Balance Patch Preview - PvP

[mortrialus.3062]

The following amulets have been removed from the PvP Build panel

• Deadshot Amulet
• Wanderer Amulet

Why? These are literally the same offensive/defensive split for stats are Marauders and Demolisher's.

[Bladestrom.6425]

On the negative, the level of change in 1 patch here is going to be an absolute *** balance holocaust resulting on broken builds and emergency fixes, its a page 1 of the 'how not to phase in change in a controlled manner' handbook. However I can forgive that because I love LOVE the fact they realise their cadence of changes is far too slow and they are very making moves to address this. I've been banging on for a long long time about how this is the fundemental root cause of all the balancing issues, but it looks like they have software engineers on board that gets this.

[Widmo.3186]

Byebye weaver, was nice knowing you. One day we will meet again, I hope.

[zealex.9410]

Not much in the way of nerfing condies, im afraid condies will either be useless or flat out better than power with their current itteration. I think it would be healthier for the overall game if condi skills and condi dmg worked exactly like power with flat debuffs, no stacks and set coefficience for each diff skill (taking cc skills into acount for condie dmg as well)

[Vithzerai.3291]

I don't know who this new company is, but I like their balance changes already. If only to watch the flood of Mirage mains come down from the heavens to say their class was trash beforehand and this nerf is unnecessary and continuing the Mesmer discrimination.

[Tycura.1982]

Some of the underplayed HOT spec nerfs were harsh but otherwise this patch is looking good. Mirage dodge nerf might be overkill. Might want to make their dodge cost a little less endurance than normal. Thanks balance friends

[Serenity.6304]

PvP will get less spammy. I like that. Can’t wait to see it in action. And with the new, more frequent schedule of updates it is not a big deal when changes don’t seem to work out as they were supposed to.

[ArthurDent.9538]

Aside from how terrible balance is inevitably going be after basically flipping the board on this game, can we please stop blanket nerfing all hard cc skills to negligable damage. Cast time, cool down, range, and cc duration all need to be weighed against each other to determine appropriate damage levels. All this does is make long cool down well telegraphed CC's like prime light beam complete trash compared to more spammable and less telegraphed stuff like overcharged shot.

[Zexanima.7851]

Fire, can’t wait to test these changes

[Simonoly.4352]

Not convinced the -50% endurance change for Mirage is going to be particularly viable. Especially if Ambush Skills are not improved to be more impactful.

[dawn.8406]

please touch Shadow arts DP, it needs a touch of the mighty devs-

[dubidubidubidu.5308]

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:

Mesmer

Profession Mechanics

Shatters

• Mind Wrack: Adjusted as follows.
  • One Clone Shattered: Reduced power coefficient from 1.15 to 1.0
  • Two Clones Shattered: Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.92 to 0.7
  • Three Clones Shattered: Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.805 to 0.613

Chrono Shatters

• Split Second: Adjusted as follows.
  • One Clone Shattered: Reduced power coefficient from 1.15 to 1.0
  • Two Clones Shattered: Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.92 to 0.7
  • Three Clones Shattered: Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.805 to 0.613

Weapons

Greatsword

• Spatial Surge: Reduced minimum power coefficient per strike from 0.23 to 0.15. Reduced maximum power coefficient from 0.335 to 0.223
• Mirror Blade: Increased cooldown from 5 seconds to 8 seconds
• Mind Stab: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.7
• Phantasmal Berserker: Reduced phantasm power coefficient per strike from 0.23 to 0.15
• Illusionary Wave: Reduced power coefficient from 0.3 to 0.01. Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds

Staff

• Winds of Chaos: Reduced power coefficient from 0.3 to 0.2
• Phase Retreat: Increased cooldown from 10 seconds to 12 seconds
• Phantasmal Warlock: WvW will now use the PvP version of the skill (1 warlock summoned)

Scepter

• Autoattack Chain: Reduced power coefficients from 0.5/0.5/0.75 to 0.333/0.333/0.5
• Illusionary Counter: Increased cooldown from 8 seconds to 12 seconds. WvW will now use the PvP version of the skill (1 clone summoned)
• Confusing Images: Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.38 to 0.255

