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Laranthir? (spoilers)


Fenella.2634

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Though despite Laranthir's temporary retirement for unknown reasons. It is possible to cover this up with the lore reason being how Sylvari still suffers from the events of HoT public relations wise. As we learn in this Saga through some NPC dialogues, the events of HoT has greatly impacted people's opinions on Sylvari to a point some people just refuse to accept Sylvari ever again as people or friends even if they had a long positive history with them.

it is even worse that it is public knowledge now that Sylvari are Dragon Minions due to their origin being creations of Mordremoth which no doubt contributes to the continue mistrust towards Sylvaris even after Mordremoth's death.

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@"Aeon.4583" said:As it comes to Laranthir, it is highly possible that he took a leave of absence from Vigil for some time, Taking under consideration that Pale Tree is\was injured ( possibly cannot reproduce any longer ) and that Sylvari population been reduced around her, his presence in Grove will be more appropriate.

The Pale Tree is able to reproduce even though not entirely recovered according to the Notes from Rata Novus (gosh, was that hard to find as I couldn't remember where I saw it mentioned). And she did get somewhat better after regrowing the Caladbolg. It's been about four or five years in the game since those events so she migt be almost okay by now.

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

That said, I could see them taking Laranthir's leave and using this to open up either a Side Story where we share the news and learn a bit about the founding of the Vigil that involved Almorra's "darkest time" that LAranthir (which seems to have involved Jhavi, Rodrigez, Efut, and Fuji Shadowbane), or using this to bridge in some loose sylvari plot threads like Malyck, the Awakened Sylvari, and the Pale Reavers/Carys.This is what I have hopes for (although I'm afraid it won't be the case. But I'll let me dream for a while longer :) )

I'd also disagree that he's better as a small leader, he shows to be very tactical in the personal story imo.I agree with you here, he proved to be capable enough. However I've always had the impression he's not really interested in being the leader.


To lighten it up a little - I can totally see Laranthir when he's told about Almorra - /facepalm and says: "Oh thorns, first vacation in years and this is what happens..."

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Laranthir returning to the Grove could portend future developments there. As was pointed out, we're long overdue for an update on the status of the Pale Tree. And there's certainly plenty of room in however many episodes of LS5 we have left to make some story hops. Maybe we'll visit the Grove to rally additional Sylvari support, since they are likely more resistant to Jormag's whispers due to their origins. Or perhaps there are other events going on in the Grove which require Laranthir's presence; maybe the Pale Tree called him for some purpose, as she has done to other Sylvari. Or maybe he just needed a break; after all, even the most prominent leaders take time off every now and then.

One thing is for sure: when word of the crisis in Bjora reaches Laranthir in the Grove, he will almost certainly come running with reinforcements in tow. What happens when he gets to Bjora and finds Jhavi doing well and having the support of the local troops? Will she give him a smooth turnover of command and step back? Will she demand to maintain her position? Will he dutifully stand aside and leave Jhavi in charge for now so as not to be disruptive in the present crisis, or will he be resentful? What will the Vigil troops under the different commanders do? Lots of potential drama as the Vigil faces arguably the worst crisis of its existence.

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@Jimbru.6014 said:Laranthir returning to the Grove could portend future developments there. As was pointed out, we're long overdue for an update on the status of the Pale Tree. And there's certainly plenty of room in however many episodes of LS5 we have left to make some story hops. Maybe we'll visit the Grove to rally additional Sylvari support, since they are likely more resistant to Jormag's whispers due to their origins. Or perhaps there are other events going on in the Grove which require Laranthir's presence; maybe the Pale Tree called him for some purpose, as she has done to other Sylvari. Or maybe he just needed a break; after all, even the most prominent leaders take time off every now and then.

