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Do You Find The Game More Fun To Play Now Or Before Revamp


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@UNOwen.7132 said:

@apharma.3741 said:I don't miss builds literally having everything in 1 package. Many of the people who loved pre Feb patch were playing extremely strong classes which had few weaknesses. Think about it, how many condi builds performed well and why? Yeah the ones that literally looked at you and hit you with 4+ conditions. How many "side noders" performed well? Yeah the ones with 4+ cleanse on one button and very low cool down 2 or more cleanse buttons. Go through all the classes and look at all the skills, specs and weapons used, the one common separator for them was whether they were overloaded or stupidly low cool down.

Is this perfect? No and it's a shame ANet has retreated into it's shell half way through a major project holding the balance team back instead of letting them get the pace and approximate strength of roles in the right place. This is why you have "condispam" and "bunker everywhere" viewpoints as these are easier to play and much more rewarding but haven't had the sharp tuning down/slight increase to other roles to balance out the risk/reward. Yet look at the MotA games, they were very good, players actually died very quickly to coordinated attacks and tactics became a lot more relevant, it was night and day between those who could rotate and those who were used to the power creep rendering tactics largely irrelevant.

I mean of course they died to being outnumbered, thats how it works. Thing is, thats the only way they died. And if they were in a position where neither team was going to outnumber them, well you get the synchronised Sylvari dancing. Also, tactics were extremely important before the patch too. Its just that micro, or mechanical skill, wasnt basically irrelevant.

They didn't just die to being +1, match ups made a difference in a lot of games where you want to swap your side noders out as one scales better in a fight or has a better match up and the game is going in your favour. Rotations and positioning of fights, whether you go 2 node or 3 node, loads of factors were present in the MotA which you wouldn't have seen pre Feb. We know this because we saw it in the monthly AT.

They died just to being outnumbered. We saw what the sidenoder "fights" looked like. Honestly the best one was the 2 Sylvari synchronised dancing around Tranquility because they both knew there was no point at all in fighting. Anyway, yes, rotation is a big thing now, because +1s are the only way you kill people. Here is the thing. Those were also there pre-february. In fact, they were just as important as right now. Its just that unlike right now, they werent the
only
important thing. We just lost micro skill entirely, while gaining nothing. And as a result, sidenoding has become dreadfully unfun. Even with the enjoyment that grenades always bring, Im not fond of just sitting there waiting for my thief to come around and make me able to kill the enemy.

One of the problems with the "bunker meta" isn't just a numbers game, it's that they're much easier to play than they are to be killed and condi rev is probably the best example of this which also contributes to the "condi meta" idea. Make the side noders more skilful like current mirage needs and you'd see everyone complaining of a zerg meta.

Its not really that theyre easier to play. Some of them are, but I wouldnt say that Holo is particularly easy to play. The problem is because you can make multiple major mistakes, and you still wont die. Sidenoders arent skillful because they only have 2 jobs right now. 1, knockback the enemy, and 2, avoid being knockbacked yourself. Everything else doesnt matter, and since both of those tend to stalemate as well, you just see sidenoders messing around waiting for reinforcements. Even if the sidenoders were technically harder builds to play optimally, it wouldnt change a thing, because you dont need to play optimally. The biggest difference would just be that the worse players get knocked back a bit more often.

I guess you only watched the NA vs NA games then /shrug.

Nah, I watched the EU games most. Yknow, stuff like Obindo and the enemy rev fighting around Tranquility for 7 minutes without anyone dying. Or hell, Obindos MOTA montage which shows exactly 0 clips of him solo-killing anyone. This is a montage, with the most exciting clips selected, and there isnt one of him solo-killing anyone, because it didnt happen. A few good instant stunbreaks vs knockback though, which is nice, but its sad that that is what sidenoding devolved to.

"The problem is because you can make multiple major mistakes, and you still wont die." This is a skill issue. Thank you for agreeing. You should be punished for making major mistakes especially multiple times but they aren't because the skill floor is relatively low and the skill ceiling isn't that much higher.

Thats not why they arent punished. A low skill floor just means mistakes are less easy to make. No, they arent punished because, if they screw up, what exactly do you do? You cant kill them. The damage just plain isnt there. If you knock them back you decap the point, but thats already happening, and as I said, its not fun.

As I said, if a lot of side noders required the same skill as mirages require to even hold the node you wouldn't hear much complaining about "bunker meta" anymore.

Sure, if you put it like that. Problem is, the only way to do that is to bring back a
lot
of damage. Frankly, damage should
never
be lower than pre-HoT specialisation patch at the
lowest
. Right now, it seems were about 20-30% lower than that.

OMEGALUL literally the first clip is of Obindo beating a holo, sure technically the holo died to Zan's barrage but the enemy holo had lost the fight, the node and was pretty much dead regardless. There's more than one way to win in GW2, something you seem to have forgotten in the power creep era.

Low skill floor, low ceiling means that skill is not going to be the deciding factor most of the time no matter what you do even if you slap on more damage. You should note I said "holding the balance team back instead of letting them get the pace and approximate strength of roles in the right place. " 1v1 builds don't need more damage or at least not a lot more, they need to be able to spike damage on a moderate cool down with a set up required. Otherwise you'll end up with the same problem just that 1v1 builds start dominating the meta. Think old condi chrono just before HoT.

Condi mirage is actually in a decent spot, to kill it needs to set up on a decent cool down and manage it's cool downs. It can spike very hard but unfortunately needs a lot more skill to pull off than equivalent 1v1 builds because it has to kite and will lose the node when it messes up. Your rotations matter more with mirage. That doesn't mean it's perfect and well balanced just more like what 1v1 node holders should be like.

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@apharma.3741 said:

@apharma.3741 said:I don't miss builds literally having everything in 1 package. Many of the people who loved pre Feb patch were playing extremely strong classes which had few weaknesses. Think about it, how many condi builds performed well and why? Yeah the ones that literally looked at you and hit you with 4+ conditions. How many "side noders" performed well? Yeah the ones with 4+ cleanse on one button and very low cool down 2 or more cleanse buttons. Go through all the classes and look at all the skills, specs and weapons used, the one common separator for them was whether they were overloaded or stupidly low cool down.

Is this perfect? No and it's a shame ANet has retreated into it's shell half way through a major project holding the balance team back instead of letting them get the pace and approximate strength of roles in the right place. This is why you have "condispam" and "bunker everywhere" viewpoints as these are easier to play and much more rewarding but haven't had the sharp tuning down/slight increase to other roles to balance out the risk/reward. Yet look at the MotA games, they were very good, players actually died very quickly to coordinated attacks and tactics became a lot more relevant, it was night and day between those who could rotate and those who were used to the power creep rendering tactics largely irrelevant.