Sword

• Autoattack Chain: Adjusted as follows
  • Mind Slash: Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.5
  • Mind Gash: Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.5
  • Mind Spike: Reduced base power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.666. Reduced power coefficient against foes with no boons from 2.0 to 1.333
• Blurred Frenzy: Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.2564 to 0.128

Sword OH

• Illusionary Riposte: Reduced power coefficient from 2.0 to 1.0
• Phantasmal Swordsman: Reduced power coefficient of the phantasm leap attack from 0.5 to 0.35, Reduced power coefficient per strike of the phantasm flurry attack from 0.15 to 0.1

Focus

• Phantasmal Warden: Reduced power coefficient per strike of the warden attack from 0.138 to 0.1

Pistol

• Phantasmal Duelist: Reduced power coefficient per strike of the phantasm attack from 0.115 to 0.1
• Magic Bullet: Reduced power coefficient from 0.2 to 0.01. Reduced stun duration from 2.5 seconds to 2 seconds

Torch

• The Prestige: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5

Shield

• Tides of Time: Reduced power coefficient from 0.8 to 0.01

Axe

• Autoattack Chain: Reduced power coefficients from 0.55/0.55/1.1 to 0.366/0.366/0.732
• Lingering Thoughts: Increased ammo recharge from 10 seconds to 12 seconds
• Axes of Symmetry: Increased cooldown from 10 seconds to 15 seconds

Heal

• Ether Feast: Increased cooldown from 20 seconds to 25 seconds
• Mantra of Recovery: Increased cooldown from 10 seconds to 18 seconds
• Mirror: Increased cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds
• Signet of the Ether: Reduced illusion summon base heal from 350 to 297
• Well of Eternity: Reduced initial base heal from 3230 to 2099. Reduced ending heal coefficient from 1.2 to 0.8
• False Oasis: Reduced pulse base heal from 1620 to 1215. Reduced pulse heal coefficient from 0.5 to 0.2

Utility

• Decoy: Increased cooldown from 40 seconds to 45 seconds
• Mirror Images: Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 35 seconds
• Arcane Thievery: Reduced quickness and slow duration from 4 seconds to 2 seconds
• Blink: Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 35 seconds
• Mantra of Concentration: Increased cooldown from 15 seconds to 60 seconds. Increased ammo recharge from 30 seconds to 45 seconds
• Mantra of Distraction: Reduced diversion recharge from 15 seconds to 10 seconds
  • Power Lock (from Mantra of Distraction): Reduced daze duration from 1.5 seconds to 1 second
• Power Spike (from Mantra of Pain): Reduced power coefficient from 1.33 to 0.45. Adjusted vulnerability from 5 stacks for 8 seconds to 12 stacks for 6 seconds
• Mantra of Resolve: Increased cooldown from 12 seconds to 25 seconds
• Signet of Midnight: Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 35 seconds
• Well of Action: Reduced quickness duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds
• Well of Precognition: Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 45 seconds
• Sand Through Glass: Increased cooldown from 25 seconds to 30 seconds

Elite

• Mass Invisibility: Increased cooldown from 60 seconds to 75 seconds
• Gravity Well: Reduced pulse power coefficient from 0.6 to 0.01. Reduced final power coefficient from 2.4 to 0.01 Reduced cooldown from 90 seconds to 60 seconds

Traits

Domination

• Dazzling: Reduced vulnerability duration from 8 seconds to 6 seconds
• Rending Shatter: Reduced vulnerability duration from 8 seconds to 6 seconds
• Furious Interruption: Reduced quickness duration from 3 seconds to 2 seconds
• Power Block: Reduced weakness duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds

Dueling

• Sharper Images: Reduced bleeding duration from 5 seconds to 2 seconds
• Desperate Decoy: Increased cooldown from 40 seconds to 120 seconds
• Duelist's Discipline: Reduced bleeding duration from 3 seconds to 2 seconds
• Evasive Mirror: Reduced mirror duration from 2 seconds to 1.5 seconds

Chaos

• Metaphysical Rejuvenation: Reduced regeneration duration from 10 seconds to 5 seconds
• Illusionary Membrane: Reduced protection duration from 3 seconds to 2 seconds
• Chaotic Persistence: Reduced bonus boon and condition duration per boon from 2% to 1%
• Method of Madness: Increased cooldown from 35 seconds to 75 seconds
• Master of Manipulation: Reduced superspeed duration from 3 seconds to 1.5 seconds
• Chaotic Transference: Increased toughness to condition damage conversion from 7% to 13%. Reduced concentration to expertise conversion from 13% to 5%
• Chaotic Dampening: Reduced protection duration from 4 seconds to 2.5 seconds
• Bountiful Disillusionment: Reduced might duration from 8 seconds to 6 seconds

