PvE got Raids, time for PvP to get Battlegrounds? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

PvE got Raids, time for PvP to get Battlegrounds?

Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭

So, what’s a Battleground?

An instanced PvP match where two teams of players face each other. Just like conquest, only that with larger numbers (10, 20, 50), and additional mechanics, or instanced simplified WvW.

In GW2’s case, these battlegrounds would offer endless possibilities. These are just examples for three potential game modes:


Loot the Vault

Deep inside the Mists, inside sealed cursed vaults, ancient and terrible creatures guard chambers full of gold, gemstones, and powerful artifacts. Many foolish looters have breached into them, never to return, slaughtered by monsters in the darkness, or stabbed in the back by their own comrades.

In this revision of the classic Capture the Flag mode, two teams compete against each other to be the first to hoard the biggest pile of stolen treasure.

  • Vaults can be represented by multiple locations, like crypts, lairs, dungeons, temples, mines, etc.
  • Treasure is represented by bundles of different values. A wooden chest full of gold pieces, an ancient tome of forbidden magic, a sack of glowing gemstones, an intricate diamond vase… Some can be heavier, slowing you down, and others can be cursed and injure you while you are carrying them.
  • Treasure can be acquired from treasure chambers, the enemy camp, or from the ground. Crowd control and death make you drop the treasure to the ground, where it can be taken by other players or even monsters. Delicate treasure can be broken when dropped.
  • Enemy monsters plague the vault, and you’ll have to face them as often as the enemy team. There’s also several powerful bosses as well, and defeating them unlocks new chambers, full of valuable treasures, or maybe nothing but more monsters.
  • The vault is full of traps, which you can deactivate and reactivate at will, trapping enemy monsters and players; or maybe your own team, if you’re careless.
  • Victory is achieved by the team to hoard the maximum treasure before the timer runs out, or the team with the biggest pile of treasure when the timer ends.

Some unique mechanic ideas for each map:

  • Crypt: Coffins can be found across the entire map. They can be opened, spawning monsters, treasure, or nothing at all. Nearby damage can break and disturb the coffins too, so tread carefully.
  • Labyrinth: The layout of the map changes every few minutes, with walls moving, trapping players and opening new sections.
  • Temple: Two powerful invulnerable bosses patrol the map, killing players indiscriminately.
  • Lair: A powerful beast lies in the middle, guarding a pile of treasure. The beast can be killed, but it’s too dangerous, so instead part of your team can distract it while the rest steals the treasure.

The charm of this game mode is to sabotage the enemy team as much as possible, stealing their hard-earned treasure from their base, setting up traps, killing them in the middle of a fight against a boss, and more.


War Hall

Some guilds have claimed their own territory inside the Mists, restoring ruined fortresses into majestic war halls. Stable staging points inside the Mists provide multiple advantages for the Mist War, but they also provide an easy target for rival guilds, which can at last take revenge on a more personal level.

In this mode, partially inspired by Tower Defense and Tug of War modes, the first team assaults a fortress defended by the second team, with the final goal of killing their lord and capturing the throne room before the timer runs out.

  • Supply plays a key role in this game mode. It’s generated by Supply Generators, similar to those in the Edge of the Mists. Players need to take supply directly from them, and then spend it on repairs, siege weapons, or allied troops.
  • NPC troops will lead the front line, and both sides need to watch out and make sure their own troops aren’t overwhelmed, else they are overwhelmed themselves later on.
  • General World vs World rules apply, with a major exception: Recapturing doesn’t heal structural damages.
  • The attacking team achieves victory by slaying the enemy lord and capturing the throne room before the timer runs out. The defending team achieves victory by surviving until the timer ends.
  • Two different types of queues: Mercenary and Commander.
  • Mercenary queue has no predefined leaders, and each team has to improvise. Players can queue as parties or individually, and the matchmaking will group them together until the two teams are complete. Think of PvP hotjoin and solo queue.
  • Commander queue has a clear leader, and you join with an organized squad. Additional players can be recruited through LFG. This queue also has a league system, where guilds compete against each other, unlocking bonus upgrades for their guild halls, as well as unique decorations and trophies available only to the best. Think of PvP team queue.
  • Each guild can unlock its own war hall, for use in custom games and commander queue. Guild War Halls can be customized in multiple ways, including fortress layout, special effects, guard equipment, lord abilities, and more. The attacking force can be customized as well.