I mean of course they died to being outnumbered, thats how it works. Thing is, thats the only way they died. And if they were in a position where neither team was going to outnumber them, well you get the synchronised Sylvari dancing. Also, tactics were extremely important before the patch too. Its just that micro, or mechanical skill, wasnt basically irrelevant.

They didn't just die to being +1, match ups made a difference in a lot of games where you want to swap your side noders out as one scales better in a fight or has a better match up and the game is going in your favour. Rotations and positioning of fights, whether you go 2 node or 3 node, loads of factors were present in the MotA which you wouldn't have seen pre Feb. We know this because we saw it in the monthly AT.

They died just to being outnumbered. We saw what the sidenoder "fights" looked like. Honestly the best one was the 2 Sylvari synchronised dancing around Tranquility because they both knew there was no point at all in fighting. Anyway, yes, rotation is a big thing now, because +1s are the only way you kill people. Here is the thing. Those were also there pre-february. In fact, they were just as important as right now. Its just that unlike right now, they werent the
only
important thing. We just lost micro skill entirely, while gaining nothing. And as a result, sidenoding has become dreadfully unfun. Even with the enjoyment that grenades always bring, Im not fond of just sitting there waiting for my thief to come around and make me able to kill the enemy.

One of the problems with the "bunker meta" isn't just a numbers game, it's that they're much easier to play than they are to be killed and condi rev is probably the best example of this which also contributes to the "condi meta" idea. Make the side noders more skilful like current mirage needs and you'd see everyone complaining of a zerg meta.

Its not really that theyre easier to play. Some of them are, but I wouldnt say that Holo is particularly easy to play. The problem is because you can make multiple major mistakes, and you still wont die. Sidenoders arent skillful because they only have 2 jobs right now. 1, knockback the enemy, and 2, avoid being knockbacked yourself. Everything else doesnt matter, and since both of those tend to stalemate as well, you just see sidenoders messing around waiting for reinforcements. Even if the sidenoders were technically harder builds to play optimally, it wouldnt change a thing, because you dont need to play optimally. The biggest difference would just be that the worse players get knocked back a bit more often.

I guess you only watched the NA vs NA games then /shrug.

Nah, I watched the EU games most. Yknow, stuff like Obindo and the enemy rev fighting around Tranquility for 7 minutes without anyone dying. Or hell, Obindos MOTA montage which shows exactly 0 clips of him solo-killing anyone. This is a montage, with the most exciting clips selected, and there isnt one of him solo-killing anyone, because it didnt happen. A few good instant stunbreaks vs knockback though, which is nice, but its sad that that is what sidenoding devolved to.

"The problem is because you can make multiple major mistakes, and you still wont die." This is a skill issue. Thank you for agreeing. You should be punished for making major mistakes especially multiple times but they aren't because the skill floor is relatively low and the skill ceiling isn't that much higher.

Thats not why they arent punished. A low skill floor just means mistakes are less easy to make. No, they arent punished because, if they screw up, what exactly do you do? You cant kill them. The damage just plain isnt there. If you knock them back you decap the point, but thats already happening, and as I said, its not fun.

As I said, if a lot of side noders required the same skill as mirages require to even hold the node you wouldn't hear much complaining about "bunker meta" anymore.

Sure, if you put it like that. Problem is, the only way to do that is to bring back a
lot
of damage. Frankly, damage should
never
be lower than pre-HoT specialisation patch at the
lowest
. Right now, it seems were about 20-30% lower than that.

OMEGALUL literally the first clip is of Obindo beating a holo, sure technically the holo died to Zan's barrage but the enemy holo had lost the fight, the node and was pretty much dead regardless. There's more than one way to win in GW2, something you seem to have forgotten in the power creep era.

He hadnt. Obindo had completely exhausted his offensive abilities, and the holo had enough time to wait for heat therapy to kick in and for his healing skill to recharge. Without Zans Barrage, that fight wouldve stalemated. In fact, he didnt even leave the point until Zan appeared, so without Zan, he probably wouldve stayed on the point. There is more than one way to win in GW2 in theory, but right now its knockback or outnumbering.

Low skill floor, low ceiling means that skill is not going to be the deciding factor most of the time no matter what you do even if you slap on more damage. You should note I said "holding the balance team back instead of letting them get the pace and approximate strength of roles in the right place. " 1v1 builds don't need more damage or at least not a lot more, they need to be able to spike damage on a moderate cool down with a set up required. Otherwise you'll end up with the same problem just that 1v1 builds start dominating the meta. Think old condi chrono just before HoT.

If you increase damage, then skill floor increases. If damage gets higher, mistakes are more easily punished, and punished harder. Meaning players cant keep screwing up. And then, you dont have this issue. 1v1 builds absolutely need more damage, everyone needs more damage (again, no lower than pre-HoT specialisation, which right now means about a 25% damage boost across the board). Anyway, 1v1 builds cant dominate the meta because teamfights will still happen. We just get 1v1 builds that can kill other 1v1 builds, rather than the current state where if no one comes to +1 you, and the objective youre fighting for cant be won by knockback, you just synchronise your dances because there is no point doing anything else, as we saw in the MOTA.

Condi mirage is actually in a decent spot, to kill it needs to set up on a decent cool down and manage it's cool downs. It can spike very hard but unfortunately needs a lot more skill to pull off than equivalent 1v1 builds because it has to kite and will lose the node when it messes up. Your rotations matter more with mirage. That doesn't mean it's perfect and well balanced just more like what 1v1 node holders should be like.

Condi Mirage cannot solo-kill any player right now. Its spike is far too low for that, its a build that bursts together with others. As a sidenoder its awful because it doesnt have a good knockback.

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@Shiyo.3578 said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Disagree, waaay too many blocks/invuls/evades on too short of a CD.

I disagree. The skill ceiling was significantly higher back then. Good players would be able to consistently win their 1v1s and outskill people 1vX. It was perfect. The people complaining about the cooldowns being too short simply didn't know how to trade cooldowns effectively and react fast enough.

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@shadowpass.4236 said :Good players would be able to consistently win their 1v1s and outskill people 1vX.Good class yeah, do the same vid with a mesmer vs ranger pre-patch it would not be the same at all.

