Why is Berserker Stance getting increased to 40 secs?

[Lonecap.4105]

It's not even a stunbreak and provides 4 seconds of resistance as the only thing it does. Ok yeah it pulses adrenaline, whatever, great. Keep this at 30 seconds please. OR make it break stun in addition.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:It's not even a stunbreak and provides 4 seconds of resistance as the only thing it does. Ok yeah it pulses adrenaline, whatever, great. Keep this at 30 seconds please. OR make it break stun in addition.

I have no idea either, but they're increasing CDs relatively across the board and I think the 4s of resistance is one of the reasons for the CD increase.

[sneakytails.5629]

Yeah it needs an update, I would only use Berserker Stance when facing oppressive condi builds. Even then it had to be combined with other layers of condi cleanse to really have a place on my bar. By itself it is really quite weak and the current 30 second cooldown is too long in the current game.

There will be frustrated power players moving to condi bunker post patch and changes like this will only encourage that to return.

[Girth.9731]

They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

[Lonecap.4105]

@Girth.9731 said:They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

Excellent ideas. I like the protection and resistance idea tbh.

[Girth.9731]

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Girth.9731 said:They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

Excellent ideas. I like the protection and resistance idea tbh.

I think it would be cool too, and tbh pretty balanced. Then you would be comparing 5s of protection against 5s of superspeed and a stun break on a 5s longer cooldown. I feel like this is pretty in-line in terms of power level.

[Girth.9731]

@Girth.9731 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Girth.9731 said:They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

Excellent ideas. I like the protection and resistance idea tbh.

I think it would be cool too, and tbh pretty balanced. Then you would be comparing 5s of protection against 5s of superspeed and a stun break on a 5s longer cooldown. I feel like this is pretty in-line in terms of power level.

Also, another thing to consider is that Anet can't add too much to the skill because Last Stand still exists and would probably lead to it being really overloaded if you took the trait. Once Last Stand is reworked then they will be more free to play with the skill. Until then, just don't use it.

[Aigleborgne.2981]

@Girth.9731 said:

@Girth.9731 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Girth.9731 said:They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

Excellent ideas. I like the protection and resistance idea tbh.

I think it would be cool too, and tbh pretty balanced. Then you would be comparing 5s of protection against 5s of superspeed and a stun break on a 5s longer cooldown. I feel like this is pretty in-line in terms of power level.

Also, another thing to consider is that Anet can't add too much to the skill because Last Stand still exists and would probably lead to it being really overloaded if you took the trait. Once Last Stand is reworked then they will be more free to play with the skill. Until then, just don't use it.

Last Stand is as good as dead with 300s cooldown.Protection wouldn't fit the stance's name. It should have an offensive part. Adrenaline gain is sometimes useless, but there are still times I struggle to fill my 3 bars. It all depends on your build.

Overall, this stance is not that bad, just we have better utilities.

[Yasai.3549]

Considering some builds don't even use Berserker's stance, I don't even know why they nerfed it.

In most cases, Featherfoot Grace is picked over it specifically because it has a Stunbreak on it.

The only thing Berserker's Stance has for it is it pulses Resistance which makes it resistant to Corrupts, if not, most people will willingly pop Healing Signet for Resistance and Heal because they can still Regen through Adrenal Health.

[RedShark.9548]

@Yasai.3549 said:Considering some builds don't even use Berserker's stance, I don't even know why they nerfed it.

In most cases, Featherfoot Grace is picked over it specifically because it has a Stunbreak on it.

The only thing Berserker's Stance has for it is it pulses Resistance which makes it resistant to Corrupts, if not, most people will willingly pop Healing Signet for Resistance and Heal because they can still Regen through Adrenal Health.

Most ppl, atleast in pvp, dont play defense, so no adrenal health.

They pop healing sig because the dmg thats being negated by resistance far outshines the healing it could have provided with those 344hp ticks.

Never rly was a fan of berserker stance, especially in the times were condis simply outlasted resistance and you died to them if you couldnt cleanse in time.

Might change now that condi durationstats were gutted in pvp. Still a boring skill tho.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Perhaps a way of thinking about it is that Berserker's Stance, Featherfoot Grace, and Healing Signet can all be used for very long Resistance uptime.

[Girth.9731]

@Aigleborgne.2981 said:

@Girth.9731 said:

@Girth.9731 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Girth.9731 said:They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

Excellent ideas. I like the protection and resistance idea tbh.

I think it would be cool too, and tbh pretty balanced. Then you would be comparing 5s of protection against 5s of superspeed and a stun break on a 5s longer cooldown. I feel like this is pretty in-line in terms of power level.

Also, another thing to consider is that Anet can't add too much to the skill because Last Stand still exists and would probably lead to it being really overloaded if you took the trait. Once Last Stand is reworked then they will be more free to play with the skill. Until then, just don't use it.

