If the new balance patch is supposed to be decreasing damage by just about 33%...

[Kodama.6453]

@"Anput.4620" said:

It is all abouth how well it does something, not what it does. This sounds like when poeple in TCG's call control decks bad because they are "not fun" even though they are balanced. I don't believe in things like unfun/fun etc, just balance based on raw performance.

You should never balance solely around raw performance if you are designing a game. I will give you an extreme example:I create a new skill for the game. It is an auto attack and has the following effect: "If this attack connects, there is a 50/50 chance to either instantly kill my targeted opponent or myself."

By raw performance, this skill will have a 50% chance to win a battle. Might seem balanced, but this clearly is not a healthy design in the slightest.

[Anput.4620]

@Kodama.6453 said:

@"Anput.4620" said:

It is all abouth

how well

it does something, not

what

it does. This sounds like when poeple in TCG's call control decks bad because they are "not fun" even though they are balanced. I don't believe in things like unfun/fun etc, just balance based on raw performance.

You should never balance solely around raw performance if you are designing a game. I will give you an extreme example:I create a new skill for the game. It is an auto attack and has the following effect: "If this attack connects, there is a 50/50 chance to either instantly kill my targeted opponent or myself."

By raw performance, this skill will have a 50% chance to win a battle. Might seem balanced, but this clearly is not a healthy design in the slightest.

But RNG is also bad, inconsistent performance.

[Kodama.6453]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Kodama.6453 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

It is all abouth

how well

it does something, not

what

it does. This sounds like when poeple in TCG's call control decks bad because they are "not fun" even though they are balanced. I don't believe in things like unfun/fun etc, just balance based on raw performance.

You should never balance solely around raw performance if you are designing a game. I will give you an extreme example:I create a new skill for the game. It is an auto attack and has the following effect: "If this attack connects, there is a 50/50 chance to either instantly kill my targeted opponent or myself."

By raw performance, this skill will have a 50% chance to win a battle. Might seem balanced, but this clearly is not a healthy design in the slightest.

But RNG is also bad, inconsistent performance.

All I am saying is that raw performance should not be the only factor for balancing.If you have game mechanics which are extremely frustrating to deal with, then this with have negative effects on the game you are designing.

You can say that such a mechanic might be balanced when it comes to power, proven by the raw performance. But if a mechanic starts to become more and more frustrating to deal with for the big majority of players, then the mechanic should probably get reworked or nerfed.

Keep in mind that game design is a business. Factors like "fun/unfun" definitely are important to consider, because you are delivering a product and if said product just frustrates the majority of it's consumers, then you won't be very successful with your design.

[Aihao.5824]

why all want to nerf deadeye? he was the only solution vs bunkerplayers, and is weak vs mobile classes cuz of lack of survivability.Thief is a high risk and no rewards profession, compared to others. Now Anet made lower sustain that makes pvp pathetic.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

I use the Poison stacking build on Daredevil, not Deadeye, but I still think it was nerfed just way too much. The Thief already struggles with allocating points into everything they need, and now you have to work even harder to get those numbers up.

I don't use stealth much, and I don't have a high opinion of it, due to what it does to the class. Mesmer and Thief are balanced entirely around their class mechanic even though neither class has to use it, and many alternate builds are viable

Meanwhile classes like Guardian (especially FB) can play any role they want.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

Now as a newish condi rifle DE WvW'er (started late Dec - early Jan) the Condi Rifle poison stacking immobilizing DE has a lot of weaknesses and relies on its non perma stealth re-positioning to counter it.

Condi DE rifle doesn't usually run Trickery, thus they are reducing the init pool they have. If they are running trickery, they are nerfing their own damage/survivability.

If you can do one of the following, you can beat the condi rifle DE:

1.) Projectile hate: The guardians 1 minute reflect wall (exaggeration ofc as it does last a while) is a pain. Warrior shield reflecting while he moves is a pain, pewpew druids/soulbeasts are a pain (wilderness survival ftw), ele's with all their reflects and such. There's more than these but this is just an example

2.) Resistance/condi clears: Condi Rifle DE's rely on poison for their damage (maybe bleed or torment on the side pending on stolen skill but mainly poison). cleanse it and you blue ball them of any kills. They will blow their initiative thus leaving them open for the sweet release of death.

3.) Pets/Minions: Pain in my but when fighting a minion master or on a lesser scale, a ranger. A lot of the poison damage comes from a build up of stacks. 1 stack gets used per target hit. If you hit 2 minions and the master (Player), you just wasted 2 stacks and necro shrugs off the damage a lot faster.

4.) Reveal: This one may seem obvious and you may think "But the DE can use the elite to re-stealth themselves". While that may be true, however the warmup on that skill is long enough to burst them down. On top of that, DH's and Spellbreaker's have a tether that is essentially a reveal as long as they are tethered.

5.) CC: If you can CC us (channeled CC for example) as we are going into stealth, you just made us waste stealth which is important for damage and survivability. Immob them and same thing.

5.) Sentries/Towers: Marked is def working as intended as this is the rightful bane of any stealth using thief. More DE than the others.

The DE works best when you are preoccupied with something as it increases their chances of landing their condi immob burst. If you see one in a GvG fight picking at the stragglers, focus them. If you let one freecast they can and will down just about anyone.

[Widmo.3186]

Deadeye is the most unhealthy spec in gw2, change my mind. Previously MBS, skill without counterplay allowing to oneshot ppl, now because of patch providing lack of damage on some classes maybe you can't oneshot ppl anymore but as well can't be killed, its like a pewpew ranger but with better mobility and bigger stealth access.

As we all know, condi builds are usually more annoying than power builds, so combining DE with Condi makes...well, unhealthy^2?