Deathly Chill

[ZDragon.3046]

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@Sigmoid.7082 said:

@Yasai.3549 said:Make Deathly Chill similar to Terror instead of making it inflict Bleed.

Chill causes damage over time.

Fun.

Do people who keep bringing this up just completely not understand why it was change from this originally?

Yep I think so.

@Yasai.3549 It's not "fun", it's imbalanced. Bound to be to strong in sPvP and abysmal in PvE. It's a plain loss compared to the current design and considering the thread have been opened due to

deathly chill

feeling to "weak", it's bound to make the trait feel even weaker/useless.

I dont agree

But againThe reason to be perfectly clear is not because it was imbalanced it was due to one reaper overwriting anthers damage in pve meaning when you had more than 1 reaper in any event, fractal, or at this point if it still existed raids. Their damage would would be consistently overwriting each others leading to dps losses for each reaper you brought.

Technically speaking in spvp with all the anti movement inhibiting traits that now exists the old version would be imo considered under-powered especially with chill duration cut to what they are now, the nerfing of chill duration on runes, and the removal of expertise. Chill is not something that says on a player permanently anymore if they play decently smart.

That said due to the nature of the pve issue i doubt it will ever come back. That said Deathly chill has been hit with smiters boon in spvp which is why people want it gone. Because its for the lack of a better word "poo" especially considering anet has yet to QoL base reapers attack speeds forcing people into RO to make reaper feel modern and viable.

If they at least started with upgrading base reaper attack speeds then at least Deathly might, and i use the word loosely, "might!" have some value in spvp but right now its not worth using you take more damage than you can deal with those slow attacks when you go in for melee trades. The only time it will really work is the first time when you surprise someone with it because they dodge incorrectly due to reapers speed being 50% slower than what they are use to seeing.

[Mormegil.2345]

It does not deserve the elite gm slot, i am not comparing it with reaper's onslaught since thats the op choice.To be clear, reaper's onslaught covers the offensive part for both condi, hybrid, and power builds since it adds ferocity, quickens and also recharges your shroud so both builds can take the advantage.Blighter's boon gives the perfect survival, so it is for those who wants to stand long.The part that lies empty is the part where the build tends to focus on CC. So if we are to make it chill-dependant, it could make sense to cause hard CC in some way. my proffering is:

Deathly ChillInflicting chill on a foe grants you a charge of the effect "Overchill" for 20 secondsCan stack up to 12 timesOn the 12th charge, your next attack inflict freeze to enemies for 0.25 second.

It gets more useful where you face multiple enemies, which is the whole theme of reaper.If you think it can get overpowered on spvp or wvw this way: you can make it giving the "overchill" effect to enemies for 5 max stacks instead of 12. but as i mentioned, the first way it is really fitty for reaper's playstyle. Or you can make it activate on the 20th charge but add +10 toughness bonus for each stack, so it becomes a two-edged mechanic.Also the duration is so short it is only useful to interrupt enemies although it is hard to count the charge, making it a blind-shot, so the output rate is balanced by the lack of preciseness.

Anyway, you've got the point, reaper has no need for dps nor survival, it needs hard CC.Dont waste the whole freezing cool theme.Love you

[Aplethoraof.2643]

As a user of Deathly Chill, I'd say it is still very useful. I've used it in both sPvP and PvE for my condi reaper builds - it works fine. It provides cover conditions and the bleed does a fair bit of damage if you can use combos to stack it up.

If it were changed, I'd suggest a slight buff in the form of it making bleed deal more damage. In a similar way to how Demonic Lore causes Torment to do more damage.

Condi Reaper builds are far from dead - you can still make effective ones if you put a bit of effort into them. Though getting rid of Deadly Chill would certainly change that - the only real motivation for changing it would be to remove Condi Reapers options. Power reaper builds will still be better off choosing Reaper's Onslaught, it is a very good trait (even for Condi Reapers it can be useful).

If anything, Blighters Boon is the trait in need of help. Not Deathly Chill.

[KrHome.1920]

@Aplethoraof.2643 said:Reaper's Onslaught [...] (even for Condi Reapers it can be useful).True, if I would play condi reaper to a serious extent, I would pick a hybrid amulet, dhuumfire and reaper's onslaught in the competitive modes currently. For the bleed burst I would just pick blood is power and a transfer. That applies more condi pressue than deathly chill with its single bleed.

