[vT]Hobo: Post Patch WvW Roaming Videos

[Xenic.1387]

Great video as usual. @Helly.2597 it's crazy how much more tanky you are than I am while still doing ridiculous amounts of damage.

[Bezerker.2379]

@Xenic.1387 said:Great video as usual. @Helly.2597 it's crazy how much more tanky you are than I am while still doing ridiculous amounts of damage.

He's great at dodging the actual bursts + line of sighting. It makes a huge difference. Also, with healing power (I am assuming he's still running a marshall style build of some sort?) he's going to have a decent amount of barrier. Using it wisely, and at the right time, vs rolling keys over f2-f5 is huge in sustain.

If I recall (I could be wrong), in the past, he ran herald shroud too for more barrier at one point but I think he's right on his choice of second tier traits in scourge.

[Helly.2597]

@Xenic.1387 said:Great video as usual. @Helly.2597 it's crazy how much more tanky you are than I am while still doing ridiculous amounts of damage.

Thanks! A big part of my sustain here is from parasitic contagion, which gives me a decent amount of regen from being aggressive. Otherwise positioning is big on scourge and proper shade use is where a lot of extra damage comes from tbh.

@Bezerker.2379 said:

@Xenic.1387 said:Great video as usual. @Helly.2597 it's crazy how much more tanky you are than I am while still doing ridiculous amounts of damage.

He's great at dodging the actual bursts + line of sighting. It makes a huge difference. Also, with healing power (I am assuming he's still running a marshall style build of some sort?) he's going to have a decent amount of barrier. Using it wisely, and at the right time, vs rolling keys over f2-f5 is huge in sustain.

If I recall (I could be wrong), in the past, he ran herald shroud too for more barrier at one point but I think he's right on his choice of second tier traits in scourge.

Yup, just as you say positioning is big for survival on any necro spec. Scourge gives you the opportunity to be defensive and offensive at the same time with how shades work, which is where it shines I think.

I used to run a Marshal's hybrid (and might break it out again) but this build has almost no healing power. A lot of the sustain is from PC and always having a shade under my feet if I use f3.

With the change to shade cd, middle trait outcompetes harbinger shroud. Since you lost a lot of dmg from only getting 1s of burning (thanks anet...) You supplement it with using shades more often and hopping from shade to shade like they're islands of sustain.

[Zexanima.7851]

@Helly.2597 You ever do sPvP on scourge? I can never seem to get good value out of PC there. Probably because it depends on having lots of bodies to apply condi too

[Za Shaloc.3908]

Oh hey, I am in the fight near the SET sentry (Rev). Was a nice fight!

[Helly.2597]

@Zexanima.7851 said:@Helly.2597 You ever do sPvP on scourge? I can never seem to get good value out of PC there. Probably because it depends on having lots of bodies to apply condi too

I don't usually. I know a good friend who's been having success with it recently. For spvp you're totally right, PC isn't effective cause you have fewer opponents. Weakening shroud would be the best choice there.

[Shroud.2307]

@Helly.2597 said:Yup, just as you say positioning is big for survival on any necro spec. Scourge gives you the opportunity to be defensive and offensive at the same time with how shades work, which is where it shines I think.

I used to run a Marshal's hybrid (and might break it out again) but this build has almost no healing power. A lot of the sustain is from PC and always having a shade under my feet if I use f3.

With the change to shade cd, middle trait outcompetes harbinger shroud. Since you lost a lot of dmg from only getting 1s of burning (thanks anet...) You supplement it with using shades more often and hopping from shade to shade like they're islands of sustain.

Out of curiosity, why do you play hybrid? I understand the benefit of it in that not everything you encounter will be weak to Conditions, some are nearly immune and Shades have decent Power damage, but I feel like Power damage is too low when mainly camping Scepter. This isn't a criticism on your game play but I am curious the reason you choose to do this and any other insights you might have.

As I'd said a while back, I had picked up Scourge for the first time since it's introduction and have been playing it pretty much exclusively since doing so. I go with a full Condition TB build though and I use Death Magic instead of Soul Reaping. Personally, I dislike Death Magic because I find it boring and rewarding of passive game play but, I also find it helps me with a full Condition build more than Soul Reaping. I've had a lot of success with it and although I think I still have a lot to learn, my experience with Necro in general is making progress much faster than it might otherwise be if I was new to the class. Still, there are things I'd like to learn from others with more skill and experience such as yourself.