Types of objectives:

  • Supply Generator: Can not be captured, but can be destroyed, stopping the production of supply until the owning team repairs it. While destroyed, the enemy team can take supply from it too.
  • Building: Capture point inside. Has own gates and walls, and can provide access to upper sections of the war hall.
  • Plaza: Large capture point. Open space with barricades. The throne room is considered a plaza.
  • Hall Gate: Capture point in the inner side, automatically destroyed if captured by the attackers.
  • Hall Wall: Can not be captured.
  • All guards need to be killed before the objective is captured.

Usage of supply:

  • Both teams can spend supply on repairs and building siege weapons, similar to WvW. Supply can be spent on troops too, which work differently for each team.
  • The troops of the attacking team spawn endlessly from their base, from three different points with three different routes of attack. Spawning facilities can be upgraded to spawn more troops, like in a Tug of War game.
  • The troops of the defending team need to be spawned manually, placed above walls or inside controlled objectives, like a Tower Defense game. Once they die, they don’t respawn.
  • Both teams start with a basic number of troops. Note that troops can’t control siege, only players can.
  • Additionally, both teams have three long-range heavy cannons, that can reach any point in the battlefield except the spawning positions and the supply generators. Loading and firing them consumes supply.

This game mode works as a WvW-lite, with an additional layer of management, and the satisfaction of a long siege, including the joys of artillery fire for one side and slaughtering an endless stream of enemy troops for the other.


Dominance

All across the Mists, timeless battlefields are still burning, frozen in place. Endless struggle with no end, waiting for brave heroes to rise victorious and break the cycle.

This mode combines Conquest elements with King of the Hill elements, with a special emphasis on fights. Two teams face each other in battle, competing to be the first to capture the entire map or to score the most kills.

  • The map has a total of five capture points. They take longer to capture than Conquest points, and require multiple players at once. Four have a normal size, and require at least 2 players, while the fifth is larger, and requires at least 5 players.
  • Maps take place in complex environments, like urban battlegrounds or dense forests. Specific locations across the map can give clear advantages to melee or ranged combat. The environment is highly destructible, and repairs are not enabled.
  • Specific siege weaponry is available and plays a key role for ranged combat. Siege bundles are limited in number, and can be picked at the starting location. Siege weapons are deadlier hidden or placed at vantage points.
  • Players can respawn at the starting location, or at any point they have captured, as long as it’s not under attack. Respawn is wave-based, with all dead players respawning at the same time.
  • All deaths, by other players or by the environment, qualify for the score.
  • Victory is achieved by the first team to capture all five points or score the maximum kills before the timer runs out, or the team with the most kills when the timer ends.

Some environment ideas:

  • Burning City: An urban environment, where you can enter the ruined buildings. You can navigate the map through the streets, the roofs, or the sewers. The buildings can be further destroyed by siege weapons, and collapsing pieces damage nearby players. Burning debris can block routes as well.
  • Swamp Ruins: Hard to navigate, pools of stagnant water slow you down. Local creatures can attack lonely players, slowing them down even further. Climbing ruined towers and treehouses is mandatory to scout the nearby terrain.
  • Monastery Peak: Vertical map, with bridges and stairs linking the different buildings. Every few minutes, a snowstorm hits the exterior, impairing visibility and applying chill to unsheltered players. Falling down can be fatal.
  • Dark Mine: Some zones have natural light, but most of the mine is shrouded in darkness. You need to light fires to see properly, or hide in the shadows to ambush the enemy team. Mine equipment is active, and many of the tunnels have railways with moving carts, that can crash into your squad if you are careless. Drills can be activated to open new tunnels.

This game mode is similar in gameplay to some classic FPS games, and encourages ambushes and strategic approaches. Scouting and knowing the environment is very important as well. A melee fighter will perform better inside smaller spaces with close distances, while a ranged fighter will have an advantage at open spaces with ground obstacles.


So yeah, just three random ideas for some good battleground gameplay. I would say 10v10 is an ideal number of players, and would follow compositions similar to those of raids. The size of these maps should be roughly 1/3 of a normal WvW map, with multiple floors when needed.

These wouldn’t replace World vs World, but provide an alternative gameplay to it. I feel like WvW has just too many things going on, and too many playstyles to cater, and adding new modes could give WvW more freedom for a clear direction. Also, one of the biggest disadvantages of WvW is that you can spend long times with no action, while battlegrounds would provide instant action easily, just like PvP, but with larger parties where teamplay combat really makes a difference.

Should battlegrounds make it into the game (dreaming is free) WvW could grow into a new direction. Alliances instead of servers? Guilds having bigger control over captured buildings? Shorter matches?