One thing is for sure: when word of the crisis in Bjora reaches Laranthir in the Grove, he will almost certainly come running with reinforcements in tow. What happens when he gets to Bjora and finds Jhavi doing well and having the support of the local troops? Will she give him a smooth turnover of command and step back? Will she demand to maintain her position? Will he dutifully stand aside and leave Jhavi in charge for now so as not to be disruptive in the present crisis, or will he be resentful? What will the Vigil troops under the different commanders do? Lots of potential drama as the Vigil faces arguably the worst crisis of its existence.

It's more likely that Arenanet forgot about him and that one note about his absence was just shoved into the game after players pointed out his absence.If noone had pointed it out, it's entirely that Arenanet wouldn't have put in that note.As for the pale tree, I doubt Arenanet will incorporate her into the story again anytime soon.Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

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I can't imagine Laranthir and Jhavi starting a fight over who leads the Vigil. If Laranthir even considers to return, I'm sure they will work this issue out peacefully and professionally. They have both been with the Vigil for a long time and both have had high positions for years. When you replay the personal story as a member of the Vigil, you will notice Jhavi being there even back then. She didn't have any dialogue, but she was already a named NPC.As for Laranthir, he has proven in the PS and especially in HoT that he stays loyal and on track even when faced with severe opposition and distrust within the Pact. I absolutely cannot imagine him risking the Vigil's unity by insisting on his personal position. OTOH, I'm not even sure Jhavi herself would want to lead the Vigil. We don't know all that much about her yet. So far, she seems to be more interested in her family's history than politics.

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@"Fueki.4753" said:Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

I believe some sylvari could be more resistent to Jormag's whispers. Specifically the HoT veterans, not because immunity, but because "been there, done that, not again". But the younger ones are probably just as vulnerable as anyone else.

@Fenella.2634 said:I can't imagine Laranthir and Jhavi starting a fight over who leads the Vigil. If Laranthir even considers to return, I'm sure they will work this issue out peacefully and professionally. They have both been with the Vigil for a long time and both have had high positions for years. When you replay the personal story as a member of the Vigil, you will notice Jhavi being there even back then. She didn't have any dialogue, but she was already a named NPC.As for Laranthir, he has proven in the PS and especially in HoT that he stays loyal and on track even when faced with severe opposition and distrust within the Pact. I absolutely cannot imagine him risking the Vigil's unity by insisting on his personal position. OTOH, I'm not even sure Jhavi herself would want to lead the Vigil. We don't know all that much about her yet. So far, she seems to be more interested in her family's history than politics.

I can't either. However I see Laranthir as the one who probably wouldn't even be interested in the leading position. Also, I'm not sure how bad is the after-Mordy distrust to the sylvari in the present, but if it's still an issue (or he sees it that way) Laranthir woud certainly step down to not compromise the order.

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  • 9 months later...

At least he is not forgotten, that was good to see. :)I hope the reason for his absence is not just "So Jhavi can become the new Vigil leader without serious discussion", though. I mean, we don't have to have those discussions on screen, but I think they should still happen within the Vigil. This is kind of an important matter to the order.

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Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

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@HotDelirium.7984 said:

Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

It has been implied that Sylvari were immune to corruption due to being minions of Mordremoth.I don't think it was directly stated anywhere though.

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@HotDelirium.7984 said:Maybe he got a new Wyld Hunt?

Voice actors don't usually have it in their contract that only they can voice that character do they?They could have hired a new voice actress for Zoija by now.

I wish they would, Zojja not having any role in a Primordus plot is going to be a serious disappointment.Specially now that we're going back to Rata Sum and having a whole Frost Legion Asura alliance going on.Zojja needs to come back into the story asap and if that means recasting her then just do it Anet, nobody will care at this point.

Someone said there was some dialogue of the Pale Tree still recovering?

There was yes, I don't remember exactly what was said but I think it was along the lines of, Wounds as deep as the ones she sustained will take a long time to fully heal but she's doing much better now.

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@Fueki.4753 said:

Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

It has been implied that Sylvari were immune to corruption due to being minions of Mordremoth.I don't think it was directly stated anywhere though.

