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WvW Skirmish Tracks need a gold reward per Tier


Geoff Fey.1035

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@Infusion.7149 said:Ascended trinkets are moot. You can do Bjora Marches and get the trinket for eternal ice at the vendor and convert to get diflourite and mistborn motes or other LS4 currency for second trinket.

Yea, but I've done enough Living Story that the mere sight of it makes me want to hurl. I can only imagine it worse for those that don't like pve at all. I want to Bjora Marches once, and I swear it was like one the worst maps I've ever played in. Somewhere up there with the half completed maps like Southsun and Dry Top.

LS3 was decent at parts, but LS4 and beyond... ugh.

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@ArchonWing.9480 said:If you spent 48 hours of doing anything but WvW, you would have 2 sets of ascended.

That sounds a little hyerbolic to me. 48 hours of gold farming in SW or Drizzlewood...sure, but to compare 48 hours of farming gold like you live in a certain people's republic vs. playing a particular game mode for the same length of time, for fun, isn't the same. If someone spent 48 hours doing map completion, pretty sure they wouldn't be wearing 2 full sets of ascendeded (though they still might have more gold than a WvW'er)

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@Turkeyspit.3965 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:If you spent 48 hours of doing anything
but
WvW, you would have 2 sets of ascended.

That sounds a little hyerbolic to me. 48 hours of gold farming in SW or Drizzlewood...sure, but to compare 48 hours of farming gold like you live in a certain people's republic vs. playing a particular game mode for the same length of time, for fun, isn't the same. If someone spent 48 hours doing map completion, pretty sure they wouldn't be wearing 2 full sets of ascendeded (though they still might have more gold than a WvW'er)

Only slightly. I don't know anyone that would do 48 hours of map completion just because, personally.

So maybe 1 set of ascended armor then for not actually farming. (300/48= 6.25g). That's almost possible in WvW. Regardless, my point was about 48 hours for an exotic set.

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Give gold per chest in the skirmish track, scale it by the chest, with more gold in the final chest of each tier, something that adds up an extra 60g per week. Make the shards actual marks. Add Mystic Coins to the repeatable Diamond chest.

That last change alone would guarantee a higher population of players in the game mode.

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WvW: 322 hrs = _166.95g _over 8 weeks plus 37.6 WvW Reward Tracks (assuming selling all Memories of Battle)What? No!

166g is what I get in about 20 hours of playtime in WvW. Still less than in PvE, but not by such an extent like you say.

The reward track chests grant a lot of T6 and ascended materials. And you get a ton of ascended gear just for playing.

After 322 hours in WvW I have everything I need for a legendary. I have 6 of these and a legendary armor and the legendary backpack. Following your calculation I must have played WvW for more than 20.000 hours (no I did not! - nowhere near!).

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@Turkeyspit.3965 said:

@"Justine.6351" said:More gold make me more gooder at wvw. Definitely can't have enough of it and needs a buff. Maybe the veteran creature events could give bags of gold when killed?

Ancient Boreal Spirit and Overgrown Grub say: "am I a joke to you?"

Yeah I wanna do the tree champ but nobody ever does it. Maybe if they increase it's rewards to 10g every kill it would be more popular? Could even add a krait champion boss on the other side since it's missing a champ. Go a step further and revamp the balance of veteran creature encounters. Make the dragons in desert borderland a real fight with big loot. It's all there, they just need to do it.

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I like how the fractal breakdown has "sell everything" for a roundabout amount, but doesn't do the same for the wvw breakdown, only selling memories of battle, which btw you can earn 25 in the gift of battle reward track rather than the 15 in the rest of them. Nevermind the heavy bags you earn from kills which can sell a stack of 250 for about 6g or open for t6 mats, nevermind all the crafting materials you can farm in objectives, nevermind all the materials including ectos you get from gear breakdowns, nevermind the random ascended materials from the warp packets, nevermind mystic coins. You even go so far as to include warlord armor for pvp rewards, but don't include the same for wvw rewards?

How can you even compare for time value in wvw to pve as well when you can stand afk for 10 mins at a time, repair a wall to keep t6 participation, go back afk for another 10 mins, or sit afk botting a treb in smc, you can do this for hours and or even days. Meanwhile pve(other than some of the bot areas) and spvp requires you to be active for your rewards, hence why the time/reward ratio is much better than wvw. The wvw players who actually have sunk a lot of time in wvw and earned high wxp levels, were rewarded with higher pip ticks, thus acquiring skirmish rewards much faster.

