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Official Feedback Thread about Build and Equipment Templates


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the revert button is going to be the best they would be able to do with the system they have in place. lets be honest they are not going to rework it from the ground up.

That being said I would like some update on the other issues mentioned please. I don't care about the monetisation we all know that is not going to change.

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@"Fire Attunement.9835" said:I have another update for you on what we're working on for Build and Equipment Templates. As mentioned in a previous post, one thing we've been working on is a way to give you all greater flexibility when making experimental changes to templates. That's almost ready, and a Revert button for changes to templates will be shipping with the February 25 build. This feature will work a bit like a restore point: Clicking it will return everything back to the way it was when you first loaded up a build.

So instead fixing the "templates" you did give us an addiontional button that we can press so that we can manual fix the way the templates are working in this game? How about you just change the name to loadouts and than then they are accting exactly the way it should. Keep in mind that this should be a QoL improvement that should help us to REDUCE the amount of mouse-clicks. At the moment it is INCREASING the amount of mouse clicks and is insering a unfunny "search the items that are hidden in your invenentory since you are so stupid and get legendary armor and weapons" game. No one like to do stupid things over and over and over and over and over again that were not needed before.

I really hope that your vacation is soon over and your start in fixing the broken things, before you insert another things that just increase the amount of mosue clicks.

We want a QoL-improvement not a QpL-deimporvement. Give us working templates and not broken loadouts.

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Deltaconnected usually has fixes to Arc within 24 hours of there being a problem.He even posted a fix on Xmas day.

Yet another thing that sets Arc Templates far apart from the bullshit we have from anet.

I've tried using the current crap again. It's worse in almost every conceivable way.And the limited slots and disgusting level of monetisation just kill any joy of experimenting with and creating builds.

And, for the avoidance of doubt, yes, I completely expected to pay something to make extended use of a templates system; I've said before that I'd have gladly paid 5k gems to keep using Arc Templates - it was that good, and made exploring the game that much fun for me. RIP.

The current garbage isn't even a template system, gg.

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When there's a new balance patch getting you excited to log in, theorycraft builds and play, but then Arc Templates is still gone and Anet still thinks it's okay to ask for 10€ per clunky Loadout slot, per character, to mess around with some new build ideas, and you just disappointedly log off again.

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I really don't know what to say to this anymore. How is it possible that you constantly miss the point so much, Anet? :(This balance patch was such a great opportunity to finally figure out a working solution for actual build templates. We have been waiting for how many months now? What are we supposed to do with these reset buttons that only work while the window is open?

Can we at least get ArcTemplates back now? I mean, it's quite clear now that your system really can't compare to what we had before. Please just buy the ArcTemplates and charge us for them (maybe not hundreds of Euros / Dollars, but it's fine if there're not free).

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@Astralporing.1957 said:

@BlackyWarsX.5384 said:The revert button only works for Skills & Traits? ... I don't know what I expected there.

...still not templates.More, from the patchnotes it works only until you close the window. So, basically, that problem remains completely unchanged.

Not only from the patchnotes, ingame it says the same and works exactly as it is described....I expected so much more from Arenanet. My bad.

There is so much valuable feedback in this thread and Arenanet still misses what the community really wants. That's just amazing.

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@Astralporing.1957 said:

@BlackyWarsX.5384 said:The revert button only works for Skills & Traits? ... I don't know what I expected there.

...still not templates.More, from the patchnotes it works only until you close the window. So, basically, that problem remains completely unchanged.

It's like they didn't bother to even understand what the players were talking about.

  • They say something about wanting to change back the build to before changes. Something about experimentating builds.
  • They can't remember what they just changed? Well ok whatever... let's hope they shut up after this.

I don't even get who that button is destined for. Somebody trying on golem whith the window opened on a side?Seriously WTF. The lengths they go not to acknowledge the design is wrong.