Looking forward your opinions! =D

Original thread: https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/wuv/PvE-got-Raids-time-for-Battlegrounds

Comments

  • Jekkt.6045Jekkt.6045 Member ✭✭✭

    pvp laggs even with 8v8 so anything higher than that is impossible. furthermore, the more players the more chaotic and worse gw2 pvp gets. the only new game mode i would support would be a real gw1 style gvg with 6v6. then again, this pvp scene is so dead that any new game mode that requires coordination and more than 2 players per team would most likely fail.

  • ibThuggin.1758ibThuggin.1758 Member ✭✭
    edited September 16, 2017

    All they need is 8v8 Guild vs Guild like they had in the first GUILD WARS game. Unfortunately these devs are more content with just kitten up the balance by introducing more bs with every elite class spec. On a positive note your ideas sound interesting.

  • R E F L H E X.8413R E F L H E X.8413 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 16, 2017

    2v2 isnt really enough people to call it a team thats basically dueling. You want something resembling midline frontline and backline which isnt going to happen in this game anyways even if we got the perfect format.

    between using the same weaponset without changeable skills and conquest only the game has held my interest less than runescape did in the past.

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭

    @Jekkt.6045 said:
    pvp laggs even with 8v8 so anything higher than that is impossible. furthermore, the more players the more chaotic and worse gw2 pvp gets. the only new game mode i would support would be a real gw1 style gvg with 6v6. then again, this pvp scene is so dead that any new game mode that requires coordination and more than 2 players per team would most likely fail.

    I play WvW fine most of the time with 50+ people on screen :anguished: .

    @tsuyosugiru.7634 said:
    I'd rather see 2v2 arenas :)

    But we already have those lol: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hall_of_the_Mists

    @R E F L H E X.8413 said:
    2v2 isnt really enough people to call it a team thats basically dueling. You want something resembling midline frontline and backline which isnt going to happen in this game anyways even if we got the perfect format.

    between using the same weaponset without changeable skills and conquest only the game has held my interest less than runescape did in the past.

    How about a mode where you can swap between your characters quickly and easily? Like, you play as your guardian, get killed, and then decide to respawn as your ranger?

  • Can we bring back old caprixorn allready...

  • Yes we need a new gamemode or completely redo stronghold

  • I really hope a dev reviewed this post.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This was like best idea i have ever seen :D

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • Sifu.9745Sifu.9745 Member ✭✭

    Yes, please. Battlegrounds would be way better options for those who like balanced massive fights, like 10 vs 10, 15 vs 15, but don't like WvW where random numbers fight against random numbers (20 vs 50 is not fun and balanced at all).

  • This is needed, more game modes pls!!!

  • I dont know if all the specific details about OPs games modes are viable but definitely pretty close to what PvP should be.

  • The problem with big group pvp in this game is the visual clutter makes it not fun.

    5v5 is already hell with crappy visual ground effects and other stuff, and wvw is unbearable.

  • masskillerxploit.2165masskillerxploit.2165 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 14, 2017

    @Daffan.8924 said:
    The problem with big group pvp in this game is the visual clutter makes it not fun.

    5v5 is already hell with crappy visual ground effects and other stuff, and wvw is unbearable.

    yeah but anet balances around those numbers (10v10, WvW). aka look at how daredevil, scourge, spellbreaker and many other builds completely broke conquest.

  • Pvp is battlegrounds. Literally every mmo has big group objective pvp as battlegrounds and extremely small scale arenas as the competitive pvp.

  • no supply or siege please
    keep that garbage in wvw

  • @ellesee.8297 said:
    Pvp is battlegrounds. Literally every mmo has big group objective pvp as battlegrounds and extremely small scale arenas as the competitive pvp.

    Wanted to say just the same! B)

  • @ellesee.8297 said:
    Pvp is battlegrounds. Literally every mmo has big group objective pvp as battlegrounds and extremely small scale arenas as the competitive pvp.

    True i guess, however I think WvW and PvP should be warped into one category. Which would be PvP or Mist Wars or Guild Wars or something like that.

    1) Introduce Factions again, have servers join 1 of 2 factions, which would reduce the current FFA for servers, to just 2 teams. (Increases competitivity while increasing teamwork amongst servers. Red Vs Blue, Kurzick vs Luxcon, idc..

    2) Change WvW to a much faster-paced version. Make a Ranked Q and Unranked Q for WvW.
    - Luxon vs Kurzick (insert whatever faction names) unranked Q would be 40v40 on a big WvW map that rotates to different maps such as (desert map, BD map, or EotM map)
    -Ranked Q would be more Guild focused, 10v10 or 15v15, where guilds compete against each other in a objective based arena (smaller map than unranked) gamemode.