Bearing in mind however, I also often play without support or solo and abuse terrain to the absolute extreme.

[Zexanima.7851]

@Helly.2597 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:@Helly.2597 You ever do sPvP on scourge? I can never seem to get good value out of PC there. Probably because it depends on having lots of bodies to apply condi too

I don't usually. I know a good friend who's been having success with it recently. For spvp you're totally right, PC isn't effective cause you have fewer opponents. Weakening shroud would be the best choice there.

Also, why serpent siphon? It's only 1 boon conversion. For the barrier? I dont see you pick it up often

EDITAfter using my brain for a second, I guess it would be good to throw in crowds of targets

[Helly.2597]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

@Helly.2597 said:Yup, just as you say positioning is big for survival on any necro spec. Scourge gives you the opportunity to be defensive and offensive at the same time with how shades work, which is where it shines I think.

I used to run a Marshal's hybrid (and might break it out again) but this build has almost no healing power. A lot of the sustain is from PC and always having a shade under my feet if I use f3.

With the change to shade cd, middle trait outcompetes harbinger shroud. Since you lost a lot of dmg from only getting 1s of burning (thanks anet...) You supplement it with using shades more often and hopping from shade to shade like they're islands of sustain.

Out of curiosity, why do you play hybrid? I understand the benefit of it in that not everything you encounter will be weak to Conditions, some are nearly immune and Shades have decent Power damage, but I feel like Power damage is too low when mainly camping Scepter. This isn't a criticism on your game play but I am curious the reason you choose to do this and any other insights you might have.

As I'd said a while back, I had picked up Scourge for the first time since it's introduction and have been playing it pretty much exclusively since doing so. I go with a full Condition TB build though and I use Death Magic instead of Soul Reaping. Personally, I dislike Death Magic because I find it boring and rewarding of passive game play but, I also find it helps me with a full Condition build more than Soul Reaping. I've had a lot of success with it and although I think I still have a lot to learn, my experience with Necro in general is making progress much faster than it might otherwise be if I was new to the class. Still, there are things I'd like to learn from others with more skill and experience such as yourself.

Bearing in mind however, I also often play without support or solo and abuse terrain to the absolute extreme.

Death magic is another option. If I went death magic I wouldn't take PC and would go aoe corrupt instead I think (which I think you do). I like soul reaping for the lower cds, lf on fear and marks, and dhummfire is a good dps increase even with all the nerfs.

Probably the only right answer for why I am hybrid is because I enjoy it more and for how I play it "feels nicer." My non-gut response is a mixture of what you said about power being nice for some things and imo it does add up especially with desert shroud even if it's a lot of small numbers. I also want around 25-30% crit chance on my necro builds just for the cover bleed condi (which I would argue also adds up over a fight). But pure condi also works well, I honestly wouldn't recommend people play what I play. It's about what you find fun and what fits your playstyle.

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Helly.2597 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:@Helly.2597 You ever do sPvP on scourge? I can never seem to get good value out of PC there. Probably because it depends on having lots of bodies to apply condi too

I don't usually. I know a good friend who's been having success with it recently. For spvp you're totally right, PC isn't effective cause you have fewer opponents. Weakening shroud would be the best choice there.

Also, why serpent siphon? It's only 1 boon conversion. For the barrier? I dont see you pick it up often

EDITAfter using my brain for a second, I guess it would be good to throw in crowds of targets

It's a long range boon strip that also is an aoe. It can be nice to chase down ppl with that. But it's also a poison that on my build is 15s so you'll see me save it for downs a lot since it helps a lot. And the barrier is nice since it also cleanses. Those are a nice bonus, and usually unless I'm pressured I leave them for allies to pick up if they need them.

[Shroud.2307]

@Helly.2597 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

@Helly.2597 said:Yup, just as you say positioning is big for survival on any necro spec. Scourge gives you the opportunity to be defensive and offensive at the same time with how shades work, which is where it shines I think.

I used to run a Marshal's hybrid (and might break it out again) but this build has almost no healing power. A lot of the sustain is from PC and always having a shade under my feet if I use f3.