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only build not gear as well = not useful

Anet knows what they did and I am sure its the only thing that could have been done without a complete rework which is what is needed

another EPIC fail

my feedback is rework the whole darn thing. this is partly why your earnings are down and as a former whale I am not spending a dime of my money

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Welp - the revert button is garbage...the load-out still auto-updates if you play with your build; and if you close the window...you cannot revert....so - STILL NOT A TEMPLATE.As an aside to the players posting in this thread - please stop quoting a "nice photoshop effort"...the (heavy air quotes) build templates (end heavy air quotes) problem is much deeper than a pretty UII would take functionality over shiny any day of the week

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Like for real, am i supposed to go open the template, change smth and keep the window open while im playing the game to test out the trait so i can then click revert if i dont like it? Meanwhile if i want the privilege of playing with my full screen free i cant go back to the template window and click revert afterwards because it only works while the window is open when you make the changes.

Go back to the drawing board and give us a save and a load button. I dont wanna be rude to the devs but holy shit this is such a weird way go about fixing tenplates.

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@zealex.9410 said:Like for real, am i supposed to go open the template, change smth and keep the window open while im playing the game to test out the trait so i can then click revert if i dont like it?

Yes, I actually logged in to take a look, and - as expected - it's a nonsense feature.

Go back to the drawing board and give us a save button. I dont wanna be rude to the devs but holy kitten this is such a weird way go about fixing templates.

Good luck with that.

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Maybe this is just for mis-clicks. It may be more complex and require changing a lot about the way the thing works in order to add a more functional save/revert system. That said, they should have put more time and effort into this thing that they wanted players to spend significant amounts of IRL money on - and shipped a more polished product to begin with. Did they even release the tutorial they spoke about right before it templates shipped?(A tutorial that should have been released before the feature it explained) The whole templates release seems weird, not a lot of commitment.edit - typo

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Can you not just admit that the build system you've implemented is shit? remove it, refund players and contact the creator of ArcDPS and get them to build it into GW. You cannot fix this piece of crap, you can't, you've shown us you can't. Band aid's are not going to make it go away.

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The "revert button" is quite useless. You can't change back to the "saved template" because it requires you to keep the Build Template tab open all the time. The moment you leave the Build Templates tab it will auto save the changes. I am really curious. What's the point of that button? Who thought of it? Who implemented it? Zero effort from your side ArenaNet, yet you still demand quite some money for this. At this point and seeing the miserable results of the loadout system (thery are not templates), I strongly suggest to scrap the whole system. It's beyond fixing point and has caused so many frictions between community.

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@Nick.5276 said:Can you not just admit that the build system you've implemented is kitten?

Have you ever seen Arenanet admitting failures and apologising for them or fixing them?I certainly haven't.Not with the invisible bird flip shoe boxes that only have one source with drop rates far below precursors.Not with the theft fall damage reduction nor the theft of the healing from Guardian Greatsword trait.

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@"StrYdeR.2459" said:Welp - the revert button is garbage...the load-out still auto-updates if you play with your build; and if you close the window...you cannot revert....so - STILL NOT A TEMPLATE.As an aside to the players posting in this thread - please stop quoting a "nice photoshop effort"...the (heavy air quotes) build templates (end heavy air quotes) problem is much deeper than a pretty UII would take functionality over shiny any day of the week

Anet did it backwards. It seems they put a dev (or two) to the task to change the existing system a little, so they can call it templates and can shut down ArcTemplates, but they did not think about, if the result was usable. They should first have defined the UI together with a UI and UX designer. Not how shiny it is, but the functionality. And after that, they should have made the changes that are required for the new UI functionality.

I can understand (but I do not agree), why Anet released their bad and unfinished template system initially: They urgently needed money (or became more and more greedy) and hoped, that there will be enough raiders and whales who buy this overpriced system because ArcTemplates is not available anymore.

But why this small and silly update now to templates, that does not really improve it but makes it worse and is probably buggy by itself? It seems they have not learned anything about this topic and all "open" communication about the future or their plans feels kind of hypocritical, if they do not talk openly about the template disaster.