    3) Delete conquest, lets be real, its not fun anymore, and the balance direction that the balance team wants to go, is way off from what conquest balance should be. Also people in ranked conquest just wanna be in teamfights, 2v2s, or 1v1s, nobody really cares about playing the objective anymore.

    4) Replace conquest with 1v1, 2v2s, 3v3s arena Qs. Only have 3v3s as ranked. *balance is just too off for a 2v2 and 1v1 to be considered for a ranked Q.

    5) make automated tournaments for the new WvW ranked Q, and 3v3 ranked Q.

    I think these changes or changes close to this would make Guilds feel important again in terms of building up the prestigious of your guild. Right now there really isn't away for you to make your guild stand out by winning in sPvP, even in WvW, prestigous is built by word of mouth, but if the guild could have something like a title associated with it, or something special in the guild hall.. or.... gold capes :), to show off what its guild members achieved.

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭

    I think WvW's major problem is that it caters to way too many playstyles, which can coexist with each other. Battlegrounds would remove part of those playstyles and give them their own space. Then they could redesign WvW around a stronger design, with a clearer purpose and gameplay.

    Then they could also replace servers with alliances, either organized by the players or the game itself.

    @Sifu.9745 said:
    Yes, please. Battlegrounds would be way better options for those who like balanced massive fights, like 10 vs 10, 15 vs 15, but don't like WvW where random numbers fight against random numbers (20 vs 50 is not fun and balanced at all).

    The major problems with WvW is that there's long periods of time with no action, where nothing's happening, and that defending isn't really worth it because you can recapture stuff later anyway.

    A battleground mode would have constant fighting, just like PvP, and structural damages would be permanent, so if a door falls, it stays broken for the rest of the match.

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    no supply or siege please
    keep that garbage in wvw

    Some maps could have siege, others not, but supply and WvW-style siege building should stay in WvW.

  • I think pvp needs alternatives too. The same "5vs5 cap the points and rotate again and again" would be boring even if the balance was perfect. Of course that is not the case, and it's understandable (well, moderately) given the amount of specs, having to deal with pve balance as well and so on. The logical consequence imo is to introduce variety in game modes, where a deadeye could take advantage of the environment to actually become valuable to his team (first example that came to mind).
    (sorry for my english btw)

  • Cynz.9437Cynz.9437 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 8, 2017

    @masskillerxploit.2165 said:

    @Daffan.8924 said:
    The problem with big group pvp in this game is the visual clutter makes it not fun.

    5v5 is already hell with crappy visual ground effects and other stuff, and wvw is unbearable.

    yeah but anet balances around those numbers (10v10, WvW). aka look at how daredevil, scourge, spellbreaker and many other builds completely broke conquest.

    actually scourge/sb/fb combo is even more unbearable in big numbers, just saying

    GW is P2Win. We are always lied to.

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭

    @Smithwicks.8514 said:
    I think pvp needs alternatives too. The same "5vs5 cap the points and rotate again and again" would be boring even if the balance was perfect. Of course that is not the case, and it's understandable (well, moderately) given the amount of specs, having to deal with pve balance as well and so on. The logical consequence imo is to introduce variety in game modes, where a deadeye could take advantage of the environment to actually become valuable to his team (first example that came to mind).
    (sorry for my english btw)

    I think sPvP Conquest is fine. Adding more stuff to it would only give it the same problems WvW has. New stuff and ideas should go into new modes.

    I wouldn't mind some FFA Deathmatch game mode, but I'm not sure the current gameplay would work well enough with that.

  • zealex.9410zealex.9410 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lonami.2987 said:
    So, what’s a Battleground?

    An instanced PvP match where two teams of players face each other. Just like conquest, only that with larger numbers (10, 20, 50), and additional mechanics, or instanced simplified WvW.

    In GW2’s case, these battlegrounds would offer endless possibilities. These are just examples for three potential game modes:


    Loot the Vault

    Deep inside the Mists, inside sealed cursed vaults, ancient and terrible creatures guard chambers full of gold, gemstones, and powerful artifacts. Many foolish looters have breached into them, never to return, slaughtered by monsters in the darkness, or stabbed in the back by their own comrades.

    In this revision of the classic Capture the Flag mode, two teams compete against each other to be the first to hoard the biggest pile of stolen treasure.