Inspiration

• Restorative Illusions: Reduced heal coefficient from 0.77 to 0.46
• Mental Defense; Increased internal cooldown from 50 seconds to 90 seconds

Illusions

• Phantasmal Haste: Reduced quickness duration from 1.5 seconds to 1 second
• Maim the Disillusioned: Reduced torment duration from 4 seconds to 3 seconds
• Phantasmal Force: Reduced might duration from 10 seconds to 6 seconds

Chronomancer

• Delayed Reactions: Reduced slow duration from 3 seconds to 1.5 seconds
• Seize the Moment: Reduced quickness duration from 2 seconds to 1 second

Mirage

• Mirage Cloak: This trait now reduces the mirage's endurance by 50 in competitive modes
• Renewing Oasis: Reduced regeneration duration from 4 seconds to 2.5 seconds
• Dune Cloak: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5

im not sure i understand what you want to do to mirage cloak (now reduce endurance by 50??), does that mean as daredevil has 3 dodges mirages now only have one??? oO also why you want to reduce evade uptime on a spec that is build around doing things with his dodges and has already less dodges than most other classes in current state? doesnt rly make sense to me. the times mirage (not using chaosline) can dodge too often are already over. better reduce vigor duration given by chaosline.

for mind wrack i would leave the shatter dmg alone, it is balanced since game release and builds not using dmg mulitplier already do not rly do that much dmg. i would go for superiority complex (crit-) dmg reduction instead and leave mind wrack alone. the trait is what you changed during power creeping the game and what often leads to stupidly high dmg spikes on all (key-)skills (like i had 10k+ split surges crits from only my own ambush, so no clones involved, compared to around 3k without that trait or 7k+ mindwrack crits while using that trait. otherwise you force player away from more active and tactical skillbased traits like deceptive evasion into passive dmg multiplier traits to even do any dmg. but no matter what you do with mw, sup. complex should get crit dmg reduction in any case when you want to touch dmg all over the board.

esp with that in mind i would not reduce gs autoattack dmg, better just reduce power coefficient from the mirages own ambush (split surge) a little bit (adjust gs clone ambushes that they stay the same as they are now). the core gs autoattack is (like mindwrack) not powercreeped and doesnt deserve any nerfs even when everything else in the game will get nerfed. also gs3 and 5 dont even do any remarkable dmg already no need to reduce dmg here. torch prestige and gs berserker also dont need any dmg reduction in my opinion. they never got powercreeped. and when you touch sup.complex they could even get a very little dmg increase, because the base weapon dmg is not powercreeped. esp because these power build weapons already suffer from decreased vuln stacks dura from domination traitline what is normally used in power builds.

decoy already is a pretty weak utility compared to others for an already high 40 secs cd. illusionary ambush is like 3 times as strong as decoy and has way less cd (i would give illusionary ambush at least 45 secs too btw). instead nerfing all skills that will get affected by pu and make it unusable for all builds without pu, just reduce or delete the stealth duration from pu. wasnt it like 1 secs stealth increase at some point? i remember something like that. so 1 secs more no matter how long the base stealth duration of a used skill is instead 50%. that way ppl would not use decoy anymore anyway (most would switch to signet of midnight) and also a higher cd on mass invisibility will not be necessary anymore.

mantra of pain should get the might and vuln stacks removed completely and not get more stacks for even more oneshot potential. decreased vuln duration doesnt help vs the low effort oneshot potential you have with the current core pu build thx to mantra of pain. or you let the mightstacks/ vuln as you plan it and remove the direct dmg from that mantra completely so that it only is used as a selfbuff tool (or makes it stack the might also on 2 teammates near the mesmer for that to give it some teamsupport utility).

not rly happy with the blink cd increase because again you nerf a skill for all builds to compensate a too short cd when chaosline is used. chaosline is the problem as a low skill ceiling line giving too much rewards and not the base cd of blink.

