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Do You Find The Game More Fun To Play Now Or Before Revamp


Lighter.5631

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@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

@Shiyo.3578 said:This poll isn't accurate because anyone who disliked the old meta quit the game long ago and the majority of people around were already having fun in the old meta, so they're the ones voting.

The only reason I'm back is because of the revamp. The game is a lot better now, but holo, ranger, and rev all have too much sustain and go against the entire design philosophy of the patch. Zero investment for tons of sustain = bad, and all 3 of those classes have far, far too much free sustain.

untrue, most people who prefer pre-patch are mostly active players i saw on the forum even before feb 25, and actually most people who like meta now, are people who i have not see any at all pre-patch in forum or in game pre-patch and even now.this is not about holo/ranger/rev being too much sustain(in fact these builds die super fast if you pick the counter build). it's about not having any skill involvement in the game. see if they nerf sustain again, you people will again complain about too much damage. so these are really pointless, what's important is that if this meta is fun/skillful to play or fight in. which currently, condition rev is definitely the degenerate of power rev, and daredevil is degenerate of core thief, so is defense warrior, it's passive, it's boring and it lives too long and still does good damage, what's the different? skill/fun.

in fact ,i would like to think anyone who enjoys the current meta compared to feb 25th meta might be low tier players, since the only difference is basically now requires less skill to play and die slower.also it is almost the same boring meta that killed pvp scene HoT, but you wouldn't know, while most people who dislike the current meta know because they played.You guys compare PoF with HoT balance-wise and think everything is dandy, which in reality you should compare HoT and PoF with Core, since it's the starting point for every class and e-speces should be made around them as another way to play, not a straight-up upgrade to carry them.Welcome in reality I guess.

We should compare it to core, where literally every build was doing 2x the damage on equivalent amulets and builds as they are now.

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A significant handful of builds that allowed people to immediately wipe other players off the map were harmful and needed to be removed. Similarly, some builds that gave players near infinite resources to mitigate damage also needed to be removed.

It is by no means perfectly balanced, but it's a good start compared to what we dealt with before. Glass builds still do exist and are reasonably effective, but a few builds in particular require damage buffs once all the razing is done.

I'm not willing to call it just yet. I don't think this balancing effort is even approaching finished. The only thing this patch has done so far is shown who was carried by their build prepatch and who actually knows enough about the game/their class of choice to play it well postpatch.

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The old 1 shot builds was a ridiculous era with ridiculous power creep spam fests where whoever gets the first hit wins.

There was less skillful outplaying your opponents and more of: Go in the fight, throw on stealth spam 1 shot=WIN.Or go in and throw on a million boons to have invuln spam swiftness 25 might+ fury+quickness spam.

Pre nerf meta was so bad, necro literally was trash because everything was spam burst 1 shot meta and it was boring to play because get near point get 1 shotted repeatedly.

New meta you can still kill players, but it takes more time and skill and you need to actually outplay people.

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I would have voted for an option : "The game wasn't fun before and after the patch".

Balance is unlikely to happens unless there is a miracle.

On a small positive note, they did reduce one shot builds (which is GREAT step in the goos direction), however, they didn't do it in the right way.

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@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

@"Shiyo.3578" said:This poll isn't accurate because anyone who disliked the old meta quit the game long ago and the majority of people around were already having fun in the old meta, so they're the ones voting.