Deathly chill does only really work in pve. Even on spite curses corruption builds the condi pressure it can generate in pvp and wvw is underwhelming. With such a build you have a lot of trash condis on your target due to corruptions, but no real damage. That's a general problem with condi necro.

[Aplethoraof.2643]

I like the idea from https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/117073/reaper-suggestions#latest"[in addition to causing bleeding when the enemy is chilled,]15-20% bleeding damage increase against chilled foes." -Lily.1935

Could even be a 10-15% condition damage increase against chilled foes. Something like that would be interesting.

IMO that or a straight % increase to bleed damage would be good. Maybe a hybrid - 15~20% extra bleed damage while an enemy is chilled and 50% extra chill duration in addition to causing bleed when you chill an enemy.

[Aplethoraof.2643]

@ZDragon.3046 said:They certainly could do a few things with itTo name a few

1 Play with Frost aura as reaper has a method to get this naturally which could make it a fun tempting trait specifically for utility.Deathly ChillGain frost Aura on entering shroud,Frost aura's effects are improved and last longer.Frost aura duration +25% 4 to 5 secondsDamage reduction increased from 10% to 12%Chill foes when struck from 2s to 3s

2 Make it enhance the reaper shroud skills.Deathly ChillInflicting chill causes bleeding 1 stack.Reaper skill 1 throws a short projectile slash increasing its range. (similar to the option for the holo auto that throws the disk on auto attacks) The projectile inflicts a 0.5s chillReaper skill 2 now emits an ice nova on impact instead of blind.Reaper skill 5 leaves a longer ice field

Other ideasDeathly chillInflicting chill causes bleeding 1 stack.Swapping weapons Grants the Cold Dirt effect. Entering shroud always grants the effect.Cold Dirt, Chill and slow nearby foesThe ground around the player becomes frozen for 3s and follows their movements pulsing once per second applying 1s of chill and 1s of slow per pulse it (this deals no strike damage)

Deathly ChillInflicting chill causes bleeding (1 stack) and removes a boon.Foes with no boons are slowed for 1s

Deathly ChillStriking a chilled foe causes them to take an additional strike after a delayStrike interval 1 hit every 1s after a 0.5s delay.

These ideas are pretty inspired. If only all traits were this cool :+1:

I especially like the Cold Dirt one and the idea of making it enhance shroud effects in addition to bleed-on-chill.

[Mormegil.2345]

@"Lahmia.2193" said:Make it something that isn't sustain or dps. Preferably something that you would take in a pvp/wvw situation that enhances or is triggered by chilled.

made me think like: what if they transfer the rrecharge time reduction from reaper's onslaught as an addition to deathly chill? so it can mean something and also make us not to feel forced to take the onslaught lollately i was about to build around blighter's boon but at the end it felt like the onslaught is way too precious to give.despite blighter's boon also provide a precious life force income too, the onslaught it also provides the recharges beside the dps output.i mean if deathly chill was providing enormous condi output like burning instead of chill, i could understand like "it adds too much by a single thing so it doesn't have to provide anything else" but that is not the case lol poor deathly chill:d

[Acyk.9671]

deleted

Edited April 3, 2022 by Acyk.9671

[KrHome.1920]

Condi reaper has basically 3 options to be played:

• curses, soul reaping with dhuumfire and deathly chill (slow, but highest application of damaging conditions)
• curses, soul reaping with dhuumfire and onslaught (more hybrid damage oriented, but inferior to any onslaught power build)
• spite, curses with deathly chill (focuses on might and vulnerability generation and on corrupts, so less raw damage, but more buffs and debuffs)

None of these feels really great in the competitive modes, but the two bleeds of the pve version of deathly chill would be clearly overpowered on build 1 and 3 (build 2 doesn't use it). There has to be some additional damaging condition added for condi reaper to create a serious option to be played effectively, that is not simply an additional bleed for deathly chill. What they could do, would be to take the 2 bleed pve version of deathly chill, but add an ICD of 1 or 2 seconds, because the problem with 2 bleeds is mainly the burst potential.

