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Lore question about Magic and Bloodstones

Does everyone, who uses magic draw it from the bloodstones? like, do humans, asura, charr, and the rest of the races all tap into it? didn't the six Gods create the bloodstones so that humans can use magic? and if they don't how does everyone use magic?

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  • Stephen.6312Stephen.6312 Member ✭✭✭

    @Jaccobattack.9623 said:
    Does everyone, who uses magic draw it from the bloodstones? like, do humans, asura, charr, and the rest of the races all tap into it? didn't the six Gods create the bloodstones so that humans can use magic? and if they don't how does everyone use magic?

    Hi Jacobattack,
    You've asked a very good question. I presume (correct me if I'm wrong) that you're thinking of magic as a resource, as opposed to a range of spells? If so, would it be fair to say that your question is akin to the following: Where does magic ultimately come from?

    It is true that magic can be stored in artifacts such as the bloodstones. Hence, stating that magic comes from the bloodstone (or any other containment vessel) isn't incorrect. However, the destruction of the Maguuma Bloodstone indicates that the bloodstone isn't the true source of magic. Think of it more like a capacitor within an electrical circuit.

    It's more likely that magic comes from dragons, especially Elder Dragons. I think that it is a byproduct of their metabolic processes. In it's purest form, magic is toxic to mortals and it is only after this magic has been filtered by dragons that spellcasters can safely use it. Evenso, the process of corruption may reflect the fact that refined magic, freshly metabolised by an Elder Dragon(s), is still harmful to mortals.

    Now, my personal feeling about the true source of magic is that it comes from the Rift, a fixed point within the Multiverse. This place, as I perceive it, is a massive leyline intersection to which magic returns for cleansing and renewal, and from which magic flows. The Elder Dragons are living embodiments of this mysterious place.

    Think of each Elder Dragon as a symbol of the nature of Tyria's relationship with the Rift. Their physical manifestation upon the magical confines of Tyria indicates that magic itself is in need of a shakeup.

    I hope that this helps a little.

    Want to delve into some theories about the lore and story of GW2? Check these posts out: The Search For Answers P1 and The Search For Answers P2.

  • @Stephen.6312
    Ah thank you soo much for clearing this up I think I understand now.

  • Ronan.9518Ronan.9518 Member ✭✭✭

    I'll just leave this to links from the wiki here.

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magic
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bloodstone

    From quickly reading through them I think they don't answer everything put at least a part.

  • @Jaccobattack.9623 said:
    Does everyone, who uses magic draw it from the bloodstones? like, do humans, asura, charr, and the rest of the races all tap into it? didn't the six Gods create the bloodstones so that humans can use magic? and if they don't how does everyone use magic?

    So the first thing to cover would be the bold question. This was how it got presented in GW1, but GW2 - particularly The Ruined City of Arah explorable dungeon (Seer path) retconned this. Magic was always around in the world, the Bloodstones wasn't created by the Six Gods either, but by the Seers long before the Six Gods' 'gift of magic'. The gift of magic was Abaddon unleashing magic from the original bloodstone so that the masses could use magic, as you see the ambient magic in the world was too low back before the Exodus.

    People in Tyria can use magic from the ambient magic in the world - where there is more ambient magic, namely around ley lines, magical use will be more common. Using magic is ultimately a taught thing, but with high enough ambient magic, it can be instinctual as well (e.g., accidentally casting a spell with no training when your life is in danger). In theory, everyone can use magic - so long as there is enough ambient magical energy around.

    And thus we bring in the Elder Dragons, who consume magic. They rise when there's a high amount of ambient magic energy in the world and seek to consume it regardless of the source (ley line, artifacts, living beings, etc.); when the world is too low on magic to sustain them, then they go back to sleep. This is why the world had a small amount of ambient magical energy when the Six Gods were frolicking about and messing with the Bloodstone (which the Seers made the original of in the previous dragonrise to starve out the Elder Dragons, sucking in the unconsumed ambient magic they could get), and in turn is why humans believed that the gods created magic - before they unleashed magic from the Bloodstone, there wasn't enough magical energy in the world (or more accurately, at key places of civilization) for casting spells.

    And since Elder Dragons leak magic while they sleep (which they later consume while awake - it's a closed system by all indication), civilizations were built upon their sleeping bodies due to the high levels of ambient magic, and those cities (Arah, Central Transfer Chamber, krait, charr shaman society) were the most magically potent.

    Now it should be noted that the restrictions of the Bloodstones dividing magical schools was an actual thing, but even by the time of GW1, so much time had passed and so much ambient magic entered the world from the Elder Dragons that the limitations were becoming a thing of the past - hence why secondary professions, and swapping professions (both secondary for player, and primary for NPCs), could become a thing.

    So to answer your questions in order:

    • No, but they could, and doing so would give them a significant power boost especially if directly (as covered with Season 3).
    • The asura never needed to, because they were near Primordus - presumably same for charr with Kralkatorrik. We don't know how other races were with magic before GW1's time, and as mentioned via GW2-retcon the ambient magical energy was high enough that tapping into the distant Bloodstones wasn't necessary anymore.
    • The Six Gods split the Bloodstone so that species (not just humans but primarily focused on humans) couldn't use too crazy magic willynilly. The massive surge of power among everyone was causing wars and strife - no doubt included lower classes revolting and whatnot now that they had the power to do so, cities deciding to deny King Doric allegiance, etc. etc. The ability to use magic would be there regardless because they couldn't remove all of the magic that Abaddon had unleashed - only enough to help quell the strife.
    • Per above, people have learned to channel magic from ambient pools of magic in the world - the biggest concentrations being ley lines and their hubs. In terms of times past, the asura and humans are the only species confirmed to be magic users during the Exodus period.