    • Vaults can be represented by multiple locations, like crypts, lairs, dungeons, temples, mines, etc.
    • Treasure is represented by bundles of different values. A wooden chest full of gold pieces, an ancient tome of forbidden magic, a sack of glowing gemstones, an intricate diamond vase… Some can be heavier, slowing you down, and others can be cursed and injure you while you are carrying them.
    • Treasure can be acquired from treasure chambers, the enemy camp, or from the ground. Crowd control and death make you drop the treasure to the ground, where it can be taken by other players or even monsters. Delicate treasure can be broken when dropped.
    • Enemy monsters plague the vault, and you’ll have to face them as often as the enemy team. There’s also several powerful bosses as well, and defeating them unlocks new chambers, full of valuable treasures, or maybe nothing but more monsters.
    • The vault is full of traps, which you can deactivate and reactivate at will, trapping enemy monsters and players; or maybe your own team, if you’re careless.
    • Victory is achieved by the team to hoard the maximum treasure before the timer runs out, or the team with the biggest pile of treasure when the timer ends.

    Some unique mechanic ideas for each map:

    • Crypt: Coffins can be found across the entire map. They can be opened, spawning monsters, treasure, or nothing at all. Nearby damage can break and disturb the coffins too, so tread carefully.
    • Labyrinth: The layout of the map changes every few minutes, with walls moving, trapping players and opening new sections.
    • Temple: Two powerful invulnerable bosses patrol the map, killing players indiscriminately.
    • Lair: A powerful beast lies in the middle, guarding a pile of treasure. The beast can be killed, but it’s too dangerous, so instead part of your team can distract it while the rest steals the treasure.

    The charm of this game mode is to sabotage the enemy team as much as possible, stealing their hard-earned treasure from their base, setting up traps, killing them in the middle of a fight against a boss, and more.


    War Hall

    Some guilds have claimed their own territory inside the Mists, restoring ruined fortresses into majestic war halls. Stable staging points inside the Mists provide multiple advantages for the Mist War, but they also provide an easy target for rival guilds, which can at last take revenge on a more personal level.

    In this mode, partially inspired by Tower Defense and Tug of War modes, the first team assaults a fortress defended by the second team, with the final goal of killing their lord and capturing the throne room before the timer runs out.

    • Supply plays a key role in this game mode. It’s generated by Supply Generators, similar to those in the Edge of the Mists. Players need to take supply directly from them, and then spend it on repairs, siege weapons, or allied troops.
    • NPC troops will lead the front line, and both sides need to watch out and make sure their own troops aren’t overwhelmed, else they are overwhelmed themselves later on.
    • General World vs World rules apply, with a major exception: Recapturing doesn’t heal structural damages.
    • The attacking team achieves victory by slaying the enemy lord and capturing the throne room before the timer runs out. The defending team achieves victory by surviving until the timer ends.
    • Two different types of queues: Mercenary and Commander.
    • Mercenary queue has no predefined leaders, and each team has to improvise. Players can queue as parties or individually, and the matchmaking will group them together until the two teams are complete. Think of PvP hotjoin and solo queue.
    • Commander queue has a clear leader, and you join with an organized squad. Additional players can be recruited through LFG. This queue also has a league system, where guilds compete against each other, unlocking bonus upgrades for their guild halls, as well as unique decorations and trophies available only to the best. Think of PvP team queue.
    • Each guild can unlock its own war hall, for use in custom games and commander queue. Guild War Halls can be customized in multiple ways, including fortress layout, special effects, guard equipment, lord abilities, and more. The attacking force can be customized as well.

    Types of objectives:

    • Supply Generator: Can not be captured, but can be destroyed, stopping the production of supply until the owning team repairs it. While destroyed, the enemy team can take supply from it too.
    • Building: Capture point inside. Has own gates and walls, and can provide access to upper sections of the war hall.
    • Plaza: Large capture point. Open space with barricades. The throne room is considered a plaza.
    • Hall Gate: Capture point in the inner side, automatically destroyed if captured by the attackers.
    • Hall Wall: Can not be captured.
    • All guards need to be killed before the objective is captured.

    Usage of supply:

    • Both teams can spend supply on repairs and building siege weapons, similar to WvW. Supply can be spent on troops too, which work differently for each team.
    • The troops of the attacking team spawn endlessly from their base, from three different points with three different routes of attack. Spawning facilities can be upgraded to spawn more troops, like in a Tug of War game.
    • The troops of the defending team need to be spawned manually, placed above walls or inside controlled objectives, like a Tower Defense game. Once they die, they don’t respawn.
    • Both teams start with a basic number of troops. Note that troops can’t control siege, only players can.
    • Additionally, both teams have three long-range heavy cannons, that can reach any point in the battlefield except the spawning positions and the supply generators. Loading and firing them consumes supply.

    This game mode works as a WvW-lite, with an additional layer of management, and the satisfaction of a long siege, including the joys of artillery fire for one side and slaughtering an endless stream of enemy troops for the other.