With the change to shade cd, middle trait outcompetes harbinger shroud. Since you lost a lot of dmg from only getting 1s of burning (thanks anet...) You supplement it with using shades more often and hopping from shade to shade like they're islands of sustain.

Out of curiosity, why do you play hybrid? I understand the benefit of it in that not everything you encounter will be weak to Conditions, some are nearly immune and Shades have decent Power damage, but I feel like Power damage is too low when mainly camping Scepter. This isn't a criticism on your game play but I am curious the reason you choose to do this and any other insights you might have.

As I'd said a while back, I had picked up Scourge for the first time since it's introduction and have been playing it pretty much exclusively since doing so. I go with a full Condition TB build though and I use Death Magic instead of Soul Reaping. Personally, I dislike Death Magic because I find it boring and rewarding of passive game play but, I also find it helps me with a full Condition build more than Soul Reaping. I've had a lot of success with it and although I think I still have a lot to learn, my experience with Necro in general is making progress much faster than it might otherwise be if I was new to the class. Still, there are things I'd like to learn from others with more skill and experience such as yourself.

Bearing in mind however, I also often play without support or solo and abuse terrain to the absolute extreme.

Death magic is another option. If I went death magic I wouldn't take PC and would go aoe corrupt instead I think (which I think you do). I like soul reaping for the lower cds, lf on fear and marks, and dhummfire is a good dps increase even with all the nerfs.

Probably the only right answer for why I am hybrid is because I enjoy it more and for how I play it "feels nicer." My non-gut response is a mixture of what you said about power being nice for some things and imo it does add up especially with desert shroud even if it's a lot of small numbers. I also want around 25-30% crit chance on my necro builds just for the cover bleed condi (which I would argue also adds up over a fight). But pure condi also works well, I honestly wouldn't recommend people play what I play. It's about what you find fun and what fits your playstyle.

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Helly.2597 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:@Helly.2597 You ever do sPvP on scourge? I can never seem to get good value out of PC there. Probably because it depends on having lots of bodies to apply condi too

I don't usually. I know a good friend who's been having success with it recently. For spvp you're totally right, PC isn't effective cause you have fewer opponents. Weakening shroud would be the best choice there.

Also, why serpent siphon? It's only 1 boon conversion. For the barrier? I dont see you pick it up often

EDITAfter using my brain for a second, I guess it would be good to throw in crowds of targets

It's a long range boon strip that also is an aoe. It can be nice to chase down ppl with that. But it's also a poison that on my build is 15s so you'll see me save it for downs a lot since it helps a lot. And the barrier is nice since it also cleanses. Those are a nice bonus, and usually unless I'm pressured I leave them for allies to pick up if they need them.

I know the feels. I often play things that are suboptimal or just straight up bad because I strongly prefer to play things that feel "custom made" and things that are fun rather than things that I feel will carry my mistakes.

Pre-February patch I never encountered another zerk Dreadmancer or Power/Vitality Firearms core Engi, both things I played often, loved dearly and had lots of success with. I'd say the Scourge build I play now is less unique and a lot less skillful but it's very fun anyway.

Anyway, thanks for the response. Happy to know we think more alike than I thought!

[Zexanima.7851]

@Helly.2597 Sorry to keep bothering you with questions but trying to get this whole scourge roaming thing figured out. Did some roaming last night and it went 'ok' but the one thing that would consistently screw me over is getting punked by sic'em soulbeasts (which there are a fair number of). I know LoS is a good way to deal with them but that's not feasible. Even with 3k toughness and 10% damage reduction they still smack from forever away. Any suggestions? Is this just something you have to deal with? I tried corrosive poison cloud but but by the time I stun break and get it cast the damage is done.