The only reason I'm back is because of the revamp. The game is a lot better now, but holo, ranger, and rev all have too much sustain and go against the entire design philosophy of the patch. Zero investment for tons of sustain = bad, and all 3 of those classes have far, far too much free sustain.

untrue, most people who prefer pre-patch are mostly active players i saw on the forum even before feb 25, and actually most people who like meta now, are people who i have not see any at all pre-patch in forum or in game pre-patch and even now.this is not about holo/ranger/rev being too much sustain(in fact these builds die super fast if you pick the counter build). it's about not having any skill involvement in the game. see if they nerf sustain again, you people will again complain about too much damage. so these are really pointless, what's important is that if this meta is fun/skillful to play or fight in. which currently, condition rev is definitely the degenerate of power rev, and daredevil is degenerate of core thief, so is defense warrior, it's passive, it's boring and it lives too long and still does good damage, what's the different? skill/fun.

in fact ,i would like to think anyone who enjoys the current meta compared to feb 25th meta might be low tier players, since the only difference is basically now requires less skill to play and die slower.also it is almost the same boring meta that killed pvp scene HoT, but you wouldn't know, while most people who dislike the current meta know because they played.

Quite interesting what you write about "basically now requires less skill to play" when in reality the meta before 25th didn't require much knowledge about classes/rotation/kiting etc.

You are not talking sense, tell me any build/anything that requires more skill then beforeyes, you can't find because they are all less skill required now. classes/rotation/kitting is even less required now.and how is fights more tough compared to before, now you die way slower with more error allowed and has more braindead builds

and why you are giving your rank range so widely.if that's the case then i'm plat 1-legendary 1.

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people complain about 1 shot, but it still exists, before 2/25 every class had the option, now only 3-4 classes have the option, balanced?step in the right direction?thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classesguess what happens when low mobility class dodges 1 shot from high mobility class? they reset, and try again, infinitely, because you can't return the burstwhat people miss, you can dodge the 1 shot leaving them with their skills on cool down, then follow up with your own 1 shot(pre2/25), stunned? bring a stun breaknow you only need random dodges in most fights, because 30 damage is 30 damage, doesn't matter what you dodge as long as you press all the buttons.

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@avey.4201 said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still exists, before 2/25 every class had the option, now only 3-4 classes have the option, balanced?step in the right direction?thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classesguess what happens when low mobility class dodges 1 shot from high mobility class? they reset, and try again, infinitely, because you can't return the burstwhat people miss, you can dodge the 1 shot leaving them with their skills on cool down, then follow up with your own 1 shot(pre2/25), stunned? bring a stun breaknow you only need random dodges in most fights, because 30 damage is 30 damage, doesn't matter what you dodge as long as you press all the buttons.

mesmer high mobility class?pepothinks

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@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@avey.4201 said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still exists, before 2/25 every class had the option, now only 3-4 classes have the option, balanced?step in the right direction?thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classesguess what happens when low mobility class dodges 1 shot from high mobility class? they reset, and try again, infinitely, because you can't return the burstwhat people miss, you can dodge the 1 shot leaving them with their skills on cool down, then follow up with your own 1 shot(pre2/25), stunned? bring a stun breaknow you only need random dodges in most fights, because 30 damage is 30 damage, doesn't matter what you dodge as long as you press all the buttons.

mesmer high mobility class?pepothinks

Pretty sure he was meaning teef by that.

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"avey.4201" said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still exists, before 2/25 every class had the option, now only 3-4 classes have the option, balanced?step in the right direction?thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classesguess what happens when low mobility class dodges 1 shot from high mobility class? they reset, and try again, infinitely, because you can't return the burstwhat people miss, you can dodge the 1 shot leaving them with their skills on cool down, then follow up with your own 1 shot(pre2/25), stunned? bring a stun breaknow you only need random dodges in most fights, because 30 damage is 30 damage, doesn't matter what you dodge as long as you press all the buttons.

mesmer high mobility class?pepothinks

Pretty sure he was meaning teef by that.

"thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classes"nah, hes just one of those peeps that sees blink and thinks mesmer is super mobile :D

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I don't understand these posts about slower play being more skillful. Nor the first hit wins.

Here's an anecdote.

I'm a war main and have been since early HoT. I have an acquaintance and we'll call him "brownbeard." He's an exceptional rev player. Plat 2 - 3. I'm a passing fair plat 2 on a good day. We both pride ourselves on our mastery of our classes and duel on a nearly daily basis.