Last Stand is as good as dead with 300s cooldown.Protection wouldn't fit the stance's name. It should have an offensive part. Adrenaline gain is sometimes useless, but there are still times I struggle to fill my 3 bars. It all depends on your build.

Overall, this stance is not that bad, just we have better utilities.

Remember, they have said Last Stand, Defy Pain, and passive proc traits like these are being reworked when the design team gets to it. For now, these cooldowns are basically the balance team saying "don't use these traits".

[RedShark.9548]

@Aigleborgne.2981 said:

@Girth.9731 said:

@Girth.9731 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Girth.9731 said:They probably should have increased the number of pulses to 5 to MAYBE put it on par with Featherfoot's Grace. Lucky, I don't think condi is going to be very good post-patch so we probably don't have to worry. Problem is, the adrenaline gain is just so low value and rarely necessary. Having an extra second of resistance, superspeed, and a stunbreak for only a 5s longer cooldown is just a no-brainer. I would consider changing the number of pulses to 5, remove the adrenaline gain, and add some other unique benefit to the differentiate skill. Maybe some short duration pulsing might to give it a little offensive potential? Kind of fits the theme. Or maybe even 1s pulses of protection? I feel like a skill that gives resistance and protection would be pretty unique, and Warrior doesn't have many ways to generate protection.

Excellent ideas. I like the protection and resistance idea tbh.

I think it would be cool too, and tbh pretty balanced. Then you would be comparing 5s of protection against 5s of superspeed and a stun break on a 5s longer cooldown. I feel like this is pretty in-line in terms of power level.

Also, another thing to consider is that Anet can't add too much to the skill because Last Stand still exists and would probably lead to it being really overloaded if you took the trait. Once Last Stand is reworked then they will be more free to play with the skill. Until then, just don't use it.

Last Stand is as good as dead with 300s cooldown.Protection wouldn't fit the stance's name. It should have an offensive part. Adrenaline gain is sometimes useless, but there are still times I struggle to fill my 3 bars. It all depends on your build.

Overall, this stance is not that bad, just we have better utilities.

It should taunt all longbow rangers on the map, so the torch wont reach the wall of helms deep.

[felix.2386]

they increasing defensive cooldowns for overall less sustain.also they nerfing condition duration by a lot

so good they nerfed defy pain and last stand, two of the most noob-friendly trait ever existed for warrior.so is all auto proc stab, invuln, evade

[Aigleborgne.2981]

@"lighter.2708" said:so good they nerfed defy pain and last stand, two of the most noob-friendly trait ever existed for warrior.so is all auto proc stab, invuln, evade

It's not like you have much choice in defense anyways.

Defy pain is most likely better than other master choices. Power attack is not great and the last one requires using a mace.

Last stand is nice for its active effects. I especially like it with frenzy stance. Cleansing ire is only good if you have cleanse issues. And Rousing is currently great, but not sure after nerf.

What strikes me is they always delay changes. Nobody is gonna use those 300s cooldowns. We might stick with them for months. Less build diversity.

I am not happy with their choice of nerfing sustain skills or traits. When you are playing melee, you definitly need more sustain than the backline.If those changes encourage melee to get toughness or vitality, it will lower their offensive power, something that defensive skills did not.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

@Aigleborgne.2981 said:

@"lighter.2708" said:so good they nerfed defy pain and last stand, two of the most noob-friendly trait ever existed for warrior.so is all auto proc stab, invuln, evade

It's not like you have much choice in defense anyways.

Defy pain is most likely better than other master choices. Power attack is not great and the last one requires using a mace.

Power Attack needs a big over haul. Sundering Mace is good, but only if you go for a full lockdown build, which will be better and easier to do post patch.

Last stand is nice for its active effects. I especially like it with frenzy stance. Cleansing ire is only good if you have cleanse issues. And Rousing is currently great, but not sure after nerf.

RR is getting a healing nerf, but you can still use it with Tempest Runes, which were not nerfed, for some decent healing. With the 1000 toughness it should still be as useful as it is now pre-patch

What strikes me is they always delay changes. Nobody is gonna use those 300s cooldowns. We might stick with them for months. Less build diversity.

The balance team can only change numbers, they can't utterly revamp skills and traits. The Dev team has to do that, which requires more testing on their part. The 300s CD is a placeholder for the time being, because the point is to stop their use during that period.

I am not happy with their choice of nerfing sustain skills or traits. When you are playing melee, you definitly need more sustain than the backline.If those changes encourage melee to get toughness or vitality, it will lower their offensive power, something that defensive skills did not.

All damage and sustain got dropped across the board, not just warrior's. The ratio of incoming damage and level of sustain has not changed (excluding Defy Pain and Last Stand nerfs).