@"UNOwen.7132" :Wtf is 1v1 build ?You have sidenoders who will do endless fight versus other sidenoders and who win against +1.You have +1 who do even fight versus other +1 (supposely) and are the only way to kill sidenoders.You have teamfight class who fight for ages in a 2+v2+ fight with some tools to rez/heal/aoeCC/damage."1v1" build in a 5v5 rotation capture game is only a few part of it. It was just +1 with bad mobility reconverting.What you just want is everyone +1 while having even more tools to do the said behind roles. It's not the case for everyone.

High damage has nothing to do with skill floor. It's harder to build up a damage output (output clones, stack might, comboing.) than to just throw half life in one clic. Same for concentration uptime. When you look at my previous vids, you think that I need more damage ? You think a game where everyone spend most of his time walking from respawn or can't go into fight is fun ?

Btw as promised, vids on less mobile, less damage, more sidenode build :I don't feel unkillable, and apart versus the condirev and condiranger I don't feel opponent were unkillable. Mean It's not endless fight. (I did a hellish fail in the last, don't need to come on this, I already know it.)

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@viquing.8254 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said :Good players would be able to consistently win their 1v1s and outskill people 1vX.Good class yeah, do the same vid with a mesmer vs ranger pre-patch it would not be the same at all.

Actually, it wouldnt be much different. More focus on condi clearing, but thats about it.

@"UNOwen.7132" :kitten is 1v1 build ?You have sidenoders who will do endless fight versus other sidenoders and who win against +1.

That is not what sidenoders are supposed to be. But the fact that you believe this explains a lot to be honest. No, a sidenoder is not supposed to have endless fights. A sidenoder is someone who fights on the sidenode, and eventually wins or loses.

You have +1 who do even fight versus other +1 (supposely) and are the only way to kill sidenoders.

First of all, they dont. Generally +1 classes avoid each other, not much point really given how good they tend to be at running away. Exceptions apply. Second, they are NOT supposed to be the only way to kill sidenoders.

You have teamfight class who fight for ages in a 2+v2+ fight with some tools to rez/heal/aoeCC/damage."1v1" build in a 5v5 rotation capture game is only a few part of it. It was just +1 with bad mobility reconverting.What you just want is everyone +1 while having even more tools to do the said behind roles. It's not the case for everyone.

No? No matter what you do, no class can match thief in +1s simply because of thieves shortbow 5. Thats also why its not the goal. What I want is for sidenoders to not be a waste of time class that has to wait for others to be able to be useful. But at least you finally admitted the horrible problem the current patch has, even if you think its not an issue. I guess as a +1 player you just couldnt understand how those filthy sidenoders dare not have to rely on you. Youre their superior after all, right?

High damage has nothing to do with skill floor. It's harder to build up a damage output (output clones, stack might, comboing.) than to just throw half life in one clic. Same for concentration uptime. When you look at my previous vids, you think that I need more damage ? You think a game where everyone spend most of his time walking from respawn or can't go into fight is fun ?

High damage has everything to do with skillfloor. Higher damage means easier and more punishable mistakes. Means you can make fewer mistakes. Means higher skill-level. And why are you talking about +1 situations still, thats not the point. Also, "You think a game where everyone spend most of his time walking from respawn or can't go into fight is fun ?" I believe I had already explained that that wasnt the case pre-patch at all.

Btw as promised, vids on less mobile, less damage, more sidenode build :I don't feel unkillable, and apart versus the condirev and condiranger I don't feel opponent were unkillable. Mean It's not endless fight. (I did a hellish fail in the last, don't need to come on this, I already know it.)

Lets see. First video is irrelevant, you have a grand total of 0 1v1s. Always outnumbering or outnumbered. Second video, hey you got a 1v1 kill. Against another unviable class which says nothing about the meta. Who spammed skills under confusion. Then a Rev you cant kill, but almost die to because Mesmer is unplayable thanks to the new patch. The rest falls into either category. Now, try playing any of the actual sidenoders. No unplayable mesmer nonsense, Holo, Rev, Ranger. See what that looks like. You will find you still cant kill the enemy, but you wont be dying anymore either.

But ultimately, you dont need to say anything. You have already admitted that this meta is garbage. You have just also admitted that you dont see it as a problem, because youre not a sidenoder player and you dont care for sidenoders. Quite the opposite, it seems youre only happy with a meta when theyre dependent on you and dont matter otherwise. Its quite selfish, but it explains a lot.

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@"UNOwen.7132"

+1 should be the only way to finish sidenders, if it's not the case, there will always be ONE sidenoder way behind the other.Now tell my why someone having more sustain should do as much damage as someone having less sustain but more mobility and damage. You know the "I do everything in every single build" powercreep I don't want to be back.If someone choose to be tankier while dropping damage on mobility, let them the possibility to choose this omg. They don't prevent you to play squishy specs.

High damage reduce skillfloor way more than it upgrade it. (lmao It's exactly the same WvW discussion with WvWers who want easy structure cap to promote fight while it destroy it.).By the way : coming, bursting half life or being half life it make 10 sec concentrtion session. Versus building setup, rupting many keyskill and mindly bursting on multiple windows is way harder.And sorry but just look at :

1) it's not low damage.2) the animation came at the same time as the damage. So your "mistake are punishable" look more like : the higher the number of instant atomic button, the better it is.Which isn't skill for me. What you don't understand is that there will always be class with better tools than other for the same finality that's why not focus on "duelling" but on overall build with pro AND CONS. Is better than having everyone plated with everything. It also increase drasticly the need to rotate.

About vids review, PvP is around rotating and taking best fight for his class/build, not about "duelling" someone to be "selfish" as you mention it (and like it was to rollface people before probably.).It's fun how you rarely see unkillable condi tank rev because you know, it's slow so it has weakness.

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@"shadowpass.4236" said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Ah yes, stab for how long was it? Had to wait like 20s so ranger would be finally "vulnerable" to cc? Evasion on GS AA was nice as well with that stow, really love these exploits <3 Looked like a fight against new player that jumped on Powercreep class, I say he was doing fine being carried by broken spec. If you call that "fun" then lmao. People really have very low standards for fun these days I guess.Btw. I usually go and play single player games and use cheat engine to have this kind of "fun"(ez access to everything at any given time, luv it).

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@Jables.4659 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

For me nothing changed. I run exactly the same builds like before but changed the amulet from paladin to marauder.

The meta changed.

This thread is not about the meta. It's about "Do you find the game more fun... ?"