Hey I'm all for increasing rewards in wvw, I fought for increase in rewards and equal access to ascended gear for years before they brought in the skirmish tickets rewards, which was a huge step in allowing players to be able to gear strictly from wvw than pve. But if you want people, especially anet, to take your breakdown seriously, then be completely honest about the breakdowns in every area.

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@"XenesisII.1540" said:I like how the fractal breakdown has "sell everything" for a roundabout amount, but doesn't do the same for the wvw breakdown, only selling memories of battle, which btw you can earn 25 in the gift of battle reward track rather than the 15 in the rest of them. Nevermind the heavy bags you earn from kills which can sell a stack of 250 for about 6g or open for t6 mats, nevermind all the crafting materials you can farm in objectives, nevermind all the materials including ectos you get from gear breakdowns, nevermind the random ascended materials from the warp packets, nevermind mystic coins. You even go so far as to include warlord armor for pvp rewards, but don't include the same for wvw rewards?

How can you even compare for time value in wvw to pve as well when you can stand afk for 10 mins at a time, repair a wall to keep t6 participation, go back afk for another 10 mins, or sit afk botting a treb in smc, you can do this for hours and or even days. Meanwhile pve(other than some of the bot areas) and spvp requires you to be active for your rewards, hence why the time/reward ratio is much better than wvw. The wvw players who actually have sunk a lot of time in wvw and earned high wxp levels, were rewarded with higher pip ticks, thus acquiring skirmish rewards much faster.

Hey I'm all for increasing rewards in wvw, I fought for increase in rewards and equal access to ascended gear for years before they brought in the skirmish tickets rewards, which was a huge step in allowing players to be able to gear strictly from wvw than pve. But if you want people, especially anet, to take your breakdown seriously, then be completely honest about the breakdowns in every area.

The fractal estimate was insanely low. If we're comparing some high level super experienced WvWer. Doing so with the fractal goer as well giving them a mid level mist attunement can almost double that income. It also wasn't a 'sell everything' it was a 'open encryptions and sell the stuff' thing. Fractals should be giving someone around 40-50g from dailies + CMs if they sell absolutely everything.

You could make the argument of AFKing being all that's necessary to earn the rewards, but WvW isn't filled with bots gold farming. That's PvP.

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@God.2708 said:The fractal estimate was insanely low. If we're comparing some high level super experienced WvWer. Doing so with the fractal goer as well giving them a mid level mist attunement can almost double that income. It also wasn't a 'sell everything' it was a 'open encryptions and sell the stuff' thing. Fractals should be giving someone around 40-50g from dailies + CMs if they sell absolutely everything.

You could make the argument of AFKing being all that's necessary to earn the rewards, but WvW isn't filled with bots gold farming. That's PvP.

Regardless, op made an even more insanely low estimate on wvw gains.Be honest if you want the devs to take you seriously.

Fractals (CM+T4+Recs) Dailies

Approx. 14-20g/day, assuming you sell everything you get and buy keys to open the chests.

That sounds like sell everything to me...

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@XenesisII.1540 said:

@God.2708 said:The fractal estimate was insanely low. If we're comparing some high level super experienced WvWer. Doing so with the fractal goer as well giving them a mid level mist attunement can almost double that income.
It also wasn't a 'sell everything'
it was a 'open encryptions and sell the stuff' thing. Fractals should be giving someone around 40-50g from dailies + CMs if they sell absolutely everything.

You could make the argument of AFKing being all that's necessary to earn the rewards, but WvW isn't filled with bots gold farming. That's PvP.

Regardless, op made an even more insanely low estimate on wvw gains.Be honest if you want the devs to take you seriously.

Fractals (CM+T4+Recs) Dailies

Approx. 14-20g/day,
assuming you sell everything you get
and buy keys to open the chests.

That sounds like sell everything to me...

Your attempt to play devils advocate by calling for some high bar does nothing to provide for the discussion. You do it. I provided anecdotal evidence that was confirmed by others experience that his calculations, though not accounting for everything, were basically true in spirit even if not in detail. You're just screeching 'NOT GOOD ENOUGH' into the ether.

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I think making the loot more dependent on events, defending, attacking, kills, general participation etc would be better than the semi-passive reward track.

For instance;

  • Adding a liquid gold reward per event completed, like PvE, but higher (due to less frequency) and an item like the Bag of Coins.

