Revenant stunbreak on legend swap removal

[torben.1532]

Don’t go though with this, I got a feeling it’s gonna make the class semi unplayable.

Edit: A better way to nerf Revenant stunbreaks would be to either go through with the legends stunbreaks nerfed the way you guys did it OR the legend swap stunbreak getting removed.if you do both it will be unplayable

[witcher.3197]

Removing stun break from Invocation and Stability from Retribution is definitely gonna hurt every single build in a major way when it comes to surviving CC. Hope they revert them.

[Ovark.2514]

I am very happy with this change. Revs are one of the slipperiest classes atm.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

They did this too all classes, Stability and stunbreak nerfed across the board but in turn hard CC also lost damage so we'll see. It seems bad on paper, but while enemies will be able to lock you down more, they'll do far less damage.

It seems ArenaNet is trying to get players to focus on disabling each other instead of destroying outright, like in DAoC. The nerfs to damage and healing means that players will be wittled down slowly instead of making miraculous recoveries, while CC keeps less important targets out of the fight for significant periods of time while more important targets are dealt with.

I imagine the meta will change towards focusing down supports instead of DPSers.

[mortrialus.3062]

I've been thinking about advocating nerfing this trait but couldn't think of a way to do so without changing the whole thing. And I'm pleasantly surprised they did decide to straight up change it.

Glint Shiro is definitely too strong. But I don't think it's gross in terms of its overall damage, burst, or mobility. The main problem with Glint Shiro is that it has Team Fight carry damage like a scourge while having a defensive rotation that prevents it from being focused like a team fight damage carry.

And a decent part of it is stun break on Legend Swap. Now it's not as bad Elusive Mind before it got exhaustion added to it. Even though the dodge rolls are an effective 10 second cooldown to refill an endurance bar, Mirage did pull a lot a head due to Adventure Runes and running Energy Sigil on both weapon sets as well as massive vigor uptime at the time... but Stun Break on Legend Swap is in it's league in terms of just too much stun break access. You literally just can't lock down a rev the way you can currently CC and contain something like a Holosmith, Necro/Reaper, Core Guardian, Core Warrior, ect ect.

[Quadox.7834]

i agree it should instead get a 6 sec exhaustion if you break a stun with it

[Buran.3796]

@Ovark.2514 said:I am very happy with this change. Revs are one of the slipperiest classes atm.

Revs just got erased from PvP and WvW. With the nerfs in damage over all classes PvP will be again the realm of inmortal tanks, as was in the age of the celestial eles; since Revs lacks any good tank build and power Herald no longer will be able to kill other classes, they will njsut dissapear.

The change will be even more drastic in WvW, since the only reason to run Revs in zergs was use the hammers and range, and after a year of nerfs in the damage of Colescence of Ruin + multiple bugs which made it unconsistent now they doubled the cooldown, effectively halving the damage. So no longer reason to use Revs in team composition. They aren't but Waarriors with slower attacks that need to pay energy cost on top of longer cooldowns...

[apharma.3741]

Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

[Halikus.1406]

You already get extra 5 ultilities and 2 stun breaks base since every legend has at least one.You simply lost the broken one, 8 secs cd, why are you crying again?

[mrauls.6519]

@Hannelore.8153 said:They did this too all classes, Stability and stunbreak nerfed across the board but in turn hard CC also lost damage so we'll see. It seems bad on paper, but while enemies will be able to lock you down more, they'll do far less damage.

It seems ArenaNet is trying to get players to focus on disabling each other instead of destroying outright, like in DAoC. The nerfs to damage and healing means that players will be wittled down slowly instead of making miraculous recoveries, while CC keeps less important targets out of the fight for significant periods of time while more important targets are dealt with.

I imagine the meta will change towards focusing down supports instead of DPSers.

I hope you are right

[Stand The Wall.6987]

I think removing this would have been fine if it was just this, but the hit to shiro and this together doesn't sound good. altho when you think about it they were both kind of op...

[torben.1532]

I wouldn't even be mad About stunbreak nerfs but the way they did it was too much. Either get rid of legend swap stunbreak and leave the others as is or nerf the others and leave legend swap.

[apharma.3741]

No, this is needed, remember EVERYONE is getting this treatment in some way and if one class or skill gets missed by the hammer CMC, BenP and the rest of the devs we don't know about that have contributed to this shift are winding up.