Prepatch despite the damage both our classes can dish out these fights could vary from nearly instant to a 10 minute high stakes dance of one skill answering another until someone slips.

Post patch the match up is grueling for both sides. Even if he were to land his sword skills perfectly on me it won't guarantee a kill. Staff gives me too long of a guilt free sustain window and the match devolves into a matter of if I can catch him with bulls charge when he has no stunbreaks or I'll eventually be widdled down by Rev f2 off CD. The bout takes forever and isn't nearly as exciting as it use to be.

If you can't see why that's less skillful take this into consideration

Imagine your favorite fighting sport.BoxingHEMAUFC

Nobody watches those sports wanting to see slow plodding fights of attrition where punches are thrown rarely.

I want to see two masters fence with speed and precision at equal odds.

I want to see savage rush downs and excessive brutality pressing an advantage on an opponent.

Give me high stakes and split second reactions but with the grace of masters. That's skill.

Not slamming auto attack over and over. Definitely not CC spamming someone to cheese the lack of stunbreaks. Not mindlessly dropping AoE on a point. All classes should move towards more active gameplay.

True shot, DJ, Glacial Hammer, Glint 5, Drop the hammer, Oppressive Collapse,Phantasmal Berserker, Worldly Impact, Pile Driver, Executioner's Scythe, PLB. ect. Why shouldn't these skills be rewarded with nuke potential? Landing them takes effort. Against a competent opponent I'd even go so far as to say skill.

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@avey.4201 said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still existsNot even remotely close to how it used to be. When a player exits stealth there's like a 0.3s or so window before their model properly loads(slightly longer on bad rigs) for the opponent. Pre-patch it was quite possible to get downed from full health with protection on in that small window before models load on initial engagements at mid.

This level of ridiculous burst should never have been a thing to begin with.

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@"Tycura.1982" said:I don't understand these posts about slower play being more skillful. Nor the first hit wins.

Here's an anecdote.

I'm a war main and have been since early HoT. I have an acquaintance and we'll call him "brownbeard." He's an exceptional rev player. Plat 2 - 3. I'm a passing fair plat 2 on a good day. We both pride ourselves on our mastery of our classes and duel on a nearly daily basis.

Prepatch despite the damage both our classes can dish out these fights could vary from nearly instant to a 10 minute high stakes dance of one skill answering another until someone slips.

Post patch the match up is grueling for both sides. Even if he were to land his sword skills perfectly on me it won't guarantee a kill. Staff gives me too long of a guilt free sustain window and the match devolves into a matter of if I can catch him with bulls charge when he has no stunbreaks or I'll eventually be widdled down by Rev f2 off CD. The bout takes forever and isn't nearly as exciting as it use to be.

If you can't see why that's less skillful take this into consideration

Imagine your favorite fighting sport.BoxingHEMAUFC

Nobody watches those sports wanting to see slow plodding fights of attrition where punches are thrown rarely.

I want to see two masters fence with speed and precision at equal odds.

I want to see savage rush downs and excessive brutality pressing an advantage on an opponent.

Give me high stakes and split second reactions but with the grace of masters. That's skill.

Not slamming auto attack over and over. Definitely not CC spamming someone to cheese the lack of stunbreaks. Not mindlessly dropping AoE on a point. All classes should move towards more active gameplay.

True shot, DJ, Glacial Hammer, Glint 5, Drop the hammer, Oppressive Collapse,Phantasmal Berserker, Worldly Impact, Pile Driver, Executioner's Scythe ect. Why shouldnt these skills be rewarded with one shot potential? Landing them takes effort. Against a competent opponent I'd even go so far as to say skill.

Because 2 clicks under quickness = 1 dead was skill ? https://imgur.com/a/mRihe6eAnd contrary to what you think, landing a burst combo after the opponent temporise "normal" 5k rotation was more than easy.

Every click some class did before pactch were around 5 to 9k.Taking back your example : nobody want to see a boxing match who end in 5 sec with two hits.

