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Forced to grind levels, even on a paid account?


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@ConorT.5396 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

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Except these are not "FACTS THAT YOU KNOW TO BE TRUE". They are anecdotes and opinions back up by very little - if any - genuine evidence. You do not have access to the facts. Anet does.

The NPE since 2014 has not damaged the game or the influx of new players (which as I have said previously has been considerable in the past) and has maintained a healthy population ever since despite its age and other - more questionable - design decisions.

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

It becomes repetitive after they have interacted a 3rd time with an object to spawn a mob & kill it.

Lol. Ok, kill 3 mobs is repetitive and again I'll say MMO's are not for you. I commend you for lasting 5000 hours then. I give up. Carry the torch rand and cyn wheres ari or others that love to argue. Peace

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@Jilora.9524 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

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@"Randulf.7614" said:Except these are not "FACTS THAT YOU KNOW TO BE TRUE". They are anecdotes and opinions back up by very little - if any - genuine evidence. You do not have access to the facts. Anet does.

The NPE since 2014 has not damaged the game or the influx of new players (which as I have said previously has been considerable in the past) and has maintained a healthy population ever since despite its age and other - more questionable - design decisions.

The facts I know to be true are:

  1. Guild Wars 2 currently has a high number of new-player game abandonment. Perhaps not the highest in history - but still high.
  2. There is currently an INFLUX of new players.
  3. New players do not like the fact they are forced to do side quests & this is more obvious in the veteran MMORPG player community that have moved to GW2 for challenging content.
  4. Guild wars 2 is an old game & the starter area should be exceptionally polished ESPECIALLY IF THERE IS A RESTRICTION FOR NEW PLAYERS TO STAY THERE. It is not polished, it is dated.

Once again - if you are reading this I am not criticising Guild Wars 2 as a whole, I love end-game content & I love the community in the game.

I an simply pointing out the fact that I believe that the restriction for gating the personal story has taken away of the freedom that Guild Wars has offered since Guild Wars prophecies .

And from my point of view, it is having a negative impact on new-player retention during this period of influx.

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

Ok msg me it. I won't dox you or write it or hell send me an invite. I didn't think announcing the name would be a bad thing. I just find your story to be a little fishy so if I had a name of I guild and then saw that guild running around I'd believe you more. 600 still a lot.

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@Jilora.9524 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

Ok msg me it. I won't dox you or write it or hell send me an invite. I didn't think announcing the name would be a bad thing. I just find your story to be a little fishy so if I had a name of I guild and then saw that guild running around I'd believe you more. 600 still a lot.

Out of the 600 recruited members, there are 240 active members.

The rest have been culled due to 4+ weeks of inactivity below 50 achievement points.

Which is what I am basing my facts on.

This is more data than most people outside aNet would have.

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

Ok msg me it. I won't dox you or write it or hell send me an invite. I didn't think announcing the name would be a bad thing. I just find your story to be a little fishy so if I had a name of I guild and then saw that guild running around I'd believe you more. 600 still a lot.

Out of the 600 recruited members, there are 240 active members.

The rest have been culled due to 4+ weeks of inactivity below 50 achievement points.

Which is what I am basing my facts on.

This is more data than most people outside aNet would have.

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

Ok msg me it. I won't dox you or write it or hell send me an invite. I didn't think announcing the name would be a bad thing. I just find your story to be a little fishy so if I had a name of I guild and then saw that guild running around I'd believe you more. 600 still a lot.

You are not online in-game.

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

Ok msg me it. I won't dox you or write it or hell send me an invite. I didn't think announcing the name would be a bad thing. I just find your story to be a little fishy so if I had a name of I guild and then saw that guild running around I'd believe you more. 600 still a lot.

Out of the 600 recruited members, there are 240 active members.

The rest have been culled due to 4+ weeks of inactivity below 50 achievement points.

Which is what I am basing my facts on.

This is more data than most people outside aNet would have.

