Should Arenanet only add new maps when there is an expansion? — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Should Arenanet only add new maps when there is an expansion?

blade eyes.2034blade eyes.2034 Member ✭✭
edited January 31, 2020 in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Hello folks, I have some thoughts that I want to share as a player who has played all of the living stories from season 1 to the current "saga." I don't know why Arenanet went back on this, but one reason they only added few maps during season 1 and 2 is that they didn't want old maps to be abandoned and become "ghost maps." Something that they were particularly eminent about, yet that's the problem they created today with the newer living story model. Another thing that the living stories were supposed to do is bring content to existing maps, now most of those maps, especially the mini maps that are introduced by the living story are nothing, but "ghost maps" where the only reason to visit them is for a collection that soon everyone will get and move on, no real content to add or expand on them. That's why living Story season 1 and 2 made much more sense, they created content for old maps to revisit while moving the story forward, and only adding maps occasionally like Dry Top and Silverwastes to expand on core Tyria. I don't think I would be the only one who feels like the living story should be used as a way to lead into an expansion, instead of trying to replace it with "saga." I think I and many like the feeling of exploring a whole new continent with our friends and guilds, instead of this Dreadful slow expansion. Lastly, I really loved the older model of the living story when it was capable of delivering new content every 2 weeks because Arenanet didn't have to create mini-maps that soon will be abandoned, which takes a lot of resources that can be used elsewhere.


  • Xenon.4537Xenon.4537 Member ✭✭✭

    If they only added maps with expansions in 2020, we wouldn't get any new maps in the game. :)

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The maps aren't getting abandoned because they are added with LS. They are getting abandoned because they are designed to be transient, and because access to them is locked behind specific LS episodes.

    So, the maps do not get reused later on, and the core of the design is based on an assumption that there's only one current map, and the old ones should get abandoned as soon as everyone gets done with achievements from that LS chapter.

    Take Sun's refuge, for example - it had a massive potential to be reused, but that potential got wasted due to the things mentioned above. Anet was not willing to open access to it for everyone, was not willing to work on past content, and was not willing to give players any reason to stay there instead of moving on to the New Stuff(TM).

    And the new Saga maps are the same, nothing has really changed there.

    Notice though, that it is a design principle that is a result of a choice. Deviating from it does not require an expansion - all that is needed is a will to do it differently.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 31, 2020

    It's odd to me that they are willing to make Heart of Thorns free (which was still selling by the way) in order to make the game more accessible to new players, while at the same time still lock the episodes behind a paywall. Now someone will say "it costs gems, you can use gold to unlock it" but I'll answer with "a newer player won't be able to accumulate that gold fast enough, and will probably have better areas to spend that gold than unlocking content that shouldn't be locked in the first place."

    A paywall is still a paywall, even if you use gold to unlock it, and it causes a lot of the design problems with the game. Imagine if the Kodan required us to use the Flame of Koda (which we learned back in Breaking the Ice) for some ritual. Remember in Bitterfrost there were chests encased in ice that we had to melt using Koda's Flame? Why aren't there chests like that in Bjora???? It's an area full of Icebrood after all. Oh right, the paywall problem I discussed above.

    And this goes much much deeper. Why are Kralkatite meteors only falling around Istan? What's so special about that island that branded meteors love so much? Why aren't they dropping in Dragonfall, you know where the Elder Dragon actually resides. Why are the Inquest using their special turrets (that we learned how to manipulate) only around Kourna and not anywhere else? Why do we have brand new gliding abilities only around Bloodstone Fen, and not everywhere there are laylines (they are powered by laylines, but there are laylines for example in Dragonfall). I hope you get the idea, the way they are monetizing their game and selling their episodes is why the Living World maps are so disjointed and their mastery unlocks only used on them. I'd hoped with the start of the Saga they'd change this, but to my disappointment they did not.

  • Cobrakon.3108Cobrakon.3108 Member ✭✭✭

    There is simply too much of the world map that needs to be filled up. Going new places is part of the game.

  • New level 80 maps is needed, but the ones that come from LS feels too specfic. They feel too incoherrent with the rest. The ones that fet adferd could see a better utilisation, not the current «spamming» of maps. One thing that makes hot and PoF maps work is the common theme and that they are connected to eachother. Several maps released at once, would create a better flow, when one could take the time with them and get the feel for them, and not just stress with them while there is still people there. Also, Silverwastes and Dry Top is still the better non core LS maps in my book.

  • @maddoctor.2738 said:
    It's odd to me that they are willing to make Heart of Thorns free (which was still selling by the way) in order to make the game more accessible to new players, while at the same time still lock the episodes behind a paywall

    They need to be bundled with their associated expacs or sold as an "expac" on their own


  • KeoLegend.5132KeoLegend.5132 Member ✭✭✭

    because the stupid way which LW episodes are sold.
    Instead of making a pass or smt, they sell them separatedly. The result: well, one map tied to one episode. Thats why we have so many ghost maps.
    I would love the idea of new maps being added only when/if a new expansion comes, and then making Living world use those old maps

  • in the case of icebrood saga I really wouldn't mind if it ends up only being 2 more new maps, I'd rather have them work on already existing content, which is drying up to dust.
    Fractals, WvW, PvP, Raids, boring PvE maps and hell even dungeons feel more important to establish solid content, rather than tons of bits of breadcrumbs everywhere.