Even with mesmer getting destroyed to oblivion, the game is more enjoyable after the rework and see more builds diversity.

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@viquing.8254 said:

@"Tycura.1982" said:I don't understand these posts about slower play being more skillful. Nor the first hit wins.

Here's an anecdote.

I'm a war main and have been since early HoT. I have an acquaintance and we'll call him "brownbeard." He's an exceptional rev player. Plat 2 - 3. I'm a passing fair plat 2 on a good day. We both pride ourselves on our mastery of our classes and duel on a nearly daily basis.

Prepatch despite the damage both our classes can dish out these fights could vary from nearly instant to a 10 minute high stakes dance of one skill answering another until someone slips.

Post patch the match up is grueling for both sides. Even if he were to land his sword skills perfectly on me it won't guarantee a kill. Staff gives me too long of a guilt free sustain window and the match devolves into a matter of if I can catch him with bulls charge when he has no stunbreaks or I'll eventually be widdled down by Rev f2 off CD. The bout takes forever and isn't nearly as exciting as it use to be.

If you can't see why that's less skillful take this into consideration

Imagine your favorite fighting sport.BoxingHEMAUFC

Nobody watches those sports wanting to see slow plodding fights of attrition where punches are thrown rarely.

I want to see two masters fence with speed and precision at equal odds.

I want to see savage rush downs and excessive brutality pressing an advantage on an opponent.

Give me high stakes and split second reactions but with the grace of masters. That's skill.

Not slamming auto attack over and over. Definitely not CC spamming someone to cheese the lack of stunbreaks. Not mindlessly dropping AoE on a point. All classes should move towards more active gameplay.

True shot, DJ, Glacial Hammer, Glint 5, Drop the hammer, Oppressive Collapse,Phantasmal Berserker, Worldly Impact, Pile Driver, Executioner's Scythe ect. Why shouldnt these skills be rewarded with one shot potential? Landing them takes effort. Against a competent opponent I'd even go so far as to say skill.

Because 2 clicks under quickness = 1 dead was skill ?

Every click some class did before pactch were around 5 to 9k.Taking back your example : nobody want to see a boxing match who end in 5 sec with two hits.

Even with mesmer getting destroyed to oblivion, the game is more enjoyable after the rework and see more builds diversity.

It's skill when you have the ability to not die in 5 seconds despite the competition. To take that boxing example even farther. Say someone has a history of 5 second knockouts and they go up against an opponent that can hold their own. That person who can hold their ground is skilled.

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@Tycura.1982 said:

@Tycura.1982 said:I don't understand these posts about slower play being more skillful. Nor the first hit wins.

Here's an anecdote.

I'm a war main and have been since early HoT. I have an acquaintance and we'll call him "brownbeard." He's an exceptional rev player. Plat 2 - 3. I'm a passing fair plat 2 on a good day. We both pride ourselves on our mastery of our classes and duel on a nearly daily basis.

Prepatch despite the damage both our classes can dish out these fights could vary from nearly instant to a 10 minute high stakes dance of one skill answering another until someone slips.

Post patch the match up is grueling for both sides. Even if he were to land his sword skills perfectly on me it won't guarantee a kill. Staff gives me too long of a guilt free sustain window and the match devolves into a matter of if I can catch him with bulls charge when he has no stunbreaks or I'll eventually be widdled down by Rev f2 off CD. The bout takes forever and isn't nearly as exciting as it use to be.

If you can't see why that's less skillful take this into consideration

Imagine your favorite fighting sport.BoxingHEMAUFC

Nobody watches those sports wanting to see slow plodding fights of attrition where punches are thrown rarely.

I want to see two masters fence with speed and precision at equal odds.

I want to see savage rush downs and excessive brutality pressing an advantage on an opponent.

Give me high stakes and split second reactions but with the grace of masters. That's skill.

Not slamming auto attack over and over. Definitely not CC spamming someone to cheese the lack of stunbreaks. Not mindlessly dropping AoE on a point. All classes should move towards more active gameplay.

