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​🔰​ Commander/Mentor/Squad/Mechanics in need of improvements? PvE+WvW [Comments/Feedback/Suggestions]


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(1.9.2021 minor edit to title above since game mechanics, squads, commanders and group play are holistically integrated & should be viewed as a whole)In another forum thread, there's been discussions towards the current "looking for group" (LFG) panel & how it can be improved for better UI + team play experience, since the Squad Panel is heavily intertwined with LFG, commander, and game mechanics going forward, do you see a need to enhance the current "Squad UI/Commander/Tag/functions/Panel"? Based on your gameplay experience for all game modes (Raids, PvE, WvW), are there features you'd like to see? Something missing? Issues when leading a squad? Please share your comments or suggestions, thanks! 😃

Wiki References:

Edited by Woop S.7851
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Needs a label for WvW : closed/private guild group , open (Public) , size (<10 , 25+) denoted by bars , circles, stars, or somethingMaybe also pop up the squad message on right click or double click if open squad since people tend to put voice comms information there. There's a lot of unused options on right clicking a tag: it's only "join squad now" when it could easily have "view squad message" , "see who is in my guild(s)" , "see mutual friends" (to avoid pin spies).

For PvE : a way to label what the squad is for if it's not in LFG , stop random people from merging with another squad on a completely different map

  • on right clicking a tag: view squad message , etc
  • option to hide squads <5 or empty squads with only one person
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as I have mentioned before, it would be cool if commanders and players could prioritize which combo fields they want to combo regardless of what was thrown down first. for example, as an ele with aura share it would be sweet if I could tic a box that always makes me leap through chaos fields, and as a commander make all players blast water fields before anything else. ofc player prefs should override the comms. I think functionality changes and an overall buff to combo fields are in order as well, since it promotes organized play for superior results.

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  1. I'd say a button to reach your commander's map, with a queue if the map is full.

  2. Icons tag additions via success, reward path or gems.

  3. The squad greeting message that should pop in the middle of the joining player's screen, many don't read the chat.

  4. Buttons with icons that can be set up by writing a message from within and when clicked it appears in the middle of the player's screen.Like use your hard controls, or stay pack, heal, or dispell, ...Things that we repeat quite often, but it's complicated to write + play and lead.

  5. Integration of the ground and person marking system with a wheel (cercle, square, arrow, ....), such as that of GW2radial

  6. be able to reserve a place for someone or put a "occupied" place or simply limit the maximum number of people in the squad for lfg to a chosen number.Especially useful in raid or strike mission if you reserve a place for someone, it prevents too many people to come to the LFG.

  7. removed the occurrence restriction on the lfg to change the description of your ad for the lead.

  8. Adapted the icon of the squad lead so that it doesn't interfere with the statue and mechanic icons we receive in raid or strike mission for the mechanics (poison, chains, bombs, clock, aggro, ...)

  9. a complete overhaul of the LFG, with a FF14-style system.

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Thanks for the comments! Consolidated list below, updated as they're found:

Thanks to @JusticeRetroHunter.7684 and @Virtuality.8351 for mentioning the below:

  • Squads should have more control over the party element in the squad, what he referred to as “nested squads”
  • Basically each party/subgroup in a squad should have the ability of having their own commander tag (a sub-commander tag) which would make fights more complex by adding a new level of organization & micro-management
  • In addition, nested sub-squads would have the ability of say, having 2 parties of 5, and an additional space for specs that utilize abilities that have potentially higher ally target caps. Soothing Mist for example can effect 13 people at any given time, but because of the current structure, an elementalist with soothing mist can only apply this on to 5 people if they are in a party of 5. Nesting the sub-squad so that it can be considered part of the party without being effected by squad/party buff prioritization would allow these buffs to be applied to more than 5 people without having to be in your own sub-squad (thus denying yourself of your parties 5 target boons and buffs.)

