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Balance Update Update - WvW


Cal Cohen.2358

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@"MELORD.5013" said:nerf Siege/Condi Rev/Banners all should be good ?This is the WvW post, condi rev isn't a thing (yet?). Conditions on revenant mace+axe are toned down anyway."Searing Fissure: Adjusted initial burning from 3 stacks for 3 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds. Increased additional burning duration from 1 second to 4 seconds""Temporal Rift: Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.01. Adjusted torment from 2 stacks for 12 seconds to 1 stack for 1 second""Scorchrazor: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.01. Reduced burning duration from 4 seconds to 1 second"

@"XiTe.1079" said:Thank you very much that you are reconsidering the changes towards the stab mantra and stand your ground, however please dont forget about the boon duration - 1 second is just waaaay too less for the amount of immob/cc there is in the game currently.

More Feedback:

Winds of disenchantment: The problem of the skill is not the amount of boons it strip and that it stops boon uptime or the amount of targets it can hit. The only, big issue with this elite is that you can move with it. I really would like to see the stationary version back into the game. This would be enough balance, as you can properly kite it, rather than being chased by 2-5 at once and cant get out of it, literally obliberating whole squads.Also you said you that you want make CDs matter - this would do the trick with this elite.Current state, and it wont change after the patch, warriors just have to shut down their brain, activate "Defiance Stance" and bubble run onto the enemy and there till its over.By changing it back to stationary, you would really have to think about the placement again, reading enemy movement and so on - making it really matter again.

Merciful Intervention: In my opinion, giving wvw the pvp version of this skill is a mistake. Its pretty much the only reliable skill to properly save one or two players in large scale fights.The way to counter bubbles is generally CC , as interrupts stop the bubble. That's why scrapper hammers (Thunderclap specifically) are very useful, provided the spellbreaker doesn't have massive amounts of stability : all leap combos in that lightning field are dazes. In addition, unblockable reaper's mark from necromancers/scourges/reapers can fear the spellbreakers if there is no stability ; likewise with heralds' Surge of the Mists knockback , Drop the Hammer knockdowns, and other warriors' Earthshaker / Backbreaker.

People were clamoring for no downstate, making MI much weaker is sort of a way to achieve that.

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@Infusion.7149 said:

@"MELORD.5013" said:nerf Siege/Condi Rev/Banners all should be good ?This is the WvW post, condi rev isn't a thing (yet?). Conditions on revenant mace+axe are toned down anyway."Searing Fissure: Adjusted initial burning from 3 stacks for 3 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds. Increased additional burning duration from 1 second to 4 seconds""Temporal Rift: Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.01. Adjusted torment from 2 stacks for 12 seconds to 1 stack for 1 second""Scorchrazor: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.01. Reduced burning duration from 4 seconds to 1 second"it is a thing at least in wvw roaming the build was made by souls a TP baron he streams it on twitch

he said that the build will be the best roaming build after balance patch since they didn't look at it that much , who knows ?

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@SnowHawk.3615 said:could you like nerf all damage types? it would really improve on the player base depending on dmg to do dmg. thanks! also please take away steal/swipe completely from thieves, the don't need it.

Cal pay attention to this, u may as well just throw the game in the trash if ur going to let this community steer the balance of the game. Are you and the team not up to the task? If not please resign now and let a real team do the balancing. I had hope for this team but their literal amateur's that are relying on the community to make the decisions for them lol and one look at 90% of the community posts regarding balance any one SHOULD be able to realize which their the last people to let steer the game. Good luck cal, ur gonna need it for the short time left gw2 is gonna be around with ur team at the helm.

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@Karnasis.6892 said:

@"Anput.4620" said:

You also seem to be nerfing Deadeye when the concern is actual builds to be too good for Thief, like condi DD or sword DD, not cheese builds which will now be gutted to unviability when the backstab build folded to any tanky target. My concern being that balancing is done from the bottom up instead of from the top down.