Still a controversial topic, with Sylvari being immune because of being a dragon minion or because of the protection of the Pale Tree through the dream. It’s unfortunately still a topic we don’t have a concrete answer to.

I’m still of the opinion that it’s a combination of the two. As to date we haven’t seen another dragon minion be corrupted by another dragon( we got Subject Alpha, etc. because of Inquest meddling, blah blah, but still no actual evidence like what would happen if Kralkatorrik branded over a Risen while Zhaitan was alive.)

During the personal story, it was advised that the Sylvari were immune to the corruption of Zhaitan, which allowed the Pact a victory in Orr, among other reasons. Even in Caledon Forest you had Risen fighting right next to the Soundless village, (which should have no such protection) which produced no Risen Sylvari.

In Season 2, the Pale Tree spoke about that the reason the Sylvari were immune to dragon corruption was because of the Pale Trees protection. This is of course the Pale Trees reasoning without telling the other races that they are all dragon minions. This protection is also talking about Mordremoth’s corruption as well, mainly because you need to explain how a whole playable race isn’t immediately taken over by Mordremoth the very second it awakes.

Then you have Taimi advising that she thought dragon minions couldn’t be corrupted by other dragons in Season 4, but again no concrete answers, other then the reasoning from Taimi that maybe because Aurene absorbed Mordremoth’s energy as an egg.

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@Tyson.5160 said:

Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

It has been implied that Sylvari were immune to corruption due to being minions of Mordremoth.I don't think it was directly stated anywhere though.

Still a controversial topic, with Sylvari being immune because of being a dragon minion or because of the protection of the Pale Tree through the dream. It’s unfortunately still a topic we don’t have a concrete answer to.

I’m still of the opinion that it’s a combination of the two. As to date we haven’t seen another dragon minion be corrupted by another dragon( we got Subject Alpha, etc. because of Inquest meddling, blah blah, but still no actual evidence like what would happen if Kralkatorrik branded over a Risen while Zhaitan was alive.)

During the personal story, it was advised that the Sylvari were immune to the corruption of Zhaitan, which allowed the Pact a victory in Orr, among other reasons. Even in Caledon Forest you had Risen fighting right next to the Soundless village, (which should have no such protection) which produced no Risen Sylvari.

In Season 2, the Pale Tree spoke about that the reason the Sylvari were immune to dragon corruption was because of the Pale Trees protection. This is of course the Pale Trees reasoning without telling the other races that they are all dragon minions. This protection is also talking about Mordremoth’s corruption as well, mainly because you need to explain how a whole playable race isn’t immediately taken over by Mordremoth the very second it awakes.

Then you have Taimi advising that she thought dragon minions couldn’t be corrupted by other dragons in Season 4, but again no concrete answers, other then the reasoning from Taimi that maybe because Aurene absorbed Mordremoth’s energy as an egg.

Guess the closest thing we have is Caithe being kinda branded by Aurine and the Awakened Sylvari that Joko managed to enslave.The specifics of these are still unclear though, the latter we'll likely never get an answer for since Joko is probably nothing more than a pile of fertiliser on a mountain somewhere these days.

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@Teratus.2859 said:

Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

It has been implied that Sylvari were immune to corruption due to being minions of Mordremoth.I don't think it was directly stated anywhere though.

Still a controversial topic, with Sylvari being immune because of being a dragon minion or because of the protection of the Pale Tree through the dream. It’s unfortunately still a topic we don’t have a concrete answer to.

I’m still of the opinion that it’s a combination of the two. As to date we haven’t seen another dragon minion be corrupted by another dragon( we got Subject Alpha, etc. because of Inquest meddling, blah blah, but still no actual evidence like what would happen if Kralkatorrik branded over a Risen while Zhaitan was alive.)

During the personal story, it was advised that the Sylvari were immune to the corruption of Zhaitan, which allowed the Pact a victory in Orr, among other reasons. Even in Caledon Forest you had Risen fighting right next to the Soundless village, (which should have no such protection) which produced no Risen Sylvari.