Other Comments found:UI/UX:

  • Squad Panel Missing an "advertise" checkbox, currently displayed only under the LFG pop-up panel
  • Health bars of squad members (when low) displays as another color (white maybe) so commander and healers know
  • Can not decipher sub-groups since all squad members have blue name tags (hard for sub-groups to stack boons)
  • Mentor tag icon not used very often, need straightforward simple design geared towards PvE or smaller groups (5-10 people)
  • Nested Mentor tag inside a large squad? Enable Lieutenants to use Mentor tag (visible only to their subgroup) while in WvW?

Squad panel/Visual:

  • Re-sizable commander tag (seen by main player only)
  • Display of numbers beside the tag (indicates how many players are currently in squad, debatable since spies with alt-accounts from opposing server may know)
  • Hover over short descriptions ("Zerging", "Havoc", "I want bay", etc). This is to encourage easily defined parties at a glance.
  • More shapes to customize squad tags and encourage smaller groups to run with "their own" tags (attackers, defenders, capturers etc.), creates dynamic small group game-play, also helps in big blob fights
  • Squad size indicator, such as 1-3 chevrons beneath the tag to indicate 1-10, 11-25, 26-50.
  • Map/team chat should note if the talker is a commander of a certain map (this is just to boost peoples egos and make them want to tag up for it).
  • Ability to set simple attack/defend objectives for bonus points for the entire squad (similar to battlefield 2142 where the commander can place objectives for each of the separate 5-person squad groups)
  • Players reported joining a squad/group, then the group suddenly disbands due to leader leaving before player joined: confusing. Currently missing "auto-designate player X as commander" feature when a leader leaves
  • Party features (PvE): Mentor tag needs a "private mentor tag" checkbox (for helping new guild members/players), leader do not want the whole map to think the group is doing map events

Game-play/Function/Features:

  • WvW seems to consist of only 1 commander on 1 map at a time, seems to be due to zerg sizes
  • Encourage smaller squads to capture multiple objectives simultaneously by x2 rewards mechanic?
  • Personal waypoints placed by commanders on the mini-map can not be seen by squad members
  • Waypoint path lines on minimap?
  • Sub-group mini-tags needed, allows: commander micro-management tactics (example: sub-group A of 20 people is holding/fighting the enemy, commander orders sub-group B of 10 players circles around and flanks the enemy from behind or hits an enemy tower) currently not possible as squad members can't decipher who is in A or B, confusion occurs
  • "Master Commander" feature (checkbox), enabling it allows all sub-groups to have its own mini-tag
  • Commander NPC Siegerazor and Siegecrusher with automated attack features + other functions when no commander is on map

Additional comments taken from WvW forums (4.14.2020)

  • Parties should be able to do squad commands and the party leader have their own ministag
  • How about having your subgroup having a different color than the rest of the squad? No, that different shade of blue doesn't cut it
  • u could make squad colors different, like having the players on 1 squad displayed the others in their party highlighted somehow + small party leader tags. that would need a lot of icon changes etc and the main tag has to be way more highlighted then he/she is at the moment
  • Comments: with all the shiny effects and bling bling it gets yet sometimes hard to spot where the tag is, even when on voice. (after a slight lag-hic-up i sometimes stroll into the wrong direction at pushing) - so it could be a bit annoying to have several mini-tags around and confusing you even more. technically the idea isn't bad surely.
  • but do we really want more icons floating around, if we often tend to use small settings for visuals, just to minimize lag as much as possible?
  • QoL things I'd like:
    1. A keybind for swapping party view and squad view.
    2. A couple personal raid markers. Independent from the party target and squad markers. Only visible to the player.
    3. I'd like to be able to turn off name plates of non squad members.

