yet they deal even deal enough damage to justify such counterplay.Leaving people with cheese cheese cheese, becouse you cant trust your berserker to deal any damage.Becouse it can spin the wrong way and clip once for 2k dmg, instead of landing properly for 8k.

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