    Dominance

    All across the Mists, timeless battlefields are still burning, frozen in place. Endless struggle with no end, waiting for brave heroes to rise victorious and break the cycle.

    This mode combines Conquest elements with King of the Hill elements, with a special emphasis on fights. Two teams face each other in battle, competing to be the first to capture the entire map or to score the most kills.

    • The map has a total of five capture points. They take longer to capture than Conquest points, and require multiple players at once. Four have a normal size, and require at least 2 players, while the fifth is larger, and requires at least 5 players.
    • Maps take place in complex environments, like urban battlegrounds or dense forests. Specific locations across the map can give clear advantages to melee or ranged combat. The environment is highly destructible, and repairs are not enabled.
    • Specific siege weaponry is available and plays a key role for ranged combat. Siege bundles are limited in number, and can be picked at the starting location. Siege weapons are deadlier hidden or placed at vantage points.
    • Players can respawn at the starting location, or at any point they have captured, as long as it’s not under attack. Respawn is wave-based, with all dead players respawning at the same time.
    • All deaths, by other players or by the environment, qualify for the score.
    • Victory is achieved by the first team to capture all five points or score the maximum kills before the timer runs out, or the team with the most kills when the timer ends.

    Some environment ideas:

    • Burning City: An urban environment, where you can enter the ruined buildings. You can navigate the map through the streets, the roofs, or the sewers. The buildings can be further destroyed by siege weapons, and collapsing pieces damage nearby players. Burning debris can block routes as well.
    • Swamp Ruins: Hard to navigate, pools of stagnant water slow you down. Local creatures can attack lonely players, slowing them down even further. Climbing ruined towers and treehouses is mandatory to scout the nearby terrain.
    • Monastery Peak: Vertical map, with bridges and stairs linking the different buildings. Every few minutes, a snowstorm hits the exterior, impairing visibility and applying chill to unsheltered players. Falling down can be fatal.
    • Dark Mine: Some zones have natural light, but most of the mine is shrouded in darkness. You need to light fires to see properly, or hide in the shadows to ambush the enemy team. Mine equipment is active, and many of the tunnels have railways with moving carts, that can crash into your squad if you are careless. Drills can be activated to open new tunnels.

    This game mode is similar in gameplay to some classic FPS games, and encourages ambushes and strategic approaches. Scouting and knowing the environment is very important as well. A melee fighter will perform better inside smaller spaces with close distances, while a ranged fighter will have an advantage at open spaces with ground obstacles.


    So yeah, just three random ideas for some good battleground gameplay. I would say 10v10 is an ideal number of players, and would follow compositions similar to those of raids. The size of these maps should be roughly 1/3 of a normal WvW map, with multiple floors when needed.

    These wouldn’t replace World vs World, but provide an alternative gameplay to it. I feel like WvW has just too many things going on, and too many playstyles to cater, and adding new modes could give WvW more freedom for a clear direction. Also, one of the biggest disadvantages of WvW is that you can spend long times with no action, while battlegrounds would provide instant action easily, just like PvP, but with larger parties where teamplay combat really makes a difference.

    Should battlegrounds make it into the game (dreaming is free) WvW could grow into a new direction. Alliances instead of servers? Guilds having bigger control over captured buildings? Shorter matches?

    Looking forward your opinions! =D

    Original thread: https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/wuv/PvE-got-Raids-time-for-Battlegrounds

    If they added battleground wvw would prob die since every wvw guild would simply gvg there. So ye... pls big battlegrounds.

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭

    @masskillerxploit.2165 said:
    Yes we need a new gamemode or completely redo stronghold

    Stronghold could work as a MOBA-like map, but it needs 3-5 lanes, lots of NPCs, and 10 players per team. Their biggest mistake with Stronghold was trying to be different just to be different, with no solid plans behind it.

    @ellesee.8297 said:
    Pvp is battlegrounds. Literally every mmo has big group objective pvp as battlegrounds and extremely small scale arenas as the competitive pvp.

    Yeah I really miss that here. WvW is good, but it doesn't cover that type of gameplay. Battlegrounds would provide a WvW-like experience, except with more balanced teams, and more abundant action.

    @zealex.9410 said:
    If they added battleground wvw would prob die since every wvw guild would simply gvg there. So ye... pls big battlegrounds.

    I don't think it would die, but the way it's played would change a lot, probably for the better.

  • Razor.6392Razor.6392 Member ✭✭✭✭

    GW3 .

    Never said I'm the best, but I believe I'm better than you.