  • 100% chance of a Heavy Loot Bag from player kills. Yes, ppl can kill trade, but its still not going to be faster or more profitable than just farming Drizzlewood Coast, SW or Fractals.

  • Removing the Synthesizers and adding X Heavy Loot Bags (or some new bag that also awards the varietal seeds for ascended food) per skirmish tick. I feel like the Synthesizers are just a waste of time that could be put to better use. They feel like scrambling for scraps when you are starving. Can you imagine if they were in sPvP maps?

  • Add a decent gold value to the Emblem of the Conqueror and Emblem of the Avenger items received from those achievements. They can be then sold to the vendor and become their own reward track of sorts.

But also, make a reward track that is obviously aimed at crafting a set of WvW legendary armor. Clovers, MoB, Skirmish Tickets, Cloth/Leather/Metal/Trophy Shipments, Trophy Bags (rare), Grandmaster Marks/Shards etc. Everything you need to craft the armor, divided by however many repeats you think is necessary. The fact that WvW legendary armor is time gated to take at least 3 months longer than PvE armor is utterly absurd.

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@God.2708 said:Your attempt to play devils advocate by calling for some high bar does nothing to provide for the discussion. You do it. I provided anecdotal evidence that was confirmed by others experience that his calculations, though not accounting for everything, were basically true in spirit even if not in detail. You're just screeching 'NOT GOOD ENOUGH' into the ether.

Heh and all you've done is screech yeah I don't get enough gold as pve!Well no kidding, we've known this for 8 years! what else is new!

I'm not going to do the work for you, I already pointed out everything else missed in the calculations. If someone wants to do a breakdown they should probably account for everything in their calculations.

I'm simply saying, do an honest assessment if you want devs to take this seriously.

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@XenesisII.1540 said:

@God.2708 said:Your attempt to play devils advocate by calling for some high bar does nothing to provide for the discussion. You do it. I provided anecdotal evidence that was confirmed by others experience that his calculations, though not accounting for everything, were basically true in spirit even if not in detail. You're just screeching 'NOT GOOD ENOUGH' into the ether.

Heh and all you've done is screech yeah I don't get enough gold as pve!Well no kidding, we've known this for 8 years! what else is new!

I'm not going to do the work for you, I already pointed out everything else missed in the calculations. If someone wants to do a breakdown they should probably account for everything in their calculations.

I'm simply saying, do an honest assessment if you want devs to take this seriously.

I have seen no evidence that honest assessments have any impact on devs taking something seriously or not.

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I never understand why anyone that plays WvW would not ask that we could make more while playing it. All I can figure out is that they don't deploy siege and don't work on ascended armor, speciality foods. Back in the day you had to do other things to support you playing WvW. It's not as bad now, but barely. WvW is still an encouragement for players to pull out a CC to make gold to pay for WvW activities.

To a suggestion above, if the concern is AFK, add new types of ways that players could earn rewards for activities:

  • A player kill bag bounty. Use a similar algorithm that is in place for WxP that results in the longer the player is alive and earning WxP the more their loot bag is worth. If kill trading is an issue then diminishing return would account for that.
  • Objective taker bounty. Add similar logic to taking of objectives that are defended. Object is worth x amount increased by defenders and then divided by number of attackers.
  • Alliance bounty. A system that rewards players the next day based on their activities from prior day.
  • Weekly Bounties. Acquired from vendors for a base amount, complete within the week and get x times returned based on tiers. Take x towers, x camps, kill x players, kill x player types and the such. Inspiration from this comes from quests that players might have seen in Warhammer Online or things like Destiny 2 Crucible quests.

I know the forums don't like to draw PvXers in from other game modes because of rewards but no I think the rewards in WvW are subpar and still go out of game mode if I feel I need to make some coin. No one should get that feeling from their choice of game mode. I also think there is a difference in people that are crafting foods and siege and or buying it versus people that are using those that other deploy. But I can't side with the group that says we are making plenty now.

+10 on boosting it.

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I cannot understand why they dont add gold to pip chests like in pvp.You can even repeat the chest in pvp for 20 gold per repeat...You cant even make 20g from wvw if you the whole day, unless you get a 1-in-1,000,000 prec drop lmfao.