In Season 2, the Pale Tree spoke about that the reason the Sylvari were immune to dragon corruption was because of the Pale Trees protection. This is of course the Pale Trees reasoning without telling the other races that they are all dragon minions. This protection is also talking about Mordremoth’s corruption as well, mainly because you need to explain how a whole playable race isn’t immediately taken over by Mordremoth the very second it awakes.

Then you have Taimi advising that she thought dragon minions couldn’t be corrupted by other dragons in Season 4, but again no concrete answers, other then the reasoning from Taimi that maybe because Aurene absorbed Mordremoth’s energy as an egg.

Guess the closest thing we have is Caithe being kinda branded by Aurine and the Awakened Sylvari that Joko managed to enslave.The specifics of these are still unclear though, the latter we'll likely never get an answer for since Joko is probably nothing more than a pile of fertiliser on a mountain somewhere these days.

That’s another oddity is that the Pale Tree protection that is allegedly suppose to protect the Sylvari from the Elder Dragons is defeated by Joko’s awakening magic. That’s unless that protection only extends to Mordremoth and that the other dragon’s can’t corrupt the Sylvari.

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@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@anninke.7469 said:Anyone else getting slightly hopeful that Laranthir's absence may have an actual reason after all?

No.

After what they did to the Spirits, the norn aspect of the Saga in general, and to my boy Smodur - zero faith in ANet's narrative capabilities. I'd prefer they not ruin Laranthir somehow as well.

Might be the wise thing to do. I'm afraid it will end up like that but I still can't not get my hopes up. Oh well, the dissapointment to come is my own doing I guess.

And slightly off-topic, I was not pleased by Aife coming all the way to the EotN and tell me almost the same thing we've been told for FIVE KITTEN YEARS about the Pale Tree's health.

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@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@anninke.7469 said:Anyone else getting slightly hopeful that Laranthir's absence may have an actual reason after all?

No.

After what they did to the Spirits, the norn aspect of the Saga in general, and to my boy Smodur - zero faith in ANet's narrative capabilities. I'd prefer they not ruin Laranthir somehow as well.

Well I guess they are right about one thing...its DEF the Icebrood saga and has NOTHING to do with the Norn ._.

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@anninke.7469 said:

@anninke.7469 said:Anyone else getting slightly hopeful that Laranthir's absence may have an actual reason after all?

No.

After what they did to the Spirits, the norn aspect of the Saga in general, and to my boy Smodur - zero faith in ANet's narrative capabilities. I'd prefer they not ruin Laranthir somehow as well.

Might be the wise thing to do. I'm afraid it will end up like that but I still can't not get my hopes up. Oh well, the dissapointment to come is my own doing I guess.

And slightly off-topic, I was not pleased by Aife coming all the way to the EotN and tell me almost the same thing we've been told for FIVE KITTEN YEARS about the Pale Tree's health.

Longest recovery ever.

I've always wondered though from a narrative perspective- the push and pull between doing what organically and logically would happen from characters and events to doing things slightly different for the sake of keeping it fresh and not treading the same old tropes?

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@Tyson.5160 said:

Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

It has been implied that Sylvari were immune to corruption due to being minions of Mordremoth.I don't think it was directly stated anywhere though.

Still a controversial topic, with Sylvari being immune because of being a dragon minion or because of the protection of the Pale Tree through the dream. It’s unfortunately still a topic we don’t have a concrete answer to.

I’m still of the opinion that it’s a combination of the two. As to date we haven’t seen another dragon minion be corrupted by another dragon( we got Subject Alpha, etc. because of Inquest meddling, blah blah, but still no actual evidence like what would happen if Kralkatorrik branded over a Risen while Zhaitan was alive.)

During the personal story, it was advised that the Sylvari were immune to the corruption of Zhaitan, which allowed the Pact a victory in Orr, among other reasons. Even in Caledon Forest you had Risen fighting right next to the Soundless village, (which should have no such protection) which produced no Risen Sylvari.