True shot, DJ, Glacial Hammer, Glint 5, Drop the hammer, Oppressive Collapse,Phantasmal Berserker, Worldly Impact, Pile Driver, Executioner's Scythe ect. Why shouldnt these skills be rewarded with one shot potential? Landing them takes effort. Against a competent opponent I'd even go so far as to say skill.

Because 2 clicks under quickness = 1 dead was skill ?

Every click some class did before pactch were around 5 to 9k.Taking back your example : nobody want to see a boxing match who end in 5 sec with two hits.

Even with mesmer getting destroyed to oblivion, the game is more enjoyable after the rework and see more builds diversity.

It's skill when you have the ability to not die in 5 seconds despite the competition. To take that boxing example even farther. Say someone has a history of 5 second knockouts and they go up against an opponent that can hold their own. That person who can hold their ground is skilled.

It was about build who carry with plethora of 3 in 1 clics and auto-proc.Some class did atomic attacks + 3 effects/clics whereas some other did the same with 5 clics combos.Mean imagine a boxer with 4 arms fighting a dwarf.

It's nice that they stop the "I push a button it does hudge damage, aoe, hard CC, condi clear + whatever effect" to "I push a sustain button to sustain and a CC button to CC".

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Honestly all one hit bursts should have been reduced removing them from the game, thief shoulda got .75 revealed window before its burst from stealth connected. Hard cc skills shoulda been individually analyzed and damage adjusted individually. Holo beam f done from stealth shoulda had same .75 reveal before it shot out same idea as thief etc etc. This blanked power reduction with zero considerations for each individual class was lazy and unprofessional, I mean this is sopose to be their profession and this is thier work ethic haha wow they must be proud I'd hope their not. Anyway games no better off, needed a de-powercreep yes but not this lazy a$$ approach.

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@viquing.8254 said:

@Tycura.1982 said:I don't understand these posts about slower play being more skillful. Nor the first hit wins.

Here's an anecdote.

I'm a war main and have been since early HoT. I have an acquaintance and we'll call him "brownbeard." He's an exceptional rev player. Plat 2 - 3. I'm a passing fair plat 2 on a good day. We both pride ourselves on our mastery of our classes and duel on a nearly daily basis.

Prepatch despite the damage both our classes can dish out these fights could vary from nearly instant to a 10 minute high stakes dance of one skill answering another until someone slips.

Post patch the match up is grueling for both sides. Even if he were to land his sword skills perfectly on me it won't guarantee a kill. Staff gives me too long of a guilt free sustain window and the match devolves into a matter of if I can catch him with bulls charge when he has no stunbreaks or I'll eventually be widdled down by Rev f2 off CD. The bout takes forever and isn't nearly as exciting as it use to be.

If you can't see why that's less skillful take this into consideration

Imagine your favorite fighting sport.BoxingHEMAUFC

Nobody watches those sports wanting to see slow plodding fights of attrition where punches are thrown rarely.

I want to see two masters fence with speed and precision at equal odds.

I want to see savage rush downs and excessive brutality pressing an advantage on an opponent.

Give me high stakes and split second reactions but with the grace of masters. That's skill.

Not slamming auto attack over and over. Definitely not CC spamming someone to cheese the lack of stunbreaks. Not mindlessly dropping AoE on a point. All classes should move towards more active gameplay.

True shot, DJ, Glacial Hammer, Glint 5, Drop the hammer, Oppressive Collapse,Phantasmal Berserker, Worldly Impact, Pile Driver, Executioner's Scythe ect. Why shouldnt these skills be rewarded with one shot potential? Landing them takes effort. Against a competent opponent I'd even go so far as to say skill.

Because 2 clicks under quickness = 1 dead was skill ?

Every click some class did before pactch were around 5 to 9k.Taking back your example : nobody want to see a boxing match who end in 5 sec with two hits.

