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Elites Don't feel like Elites


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@Tharan.9085 said:

@avey.4201 said:what elites? check out guardian, and they are weaker than other classes utility skills.may as well run an empty slot, the benefit vs the cast time is a benefit to the enemy.

Oh yeah, renewed focus is so Bad Kappa

you spend 3 seconds losing nodes, no pressure on enemy, 3 seconds they will get several skills off cooldown.In a zerk burst/damage meta yes, in a bunker meta wasting 3 seconds is useful as spitting in a pond.

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@avey.4201 said:

@avey.4201 said:what elites? check out guardian, and they are weaker than other classes utility skills.may as well run an empty slot, the benefit vs the cast time is a benefit to the enemy.

Oh yeah, renewed focus is so Bad Kappa

you spend 3 seconds losing nodes, no pressure on enemy, 3 seconds they will get several skills off cooldown.In a zerk burst/damage meta yes, in a bunker meta wasting 3 seconds is useful as spitting in a pond.

It's objectively the strongest guardian elite.

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@"cptaylor.2670" said:Jaunt really doesn't feel like an elite. There are numerous other mirage utility skills that rarely see the light of day, like the mirage advance? The shadowstep with a cast time? It's garbage and always has been. I'd like to see them remove that and replace it with jaunt, then create a brand new elite skill.

As far as suggestions I'm don't really have any. And I wouldn't dare suggest any because at least 50 people on the forum would instantly complain about how broken it would be.

There are also a lot of missing elites for varying skill categories. I.e. Elite sigils/shouts/stances. I think most of those DO have some. But there are a few I can't think of right now that have utilities themed around a skill category but no elite skill for the fifth slot. Do guardians have an elite conjured ability? I don't think they do. Things like that.Is there an elite well for necro? Or is the plague skill a well? I've never read that much into the tooltip.

There's definitely a huge advantage of some elite skills over others though, whether it be the functionality or the cooldown length. Some might be more ideal for a certain build but the cooldown is so long that you'd just rather use a different elite.

Yeah Jaunts an odd case. Its got the power of an elite, but it really feels more like a normal skill. Then again I fear if made into a utility, itd need to lose some power. As for a replacement elite, maybe a perfect clone, i.e. one that copies all your actions? Other than Axe 3 because that wouldnt really work.

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@Bazsi.2734 said:

@avey.4201 said:what elites? check out guardian, and they are weaker than other classes utility skills.may as well run an empty slot, the benefit vs the cast time is a benefit to the enemy.

Oh yeah, renewed focus is so Bad Kappa

you spend 3 seconds losing nodes, no pressure on enemy, 3 seconds they will get several skills off cooldown.In a zerk burst/damage meta yes, in a bunker meta wasting 3 seconds is useful as spitting in a pond.

It's objectively the strongest guardian elite.

It's objectively the strongest defensive elite in the game.

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@Tharan.9085 said:

@avey.4201 said:what elites? check out guardian, and they are weaker than other classes utility skills.may as well run an empty slot, the benefit vs the cast time is a benefit to the enemy.

Oh yeah, renewed focus is so Bad Kappa

you spend 3 seconds losing nodes, no pressure on enemy, 3 seconds they will get several skills off cooldown.In a zerk burst/damage meta yes, in a bunker meta wasting 3 seconds is useful as spitting in a pond.

It's objectively the strongest guardian elite.

It's objectively the strongest defensive elite in the game.It resets the f skills , kinda meh for core resets 3 kinda meh abilities , good for DH since 3 strong abilities, and broken for firebrand since it resets 3 tomes of 15 abilities with multiple charges.Many classes just end up with the least useless skill in this slot, even if it terrible.
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@UNOwen.7132 said:

@"cptaylor.2670" said:Jaunt really doesn't feel like an elite. There are numerous other mirage utility skills that rarely see the light of day, like the mirage advance? The shadowstep with a cast time? It's garbage and always has been. I'd like to see them remove that and replace it with jaunt, then create a brand new elite skill.

As far as suggestions I'm don't really have any. And I wouldn't dare suggest any because at least 50 people on the forum would instantly complain about how broken it would be.

There are also a lot of missing elites for varying skill categories. I.e. Elite sigils/shouts/stances. I think most of those DO have some. But there are a few I can't think of right now that have utilities themed around a skill category but no elite skill for the fifth slot. Do guardians have an elite conjured ability? I don't think they do. Things like that.Is there an elite well for necro? Or is the plague skill a well? I've never read that much into the tooltip.

There's definitely a huge advantage of some elite skills over others though, whether it be the functionality or the cooldown length. Some might be more ideal for a certain build but the cooldown is so long that you'd just rather use a different elite.

Yeah Jaunts an odd case. Its got the power of an elite, but it really feels more like a normal skill. Then again I fear if made into a utility, itd need to lose some power. As for a replacement elite, maybe a perfect clone, i.e. one that copies all your actions? Other than Axe 3 because that wouldnt really work.

Hmm, might be onto something. Maybe not a perfect clone, unless it's substantially stronger. But maybe something akin to assassin's guild on Thief, since mirage is all about copying Thief. Something that summons multiple clones of varying weapon types/phantasms and they spawn with an ambush attack.