I mean, you said it right there "cheese builds". Anything that is truly awful to fight because it can't be beaten by player skill on any class. My personal thoughts would be like Perma stealth Deadeye. Yes it can be beaten, but you have to somehow be a god tier player (or just very lucky) to catch them imo. I'm an average player and I can't beat it. However I am also playing the wrong class to be able to compete with them (mesmer). My understanding is necros have a really good chance to take em out, but even then it's not a guarantee.

permastealth is bleh imo just in general, no matter the class.

Mesmer is about the best class against power rifle deadeye because they have zero AoE and can't outrun a Mesmer, just drop a crapton of condi's on them and see what happens. Holo's also do fine as they can jump on them, use the reveal and burst them before they shadow meld.

Cheese doesn't mean strong, it just means that it kills unskilled players/bad builds easilly.

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What about armor of earth? The problem was not the stab support nerf it was the nerfing all of the classes build in support but not applying that same nerf to the support version if keeping with the logic of this update.

The problem with the stab balancing in this game is that all of the support is on one class every other classes have next to nothing if any at all. An ele giving 1 stack of stab on a 2 sec duration at 240 range is nothing it may cause more harm then good if a necro hits it making it into a fear. Look at Rock solid is needs a massive update way before any thing else ele has and any other stab effect in this game.

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there are some interesting things, cheer up!On the other hand the problem with "Assassin's Signet Active", in WvW (only) I specify.All the classes whose thief has access to too much power, precision and ferocity in Wvw, because of his equipment, runes, sigil, food, oils, skill and trait + stealth attack (crit obligatory with weapon swap on Superior Sigil of Vision) compared to pvp.And so it will always one shot in time in WvW with a stealth attack (Backstab or Death's Judgment) that always crit with swap weapon.

Increased the CD in Wvw is not the problem, maybe can be prevented from using " Active signets" by being stealthy.(sneak attacks with crit obligatory do enough damage already in WvW, no need to be up domages with "Assassin's Signet Active".)

It may be small, but a sneaky one-shot isn't a fight, it's an execution. It's not fun.

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@"Cal Cohen.2358" said:General balance concernswe’ll be continuing to iterate as we gather more data and feedback based on actual gameplay. We’re prepared to act quickly in response to anything egregious that pops up, whether it’s an individual build greatly overperforming or a heavy skew of the meta in any particular fashion (unkillable tanks, dominant condition builds pushing out any power builds, etc).

Remember the permastealth trapper build?!The wvw comunity asked to look into it for a year,based on actual gameplay.Got fixed only the day after a guy solo killed Slothasor with it

So yea cant wait to see the godlike "reaction time speed" in 2020

! you are not prepared

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@Infusion.7149 said:

@"MELORD.5013" said:nerf Siege/Condi Rev/Banners all should be good ?This is the WvW post, condi rev isn't a thing (yet?). Conditions on revenant mace+axe are toned down anyway."Searing Fissure: Adjusted initial burning from 3 stacks for 3 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds. Increased additional burning duration from 1 second to 4 seconds""Temporal Rift: Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.01. Adjusted torment from 2 stacks for 12 seconds to 1 stack for 1 second""Scorchrazor: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.01. Reduced burning duration from 4 seconds to 1 second"

@"XiTe.1079" said:Thank you very much that you are reconsidering the changes towards the
stab mantra
and
stand your ground
, however please dont forget about the boon duration - 1 second is just waaaay too less for the amount of immob/cc there is in the game currently.

More Feedback:

Winds of disenchantment:
The problem of the skill is not the amount of boons it strip and that it stops boon uptime or the amount of targets it can hit. The only, big issue with this elite is that you can move with it. I really would like to see the stationary version back into the game. This would be enough balance, as you can properly kite it, rather than being chased by 2-5 at once and cant get out of it, literally obliberating whole squads.Also you said you that you want make CDs matter - this would do the trick with this elite.Current state, and it wont change after the patch, warriors just have to shut down their brain, activate "Defiance Stance" and bubble run onto the enemy and there till its over.By changing it back to stationary, you would really have to think about the placement again, reading enemy movement and so on - making it really matter again.