[Mormegil.2345]

@Acyk.9671 said:

@Mormegil.2345 said:

@"Lahmia.2193" said:Make it something that isn't sustain or dps. Preferably something that you would take in a pvp/wvw situation that enhances or is triggered by chilled.

made me think like: what if they transfer the rrecharge time reduction from reaper's onslaught as an addition to deathly chill? so it can mean something and also make us not to feel forced to take the onslaught lollately i was about to build around blighter's boon but at the end it felt like the onslaught is way too precious to give.despite blighter's boon also provide a precious life force income too, the onslaught it also provides the recharges beside the dps output.i mean if deathly chill was providing enormous condi output like burning instead of chill, i could understand like "it adds too much by a single thing so it doesn't have to provide anything else" but that is not the case lol poor deathly chill:d

Why do you want to change the design? As a Damage E spec Reaper has 1 self sustain trait line, 1 condi damage trait line (through CC) and 1 power damage trait line. Condi Reaper might not be as effective as it once was but i see no reason to replace it. Nerfing this trait line was a deliberate choice to push reaper toward a more power or hybrid choice instead of entirely condi.Reaper's onslaught is too strong but Anet has made alternatives in spite for quickness (synergize well with blighter's boon) and in soul reaping for extra ferocity.This can be resolved through balance imo, no need to change traits

Dont get me wrong, i like the onslaught and before it gets the quickness on it i was hoping for such buff. My aim is to make all gm elites viable and deathly chill is stated kinda underpowered. Im no fan for full-condi in the case, actually my builds are either power or hybrid almost on every prof. So i can assure you of that im not someone that wants to buff own possessions over and over^^To make it clear, on a full viper or tb the bleed dps is like 100 per second lol XD taking wvw or pvp into calculation where condi will be cleansed in 5-10 secs at max, it becomes trash. For open world, you can take it for fantasy ofc but i doubt that you can build anything dealing more dps on fractals or raids by building upon deathly chill. So yep, i do think it needs a touch to stand viable; not for those who wont use it, but for those who might have.

[Al Masone.1274]

Between GS being a power weapon with some utility, and reaper shroud being clearly geared more towards power, I don't think reaper needs a condi build, as it runs contrary to it's main theme of big slow hits.If you want to play condi necro stick to core or scourge, and deathly chill should be remade in to either some utility like cc or boonstrip, or something that gives even more direct damage. It could even go back to doing damage over time, but with the unique thing of scaling with power, thus giving you some chip damage when you can't reliably stick to a target, but still working in support of a power build.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

@"Al Masone.1274" said:Between GS being a power weapon with some utility, and reaper shroud being clearly geared more towards power, I don't think reaper needs a condi build, as it runs contrary to it's main theme of big slow hits.If you want to play condi necro stick to core or scourge, and deathly chill should be remade in to either some utility like cc or boonstrip, or something that gives even more direct damage. It could even go back to doing damage over time, but with the unique thing of scaling with power, thus giving you some chip damage when you can't reliably stick to a target, but still working in support of a power build.

Actually condi reaper benchmark is higher than scourge and close to power reaper. Over 33K, with good RNG you can hit 34k or more; and it's just a matter of some tweaks : grieving/sinister, sigils, etc, rotation to include DS #1 #2 or not, to may-be be higher. I didn't have the patience to try all the possibilities.

The reason condi reaper is not a thing (a bit like scourge btw) the impossibles gimmicks in group : whirl combo in ice field (DS #5+#4 +GS #2) + always this conjuration sh*t ( BiP+ condi transfer), so because of light fields everywhere and random condicleanse you lose a part of your dps. But it is doing great in solo.

This is not because you have no clear, explicit, traits "DO CONDI DAMAGE" you can't overthink how to deal condi damage, linking traits togethers.Look at your traits and skills, you can apply burning on DS #AA, you have blindness on #2 and so chill, chill on #3, a combo #5+#4 for chill and poison... Shroud has always been geared also for condi. That's why condi Reaper got nerfed a lot in the past (whirl finishers from 11 to 4, deathly chill from 3 to 2 and 1 in pvp), but that's why with the new well of darkness it starts to rise again.

I don't get why you want to delete Deathly Chill.We don't need a lot to be viable, we just need Chilling nova with reduced ICD, a condi modificator with Cold Shoulder may be, and to be perfect revert the nerf on Soul Spiral to get back 6 whirl finishers. Plus Lingering Curse, it would be nice to have the +200 Condi damage somewhere else in the traitline.

[Anchoku.8142]

Scourge has barrier spam to compensate for lower dps. Reaper needs its condi-dps and it needs to keep its ice fields off the fire fields at the same time.