Added additional comments from WvW forums (1.8.2021)https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/121378/commander-tag-anet-wishlist

  • Better color options out for the commander tags, shapes?
  • Password for squadjoin?
  • use your guild logo as tag? prestige?
  • tag lack contrast, Squad object markers can be more effective: multi-colored
  • Three of the colors are unusable in WvW due to blending in with opposition colors (red, green, blue), white is a pain in the alpine borerlands, so you end up with yellow, orange, pink and purples used the most (baby blue last)
  • tag has to swap colors when moving maps to avoid group confusion
  • adding dark grey and black would help a lot
  • split up the upper and lower portions of a tag? choose between the 9 colors you have it would massively increased the options
  • hover over a tag and see the description that the commander has set so people stop kitten joining expecting a zerg tag when I run havoc, roaming or scout tag
  • option to completely hide Commander (and Mentor) tags from the minimap than having more variety of them
  • had to use the purple triangle (squad markers) because ironically it was one of the few I could actually see
  • blue is still a commonly used tag. violet one is by far the best
  • yellow is hard to spot on bright maps, similar with white
  • orange gets harder to spot if orange swords are up
  • red-blue-green as teamcolors can be difficult as well (conflicts with team colors)
  • tag-symbol purpose driven? need a better contrast?
  • lower visual clutter/glow from effects when in WvW (Tags + Markers then easier to see)
  • tag needs to be more contrasting, party marker (CTRL + T) on the commander still used to be able to see leader (maybe reference CTRL+T for design?)
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"Mentor" ... feels a bit weird to call it that. You can get the tag easily and free. And a lot of people use it just to say "I need help with event x".As it is used now: Basically mentor is the same as commander - just that he can't make a squad.

Calling the commander "commander" is fine. "Mentor" should be removed and the explanatin on the mastery system should say "allows you to use a visible tag on the minimap" or something like that. (Change the button where something with "mentor" is mentioned as well.)

Then this someone mentioned above: "For PvE : a way to label what the squad is for if it's not in LFG"I'd love to see this in the map and minimap when hovering over the tag with the mouse cursor. Not only "commander [name]" but a box where that info could be.

Also if not already possible: The option to hide tags on the map: Sometimes annoying when they overlap event marker and I think there is just an idle commander waiting for something - which sometimes happens - when there i fact is an event already. Also nowadays some commanders hidden far away above somewhere in the map. I guess some of those people that "break out of the map" with their mounts. (Recently people announce in the map chat "oh look at me I broke the map, I'm above the map, etc. and no one cares.)

  • Hide for 1 [or more] hour
  • Hide until I change mapsOr hide per player permanently - a separate list (while not completely ignoring/blocking that player / maybe improve the block list to give checkboxes like in the chat window options - so you could manually decide to block only certain stuff from certain players)
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There is one feature that i still want that was actually meant to ship with the squad system.

This:

The commander can choose a range/radius.

Every player outside the that radius get grayed out to only the commander.

This helps the commander to see how many people are near him without having to open the map.

For WvW a huge boon.

You could select a smaller number in raids to see who is sticky to the commander and who gets out of support range to often.

Sad that this never happend.

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@"DanAlcedo.3281" said:The commander can choose a range/radius.Every player outside the that radius get grayed out to only the commander.This helps the commander to see how many people are near him without having to open the map.

Did you mean something like this below? :)nxyJNRa.jpg

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@Woop S.7851 said:

@"DanAlcedo.3281" said:The commander can choose a range/radius.Every player outside the that radius get grayed out to only the commander.This helps the commander to see how many people are near him without having to open the map.

Did you mean something like this below? :)
nxyJNRa.jpg

I would prefer that out of range instead had another colour (maybe yellow or reverse colour in text that instead it show green text and white background) then grey to show who is in range and who is not or even put them in the end of list. It is hard to see the difference between the level of green from picture above.

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There's some good in-depth stuff above. I will just add that my biggest frustration is searching for the tag in a mass of squad boxes. Sure it has some subtle indicators, and helpful commanders will move themselves to a solo group so they stand out (and so their box doesn't jump just as someone is right clicking to join in map and someone else joins or leaves). But it would be glorious if the commander got some can't-miss-it indicator, like a fully gold box.

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I know this may be seen as the ultimate elitism by some but it would be nice to have full control over who is able to apply to your squad for instanced content. Being able to weed out people by setting up requirements for levels, classes, elite specs, etc.