@"apharma.3741" said:One of the problems with the "bunker meta" isn't just a numbers game,
it's that they're much easier to play than they are to be killed
and condi rev is probably the best example of this which also contributes to the "condi meta" idea. Make the side noders
more skilful
like current mirage needs and you'd see everyone complaining of a zerg meta.A bunker build is just another cheese build. A oneshot build or a 3 shot build with 90% evasion/block uptime, both are cheese builds as well. It makes no difference in terms of required skill.

Stating that bunker requires less skill is simply not true. Surviving on a bunker build requires less skill, yes, but winning does not. Bunker builds don't get higher winrates against me just because they play bunker.

If someone plays a competitive game for surviving and calls this an achievement, he might just stop playing competitive. Playing to stall a matchup/encounter is the dumbest and most unhealthy thing you can do ... but yes, the game is full of these people. Like it is full of people, that would play oneshot builds all day if they could and bypass the whole combat mechanic. That's also pretty dumb.

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@viquing.8254 said:@"UNOwen.7132"

+1 should be the only way to finish sidenders, if it's not the case, there will always be ONE sidenoder way behind the other.

Ignoring how wrong the first part is, Im not sure i understand what logic you have for the other one. Are you saying its bad if a sidenoder can lose a 1v1 on his own because then he is behind after, well, losing? Because that is unbelievably stupid.

Now tell my why someone having more sustain should do as much damage as someone having less sustain but more mobility and damage. You know the "I do everything in every single build" powercreep I don't want to be back.

Because they have less burst damage but more sustained damage? Again Im not sure what the point of this is other than you wanting to feel superior to sidenoders by making them irrelevant without you.

If someone choose to be tankier while dropping damage on mobility, let them the possibility to choose this omg. They don't prevent you to play squishy specs.

... you do know that "sidenoder" and "bunker" are different things, right? Besides, theyre free to choose that. But fights should end, one way or another.

High damage reduce skillfloor way more than it upgrade it. (lmao It's exactly the same WvW discussion with WvWers who want easy structure cap to promote fight while it destroy it.).

Hilariously incorrect. High damage doesnt reduce skillfloor at all, it ONLY increases it, in a game where active defenses exist.

By the way : coming, bursting half life or being half life it make 10 sec concentrtion session. Versus building setup, rupting many keyskill and mindly bursting on multiple windows is way harder.

Weve been over this. Its not "10 second concentration sessions". Fights lasted for up to a minute. A minute of having to carefully setup, dodge and time everything. As opposed to now ,where you dont setup or time anything and just throw everything off cooldown.

And sorry but just look at :

1) it's not low damage.2) the animation came at the same time as the damage. So your "mistake are punishable" look more like : the higher the number of instant atomic button, the better it is.

6000 damage on a squishy enemy is indeed low. And no, you saw that he used Phase Traversal and had quickness, and still had time to dodge the second hit of deathstrike (aka the one that does damage). You had every opportunity to avoid that. You just werent good enough to.

Which isn't skill for me. What you don't understand is that there will always be class with better tools than other for the same finality that's why not focus on "duelling" but on overall build with pro AND CONS. Is better than having everyone plated with everything. It also increase drasticly the need to rotate.

We already went over this. Every build didnt have everything. Thats just an imaginary fantasy world you built for yourself because you couldnt stand the fact that the sidenoders dared not to rely on you. You want a meta where you are the only one who matters, and where those filthy sidenoders kneel before your superior might.

Sure, removing micro skill makes macro skill more important. Thats not a good thing. Thats a bad thing.

About vids review, PvP is around rotating and taking best fight for his class/build, not about "duelling" someone to be "selfish" as you mention it (and like it was to rollface people before probably.).

There is nothing selfish about being able to kill someone as a sidenoder. What is selfish is to basically deny the sidenoders any agency and any fun, and make them reliant on you.

It's fun how you rarely see unkillable condi tank rev because you know, it's slow so it has weakness.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. "You rarely see condi rev". I get that youre saying whatever to try and justify your unjustifiable position but this is a riot. Yes, the class thats in just about every game, sometimes multiple times on the same team, is something "you rarely see".

But just to summarise, the reason you prefer this meta isnt because its more skilled (it isnt, and far from it), or because its more diverse (it isnt, and far from it), or even because you think its more fun. Its because you HATE sidenoders, and you want to feel superior to them. You want to take away their agency, their fun, their very reason to play the game, and make them nothing more than your vassals. But hey, you already admitted that the meta is garbage, even if your hate blinds you to the fact that that is bad.

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@"UNOwen.7132" said:

High damage reduce skillfloor way more than it upgrade it. (lmao It's exactly the same WvW discussion with WvWers who want easy structure cap to promote fight while it destroy it.).

Hilariously
incorrect. High damage doesnt reduce skillfloor at all, it
ONLY
increases it, in a game where active defenses exist.No, just no. If you only need to use 20% of yours skills to kill someone, high damage didn't increase skillfloor at all.

And sorry but just look at :
1) it's not low damage.2) the animation came at the same time as the damage. So your "mistake are punishable" look more like : the higher the number of instant atomic button, the better it is.

6000 damage on a squishy enemy is indeed low. And no, you saw that he used Phase Traversal and had quickness, and still had time to dodge the second hit of deathstrike (aka the one that does damage). You had every opportunity to avoid that. You just werent good enough to.6000 damage IS high damage. Fucking powercreeped norms.Yeah, and same for 0:43 lmao, just evade lol.

Which isn't skill for me. What you don't understand is that there will always be class with better tools than other for the same finality that's why not focus on "duelling" but on overall build with pro AND CONS. Is better than having everyone plated with everything. It also increase drasticly the need to rotate.

We already went over this. Every build
didnt
have everything. Thats just an imaginary fantasy world you built for yourself because you couldnt stand the fact that the sidenoders dared not to rely on you. You want a meta where you are the only one who matters, and where those filthy sidenoders kneel before your superior might.Give me prepatch meta classes who hadn't damage, CC, mobility, sustain with sometimes aoe effects or other things on them, you can even look at boon uptime. Mesmer was one of the few. Apart support FB nobody had to choose between damage or other things.

Sure, removing micro skill makes macro skill more important. Thats not a good thing. Thats a
bad
thing.

About vids review, PvP is around rotating and taking best fight for his class/build, not about "duelling" someone to be "selfish" as you mention it (and like it was to rollface people before probably.).

There is nothing selfish about being able to kill someone as a sidenoder. What is selfish is to basically deny the sidenoders any agency and any fun, and make them reliant on you.BECAUSE A FUN GAME IS ABOUT MAKING CHOICE WITH PRO AND CONS. Crappy generation who can't enjoy games if they aren't the god character with everything.