@Jilora.9524 said:His 1st ever discussion and he put 70 comments in. I can't remember many mmo's that you didn't need to be a certain level to progress story. I do remember starting out in gw2 and getting wrecked in the like level 15 one because I was like level 9. That's def a quality exp and this is what he's missing. He doesn't want to grind at first he wants to enter story get wrecked then go oh let me grind a few levels now. Also somehow milking cows and cleaning graffiti is much worse then other mmos fetch / kill 10 mobs/items. This is every game so mmos are just not for you

What does my topic & comment count have to do with anything?

You can't remember any MMO's that had no level restrictions?

Guild Wars 1 & Guild Wars 2 vanilla.

It means most likely you rolled in here on an alt account to make this discussion and after 72 comments outta what 115 means no one can change your mind. You had limits in GW2 because you eventually couldn't beat story or survive in the area you needed to get to because you were so low. I got to level 12 maybe in GW1. Any new player with you trying to rush them thru content is not going to have a good exp. Let them play the game. What's your guild btw?

Also, just another point here - is that there is a difference between rushing people through the game & people been forced to do repetitive, DATED events & heart quests. (Once again, in Queensdale - Milking a cow does not even have its own animation but the character uses the dance Emote). In 2020 is this the quality of content people are expected to be locked too in a new MMORPG they are going to spend their time in?

Please remember that core hearts & world events are not the GEM of Guild Wars too anymore, they are badly made, poor & dated. And this is what new members are tied too.

The maps only really get challenging after Lions Arch - Veteran MMORPG players do not want to be bored for 20+ hours game play before they get somewhere that actually pushes their ability.

They are new. It's not repetitive to them. It is to you and I bet you talk their ear off about it again ruining their exp. Just recruit a new player give him 4 15 slot bags and tell him if you get stuck at story or a hero point hmu and I will help. Let them be free to decide on their own not forced to play your way in a game that's repetitive to all of us hence why we use tomes of knowledge to skip everything

Once again, complete non-sense because I have a team of mentors who run as officers in the guild with scheduled world events for beginners, new players - all the way up to focus Raid Squads.

So please, come up with a more reasonable explanation than this targeted hate because you cannot counter my points.

I can't counter someone who thinks he's right end all speaking for everyone because a few new players raised concerns. What is your guilds name? They sound helpful. I'm glad there's even 6000 players to recruit. I decline on my key run I bet. I am not targeting hate. I read the thread see how you think story is everything when I personally could care less and others could care less too so you don't speak for me or others I talk to. It is your opinion and not a fact. Guild name or this is just all made up

Let me just correct something from my previous post - when I stated 6000 members, this was a typo. I have recruited 600 members.

But I do not understand your obsession with doxing me when the discussion is to do with the fact that Guild Wars now has a restriction that forces people to do "side quests" that they potentially do not want to do?

Ok msg me it. I won't dox you or write it or hell send me an invite. I didn't think announcing the name would be a bad thing. I just find your story to be a little fishy so if I had a name of I guild and then saw that guild running around I'd believe you more. 600 still a lot.

You are not online in-game.

I'll log in. Don't continue the argument. Ill just chill quietly. I do play everyday tho

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@"Randulf.7614" said:Except these are not "FACTS THAT YOU KNOW TO BE TRUE". They are anecdotes and opinions back up by very little - if any - genuine evidence. You do not have access to the facts. Anet does.

The NPE since 2014 has not damaged the game or the influx of new players (which as I have said previously has been considerable in the past) and has maintained a healthy population ever since despite its age and other - more questionable - design decisions.

The facts I know to be true are:
  1. Guild Wars 2 currently has a high number of new-player game abandonment. Perhaps not the highest in history - but still high.
  2. There is currently an INFLUX of new players.
  3. New players do not like the fact they are forced to do side quests & this is more obvious in the veteran MMORPG player community of have moved to GW2 for challenging content.
  4. Guild wars 2 is an old game & the starter area should be exceptionally polished ESPECIALLY IF THERE IS A RESTRICTION FOR NEW PLAYERS TO STAY THERE. It is not polished, it is dated.

Once again - if you are reading this I am not criticising Guild Wars 2 as a whole, I love end-game content & I love the community in the game.

I an simply pointing out the fact that I believe that the restriction for gating the personal story has taken away of the freedom that Guild Wars has offered since Guild Wars prophecies .