And in wvw when we repeat the diamond chest..... we get 4 memories of battle, worth less than 40silver (-15% TP tax)2 loot bags that usually give <2 silver worth of materials...and skirmish chests which worth probably less than 50 silver.So all in all less than 1gold worth of mats for repeating diamond.. which takes... 330 pips.Assume you are a veteran and get like 10 pips per 5min, thats 33x5min = 165 minutes = almost 3 hours for less than 1 gold.

And this is not even taking into account the rewards in between completing the mini tiers in the pip track, which give flat 1.5 gold in pvp, and less than 50 silver worth of random junk in wvw.

How is this okay....

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@"TheGrimm.5624" said:I never understand why anyone that plays WvW would not ask that we could make more while playing it.

Because some people see beyond the question at hand, and look at what would come next. That doesn't mean people like me agree with it, but it helps me understand perhaps why ANET makes some of the decisions it does.

In PvP and PvE, you have to be good to get max rewards. You need to win your fights and hold your nodes, or kill the fractal/raid boss.

In WvW you get rewarded for being on the map. The only throttle to that is participation, and we've already covered that, ad nauseum, about how people can literally farm rewards in WvW while doing nothing of any importance....but ANET can't just adjust how participation is awarded because sometimes the strategic move IS to run dolayks, and sometimes roamers need to be able to smack a damaged wall to refresh their participation. So long as the bulk of the rewards in WvW (Skirmish and Reward tracks) are handed out for just being on the map, there is a limit to what ANET can dole out.

Now many would suggest increasing the rewards given for activity, such as killing other players. And that will turn into guilds from different servers (or even the same people that are on multiple guilds on multiple servers) setting up farming time when they just kill each other for loots........kind of like what was done in EoTM.

When you have to deal with the "human condition" you have to play to the lowest common denominator, and that's largely why we can't have nice things.

I've completed Diamond already, and when I get home from work today and have 90 minutes to play, I can choose to go into WvW or into T4 Fractals. Both are things I enjoy, but one of them will put a nice chunk of gold in my wallet, while the other will just give me a handful of memories of battle.

So I have no objection at all to ANET increasing the rewards - in fact I would love it if they did. But I understand why they are reluctant to do so.

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realistically, the 2 best solutions are

  1. add gold to reward tracks like pvp.
  2. add 'valuable junk' that only drops from killing players. This 'valuable junk' can sell for 5 silver, 10 silver, 25 silver, 50 silver 1 gold or some super rare valuable junk that can be sold for like 10 gold to an NPC merchant. This would encourage more fighting in wvw as the net rewards of actually engaging in fights and killing enemies would be so much worth it.

And people who say "oh people will just coordinate and trade kills" you have no idea how wvw works.If any guild group hears about this being done they will just go there and kill the kill-trades just for the fun of it.Most people in wvw enjoy playing and winning.
And those who will go to wvw to farm kills by trading will just get farmed by those who don't care and are just looking to kill stuff. Simple as that.

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Ever since they added Emblem of the Avenger I feel that their should be a vendor that will buy each of these for 10g each. What it would boil down to is every 10 kills = 1g. You would have to actively be playing to get these so it would settle the argument of having to participate on the map. I have 136 of these currently and already crafted the ring. Right now I am just sitting on these with hopes something good will come of it.

To stay on topic more rewards are needed. People should feel rewarded to play this game mode.

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@Vova.2640 said:And people who say "oh people will just coordinate and trade kills" you have no idea how wvw works.

Really.

Not going to list the original posters name (since they aren't part of this thread) but I'll just copy/paste what they said, as think it is a rather succinct description of the issue.

While its true that many did use EotM, don't forget that a lot of players used the old Obsidian Sanctum farm, back in the day I seen several streamers on twitch farming in here, 3 zergs mass killing each other, these players where going up 20-30 levels an hour with boosters, some of which today are 7k+ this is why Anet should look into WXP again,

And ...

@Vova.2640 said:And those who will go to wvw to farm kills by trading will just get farmed by those who don't care and are just looking to kill stuff. Simple as that.

Please go on. I feel you can teach me so much....

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@"Vova.2640" said:And people who say "oh people will just coordinate and trade kills" you have no idea how wvw works.If any guild group hears about this being done they will just go there and kill the kill-trades just for the fun of it.Most people in wvw enjoy playing and winning.

And those who will go to wvw to farm kills by trading will just get farmed by those who don't care and are just looking to kill stuff. Simple as that.

You must be new as this has occurred multiple times in the past and most likely still happens.

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