It's fun how you rarely see unkillable condi tank rev because you know, it's slow so it has weakness.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
. "You rarely see condi rev". I get that youre saying whatever to try and justify your unjustifiable position but this is a
riot
. Yes, the class thats in just about every game, sometimes multiple times on the same team, is something "you rarely see".How many in vids linked ? Hmm sure every game HAHAHAHAHAHA. Compared to the 4 thieves pre-patch.But just to summarise, the reason you prefer this meta isnt because its more skilled (it isnt, and far from it), or because its more diverse (it isnt, and far from it), or even because you think its more fun. Its because you
HATE
sidenoders, and you want to feel superior to them. You want to take away their agency, their fun, their very reason to play the game, and make them nothing more than your vassals. But hey, you already admitted that the meta is garbage, even if your hate blinds you to the fact that that is bad.Guy I played chrono sidenode during most of HoT, dropping damage to do this, compared to condi meta build. If you think that it is something who impact my judgment you are pretty misinformed. We can even found some old sind vids where I'm. So I know what I'm talking about and it's certainly not whatever superior, neither I feel superior playing carrying build who 2 shot everyone.

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@viquing.8254 said:

@"UNOwen.7132" said:

High damage reduce skillfloor way more than it upgrade it. (lmao It's exactly the same WvW discussion with WvWers who want easy structure cap to promote fight while it destroy it.).

Hilariously
incorrect. High damage doesnt reduce skillfloor at all, it
ONLY
increases it, in a game where active defenses exist.No, just no. If you only need to use 20% of yours skills to kill someone, high damage didn't increase skillfloor at all.

Thats not the same as high damage. Given that they can just dodge your high damage skills, and the fact that you needed to dodge theirs, however does mean its increasing the skillfloor.

And sorry but just look at :
1) it's not low damage.2) the animation came at the same time as the damage. So your "mistake are punishable" look more like : the higher the number of instant atomic button, the better it is.

6000 damage on a squishy enemy is indeed low. And no, you saw that he used Phase Traversal and had quickness, and still had time to dodge the second hit of deathstrike (aka the one that does damage). You had every opportunity to avoid that. You just werent good enough to.6000 damage IS high damage. kitten powercreeped norms.Yeah, and same for 0:43 lmao, just evade lol.

What do you mean "powercreeped norms". The only time 6000 damage was considered high damage was back when all stats were lower and as a result damage and health was just lower. But since we have had the same stat system we use now, 6000 damage is pretty low. Even as far back as the specialisation patch, 6000 damage is not much. Did you really not know that?

Which isn't skill for me. What you don't understand is that there will always be class with better tools than other for the same finality that's why not focus on "duelling" but on overall build with pro AND CONS. Is better than having everyone plated with everything. It also increase drasticly the need to rotate.

We already went over this. Every build
didnt
have everything. Thats just an imaginary fantasy world you built for yourself because you couldnt stand the fact that the sidenoders dared not to rely on you. You want a meta where you are the only one who matters, and where those filthy sidenoders kneel before your superior might.Give me prepatch meta classes who hadn't damage, CC, mobility, sustain with sometimes aoe effects or other things on them, you can even look at boon uptime. Mesmer was one of the few. Apart support FB nobody had to choose between damage or other things.

If you put it as vague as now, I just posit the counterquestion to you, show me a single build that doesnt have all of that right now. However, lets say were talking "high damage, high mobility, good CC, high sustain" and so on, then the answer is "all of them". Thief had alright damage and high mobility, but no sustain and poor CC. Engineer had high sustain and decent CC, but mediocre mobility and mediocre damage (unless it was explosive or kinetic holo, in which case it swaps sustain and damage). Ranger lacked good CC and its damage was limited by certain windows. Necro had great sustain and good CC and decent damage, but poor mobility. And so on.

Sure, removing micro skill makes macro skill more important. Thats not a good thing. Thats a
bad
thing.

About vids review, PvP is around rotating and taking best fight for his class/build, not about "duelling" someone to be "selfish" as you mention it (and like it was to rollface people before probably.).

There is nothing selfish about being able to kill someone as a sidenoder. What is selfish is to basically deny the sidenoders any agency and any fun, and make them reliant on you.BECAUSE A FUN GAME IS ABOUT MAKING CHOICE WITH PRO AND CONS. Crappy generation who can't enjoy games if they aren't the god character with everything.

Says the guy who prefers a meta where you make no choices with pros and cons, and wants to be a god character that others depend on. Really, youre just sounding like principle skinner here. "Am I so out of touch? No, its the children who are wrong". Yes, a fun game is about making choices with pros and cons. I dont make any choice as a sidenoder other than just sitting there waiting for someone else to come kill.

It's fun how you rarely see unkillable condi tank rev because you know, it's slow so it has weakness.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
. "You rarely see condi rev". I get that youre saying whatever to try and justify your unjustifiable position but this is a
riot
. Yes, the class thats in just about every game, sometimes multiple times on the same team, is something "you rarely see".How many in vids linked ? Hmm sure every game HAHAHAHAHAHA.

Youve admitted yourself before that you dont see the meta. So, yknow, its no surprise that you dont see the meta after admitting you dont see the meta.

But just to summarise, the reason you prefer this meta isnt because its more skilled (it isnt, and far from it), or because its more diverse (it isnt, and far from it), or even because you think its more fun. Its because you
HATE
sidenoders, and you want to feel superior to them. You want to take away their agency, their fun, their very reason to play the game, and make them nothing more than your vassals. But hey, you already admitted that the meta is garbage, even if your hate blinds you to the fact that that is bad.Guy I played chrono sidenode during most of HoT, dropping damage to do this, compared to condi meta build. If you think that it is something who impact my judgment you are pretty misinformed. We can even found some old sind vids where I'm. So I know what I'm talking about and it's certainly not whatever superior, neither I feel superior playing carrying build who 2 shot everyone.

You ... you really dont understand that "bunker" and "sidenoder" arent the same thing, do you? Like, your entire argument is based on you having a critical lack of basic knowledge, huh? The sidenoders right now arent bunkers. Theyre zerker builds that just cant kill the enemy because damage is too low. And no, its pretty clear that you still hate sidenoders and dont want them to have any fun. Who knows why. But its clear that that is the only reason you prefer this meta. You want them to have no fun, to be dependent on you, to feel superior.

But just to be sure, you would of course have 0 problem with Mesmer having all of its damage stripped and becoming exclusively a sidenoder who has to always wait for teammates to be able to do anything and otherwise just wasting time on the point, yes? You would have fun playing that class that you yourself said should not be able to do anything on its own, yes?