If anything it will be safer to run full glass post patch than pre patch, which means there is more breathing room for different stats to find their place in the meta. Sentinel's is going to tanky AF post patch for instance, and can be useful for a Spellbreaker in a Zerg who's only focus is to strip boons, which does not require offensive stats. Meanwhile a Berserker can dive in, lay down a double Arc Divider, and GTFO a bit more easily than before and go back to pew pewing with a rifle from the backline.

[Aigleborgne.2981]

@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:Power Attack needs a big over haul. Sundering Mace is good, but only if you go for a full lockdown build, which will be better and easier to do post patch.

Like I said, if you use mace. For any dps warrior, you will be force to take Power Attack if you pick defense. IMO, defense will loose its value for any offensive build.

RR is getting a healing nerf, but you can still use it with Tempest Runes, which were not nerfed, for some decent healing. With the 1000 toughness it should still be as useful as it is now pre-patch

I agree, especially if healing nerf is on par with all those damage nerfs.

balance team can only change numbers, they can't utterly revamp skills and traits. The Dev team has to do that, which requires more testing on their part. The 300s CD is a placeholder for the time being, because the point is to stop their use during that period.

Still, we regularly see revamp skills and traits. Look at revenant revamps next patch.I would rather wait one more months and have new traits to replace passive ones.How many months we will wait for them? We can assume it will 3 at least and it could easily be 6.3 months with unusable traits for every professions, for 2 game modes over 3.

If anything it will be safer to run full glass post patch than pre patch, which means there is more breathing room for different stats to find their place in the meta. Sentinel's is going to tanky AF post patch for instance, and can be useful for a Spellbreaker in a Zerg who's only focus is to strip boons, which does not require offensive stats. Meanwhile a Berserker can dive in, lay down a double Arc Divider, and GTFO a bit more easily than before and go back to pew pewing with a rifle from the backline.

I agree with spellbreaker but berserker is not going to kill anyone with damage nerf, at least not with double arc divider.They have nerfed cooldowns on all defensive skills (endure pain, dolyak, balance, shake it off). Beeing disabled in a zerg is a death sentence if you run berserker stats. Stunbreak have been shut down, outrage from 10 to 25s!We will see how it changes battles, but I fear the worst.However, it should be better in small scale battles and roaming.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

@Aigleborgne.2981 said:

@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:Power Attack needs a big over haul. Sundering Mace is good, but only if you go for a full lockdown build, which will be better and easier to do post patch.

Like I said, if you use mace. For any dps warrior, you will be force to take Power Attack if you pick defense. IMO, defense will loose its value for any offensive build.

RR is getting a healing nerf, but you can still use it with Tempest Runes, which were not nerfed, for some decent healing. With the 1000 toughness it should still be as useful as it is now pre-patch

I agree, especially if healing nerf is on par with all those damage nerfs.

balance team can only change numbers, they can't utterly revamp skills and traits. The Dev team has to do that, which requires more testing on their part. The 300s CD is a placeholder for the time being, because the point is to stop their use during that period.

Still, we regularly see revamp skills and traits. Look at revenant revamps next patch.I would rather wait one more months and have new traits to replace passive ones.How many months we will wait for them? We can assume it will 3 at least and it could easily be 6.3 months with unusable traits for every professions, for 2 game modes over 3.

Because with all the damage nerfs leaving these skills as is would create unkillable warriors and rangers until the revamps are rolled out.

If anything it will be safer to run full glass post patch than pre patch, which means there is more breathing room for different stats to find their place in the meta. Sentinel's is going to tanky AF post patch for instance, and can be useful for a Spellbreaker in a Zerg who's only focus is to strip boons, which does not require offensive stats. Meanwhile a Berserker can dive in, lay down a double Arc Divider, and GTFO a bit more easily than before and go back to pew pewing with a rifle from the backline.

I agree with spellbreaker but berserker is not going to kill anyone with damage nerf, at least not with double arc divider.They have nerfed cooldowns on all defensive skills (endure pain, dolyak, balance, shake it off). Beeing disabled in a zerg is a death sentence if you run berserker stats. Stunbreak have been shut down, outrage from 10 to 25s!We will see how it changes battles, but I fear the worst.However, it should be better in small scale battles and roaming.

If you're diving in as a Berserker you'll take some stab to get in and pop Headbutt with Savage Instinct traited. SI will break the stun and give you 1s of invulnerability to get into Berserk Mode pop Arc Divider, BR, then another Arc Divider then WWA out of there. If you timed it right there should be downs for your zerg to finish off, and if you didn't there should still be downs to rally off of if you drop. Balanced Stance and/or Endure Pain can still be used if you need them to get the burst off and get out. Should still be easy if you keep attention on your boons to see when you have Resistance, Stability, Protection, and Quickness up and take advantage of a push.