And from my point of view, it is having a negative impact on new-player retention during this period of influx.

Only point 2 is a fact and even then that's only by logic and extrapolation since we don't have access to that data

We have no idea on point 1 at all. We have no access to any data to prove it all, so point 1 is dismissed outright.If 3 was a fact, we'd see proof of it in feedback and mass new player abandonment. We haven't in either case.4 is debatable. I can certainly see the merit in that side of the opinion, but it remains an opinion purely. Personally I think the starter zones are in better shape than launch, but I'm not inflexible enough to fully counter the point on it. It's certainly not a fact

In your opinion the freedom is taken away, yet GW2 has consistently moved away from GW1 at almost every turn. It is a different game, with a different design philosophy. If the restrictions is something you object to now (and it is just you since this isn't a problem reported as a widespread issue after all), there are far worse post level 80 to come with masteries and other things implemented

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If they removed the level requirement, they would only go back to the original problem of people complaining about having to grind levels to keep up with the story. By gating it, they're forcing people to figure out how to play the game their own way, instead of following how other MMOs/games taught them to play (follow the quest/arrow/objective).

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@Healix.5819 said:If they removed the level requirement, they would only go back to the original problem of people complaining about having to grind levels to keep up with the story. By gating it, they're forcing people to figure out how to play the game their own way, instead of following how other MMOs/games taught them to play (follow the quest/arrow/objective).

Well, I guess that is just opinionated.

Been forced to be a level before even trying a mission.

Or been motivated to level - because you attempted it & failed.

Removing the challenge for me, makes a game less appealing - especially a 8 year old game in a saturated market.

At least, based on your comment we can agree on one thing, hearts are a grind & no fun at all.

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I fail to see how the old system was better. Explain it to me, please? The way I see it now is that you're free to do absolutely anything you want to do in order to level. Hearts, events, exploring, gathering, crafting, etc. While that was still true before the NPE, of course, it seems to me you were FORCED to do it, breaking up the story, if that's all you wanted to do. Just got done with an exciting story step, and the NPCs tell you to meet them somewhere else? Great--oh, whoops, can't do it, you need another two levels before you can not feel underpowered and die to every other enemy. Go do stuff before you can get back on track to the story.

Isn't that what you're railing against? How was that better? In the new system, the ten-level gap between chapters makes sense for the story: your character explicitly gets time off from the last chapter, and they learn to hone their skills and explore the land before they're called back to the fight. And, frankly, that gap is so easy to close because leveling is so NOT a grind that it almost doesn't matter.Or, put a different way, what would you do differently? You've said that there should be limits the player themselves discover...how's that not a "grind"? Once the player discovers those limits, now they're "forced" to go get better gear/level up until they can push past that limit. That's not a grind, according to you? What the heck IS a grind, in your opinion??

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@"Batel.9206" said:I fail to see how the old system was better. Explain it to me, please? The way I see it now is that you're free to do absolutely anything you want to do in order to level. Hearts, events, exploring, gathering, crafting, etc. While that was still true before the NPE, of course, it seems to me you were FORCED to do it, breaking up the story, if that's all you wanted to do. Just got done with an exciting story step, and the NPCs tell you to meet them somewhere else? Great--oh, whoops, can't do it, you need another two levels before you can not feel underpowered and die to every other enemy. Go do stuff before you can get back on track to the story.

Isn't that what you're railing against? How was that better? In the new system, the ten-level gap between chapters makes sense for the story: your character explicitly gets time off from the last chapter, and they learn to hone their skills and explore the land before they're called back to the fight. And, frankly, that gap is so easy to close because leveling is so NOT a grind that it almost doesn't matter.Or, put a different way, what would you do differently? You've said that there should be limits the player themselves discover...how's that not a "grind"? Once the player discovers those limits, now they're "forced" to go get better gear/level up until they can push past that limit. That's not a grind, according to you? What the heck IS a grind, in your opinion??

Honestly, I have no idea what should be done with the issues with the starter area.

All I know is, the game development company that has built the amazing elite specialisation system, the smooth mount system & release regular content in a living world - can do a lot better than just putting a level restriction in place and calling it "New Player Experience."

aNet, if they thought about it - would be able to design & develop something that does not restrict players from trying higher level story missions while encouraging them to explore.