  • JayAction.9056JayAction.9056 Member ✭✭✭

    We already have something like this with WvW. I rather they put more time into WvW and somehow manage to create a rule set or system in that which guarantees a lot more action with the new server system.

  • Draco.9480Draco.9480 Member ✭✭✭

    I'd like a capture the flag like in WoW with 10vs10 or 15vs15 or something.

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    There's an equally important factor to this other than just having a new game mode. The supporting systems like rewards, integration and incentive also need to be figured out. For example, if this becomes a platform for GvG, what do the guilds actually gain out of it? Decorations? New guild levels? Will there be a re-haul of the Guild Mission system, so this can be included? And what about guilds that can't fill a full roster of 10? Is there a mercenary system to patch that up? What do the mercenaries gain out of it? How many mercenaries can a guild have?

    Those are all in addition to the regular issues you have with increased player numbers. How do you prevent zerging? If you make separate objectives to divide players, why make it 10v10 at all? Do you provide players with additional defenses to prevent 10v1 focusing? How do you deal with 1v1's in this scenario of increased defenses? How much killing NPC's (PvE) does it include?

    Via guilds GvG actually touches upon PvE and WvW as well, and if they add something for your guild to gain in PvP, how does ANet make that available to the people of those game modes as well? The rewards don't need to be exactly the same, unless you're talking of guild levels, but things that can be compared with each other. By what means are these similar rewards gained in PvE and WvW?

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 12, 2018

    Figured I would post my final ideas for battlegrounds, used in my Cantha expansion idea. In this idea, battlegrounds would be one of the selling points of the expansion, including a total of four, available for everyone, owners of the expansion or not, accessible either from hot join or solo/team queues.


    New PvP mode: Battlegrounds

    Battlegrounds are the ultimate Player versus Player challenge. Form a squad of 10 players, and face 10 other players in combat. Each battleground has unique mechanics, and can be queued individually, with no random map selection involved. Queue as a team or as a solo player, in either unranked or ranked mode.

    Battlegrounds use real world locations, which you can visit during your adventures across Cantha. Players who don't own the expansion can access this new game mode through the Heart of the Mists.

    The rules are simple: The team who reaches 1,000 points first wins the match. Each player death gives 5 points to the enemy team, other secondary goals providing bonus points as well, and more rarely, instant victory.

    Capture points may be present to gain control over various special mechanics, but they don't affect the score in any constant way.


    Nahpui Quarter

    The gang wars of Kaineng City have taken its toll on this quarter. The docks at the southwest controlled by the Jade Brotherhood, and the northeastern tunnels by the Am Fah, the constant warfare has been going on for years. The Imperial Guard, content to see the gangs vent most of their violence far away from the palace, decided to relocate the citizens and just let the gangs take over.

    Nowadays, Nahpui Quarter is no man's land. The map represents an urban battleground, with the abandoned houses now in ruins. Fires are commonplace, and many houses have been burning for months, the dirt and the moisture preventing the flames from taking over for good. Houses can collapse at any time, trapping or killing unwary passerbies. The sewers are in disarray, and entire sections can flood with no warning. The environment itself will be your first enemy.

    Gang members clash constantly against each other, fighting for control over the quarter, seeking to establish secure routes for their smuggling activities. Mercenaries often join these fights, looking for money or just a good brawl. Groups of enemy NPCs spawn every few seconds, patrolling the streets and fighting each other.

    Both gangs have built forts at each side of the quarter. Inspired by Guild versus Guild, the secondary goal of the map is to sneak into the enemy fort and kill their Gang Lord. Allied NPCs can be used as cannon fodder to breach the gates, or alternatively, players can take secondary routes through the sewers or the rooftops. Whoever kills the enemy lord achieves instant victory no matter the score.


    Monastery of the Thousand Daggers

    High in the mountains, this monastery belonged to an ancient order of assassins long ago. Now only the snow and the chilling wind make it their home. Its remote location makes it a really unattractive target for looters, and if that wasn't enough, most of its trap systems are still up and running.

    The Monastery of the Thousand Daggers has a lot of verticality, with bridges and stairs linking the different buildings. Every few minutes, a snowstorm hits the exterior, impairing visibility and applying chill to unsheltered players. Inside the buildings, players can deactivate and reactivate all sort of traps, from spike pits to swinging axes. Be careful though, for the traps can kill your allies as easily as your enemies. Each room has a different theme and a different trap.

    The secondary goal of the map is to deactivate all the traps, unlocking access to the altar room. Once there, you can try to overcome the final set of traps and reach the secret artifact inside, achieving instant victory no matter the score.