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@"UNOwen.7132" :

UNOwen definition of skillfloor : count 1 dodge, count 2 dodge, burst !viquing definition of skillfloor : count the 2 dodges + during this time prepare burst by stacking might, putting weakness etc. + do it multiple time.

Sorry but your version look way more easy to achieve.

Play mesmer, like really, even prepacth, you will see that 6000 damage is HIGH considering the higher we can do is on a full glasscanon with modifier shatter 4k/clones. While some other class can do it on multiple skills with less setup.Did you really know that we never fight with the same tools ?Did you ever win a 1v1 versus any top thief with a power mesmer since launch ?The day mesmer scepter did the same damage as necro axe for the same type channeled skill, there were plethora of "mesmer op" whining on forum until it was nerfed.I will not go into a mesmer post but it hurt reading 6000 damage is low, it really hurt...

Right now even the most unkillable builds I met : condi ranger and rev are slow which is an exploitable weakness.Thief had vigor uptime, multiple evade on skills, condi clear and breakstunt. They had single target on demand CC with pistol and AOE with shortbow.Engineer had enough mobility to after a mes and enough damage to spike.Ranger lackked good CC ??? Guy a least : 1 on longbow, 2 on pet, 2 on GS. What look like a good CC class if ranger is a bad CC class ? Necro mobility isn't a major issue anymore since teleport and rune of speed. And so on.

When I play +1 I clearly make choice : near to inexistant condiclear, can't fight on point. Mean even non damaging condi like weakness are counter to me. But you probably never play it.

It's strange I already never see the meta in plat 2 isn't it ?

Ho and it's been a long time now that it's more build than gear that does the build. Mean you can possibly be tank with zerk gear on a full sustain build.

But just to be sure, you would of course have 0 problem with Mesmer having all of its damage stripped and becoming exclusively a sidenoder who has to always wait for teammates to be able to do anything and otherwise just wasting time on the point, yes? You would have fun playing that class that you yourself said should not be able to do anything on its own, yes?Ho it was the case for mes pre-patch + on top of that, it can't even keep the node, pretty fun hu ?Apart that contrary to before where it was the only way to play, now player can choose to play tank and rely on other or to play squishy. You know, I haven't the choice pre-patch.

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@viquing.8254 said:@"UNOwen.7132" :

UNOwen definition of skillfloor : count 1 dodge, count 2 dodge, burst !viquing definition of skillfloor : count the 2 dodges + during this time prepare burst by stacking might, putting weakness etc. + do it multiple time.

How many times have I debunked both of these. Lets fix it to be the truth, shall we?

UNOwen definition of skillfloor: Force the enemy to use his defenses inefficiently by using feints, staggering and switching up damage rotation, using windows in his attacks to crack back with a stun without using any followup and the like, while using your defenses effectively and watching out for his feints and so on while also watching for boons to steal or corrupt and optimal usage of certain defensive boons all while setting up your high damage skills.viquings definition of skillfloor: Just spam every attack off cooldown. Dont bother timing or staggering anything, you cant afford to lower your maximum DPS. Forget about feints, setups or even boon corrupts, none of it matters. Just wait for someone to +1 you.

Sorry but your version look way more easy to achieve.

After we changed it to the truth, yours looks way easier to achieve.

Play mesmer, like really, even prepacth, you will see that 6000 damage is HIGH considering the higher we can do is on a full glasscanon with modifier shatter 4k/clones. While some other class can do it on multiple skills with less setup.

You mean the same Mesmer whose power burst did something like 13000-17000 in less than a split second? Which it has been doing since the specialisation days? Compared to that 6k is considered high? What a joke.

Did you really know that we never fight with the same tools ?

Yes, thats what differentiated the old meta from the current one. Back then everyone had different tools and different ways of fighting and winning fights. Now its all the same tools. Knockbacks, and nothing else matters.

Did you ever win a 1v1 versus any top thief with a power mesmer since launch ?

Yes? At times it wasnt even exactly hard. But even if that werent the case, you do know counters exist, right?

The day mesmer scepter did the same damage as necro axe for the same type channeled skill, there were plethora of "mesmer op" whining on forum until it was nerfed.I will not go into a mesmer post but it hurt reading 6000 damage is low, it really hurt...

Only because you are so unaware of what your own class does you didnt realise 6k was peanuts to it.

Right now even the most unkillable builds I met : condi ranger and rev are slow which is an exploitable weakness.

Ok, so lets dissect this, shall we? First of all, "Condi Ranger". Condi Ranger is not played much. Because it lacks the one tool every sidenoder needs to have, a knockback. The actually played version is power Zerk ranger. Its just as unkillable as all other sidenoders. Its not slow at all, its got good mobility. For that matter, I dont know why you think a perma-swiftness class is slow.

Thief had vigor uptime, multiple evade on skills, condi clear and breakstunt. They had single target on demand CC with pistol and AOE with shortbow.

Guess you didnt know what thief was about either. First of all, thiefs condi clears are atrocious. It has 2 3 condi clears, but both are also really valuable cooldowns for other purposes, one being a stunbreak (also you think stunbreaks are something unique rather than something every class has?). Second, thiefs vigor uptime was quickly ripped or corrupted, with no way of getting it back. And you think daze is a good CC? Its not, compared to stuns, knockdowns, knockbacks and launches. And Headshot isnt even a proper Daze. Still, thief had far lower defenses than most classes, low health, minimal self-healing, and generally just wasnt capable of staying in a fight.

Engineer had enough mobility to after a mes and enough damage to spike.

Mirage? Nope, Mirage could outrun an Engineer ezpz. Core Mesmer? Perhaps, but core Mesmer isnt a very mobile class either. And the only Holo that spiked was Explosive or Kinetic holo, but those didnt have sustain.

When I play +1 I clearly make choice : near to inexistant condiclear, can't fight on point. Mean even non damaging condi like weakness are counter to me. But you probably never play it.

Right now I only play core Grenade Engineer. But remember, I used to play Thief. You make a choice. Just like the sidenoder and everyone else makes a choice. Sidenoders cant +1. +1 cant sidenode. Thats pretty much all youre saying.

It's strange I already never see the meta in plat 2 isn't it ?

You said that you didnt see the meta ever. Why you dont, frankly, I dont care.

Ho and it's been a long time now that it's more build than gear that does the build. Mean you can possibly be tank with zerk gear on a full sustain build.