Even with mesmer getting destroyed to oblivion, the game is more enjoyable after the rework and see more builds diversity.

It's skill when you have the ability to not die in 5 seconds despite the competition. To take that boxing example even farther. Say someone has a history of 5 second knockouts and they go up against an opponent that can hold their own. That person who can hold their ground is skilled.

It was about build who carry with plethora of 3 in 1 clics and auto-proc.Some class did atomic attacks + 3 effects/clics whereas some other did the same with 5 clics combos.Mean imagine a boxer with 4 arms fighting a dwarf.

It's nice that they stop the "I push a button it does hudge damage, aoe, hard CC, condi clear + whatever effect" to "I push a sustain button to sustain and a CC button to CC".

I get where you're coming from. As stated before I only play warrior so I understand the frustration of being outdone by overloaded abilities and not the skill of the one using them. Hence why I said the game should reward more active gameplay with slow or hard to land skills being the highest damaging.

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@avey.4201 said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still exists, before 2/25 every class had the option, now only 3-4 classes have the option, balanced?step in the right direction?thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classesguess what happens when low mobility class dodges 1 shot from high mobility class? they reset, and try again, infinitely, because you can't return the burstwhat people miss, you can dodge the 1 shot leaving them with their skills on cool down, then follow up with your own 1 shot(pre2/25), stunned? bring a stun breaknow you only need random dodges in most fights, because 30 damage is 30 damage, doesn't matter what you dodge as long as you press all the buttons.

1 shot pu mesRidiculous op 1 shot from rangers and infinite escapes beforeridiculous stun spam 1 shot warrInsanely op aoe scourge spam fest.insane op spam from aoe firebrandaoe spam that was also insanely op and broken from herald.

There is a reason why people complained about scourge, unless you think its skilful or rangers being able to practically 1 shot with greatsword and longbow procs and with soulbeast transformation

Its not just the damage either, but sustain was also nerfed. Basically the reason invuln spam and things like that were so high, was because the damage was basically too high to survive. Only way to survive 1 shot meta is either to have perma block invuln, or have enough mobility to escape, and it so happens rangers had resetting abilities that were crazy good.

Weavers too also had pretty nuts dmg with sustain, and none of this was healthy for the game, neither is being auto cc spammed and blown up in 2-3 seconds.

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@Aktium.9506 said:

@avey.4201 said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still existsNot even remotely close to how it used to be. When a player exits stealth there's like a 0.3s or so window before their model properly loads(slightly longer on bad rigs) for the opponent. Pre-patch it was quite possible to get downed from full health with protection on in that small window before models load on initial engagements at mid.

This level of ridiculous burst should never have been a thing to begin with.

I've never had an issue, I have an old i5, hard drive ect.attacks happen from stealth yes, stealth has not changed, and thieves can still do one shot burst from stealth, but you can hear the thief, and 2/25 didn't change this.I think the thieves are running a condi build because I get a lot of condi, but they still 1 shot from stealth, only less people are playing this build, so you don't see it as often.

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People do in fact take forever to load after unstealthing onto you sometimes. I think it depends on their ping to the server or something, some thieves are nearly impossible to fight in PvP due to not unstealthing on my screen until 3 seconds of hitting me which is absurd.

I have a SSD and I-5, I don't have a crap computer, and my internet is fine too.

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@avey.4201 said:I've never had an issue, I have an old i5, hard drive ect.Yeah and I have a $4.5k rig. You're probably not thinking of it, but the delay is there regardless of your specs.

attacks happen from stealth yes, stealth has not changed, and thieves can still do one shot burst from stealth, but you can hear the thief, and 2/25 didn't change this.The issue was that you could be fully down before you could even see the enemy. The only defence was popping iframes or predicting the burst correctly and blowing double dodges and hoping you have a really good support that keeps you alive for the follow up attacks which could also kill you in seconds if you were the targeted player.