In Season 2, the Pale Tree spoke about that the reason the Sylvari were immune to dragon corruption was because of the Pale Trees protection. This is of course the Pale Trees reasoning without telling the other races that they are all dragon minions. This protection is also talking about Mordremoth’s corruption as well, mainly because you need to explain how a whole playable race isn’t immediately taken over by Mordremoth the very second it awakes.

Then you have Taimi advising that she thought dragon minions couldn’t be corrupted by other dragons in Season 4, but again no concrete answers, other then the reasoning from Taimi that maybe because Aurene absorbed Mordremoth’s energy as an egg.

Guess the closest thing we have is Caithe being kinda branded by Aurine and the Awakened Sylvari that Joko managed to enslave.The specifics of these are still unclear though, the latter we'll likely never get an answer for since Joko is probably nothing more than a pile of fertiliser on a mountain somewhere these days.

That’s another oddity is that the Pale Tree protection that is allegedly suppose to protect the Sylvari from the Elder Dragons is defeated by Joko’s awakening magic. That’s unless that protection only extends to Mordremoth and that the other dragon’s can’t corrupt the Sylvari.

Or Risen are different from Awakened. I think the protection is against unwillingly being corrupted, not complete immunity to necromancy.

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@Daniel Handler.4816 said:

Also, as we have seen with Caithe in Season 4, Sylvari are no longer immune to being corrupted by other dragons. Who's to say Aurene is the only one being able to convert other dragon's minions?

Was that due to the good Sylvari being microscopically still connected to Mordremoth ( a guess highly diluted but still dragon minions) before we killed him?

It has been implied that Sylvari were immune to corruption due to being minions of Mordremoth.I don't think it was directly stated anywhere though.

Still a controversial topic, with Sylvari being immune because of being a dragon minion or because of the protection of the Pale Tree through the dream. It’s unfortunately still a topic we don’t have a concrete answer to.

I’m still of the opinion that it’s a combination of the two. As to date we haven’t seen another dragon minion be corrupted by another dragon( we got Subject Alpha, etc. because of Inquest meddling, blah blah, but still no actual evidence like what would happen if Kralkatorrik branded over a Risen while Zhaitan was alive.)

During the personal story, it was advised that the Sylvari were immune to the corruption of Zhaitan, which allowed the Pact a victory in Orr, among other reasons. Even in Caledon Forest you had Risen fighting right next to the Soundless village, (which should have no such protection) which produced no Risen Sylvari.

In Season 2, the Pale Tree spoke about that the reason the Sylvari were immune to dragon corruption was because of the Pale Trees protection. This is of course the Pale Trees reasoning without telling the other races that they are all dragon minions. This protection is also talking about Mordremoth’s corruption as well, mainly because you need to explain how a whole playable race isn’t immediately taken over by Mordremoth the very second it awakes.

Then you have Taimi advising that she thought dragon minions couldn’t be corrupted by other dragons in Season 4, but again no concrete answers, other then the reasoning from Taimi that maybe because Aurene absorbed Mordremoth’s energy as an egg.

Guess the closest thing we have is Caithe being kinda branded by Aurine and the Awakened Sylvari that Joko managed to enslave.The specifics of these are still unclear though, the latter we'll likely never get an answer for since Joko is probably nothing more than a pile of fertiliser on a mountain somewhere these days.

That’s another oddity is that the Pale Tree protection that is allegedly suppose to protect the Sylvari from the Elder Dragons is defeated by Joko’s awakening magic. That’s unless that protection only extends to Mordremoth and that the other dragon’s can’t corrupt the Sylvari.

Or Risen are different from Awakened. I think the protection is against unwillingly being corrupted, not complete immunity to necromancy.

Well one is dragon corruption, the other is being reanimated and bound to the will of Joko, which although being different is similar to Zhaitan.

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