Yeah, so much so that they removed certain amulets because of how much that gear option made people too tanky. Wait, no, that contradicts you. Oh right, youre wrong. Nope, theyre not tanks. As I said, theyre full Zerk, and they run very few defensive tools. Theyre not tanks. Theyre not sustain builds. Theyre squishy, its just being squishy is meaningless when damage doesnt exist.

But just to be sure, you would of course have 0 problem with Mesmer having all of its damage stripped and becoming exclusively a sidenoder who has to always wait for teammates to be able to do anything and otherwise just wasting time on the point, yes? You would have fun playing that class that you yourself said should not be able to do anything on its own, yes?Ho it was the case for mes pre-patch + on top of that, it can't even keep the node, pretty fun hu ?

Yeah except it wasnt. Mesmer was a high damage burst class that specifically wasnt much of a sidenoder. Its weird how you play Mesmer but dont seem to know Mesmer.

Apart that contrary to before where it was the only way to play, now player can choose to play tank and rely on other or to play squishy. You know, I haven't the choice pre-patch.

Oh ok you genuinely dont understand that bunkers and sidenoders arent the same thing. See, your critical lack of knowledge and understanding comes to a head here. Because there is no choice. You have to play squishy, but you still cant kill anyone solo. In fact, as always, the opposite of what you say is true. You had that choice pre-patch. We had stuff like Prot Holo, like bunker necro, boonbeast, and so on. You had the choice to be tanky, or high damage. Now, the line between squishy and tanky doesnt exist, because of how low damage is. Everyone is tanky just by virtue of that. You no longer have the choice.

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@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

@"shadowpass.4236" said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Ah yes, stab for how long was it? Had to wait like 20s so ranger would be finally "vulnerable" to cc? Evasion on GS AA was nice as well with that stow, really love these exploits <3 Looked like a fight against new player that jumped on Powercreep class, I say he was doing fine being carried by broken spec. If you call that "fun" then lmao. People really have very low standards for fun these days I guess.Btw. I usually go and play single player games and use cheat engine to have this kind of "fun"(ez access to everything at any given time, luv it).

Oh wow would you look at that? Even when the game was "powercreeped" I was able to fit in two entire fights in under 3 minutes. In the current meta, I'm lucky if I have ONE fight that ends over the course of 15 minutes.

Maybe you should count how many times I used the GS auto evade trick in both fights (the answer is, "Once!") Using it at any other point asides from the one time I did would have been a misplay.

Judging by the fact that you seem to believe a bunker meta is fun, and having fights where top tier players just /dance in tournaments because there is absolutely no risk in either of them dying, your standard for fun must be nonexistent. ^^

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Ah yes, stab for how long was it? Had to wait like 20s so ranger would be finally "vulnerable" to cc? Evasion on GS AA was nice as well with that stow, really love these exploits <3 Looked like a fight against new player that jumped on Powercreep class, I say he was doing fine being carried by broken spec. If you call that "fun" then lmao. People really have very low standards for fun these days I guess.Btw. I usually go and play single player games and use cheat engine to have this kind of "fun"(ez access to everything at any given time, luv it).

Oh wow would you look at that? Even when the game was "powercreeped" I was able to fit in two entire fights in under 3 minutes. In the current meta, I'm lucky if I have ONE fight that ends over the course of 15 minutes.

Maybe you should count how many times I used the GS auto evade trick in both fights (the answer is, "Once!") Using it at any other point asides from the
one
time I did would have been a misplay.

Judging by the fact that you seem to believe a bunker meta is fun, and having fights where top tier players just /dance in tournaments because there is absolutely no risk in either of them dying, your standard for fun must be nonexistent. ^^

Don't use words you barely understand, current meta is far from "bunker", there are few outliners for sure, but overall it's far from it. But that's what you get when you keep screaming BUFFFFFFFFFFF to everything instead of properly balancing game since HoT release.What your video showed is: unreasonable high boon uptime, abuse of an exploit, poorly designed e-spec, bad balance design aka low cd on high impact skills.Since when abusing poorly designed mechanic is considered 'evade trick'? Abusing poorly designed mechanic is called 'trick' these days, instead of asking to fix it? Just wow.Game was powercreeped and that's a FACT, current state of balance is the result of constant adding more skills that were low cd - big effect and not adressing them together with nerf-bat, same goes for sustain and condies and ccs.Yea, I can bully newbies within a minute or two as well, your point? You know why your fights last so long? Because of powercreeped sustain, which wasn't touched as it should be with 25th patch. Now imagine if A-net decided to increase heal skill cd to atleast 30s, all utilities to minimum of 40s and if they have more effects 60s+, elite skills atleast to 90s. THEN you would actually think before acting, unlike HoT and PoF meta.If you like or not, game was dumbed down skill-wise with HoT and PoF elite speces, increased damage, sustain, boons, condies, everything.Atleast now you need to pick A or B instead of getting everything in one package.If you really believe it's "bunker meta" then I wonder what were you doing while chronobunkers were on rampage...Current meta is much healthier(beside few outliners like Holo, cRev, FB) in long run for the game since Core times.

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@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Ah yes, stab for how long was it? Had to wait like 20s so ranger would be finally "vulnerable" to cc? Evasion on GS AA was nice as well with that stow, really love these exploits <3 Looked like a fight against new player that jumped on Powercreep class, I say he was doing fine being carried by broken spec. If you call that "fun" then lmao. People really have very low standards for fun these days I guess.Btw. I usually go and play single player games and use cheat engine to have this kind of "fun"(ez access to everything at any given time, luv it).

Oh wow would you look at that? Even when the game was "powercreeped" I was able to fit in two entire fights in under 3 minutes. In the current meta, I'm lucky if I have ONE fight that ends over the course of 15 minutes.

Maybe you should count how many times I used the GS auto evade trick in both fights (the answer is, "Once!") Using it at any other point asides from the
one
time I did would have been a misplay.

Judging by the fact that you seem to believe a bunker meta is fun, and having fights where top tier players just /dance in tournaments because there is absolutely no risk in either of them dying, your standard for fun must be nonexistent. ^^

Don't use words you barely understand, current meta is far from "bunker", there are few outliners for sure, but overall it's far from it. But that's what you get when you keep screaming BUFFFFFFFFFFF to everything instead of properly balancing game since HoT release.

Bunker is the wrong word, but the fact is the meta consists of classes that cant die because damage is way too low.

What your video showed is: unreasonable high boon uptime, abuse of an exploit, poorly designed e-spec, bad balance design aka low cd on high impact skills.Since when abusing poorly designed mechanic is considered 'evade trick'? Abusing poorly designed mechanic is called 'trick' these days, instead of asking to fix it? Just wow.