im all for deleting passives traits but pls delete them by replacing them with something useful and not just by making them not worth taking… 120 secs icd on desperate decoy is lol... no time to read all classes atm, does other passive traits on other classes get the same treatment or will mesmer be the only one again? since mes is already the only class with instant skills cant be used in the back, with the only skills need to face the target but have no automatic char alignment? pls remove the need to face your target from mantras, it is not needed and it is unfair, it contradicts the whole instant nature and make them unhandy like crazy. just remove the direct dmg from mantra of pain completely and such unfair treatment of instant skills will not be needed anymore. or add this senseless destruction to all instant skills in the game, like fesh air ele, fb mantras etc. and see how unhandy it will feel for them too….

overall good chances but take care that you dont nerf things with specific meta builds like core pu in mind. it often leads in making used skills unusable for any other builds not using the traitline that actually causes the problems and will force ppl into a traitline with in general lower skill ceiling because you nerf the wrong skills which then become too weak outside of builds with chaosline used. also always check if your changes force ppl into less active trait choices by nerfing dmg at places where it is not power creeped instead nerfing a trait that clearly adds too much dmg by itself (superiority complex).

EDIT: nvm didnt see the global changes when writing, gs changes maybe make sense now all together. still sup. complex trait needs attentionwhat is the boonremove prio for the new trait Vicious Expression???what you mean with the changes to mirage cloak? it sounds horrible….

[torben.1532]

ok I thought pvp changes were only the ones mentioned here. with global changes rev is deadgg not salty at all :)

[Foshizle.9802]

I don't understand Shadow Arts nerf. It's currently a meta trait on more than 1 build, none of which really uses "Shadow's Rejuvenation" let alone "Merciful ambush".Given the overall nerfs and thief play style remaining the same, SA will be be even better in perspective than it currently is.

Overall stealth was barely touched, heartseeker ignored (it will hit pretty hard after these nerfs), shadow shot went from 4 to 5 innitiative,... thief meta strength received a very gentle slap compared to other specs.

But overall well done, this was needed.

[otto.5684]

I think this is the end of sPvP for me. I am for curbing power creep a bit, but reducing CD on everything, lowering the damage on everything, seems like random number generator. Some skills has the CDs they had and deal the damage/heal they do for a reason. Not to mention, there is no way in hell to know what skill does how much damage/heal and how much CD on my main class WHEN EVERY SINGLE SKILL IS DIFFERENT. Forget the other 8 classes.

This is a different game. One that seems a derivative of the existing one, confusing and far less interesting. I am already on the fence on GW2 as a whole, sPvP was one of the few remaining anchors that keeps me attached to the game. I think this it for this. And with PvE changes boarding on pathetic, I think this is it for the game.

[Enduronex.4865]

Lol this is what people get by denying that mesmer, condi mesmer, sic em rangers/sbs. double heralds, meme one shot rifle warriors, magebane tether bunker spellbreakers, ventari bunker renegades, knockback scrappers, thieves in general, one shot eles, fire weavers, symbol firebrands were all busted, and for also denying that bursty meta game (which admittedly, rifle holo is a part of) was not how Conquest PvP should be.

Below is a real life recreation of forum responders to these balance patch notes

[Malsheem.1794]

Thats alot to take in. Looks interesting but the one thing that stood out to me was DH´s "Dragons Maw"

"Dragon's Maw: Reduced power coefficient from 2.5 to 0.01. Reduced might duration from 8 seconds to 6 seconds. Reduced slow duration from 4 seconds to 3 seconds. Reduced cooldown from 75 seconds to 50 seconds"

I play DH atm and i think im one of the few that actually use this ability instead of "Renewed Focus". Its a Elite and its the one ability that screams "Dragon Hunter" - its like a huge bear claw. Its fairly easy to play around, dodge, block, stability, whatever. Is should be a high damage ability. Fits the class and its the only elite-damage ability for DH. Im not saying it should one-shot ppl, but i doubt the damage needs a nerf - or atleast this much of a nerf.

I think its bad when ppl play "elites" but end up using everything not related to that spec. An Elite spec should invite you to use "the new unlocked stuff". Play Reaper ? use a GS and shouts. Play DH ? use Traps. So on. Think you would want to keep that in mind.