Merciful Intervention
: In my opinion, giving wvw the pvp version of this skill is a mistake. Its pretty much the only reliable skill to properly save one or two players in large scale fights.The way to counter bubbles is generally CC , as interrupts stop the bubble. That's why scrapper hammers (Thunderclap specifically) are very useful, provided the spellbreaker doesn't have massive amounts of stability : all leap combos in that lightning field are dazes. In addition, unblockable reaper's mark from necromancers/scourges/reapers can fear the spellbreakers if there is no stability ; likewise with heralds' Surge of the Mists knockback , Drop the Hammer knockdowns, and other warriors' Earthshaker / Backbreaker.

People were clamoring for no downstate, making MI much weaker is sort of a way to achieve that.

OR maybe just convert that stab into fear :wink:

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@Infusion.7149 said:The way to counter bubbles is generally CC , as interrupts stop the bubble. That's why scrapper hammers (Thunderclap specifically) are very useful, ...

It will be even more useful with the patch when taking explosives!Since it does no impact on its initial dazing hit but brings you infight, you get the Explosive Entrance buff for its first damage tick.That means your stun is followed by an AoE daze 1s afterward if you take the Flashbang trait.

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@"Frax.4562" said:Winds of Disenchantment still needs a look at, it's a welcome change that it's only 5 targets now, but it's one of the most obnoxious skill in the game with the trait enchantment collapse especially when a group has a lot of spellbreakers. A tweak to it's duration or boon removal interval would be good, with enchantment collapse trait getting a higher than 1s icd.

It's close to impossible to do anything when the enemies just rush you with more bubbles when they are bigger, and then when the duration goes down, they come with another set of bubbles and keep repeating it (effectively chaining bubbles) until you are dead and there's not much to do about it at that point. It hurts the smaller groups.

This is so true! It's ridiculous that one spell can take out an entire opposing squad without anyone else on the attacking squad doing much of anything. Just waves of bubbles and everyone is dead. How is that considered WvW fighting?

That said, I have to admit, I'm disgusted by all this "balancing" in WvW. Seriously, if you guys spent half your time on new content for us that you spend on "balancing" we'd be thrilled. Every effort you begin fizzles and dies a quick death and the last "A Message from Andrew Gray" posting didn't mention ANYTHING for WvW. I guess we are getting the message loud and clear that you want us to find a new realm vs. realm game?

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@DeLys.5380 said:

@"Frax.4562" said:Winds of Disenchantment still needs a look at, it's a welcome change that it's only 5 targets now, but it's one of the most obnoxious skill in the game with the trait enchantment collapse especially when a group has a lot of spellbreakers. A tweak to it's duration or boon removal interval would be good, with enchantment collapse trait getting a higher than 1s icd.

It's close to impossible to do anything when the enemies just rush you with more bubbles when they are bigger, and then when the duration goes down, they come with another set of bubbles and keep repeating it (effectively chaining bubbles) until you are dead and there's not much to do about it at that point. It hurts the smaller groups.

This is so true! It's ridiculous that one spell can take out an entire opposing squad without anyone else on the attacking squad doing much of anything. Just waves of bubbles and everyone is dead. How is that considered WvW fighting?

That said, I have to admit, I'm disgusted by all this "balancing" in WvW. Seriously, if you guys spent half your time on new content for us that you spend on "balancing" we'd be thrilled. Every effort you begin fizzles and dies a quick death and the last "
" posting didn't mention ANYTHING for WvW. I guess we are getting the message loud and clear that you want us to find a new realm vs. realm game?That has nothing to do with the bubble itself and everything with how utterly dependant todays meta zerg is on boons, to the point where they die if they loose the boons.

And coincidentally, it seems like boons are being substantially cut in the patch. Will it do anything? Who knows, zergs are running on like 1000%+ boon duration overcapacity so even a 50% nerf will probably have marginal impact.

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