Why do you think its a poorly designed mechanic.

Game was powercreeped and that's a FACT, current state of balance is the result of constant adding more skills that were low cd - big effect and not adressing them together with nerf-bat, same goes for sustain and condies and ccs.

The game had some powercreep, yes. But now we have major powerdip (the opposite of powercreep). The current power level of classes is far below what it has been in the entire history of the game. As I mentioned before, damage should never be below specialisation patch level damage at all. Currently were a full 20-30% below it.

Yea, I can bully newbies within a minute or two as well, your point? You know why your fights last so long? Because of powercreeped sustain, which wasn't touched as it should be with 25th patch. Now imagine if A-net decided to increase heal skill cd to atleast 30s, all utilities to minimum of 40s and if they have more effects 60s+, elite skills atleast to 90s. THEN you would actually think before acting, unlike HoT and PoF meta.

Yeah, except not really. If you actually were to look at the classes, their sustain is not higher than it was during, say, the specialisation days. In fact, quite the opposite. Its lower. And the next sentence shows just why the "powercreep" argument goes flying out the window. Why are you increasing cooldowns far beyond what they have ever been? We never had cooldowns that long. And no, longer cooldowns doesnt make the game more tactical, it just means you have longer periods where you do nothing but autoing. Its boring, its not skillful, its just dull.

If you like or not, game was dumbed down skill-wise with HoT and PoF elite speces, increased damage, sustain, boons, condies, everything.

Whether you like it or not, it actually hasnt been. The skillcap increased. Its the recent patch that made the skillcap plummet.

Atleast now you need to pick A or B instead of getting everything in one package.

You never could get everything in one package. However, since damage now is far too low, you basically can now, because youre unkillable just by being a zerker anyway.

If you really believe it's "bunker meta" then I wonder what were you doing while chronobunkers were on rampage...

At least in bunker chrono times you could kill the people who werent chrono. Not so much right now.

Current meta is much healthier(beside few outliners like Holo, cRev, FB) in long run for the game since Core times.

Nope. The current meta is the least healthy we had yet. Its got major problems, the fact that damage is far below core times, while sustain is only slightly below core times. The fact that with that low damage, skillful play is out the window and you just use everything off cooldown. In the long run, the only way to fix this meta is to massively increase damage and admit the patch was a bad idea to begin with.

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@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Ah yes, stab for how long was it? Had to wait like 20s so ranger would be finally "vulnerable" to cc? Evasion on GS AA was nice as well with that stow, really love these exploits <3 Looked like a fight against new player that jumped on Powercreep class, I say he was doing fine being carried by broken spec. If you call that "fun" then lmao. People really have very low standards for fun these days I guess.Btw. I usually go and play single player games and use cheat engine to have this kind of "fun"(ez access to everything at any given time, luv it).

Oh wow would you look at that? Even when the game was "powercreeped" I was able to fit in two entire fights in under 3 minutes. In the current meta, I'm lucky if I have ONE fight that ends over the course of 15 minutes.

Maybe you should count how many times I used the GS auto evade trick in both fights (the answer is, "Once!") Using it at any other point asides from the
one
time I did would have been a misplay.

Judging by the fact that you seem to believe a bunker meta is fun, and having fights where top tier players just /dance in tournaments because there is absolutely no risk in either of them dying, your standard for fun must be nonexistent. ^^

Don't use words you barely understand, current meta is far from "bunker", there are few outliners for sure, but overall it's far from it. But that's what you get when you keep screaming BUFFFFFFFFFFF to everything instead of properly balancing game since HoT release.What your video showed is: unreasonable high boon uptime, abuse of an exploit, poorly designed e-spec, bad balance design aka low cd on high impact skills.Since when abusing poorly designed mechanic is considered 'evade trick'? Abusing poorly designed mechanic is called 'trick' these days, instead of asking to fix it? Just wow.Game was powercreeped and that's a FACT, current state of balance is the result of constant adding more skills that were low cd - big effect and not adressing them together with nerf-bat, same goes for sustain and condies and ccs.Yea, I can bully newbies within a minute or two as well, your point? You know why your fights last so long? Because of powercreeped sustain, which wasn't touched as it should be with 25th patch. Now imagine if A-net decided to increase heal skill cd to atleast 30s, all utilities to minimum of 40s and if they have more effects 60s+, elite skills atleast to 90s. THEN you would actually think before acting, unlike HoT and PoF meta.If you like or not, game was dumbed down skill-wise with HoT and PoF elite speces, increased damage, sustain, boons, condies, everything.Atleast now you need to pick A or B instead of getting everything in one package.If you really believe it's "bunker meta" then I wonder what were you doing while chronobunkers were on rampage...Current meta is much healthier(beside few outliners like Holo, cRev, FB) in long run for the game since Core times.

https://clips.twitch.tv/VastRoundDootHassanChop

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

^ when the game was actually fun

Ah yes, stab for how long was it? Had to wait like 20s so ranger would be finally "vulnerable" to cc? Evasion on GS AA was nice as well with that stow, really love these exploits <3 Looked like a fight against new player that jumped on Powercreep class, I say he was doing fine being carried by broken spec. If you call that "fun" then lmao. People really have very low standards for fun these days I guess.Btw. I usually go and play single player games and use cheat engine to have this kind of "fun"(ez access to everything at any given time, luv it).

Oh wow would you look at that? Even when the game was "powercreeped" I was able to fit in two entire fights in under 3 minutes. In the current meta, I'm lucky if I have ONE fight that ends over the course of 15 minutes.

Maybe you should count how many times I used the GS auto evade trick in both fights (the answer is, "Once!") Using it at any other point asides from the
one
time I did would have been a misplay.

Judging by the fact that you seem to believe a bunker meta is fun, and having fights where top tier players just /dance in tournaments because there is absolutely no risk in either of them dying, your standard for fun must be nonexistent. ^^

You can't 1vsX unless your spec is busted because no matter how great people may think to be , X number of opponents should be able to down you in no time. Now the situation change when your spec is busted because maybe you can chain evades/blocks/stealth in a short amount of time or you have access to long lasting resilience boons or stealth jumping or else....yeah you can 1vsX there, because your spec is busted

Also your clips show two so called "TOP tier" individuals stalling each other, going by logic alone we believe that what should happen in every situation where both parties display same range of possibilities , both players are playing two specs designed for stalling side nodes, playing them at the "maximum" capacity

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