You could have an axe and sword clone that spawn on the target, a staff, scepter, and greatsword that spawn by you.

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@"cptaylor.2670" said:

@"cptaylor.2670" said:Jaunt really doesn't feel like an elite. There are numerous other mirage utility skills that rarely see the light of day, like the mirage advance? The shadowstep with a cast time? It's garbage and always has been. I'd like to see them remove that and replace it with jaunt, then create a brand new elite skill.

As far as suggestions I'm don't really have any. And I wouldn't dare suggest any because at least 50 people on the forum would instantly complain about how broken it would be.

There are also a lot of missing elites for varying skill categories. I.e. Elite sigils/shouts/stances. I think most of those DO have some. But there are a few I can't think of right now that have utilities themed around a skill category but no elite skill for the fifth slot. Do guardians have an elite conjured ability? I don't think they do. Things like that.Is there an elite well for necro? Or is the plague skill a well? I've never read that much into the tooltip.

There's definitely a huge advantage of some elite skills over others though, whether it be the functionality or the cooldown length. Some might be more ideal for a certain build but the cooldown is so long that you'd just rather use a different elite.

Yeah Jaunts an odd case. Its got the power of an elite, but it really feels more like a normal skill. Then again I fear if made into a utility, itd need to lose some power. As for a replacement elite, maybe a perfect clone, i.e. one that copies all your actions? Other than Axe 3 because that wouldnt really work.

Hmm, might be onto something. Maybe not a perfect clone, unless it's substantially stronger. But maybe something akin to assassin's guild on Thief, since mirage is all about copying Thief. Something that summons multiple clones of varying weapon types/phantasms and they spawn with an ambush attack.

You could have an axe and sword clone that spawn on the target, a staff, scepter, and greatsword that spawn by you.

I mean, being able to copy all your actions is quite substantially stronger from a regular clone. Imagine using Greatsword 4 and summoning 4 phantasms. Thieves guild would be too much of an expy, and not that interesting (since thieves guild isnt interesting).

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@UNOwen.7132 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:@UNOwen.7132 Trust me ability like that would be OP as one heck or utterly useless.

Arguably thats Elites in a nutshell. Iunno, it just sounds more interesting than Jaunt.

jaunt is cool, it has alot of "elite" feel to it in my book, its a cheaty spell.Its insta.It removes blind/aegiscan be cast while casting/stunned.Its not super strong unless you find a way to make it strong with smart play, by using elevation, teleporting away at the last sec to dodge melee hits, or TP behind LoS for ranged attacks, removing blinds/aegis before finishing spells, like gs5->jaunt to remove aegis from guard.But I really want portal as elite for core mes to be in a better spot.

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@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:@UNOwen.7132 Trust me ability like that would be OP as one heck or utterly useless.

Arguably thats Elites in a nutshell. Iunno, it just sounds more interesting than Jaunt.

jaunt is cool, it has alot of "elite" feel to it in my book, its a cheaty spell.Its insta.It removes blind/aegiscan be cast while casting/stunned.Its not super strong unless you find a way to make it strong with smart play, by using elevation, teleporting away at the last sec to dodge melee hits, or TP behind LoS for ranged attacks, removing blinds/aegis before finishing spells, like gs5->jaunt to remove aegis from guard.But I really want portal as elite for core mes to be in a better spot.

Iunno, it legitimately just feels like a more powerful version of a regular utility skill. Its like half a blink twice with the stunbreak replaced by a condi cleanse and confusion application. I dunno about Portal as an elite though. At that point it doesnt really have an opportunity cost.

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As elites, they (all them) could not have less than 60s CD but with valuable effect.Currently, some them looks too overpower while some others looks too weak (meh)...Ex:

TOO STRONG ELITES:

Head Butt: Too short CD... 60 sec could be fair.One Wolf Pack: Too much damage (over 3k+ per hit), and can be shared to allies... It's damage could be halved.Lich Form: Too much damage on Skill #1. This damage could be halved.Feel My Wrath! and Dragon's Maw: Both could have 60 sec CD.Dagger Storm: That evade frame is ridiculous, could be removed.Basilisk Venom and Impact Strike: Both could have 60 sec CD.Shadow Meld: Count recharge could have 60 sec.Jaunt: One more teleport to already onsanely strong Mirage... This skill could be reworked.

TOO WEAK ELITES:

Tornado: The lightning field could be removed to allow the whirl finisher combo with other fields (grants more effects).Conjure Fiery Sword: Could grants more effects. Ex:

  • Permanent fire field (180 radius) to sword and his user.
  • Skill #1: 20% Projectile finisher.
  • Skill #2: Blast finisher.
  • Skill #4: Leap finisher.

Signet of Rage: Active effect could be improved.Spirit of Nature: Has too long CD... 60 sec could be fair.Elixir X: For the love of God, what is this??? No words here. Just change this already! Please!Supply Crate: It's missing others turrets (Rifle turret, Rocket turret and Thumper turret).Prime Light Beam: Has shorter CD than would have (could be 60 sec), but doesn't compensate the lack of front load damage. This skill need have this damage back.

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