I think the thieves are running a condi build because I get a lot of condi, but they still 1 shot from stealth, only less people are playing this build, so you don't see it as often.You have plenty of time to deal with condi thief burst, even prior to the most recent nerf you could cleanse it all before you got chunked for more than 30% even when they had TG up. Sure you're screwed if they +1 when you've got stuff on cooldown and you're not a full health, but that's sort of what a +1 is supposed to do.

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@Axl.8924 said:

@avey.4201 said:people complain about 1 shot, but it still exists, before 2/25 every class had the option, now only 3-4 classes have the option, balanced?step in the right direction?thief ranger and mesmer still have 1 shot, you know the highest mobility classesguess what happens when low mobility class dodges 1 shot from high mobility class? they reset, and try again, infinitely, because you can't return the burstwhat people miss, you can dodge the 1 shot leaving them with their skills on cool down, then follow up with your own 1 shot(pre2/25), stunned? bring a stun breaknow you only need random dodges in most fights, because 30 damage is 30 damage, doesn't matter what you dodge as long as you press all the buttons.

1 shot pu mesRidiculous op 1 shot from rangers and infinite escapes beforeridiculous stun spam 1 shot warrInsanely op aoe scourge spam fest.insane op spam from aoe firebrandaoe spam that was also insanely op and broken from herald.

There is a reason why people complained about scourge, unless you think its skilful or rangers being able to practically 1 shot with greatsword and longbow procs and with soulbeast transformation

Its not just the damage either, but sustain was also nerfed. Basically the reason invuln spam and things like that were so high, was because the damage was basically too high to survive. Only way to survive 1 shot meta is either to have perma block invuln, or have enough mobility to escape, and it so happens rangers had resetting abilities that were crazy good.

Weavers too also had pretty nuts dmg with sustain, and none of this was healthy for the game, neither is being auto cc spammed and blown up in 2-3 seconds.

ele can aoe cc spam a party of 5 in spvp for several seconds, and a mesmer can still blow them up in those seconds, happened in tournaments a few weeks agothere was invuln spam one shot builds and many broken things before, no one says the balance was perfect, but from my perspective it was betterthis thread was about fun, not necessarily balance thoughat least when a thief tried to one shot me, I could one shot him back(fun)I could macro 3v3I have the longest win streak of my history in this gamethe fights are boringmost fights, when we win, I realize I'm starring at the wallI press all the buttons and win nowI had to watch animations beforeI had to be aware of my surroundings beforenow its just whoever presses all the buttons firstworst part of this balance, you can't open certain loot bags in spvp, and cleaning inventory mid match leaves these bags behind

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@Aktium.9506 said:

@avey.4201 said:I've never had an issue, I have an old i5, hard drive ect.Yeah and I have a $4.5k rig. You're probably not thinking of it, but the delay is there regardless of your specs.

attacks happen from stealth yes, stealth has not changed, and thieves can still do one shot burst from stealth, but you can hear the thief, and 2/25 didn't change this.The issue was that you could be fully down before you could even
see
the enemy. The only defence was popping iframes or predicting the burst correctly and blowing double dodges and hoping you have a really good support that keeps you alive for the follow up attacks which could also kill you in seconds if you were the targeted player.

I think the thieves are running a condi build because I get a lot of condi, but they still 1 shot from stealth, only less people are playing this build, so you don't see it as often.You have plenty of time to deal with condi thief burst, even prior to the most recent nerf you could cleanse it all before you got chunked for more than 30% even when they had TG up. Sure you're screwed if they +1 when you've got stuff on cooldown and you're not a full health, but that's sort of what a +1 is supposed to do.

thief can down you instantly, one hard burst like old backstab, but you see a poison or other condi tick as you down(I didn't check damage amounts condi vs power)they appear as your falling down, but you can hear them coming, you can time their attacks with dodge/blockstealth may be mechanically flawed, maybe they should get 50% damage reduction in stealth, 2/25 didn't change either other than less people playing it (for the moment)

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