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So here we are, a breath away from a half-year of pleas, suggestions, and wonder, reminiscing of the good ol' times of freedom and joy to tinker and dance around with just slightly different shoes for each tune playing. An era I, personally, had no taste of, because I haven't played the original Guild Wars, and my exploration of the gorgeous world of Tyria started fairly recently.As such, this tabula rasa provided me with a somewhat unique perspective, compared to the people expecting the second game being precisely the first one and then some, and the people expecting absolutely nothing, thus unconditionally praising the brand new tab of the Hero panel.

The feature itself is not bad at all, especially in a vacuum of experience similar to mine.I heartily enjoy the ability to swap between two configurations on the fly, and, contrary to seemingly popular opinion, even the fact the builds are not linked to equipment sets, e.g. with only two sets of weapons available per tab, there are times when, summing up the circumstances, the best approach is a glass cannon, boss-murdering build, with ranged, mobile weapon, which excludes both daggers and rifles from the boss-murdering gear, but pistols from the open world loadout are perfect.Sure, one could say the creators weren't exactly (puts on sunglasses) Delta winning hand (YYYEEEEEEAAAAAHHHHH), but even Rome wasn't built in a day, hm?But if Your own (would-be) inhabitants are pitching in to make their city as magnificent as possible voluntarily and free of charge...!And yet...

Herein lies the corpse of the decaying horse we're trying to beat out this wondrous world, but You, dear whoever-is-in-charge-of-this-unholy-process-of-spitting-in-the-faces-of-their-customers - because nobody believes the developers themselves are this incompetent - keep showering with plot armor: defecating in Your own living room, so You can sell Your guests the opportunity to open the window.

What You apparently do not realize is that those guests aren't bound to Your couches. They can simply stand up and walk right away.Which, looking at NCSoft's earnings, people kinda-sorta did.I highly doubt it's simply because of the Krait Oil the "templates" turned out to be, but You know what they say about camels and straws.

What all of the consideration boils down to invokes the image of Renfri's favorite fencing stance in the recent adaptation of The Witcher, which in turn feels like the author's intent was to recreate a person holding a gun and a flashlight, stabilizing each hand against the other, forgetting the slight detail that a gun is a ranged weapon, and generally not meant to be fought with in melee, so no matter how cool it looks with a sword, presenting a vulnerable part of one's body on a silver platter is seldom a reasonable decision.Only that, in Your case, You're proudly wielding a rocket launcher, and confidently firing it right through Your own forearm.

But it seems so out of place:It feels like there are two people deciding on monetization of anything, who do not even know they're colleagues, or a single person with schizophrenia.The Knife Tail Gang Bond was a marvelous idea, just as the Supply Drop Requisitions, and although I've no idea what the profits looked like, from psychological perspective - since business was always about screwing people over - they were brilliant: an obvious discount on the goods and providing an incentive to play more.And then the other guy releases a complete travesty of a system, which is... where do I even start :D-> marketed to veterans, then butchered up to the point it's not even possible to fathom a semblance of an idea of a dream of what the veterans would need-> monetized to incomprehensible lengths with ridiculously inferior functionality-> completely disregarding any input the players were asked for-> not doing a single thing to remedy the situation - or even acknowledging something is actually amiss!-> etc. (meaning THERE ARE 24 FREAKING PAGES of this, come on :X)There is absolutely nothing bad about admitting You were wrong. Hell, the entire human race could benefit from the ability to understand the concept of being mistaken or changing one's mind with new evidence is not a sign of some arbitrary weakness, but the beautiful, beautiful process of learning.

What I genuinely cannot get, however, is why You're so impossibly sure You were born walking AND immune to being advised.Why are You so hell-bent on limiting the creativity of the very people who literally are the reason You even exist?Look at, say, this niche, unpopular, forgotten game called World of Warcraft. Can You fathom people even surviving through Vanilla and into The Burning Crusade without add-ons? Or the population back in the day being so absurdly monstrous as it was, if Blizzard was throwing logs underneath their own feet like You keep doing? Certainly, the game is possibly the biggest amalgam of everything good somebody else came up with, but if You want to merely grab some free cash, why bother with all the beauty Tyria has to offer? Why employ all these grand artists if all what You strive for is being renamed to EA.net (read: Electronic Activision dot net) - and You bet the "dot net" part hurts the most, because we all loved Blizzard - and sell the exact same Fifa to mentally-impaired people or abuse children with lootboxes over and over again?