[storm.3120]

@"Jazz.4639"

im not sure i understand what you want to do to mirage cloak (now reduce endurance by 50??), does that mean as daredevil has 3 dodges mirages now only have one???oO also why you want to reduce evade uptime on a spec that is build around doing things with his dodges and has already less dodges than most other classes in current state? doesnt rly make sense to me. the times mirage (not using chaosline) can dodge too often are already over. better reduce vigor duration given by chaosline.That was exactly thoughts but its not likely they understand what they are doing or would change it.F for fellow mesmer players (if any left) , the first chrono, now mirage (especially for power ones).

[HoneyBadger.5691]

mispost.

[phokus.8934]

Mirage needs to have their endurance regen added back and the ambushes need to be greatly buffed if they only get one dodge.

This still feels like a cheap way of balancing Mirage when they should've just looked at the ambushes with IH.

[Xar.6279]

@otto.5684 said:I think this is the end of sPvP for me. I am for curbing power creep a bit, but reducing CD on everything, lowering the damage on everything, seems like random number generator. Some skills has the CDs they had and deal the damage/heal they do for a reason. Not to mention, there is no way in hell to know what skill does how much damage/heal and how much CD on my main class WHEN EVERY SINGLE SKILL IS DIFFERENT. Forget the other 8 classes.

This is a different game. One that seems a derivative of the existing one, confusing and far less interesting. I am already on the fence on GW2 as a whole, sPvP was one of the few remaining anchors that keeps me attached to the game. I think this it for this. And with PvE changes boarding on pathetic, I think this is it for the game.

git gud

[Zenix.6198]

@"Cal Cohen.2358"

could you please consider, putting percentage-values next to the coefficient changes?Like "Reduced the power-coefficient of "Skill X" from 2.0 to 1.5 (25%)".

Having to do quick maffs for that many changes is pretty tedious.Comparison between changes would also be way easier and more practical.

[dubidubidubidu.5308]

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:

Mesmer

• Mirage Cloak: This trait now reduces the mirage's endurance by 50 in competitive modes

@Odik.4587 said:@"Jazz.4639"

im not sure i understand what you want to do to mirage cloak (now reduce endurance by 50??), does that mean as daredevil has 3 dodges mirages now only have one???

oO also why you want to reduce evade uptime on a spec that is build around doing things with his dodges and has already less dodges than most other classes in current state? doesnt rly make sense to me. the times mirage (not using chaosline) can dodge too often are already over. better reduce vigor duration given by chaosline.That was exactly thoughts but its not likely they understand what they are doing or would change it.F for fellow mesmer players (if any left) , the first chrono, now mirage (especially for power ones).

no they cant be serious with that, some early april fool or something? that cant be real, it makes no sense at all... ahahahaha … just no! esp now im forced to dodge no matter if i need to just to not waste endurance reggen when my one dodge bar is full? how does that add skill need and more active gameplay? it is the absolute opposite… dumbed down we go (nick cave) yeah yeah yeah…NO NO NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (cant believe….)

need to sleep but im actually shocked…. crying and laughing at same time

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Zenix.6198 said:@"Cal Cohen.2358"

could you please consider, putting percentage-values next to the coefficient changes?Like "Reduced the power-coefficient of "Skill X" from 2.0 to 1.5 (25%)".

Having to do quick maffs for that many changes is pretty tedious.Comparison between changes would also be way easier and more practical.

git gud at maff

[otto.5684]

@Xar.6279 said:

@otto.5684 said:I think this is the end of sPvP for me. I am for curbing power creep a bit, but reducing CD on everything, lowering the damage on everything, seems like random number generator. Some skills has the CDs they had and deal the damage/heal they do for a reason. Not to mention, there is no way in hell to know what skill does how much damage/heal and how much CD on my main class

WHEN EVERY SINGLE SKILL IS DIFFERENT

. Forget the other 8 classes.

This is a different game. One that seems a derivative of the existing one, confusing and far less interesting. I am already on the fence on GW2 as a whole, sPvP was one of the few remaining anchors that keeps me attached to the game. I think this it for this. And with PvE changes boarding on pathetic, I think this is it for the game.

git gud

What does this mean?! You think this is hello kitty I am playing sPvP for the first time?! I am arguing that splitting every skill and trait damage is dumb. If you do not have anything to add to the conversation then s*****.