[Bezerker.2379]

@Zexanima.7851 said:@Helly.2597 Sorry to keep bothering you with questions but trying to get this whole scourge roaming thing figured out. Did some roaming last night and it went 'ok' but the one thing that would consistently screw me over is getting punked by sic'em soulbeasts (which there are a fair number of). I know LoS is a good way to deal with them but that's not feasible. Even with 3k toughness and 10% damage reduction they still smack from forever away. Any suggestions? Is this just something you have to deal with? I tried corrosive poison cloud but but by the time I stun break and get it cast the damage is done.

sicem soulbeasts are always a concern. Poison cloud is my goto for this, and constantly panning my camera around me to ensure i am not caught by surprise. Try to fight in areas you can line of sight. Walls, trees, anything. If you are in the middle with nothing to los around, you don't have much luck, but it is what it is. Save your barriers for those situations. Etc

[Helly.2597]

@Bezerker.2379 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:@Helly.2597 Sorry to keep bothering you with questions but trying to get this whole scourge roaming thing figured out. Did some roaming last night and it went 'ok' but the one thing that would consistently screw me over is getting punked by sic'em soulbeasts (which there are a fair number of). I know LoS is a good way to deal with them but that's not feasible. Even with 3k toughness and 10% damage reduction they still smack from forever away. Any suggestions? Is this just something you have to deal with? I tried corrosive poison cloud but but by the time I stun break and get it cast the damage is done.

sicem soulbeasts are always a concern. Poison cloud is my goto for this, and constantly panning my camera around me to ensure i am not caught by surprise. Try to fight in areas you can line of sight. Walls, trees, anything. If you are in the middle with nothing to los around, you don't have much luck, but it is what it is. Save your barriers for those situations. Etc

Yeah. If you're caught off guard by a ranger and there isn't los nearby you're in big trouble. Poison cloud is an option, but unless it gives you the space to pressure or get to los it doesn't have huge impact (from what I've experienced).

Best advice is to play around los and just force them to make moves. Forcing the issue when they are at ranged requires you to just be better than them. And that isn't always doable. By forcing them to get close you have a better chance since shroud dominates that realm.

Gameplay wise, try to interrupt their rapid fire if you don't have los. You need to dodge the lb knockback so you aren't knocked out of shades. I usually instantly put a shade down if I see a ranger about to rf me. At least you have time to react now, and if you survive the initial burst and they're full glass you can have a decent rebuttal lined up.

Also remember my most common group size isn't solo. I'm usually duo or trio, so if I get pressured I can count on my allies to use that space to help me out.

No necro build really evens the matchup against good rangers. It's a mixture of patience and accepting that sometimes you'll get memed by those type of builds.

As a scourge (and other necro specs) you want to have the opponents reacting to you. If you can stabilize the initial burst/combo your shades help you dictate where the enemy can play. So try not to panic if they get a good burst in, focus on getting barrier up and remember that if they camp lb they only have 1 cc.

[Helly.2597]

New video out. A little bit shorter due to a lack of fights this Sunday.

[Lightning Xv.8705]

@Helly.2597 said:New video out. A little bit shorter due to a lack of fights this Sunday.

Guess I actually need to update my core terror-mancer build now lol. Damn good fight though I didn't realize it went that long 2:35-4:10. Always enjoy some 1 on 1's with vt people been a while since i had a good challenge(fought yumi's shatter mes vs my cor war for atleast an hour while waiting for reset one night). I'll have to go at you again before the end of the week while we are still against each other. Nice to see scourge can roam decently again. I did a scourge build about a year ago but then made a core build got hooked and haven't gone back. Might have to give scourge some attention again when I'm bored.

enjoyed the vids

[Helly.2597]

@Lightning Xv.8705 said:

@Helly.2597 said:New video out. A little bit shorter due to a lack of fights this Sunday.

Guess I actually need to update my core terror-mancer build now lol. kitten good fight though I didn't realize it went that long 2:35-4:10. Always enjoy some 1 on 1's with vt people been a while since i had a good challenge(fought yumi's shatter mes vs my cor war for atleast an hour while waiting for reset one night). I'll have to go at you again before the end of the week while we are still against each other. Nice to see scourge can roam decently again. I did a scourge build about a year ago but then made a core build got hooked and haven't gone back. Might have to give scourge some attention again when I'm bored.

enjoyed the vids

Thanks I appreciate it.

Haha it was a good fight. Tbh you beat me and only lost cause I got the fear off the cliff. Once that happened you either could've stayed shroud and I don't pursue or you drop shroud and risk me coming down. Not a lot of options there. Not a lot of necros in wvw that force me to think, but had to pull out the stops there.

Hopefully I'll be on later this week, normally due to work I only play on Sunday.