Even in a more shameless example, take Bethesda and Skyrim.To this day the game is alive thanks to nobody else but the players. Quite literally, too, because the anniversary edition was released with the same bugs as the original.Which is to show that games aren't just a product You sell and be done with it, especially something like a MMORPG which needs to evolve and keep people interested for a long period of time, preferably 'till they or the games die.

Because a happy customer is a returning customer.Or a desperate one, but, as noted before, You do not possess a monopoly on entertainment.

The feedback You've been given after and even before the release of this Buildshit was, and is still being, completely ignored.If all people can listen to in this day and age is profit - and I'm quite sure You can look up my account and how trigger-happy I was about buying even remotely shiny stuff just to support a world as magnificent as Tyria is (and let me tell You - I didn't regret a single thing precisely because of that) - let's put the money where our mouths are, and see whether You will see a gem purchase from me ever again.And You can be sure the world won't just wait for You to come to Your senses.

Yes, I'm pretty flared up, because I love Tyria. And it doesn't deserve this nonsense.So here's a mirror allowing You to get an adequate response each time You decide to insult Your own fans.Hells know I wasn't born with enough middle fingers for all the gaming industry.

P.S.:I was looking at the Revert button and wondering: if the agreement with Delta was that Arc Templates will get shut down once You release Your own templates......why was it shut down?

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New approach with a wild idea: Scrap these templates loadouts, sit down, un-tangle your inventory spaghetti code and rebuild it to be sustainable. Take your time doing so. I know, I know, there are a lot of items in the game, but I guess at some point it has to be done before everything collapses. Unlink the wardrobe from items and link it to the slots itself in the process.

Then, introduce new actual templates, giving us template slots that combine gear, builds and wardrobe.Loading a template scans your accounts (newly introduced) gear inventory before it checks your characters inventory for the gear in the templates and only loads what it has found, otherwise you get a warning / error message in chat that some things couldn't be loaded.

Monetize the newly introduced, account-wide gear inventory: A tab for armor, a tab for weapons, a tab for sigils, a tab for runes, a tab for infusions, a tab for gathering tools. Here you can go nuts, either monetize the whole things (x slots/x gems) or monetize slots for single tabs (some people probably don't need much slots for gathering tools or upgrades).

How does the gear inventory work? Simple: you put stuff in there much like the shared inventory slots, but it works only for everything your characters can equip.Since wardrobe is now unlinked from the items itself, you now have:

  • a template system that is usable accross all characters
  • a template system that can be monetized by expanding the gear inventory (account-wide) AND/OR expanding the amount of templates you can save (per character)
  • a template system that doesn't punish players for having legendaries - it actually encourages them to get legendaries (people investing time in the game)
  • a template system that allows to visually customize builds by giving it distinctive looks
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@BlackyWarsX.5384 said:Monetize the newly introduced, account-wide gear inventory: A tab for armor, a tab for weapons, a tab for sigils, a tab for runes, a tab for infusions, a tab for gathering tools. Here you can go nuts, either monetize the whole things (x slots/x gems) or monetize slots for single tabs (some people probably don't need much slots for gathering tools or upgrades).

I agree with all you said except the account-wide gear inventory.It could discorage people from making more than one set of weapons and 3 of armor (of legendaries or per stats) and that could hurt the whole economy in the game.I prefer that it's per characters but the number of slots unlocked are unlocked for every character, and it's easy to access it to move the items to bank or shared account slots.That way you can still share gear but it's enough of a pain in the ass you could decide to get duplicated of legendaries or per stat. (wich would make sense to encourage getting, for example, different designs of legendary armors)

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