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I would like a "party only" mentor option. Sometimes I want to help friends/guilds in my party without broadcasting my location to the whole map. During this time I want them to easily be able to find my location on the map, mini map, icon. I do not want people outside of my part to know my location. I feel bad for people that think I am going to lead a meta event, when I am just trying to help my guild do something.

@Henry.5713 said:I know this may be seen as the ultimate elitism by some but it would be nice to have full control over who is able to apply to your squad for instanced content. Being able to weed out people by setting up requirements for levels, classes, elite specs, etc.

Until they balance the professions, this would be terrible for the game.

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@"Woop S.7851" said:Full image: https://i.imgur.com/eLqofP4.png

eLqofP4.png

That is an improvement what you suggest. Good work!

What I really wish is some way on main map or minimap to actually see all tags in a list as sometimes those tags move very fast around on maps and can be hard to move cursor to right place before they move again. On minimap we have at right side a section which unfold when one hover with cursor at that part of minimap. Why not add a section with all commander tag first and below all mentor tags in a list when minimap is in upper right corner so it looks like a drop down list (and reverse when minimap is in lower corner)?

I always change squad into a list on left side instead of the "new" look where one can see each profession and how much supply each and one carry. It takes less screen space and I can see if ppl are alive or dead. How does your suggestion fit when one use the old way of displaying a group or squad?

Thank you for doing this work even when it is very unlikely that ANet will make use of it. One can only hope.

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@"Josiah.2967" said:I would like a "party only" mentor option. Sometimes I want to help friends/guilds in my party without broadcasting my location to the whole map. During this time I want them to easily be able to find my location on the map, mini map, icon. I do not want people outside of my part to know my location.

Yes, that's a good idea, the "Mentor" tag function might need to be re-thought, I rarely see people use it, the button instead could be just for small groups of 5 people, can be renamed to "Party/Mentor" button, and have a "private/public" checkbox, when doing these mock-ups, I've noticed the main struggle was trying to simplify and simplify so that anyone can understand it, the current lingo consists of:

  • a 5-person party type;
  • a 10-person Squad (raid) type;
  • and a 50-person Squad
  • if all of them are called "Party" or just "Squad", it'd be so much easier to understand, GW1 only had 1 naming convention: "Party", but there must be a reason they made it this way...
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@"ShadowCatz.8437" said:What I really wish is some way on main map or minimap to actually see all tags in a list as sometimes those tags move very fast around on maps and can be hard to move cursor to right place before they move again. On minimap we have at right side a section which unfold when one hover with cursor at that part of minimap. Why not add a section with all commander tag first and below all mentor tags in a list when minimap is in upper right corner so it looks like a drop down list (and reverse when mini-map is in lower corner)?

I always change squad into a list on left side instead of the "new" look where one can see each profession and how much supply each and one carry. It takes less screen space and I can see if ppl are alive or dead. How does your suggestion fit when one use the old way of displaying a group or squad?

Yes, have to explore that for sure, I've been checking some other game's UI and cross checking it with GW2's PvP view :)For the squad panel, there seems to be 2 main views oriented to 2 types of players:

- The simplified view (displays only subgroup squad members) in the entire 50-person squad, similar to PvP team view below- The Grid icon view: aimed at commanders, they'd have to manage 50 players which makes sense

However at the moment, it seems both commanders + squad members have the option to switch between these 2 views, which is quite confusing, will have to play around with the mockups :)

plOlrQN.jpg

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@"ShadowCatz.8437" said:I always change squad into a list on left side instead of the "new" look where one can see each profession and how much supply each and one carry. It takes less screen space and I can see if ppl are alive or dead. How does your suggestion fit when one use the old way of displaying a group or squad?

After checking the PvP Spectator mode (similar to image above), I'd visualize it like something below, will add a seperate image for the "bars" (non-grid) look, but it'd be similar where health bars can be purely blue in the same "subgroup :) and in big fights, your subgroup icons will display in the chaos

Full image: https://i.imgur.com/wTrjQVj.png

wTrjQVj.png

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