Initially, the game was already geared towards exploring just out of natural curiosity. But anything could have been put in place - advanced (or specific per meta event) loot reward systems for large scale events rather than static, generic loots for example.

There is a whole host of idea's that could have and should have been explored before gating the personal story.

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People often complain about players (especially new ones) not knowing the mechanics of the game or their class, more often in end-game content. Some of these new players insta-level to 80 and then don't know how things work. The personal story, which can be argued gates progression, is the method by which the game teaches the players how to play the game. This, I believe, is Anet's design choice that far too many players choose to skip.

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I might have missed it but I do not see comment on the effect of mounts here. Once you have a level 80 character with mount(s), leveling with other characters becomes much easier, because of the mounts. I don't think they had a choice in using level restrictions in the Personal Story when mounts were added. If you start a new toon and just plop it on a roller beetle and stay on the main roads, nothing hits you and experience increases rapidly as you fly past poi's and waypoints and an occasional vista. I don't even consider needing to level up a character, it goes so quickly. Just stay in maps close to your current level.With this in mind it shouldn't be hard to see why the Story has level restrictions and needs them.

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@"Batel.9206" said:I fail to see how the old system was better. Explain it to me, please? The way I see it now is that you're free to do absolutely anything you want to do in order to level. Hearts, events, exploring, gathering, crafting, etc. While that was still true before the NPE, of course, it seems to me you were FORCED to do it, breaking up the story, if that's all you wanted to do. Just got done with an exciting story step, and the NPCs tell you to meet them somewhere else? Great--oh, whoops, can't do it, you need another two levels before you can not feel underpowered and die to every other enemy. Go do stuff before you can get back on track to the story.

Isn't that what you're railing against? How was that better? In the new system, the ten-level gap between chapters makes sense for the story: your character explicitly gets time off from the last chapter, and they learn to hone their skills and explore the land before they're called back to the fight. And, frankly, that gap is so easy to close because leveling is so NOT a grind that it almost doesn't matter.Or, put a different way, what would you do differently? You've said that there should be limits the player themselves discover...how's
that
not a "grind"? Once the player discovers those limits, now they're "forced" to go get better gear/level up until they can push past that limit. That's not a grind, according to you? What the heck IS a grind, in your opinion??

Honestly, I have no idea what should be done with the issues with the starter area.

All I know is, the game development company that has built the amazing elite specialisation system, the smooth mount system & release regular content in a living world - can do a lot better than just putting a level restriction in place and calling it "New Player Experience."

aNet, if they thought about it - would be able to design & develop something that does not restrict players from trying higher level story missions while encouraging them to explore.

Initially, the game was already geared towards exploring just out of natural curiosity. But anything could have been put in place - advanced (or specific per meta event) loot reward systems for large scale events rather than static, generic loots for example.

There is a whole host of idea's that could have and should have been explored before gating the personal story.

You always needed to level. In the original release, you could (and I often did) do story steps some levels above your own. Fun. And then you finished that step and good golly, the next step was higher level still, way above your then current abilities. So into the open world you went, to level. Or maybe craft and gather, which you claim to never have done. Pays huge xp dividends. The only significant change they made is that they formalized how the levelling process relates to the personal story. Big deal.

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@"Batel.9206" said:Isn't that what you're railing against? How was that better? In the new system, the ten-level gap between chapters makes sense for the story: your character explicitly gets time off from the last chapter, and they learn to hone their skills and explore the land before they're called back to the fight. And, frankly, that gap is so easy to close because leveling is so NOT a grind that it almost doesn't matter.

yeah like i said in my first reply to this thread, the grind in gw2, for me, is non-existent. especially for that low level range, where you could close that 10 level story gap (in my experience) so fast in about an hour (with mounts) or about 1.5 hours on the average (without mounts) and this is just taking it slow and chill.

i play grindier games (older mmorpgs), ragnarok online for example, on the official servers, if you are a completely new player, with no knowledge it's not uncommon to take a lot of hours to get from level 1 to level 15, including changing your class. and this game doesn't force anything upon you, with most if not all content (save for instanced dungeons) having no level requirement..... - at higher levels if you don't level at the recommended spots or with a group on high level dungeons, going off the beaten path at level 170+, an hour of work equates to only about less than 5% of exp and that's if you go to areas meant for your level... and if you die you lose 1% of exp (at any level). now that's grinding and not even the stressful hard kind of grinding at that.

the "grind" in gw2 is laughable.