[Za Shaloc.3908]

Sadly this and the Unwavering Avoidance change hit Ventari harder than any other legend. I am willing to adapt without Empty Vessel but the legend would benefit greatly from an actual stunbreak.

[torben.1532]

@apahrma.3741 Keep in mind that you cant just slap the same procedure on every single class as each of them is fundamentally different

[Buran.3796]

@apharma.3741 said:Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

Who cares about bursting anymore? you won't be able to beat 5 bunkers going for two control points. I don't think people will waste time in dps dealers anymore, since won't overcome team self-sustain.

[apharma.3741]

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

I don't think

Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

[Buran.3796]

@apharma.3741 said:

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

I don't think

Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

[apharma.3741]

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

I don't think

Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

I think it's had individual tests on the skills to see if they're in the right range for damage but to test all class interplay and relationships between skill interactions, stats, runes, sigils etc is far beyond even a well run company for a patch designed to set a new power level.

When it hits the playerbase of hundreds of thousands of people will be messing around with this, if we estimated they on average messed around for 3 hours each and said a conservative number of 100,000 players it's 300,000 hours of testing. How long would that take a team of 10 dedicated just to testing the changes? 30,000 hours or 375 days each.

That's without mentioning the different viewpoints, processes of thought, plans and wonky builds that get made by such a number of people playing and finding what's broken.

Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

[torben.1532]

The reason for why they showed what they intend to do is so People can give Feedback. That's exactly what my post is for.

[bhaldor.9837]

Im not a Rev main at all, but to remove Both stub break and Stability access is a bit shortsighted.

To those people complaining about revs stun break previously, remember Revs aren't able to select their skills. So unlike every other class they cannot put 2-3 stun breaks on their hotbar if needed.Not to mention Ventari doesn't have any stun breaks what so ever?... so stun break on legend swap was its only option.

[Buran.3796]

@"apharma.3741" said:

Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

They nerfed the damage and the access to abilities, the HP of each class remains the same. You won't be able to kill bunkers; +1 builds will be replaced by tanks, bruisers and support classes. Also I dont want "go for it", I have a main with no viable builds in the incoming new meta. I didn't swap from Guardian to Rev in HoT to being forced to play a tank again...

[LazySummer.2568]

Revs just need to think more carefully about saving their stunbreaks and energy for it instead of the current bs where they just spam Gaze of Darkness offensively for the broken instant cast blind + vul if they're in glint or spamming all their weapon skills for damage if they're in shrio because they can just legend swap to get away for free anyways. Good change.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@apharma.3741 said:

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

I don't think

Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

I think it's had individual tests on the skills to see if they're in the right range for damage but to test all class interplay and relationships between skill interactions, stats, runes, sigils etc is far beyond even a well run company for a patch designed to set a new power level.

When it hits the playerbase of hundreds of thousands of people will be messing around with this, if we estimated they on average messed around for 3 hours each and said a conservative number of 100,000 players it's 300,000 hours of testing. How long would that take a team of 10 dedicated just to testing the changes? 30,000 hours or 375 days each.

That's without mentioning the different viewpoints, processes of thought, plans and wonky builds that get made by such a number of people playing and finding what's broken.

Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

I will give you an usefull life tip.anet is a company.If YOU as a reasonable person, think that company ( anet ) should use X resources for something.then take 1/4 of those resources and thats propably more then they used.If you think that 10 developers were testing these changes, then I bet no more then 3 made any serious effort.

[apharma.3741]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@Buran.3796 said:

@apharma.3741 said:Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

I don't think

Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

I think it's had individual tests on the skills to see if they're in the right range for damage but to test all class interplay and relationships between skill interactions, stats, runes, sigils etc is far beyond even a well run company for a patch designed to set a new power level.

When it hits the playerbase of hundreds of thousands of people will be messing around with this, if we estimated they on average messed around for 3 hours each and said a conservative number of 100,000 players it's 300,000 hours of testing. How long would that take a team of 10 dedicated just to testing the changes? 30,000 hours or 375 days each.

That's without mentioning the different viewpoints, processes of thought, plans and wonky builds that get made by such a number of people playing and finding what's broken.

Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

I will give you an usefull life tip.anet is a company.If YOU as a reasonable person, think that company ( anet ) should use X resources for something.then take 1/4 of those resources and thats propably more then they used.If you think that 10 developers were testing these changes, then I bet no more then 3 made any serious effort.

Let me give you some free advise, don't take for verbatim that which is a hypothetical. The numbers were to demonstrate how absurd asking for this to be tested is.