    The Aurios Mines

    One of the oldest quarries of the Luxon, the Aurios Mines are famous for its mysterious relics of unknown origin, as well as the demonic plague that haunts them. In the recent decades, water has found its way into some of the quarries, and with it, various sea monsters as well.

    This map has a deep PvE component, being filled with enemy monsters that will attack both teams constantly. Luxon miners dig the jade for treasures, but they need help bringing them back to the main outpost. Inspired by Capture the Flag, the secondary goal of the map is to retrieve said treasures from across the map, and bring them back to the main outpost for bonus points.

    Treasure bundles have different properties and values. Some are heavier but more valuable, others will break if you drop them, and few might be cursed and injure the carrier. Usually, the most valuable loot will be the one at the deepest points, surrounded by more monsters. Bosses will spawn periodically across the map, and killing them will spawn additional treasure.

    Be wary of other players, for they can steal treasure from you and then deliver it themselves. Enemy monsters can also be lured against the enemy team, to keep them distracted while you hoard all the loot.


    Amatz Basin

    The site of an ancient battle between two of the Kurzick houses, the zu Heltzers and the Vasburgs, Amatz Basin is still used as a battleground to this day, testing the mettle of new Kurzick recruits.

    Inspired by King of the Hill, the secondary goal of the map is to capture a series of points, spawning every few minutes in seven different locations across the map. Sometimes, a single capture point will spawn, and others it will be two. Capture requires at least 3 players, and takes around 20 seconds. Capture points despawn after a few minutes if no one reclaims them. Players need to react to the point spawns, and move across the map according to them.

    The terrain of the map is pretty irregular and full of vegetation. Pools of stagnant water can slow you down, and some zones are shrouded in darkness, requiring you to carry torch bundles and light braziers to improve visibility. Alternatively, you can try moving in the shadows to ambush the enemy team.


    As you see, battlegrounds have a lot of potential. If done right, they could become the main PvP activity of the game, leaving sPvP and WvW in a second plane. While this might sound negative at first, both sPvP and WvW could receive updates catering to specific audiences to strengthen their own playerbase, updates that now would cause an uproar, because there's way too many players with different interests and you can't make everyone happy.

    @JayAction.9056 said:
    We already have something like this with WvW. I rather they put more time into WvW and somehow manage to create a rule set or system in that which guarantees a lot more action with the new server system.

    An open world experience will never match an instanced experience where combat is the only goal.

  • TL;DR. But keep an eye on thiş guy's ideas. He got what it takes to create things.

  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭

    They won't do anything of that sort..not now not ever, they're entirely concerned with making money using the least amount of effort and they can do that by keeping pumping out additions for the cash shop as a mean to control the fashion wars. Soon they will introduce player's housing and with it all the exotic memorabilia you can imagine. Near glider, mount and weapon skins...you'll soon find chair/bed/kitchen skins lol ....everything else is there to keep the whales entertained enough to keep coming and coming...let's not forget the mobile version for which there is a programmer job opening ...they can't miss on the whole mobile gaming cash cows.

    You guys are dreamers..but dreams don't make money

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • If I thought Anet could actually do it right, I might actually support this idea. Unfortunately, season after season of fiascos, lack of balance, continual decline of player population; leads me to believe that pvp should be slapped with a DNR order or euthanised.

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭

    @Blackdagger.9670 said:
    TL;DR. But keep an eye on thiş guy's ideas. He got what it takes to create things.

    Appreciated =D.

    @Arheundel.6451 said:
    They won't do anything of that sort..not now not ever, they're entirely concerned with making money using the least amount of effort and they can do that by keeping pumping out additions for the cash shop as a mean to control the fashion wars. Soon they will introduce player's housing and with it all the exotic memorabilia you can imagine. Near glider, mount and weapon skins...you'll soon find chair/bed/kitchen skins lol ....everything else is there to keep the whales entertained enough to keep coming and coming...let's not forget the mobile version for which there is a programmer job opening ...they can't miss on the whole mobile gaming cash cows.

    You guys are dreamers..but dreams don't make money

    They could monetize battlegrounds through guilds, leaderboards, etc. The demand is there, and let's be fair, housing is not for everyone, it won't make the same money as gliders or mounts.

    It's good to have multiple streams of revenue, and this can be one.

    @MissCee.1295 said:
    If I thought Anet could actually do it right, I might actually support this idea. Unfortunately, season after season of fiascos, lack of balance, continual decline of player population; leads me to believe that pvp should be slapped with a DNR order or euthanised.

    I think the best thing they could do is stop trying to balance it so much. Let people have fun on their own, and stop changing things every few patches.

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