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@Yggranya.5201 said:

@"lokh.2695" said:It's called the "New Player Experience" and it's a terrible experience for new players. GG ANet.

I had fun when i started. Exploring, doing hearts and events. Of couse, now that i have done them a hunderd times, it is pretty dull leveling a new character.What is bad about the "New Player Experience"?

After they introduced the new player experience I found it t be very counter intuitive that I had to rech a certain level to proceed in the story, not that I had to get some levels to be on par with the instance's level, but for the instance to even be playable for me.

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I was browsing through this series of posts again and saw it mentioned, somewhere, that the OP enjoyed the Yak escort his/her first time but now does not.

This sums it up exactly, as to why the complaints about Queensdale. A new player will enjoy the map. I certainly did, my friends do. I enjoyed all the maps my first time through. Yes, even Orr. Okay maybe not Tangled Depths, which now is one of my favorites, but the point is when you, personally, repeat something an insane number of times, OF COURSE it is a grind. OP says three months in Queensdale?! Do they never help folks after that map?! I'd say that is one of the few maps where new players do NOT need assistance.

That also may be the reason folks stop logging in, in that guild. Guild leader only helps in Queensdale because that's where he's recruiting. Because, it takes time to recruit 600 folks. Far more time than it does to rp walk the quests in Queensdale. Getting to level 10 in QD takes very little time.

Also the OP repeatedly states that there wasn't a level requirement in the game as released, while others have repeatedly said there was. In addition, OP keeps bringing in GW, which is a different game entirely, and would be like me yelling that one of the Final Fantasy games was vastly different from another. Or oh, oh, I have it. SWTOR is doing things differently from the previous!! (I do hear folks there compare the two, I never played the one that got shut down, but some folks really really really really loved it). They are two different games.

They have also not ever stated a solution. Allowing a level 2 character access to the story would, without assistance, probably end up in repeat deaths. How would THAT be a good idea? Obviously if the OP intends to shepherd a level 2 through it, they will live, but what kind of experience is that? I HATE being carried, personally. Couple friends in FFXIV were like, "let me just run you through", when I would hit a dungeon duty for my story, but once I realized this meant they would run through while I got one shot when hit, I was like, nope, thanks, I'll wait the ten minutes in queue.

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I have yet to find a game where the levelling process is as easy as GW2. I mean, you get experience for putting one foot in front of another. Nevermind all the levelling boosters you can get.

And again, the use of 'grind' as a pejorative euphemism for just playing the game.

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@ConorT.5396 said:

@ConorT.5396 said:So, I have not naturally levelled a character in over 7 years.

I started a play-through with my friend today, starting from scratch - both on Paid accounts & it appears we are forced to grind to the "recommended level" to continue the personal story?

@"Mil.3562" said:You call that grinding? Wait till you try to get the mount Skyscale.

i know it's very subjective and depends on the player's perspective but having played older mmorpgs before (the grindy ones like Tibia and Ragnarok Online), i found the grind in GW2 almost non-existent. maybe my tolerance for "grinding" in games is so high that it doesn't even bother me the slightest. -and- i still play those grindy mmorpgs still.

that said, OP, it doesn't take long to get up to the level requirement for each part of the personal story if you plan a route for zone/map completion (which doesn't take long to 100% a zone, if you do things efficiently, while tagging and getting gold on events you happen to pass by)

I understand that, but what I am trying to get across here is that, ever since GW1 was released - the game has NEVER BEEN ABOUT GRINDING.

And neither has GW2. I'm not even sure what these 'repeatable' quests you are referring to you have to grind to level ... I never did that EVER. IN fact, getting level 80 ONLY doing core maps and completion is actually pretty easy ... so whatever YOU are doing to level that you call grinding, the game isn't making you do that.

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