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  • @Konig Des Todes.2086

    So, if I understand you correctly:

    Abaddon's gift of magic to the world in 1BE and the subsequent sealing of said magic by the Five into the Bloodstone is effectively null and void due to the Arah story? I have yet to play any of the explorable Arah paths (never enjoyed dungeons much) so if this is now the new story, that makes me sad.

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  • @Donutdude.9582 said:
    @Konig Des Todes.2086

    So, if I understand you correctly:

    Abaddon's gift of magic to the world in 1BE and the subsequent sealing of said magic by the Five into the Bloodstone is effectively null and void due to the Arah story? I have yet to play any of the explorable Arah paths (never enjoyed dungeons much) so if this is now the new story, that makes me sad.

    Sources:

    Not null and void, no.

    The best shorthand source for GW2's take on Abaddon's gift of magic is: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bloodstones_(book)

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Quiz_Terminal and https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Orrian_History_Scrolls also have some lore that "updates" gw1 god lore.

    The longhand version is:

    Because of the Elder Dragons' ravages and the Seers making the Bloodstone, the world was almost entirely without magic. This meant that no one outside those camping right outside of sleeping Elder Dragons (e.g., Arah and the Central Transfer Chamber) could use magic. Abaddon's "gift of magic" was unleashing some magic from the original Bloodstone at specific places - granting different groups different kinds of magic.

    Abaddon still added magic to the world, and still made it so humans could use magic - so it was all very much important - but because of the nature of the Elder Dragons, magic would have seeped into the world regardless. Abaddon basically jumpstarted the process by a few centuries, and this resulted in the strife and wars that sparked because of all that magic at once. In theory, a gradual increase of being able to use magic would have been safer and less war-inducing.

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  • Okay, I think I fully understand but one last question. why did Abaddon do it, was his intent evil? or did he just want to give a gift to humanity and the other gods didn't agree.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 10, 2020

    @Jaccobattack.9623 said:
    Okay, I think I fully understand but one last question. why did Abaddon do it, was his intent evil? or did he just want to give a gift to humanity and the other gods didn't agree.

    Oh, all the gods agreed to grant magic. Abaddon was chosen to do the task among the gods, but it was an agreement made. However, Abaddon gifted magic a bit too freely, and that resulted in unforeseen strife. Said strife led for the human king of Central Tyria, King Doric, to plead to the gods to rescind the gift, and they decided to do so. Abaddon disagreed with this choice to rescind the gift, though. But it wasn't until the Margonites - a nation of sea-faring humans who revered Abaddon as their patron god - were hunted down in large numbers by the Forgotten for defacing the statues of the other five gods at the Temple of the Six Gods that Abaddon "turned evil" (read: decided to wage war on the other five gods).

    In GW2, particularly at The Vizier's Tower, Abaddon is depicted as a "god of magic" with a saying tied to his teachings: Act with magic, act within reason, act without mercy.

    We don't know for certain what Abaddon's intentions were for gifting magic so freely or disagreeing with rescinding the gift despite the wars and conflict caused by it, but it does seem that he highly favored the spread of magic, and was always a stern god.

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    All these squares make a circle.

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 11, 2020

    @Jaccobattack.9623 said:
    Does everyone, who uses magic draw it from the bloodstones? like, do humans, asura, charr, and the rest of the races all tap into it? didn't the six Gods create the bloodstones so that humans can use magic? and if they don't how does everyone use magic?

    Magic is a closed system within Tyria, and is present in the Mists too. Its unknown if it occurs on any world except Tyria, as the only other worlds we've seen are other copies (or potentialities) of Tyria in Fractals, WvW and some Personal Story (e.g Infinity Ball). Its worth nothing that the Human Gods brought Humans from another world and if I remember correctly, it was kind of hard for them to find a suitable world so Tyria and the Human homeworld might be exceptions amoung the stars, with very strong connections to the Mist and the Rift.

    Elder Dragons soak up magic while awake, consuming it in any way possible, even if it means destroying all life besides their own. When they go to sleep from the magic levels becoming too low, they slowly leak it back out into the world from their bodies. Presumably, every world with magic has its own ED-like cycle, although this isn't yet confirmed.

    Magic exists within all beings in Tyria. Its synonymous with terms like life force, or electricity, depending on how its used. Its not just an energy source, its an essential part of physics in the Tyria multiverse, and those physics seem to break down if its "out of balance".

    The Seers created the original Bloodstone to force the Elder Dragons to sleep early, similar to what Balthazar did to Primordus and Jormag. This was later unleached into the world by the Human Gods, and then placed back in smaller individual Bloodstones because it created alot of problems in the world, and they didn't want anyone to repeat the same mistake again.

    When using magic, its drawn from whatever the closest, most viable source is. Sometimes this is a person's own life energy, other times its a trinket kept on them. It can also be from other magical creatures, such as Elder Dragons and their minions, or directly from the ambient magic in the world, which is normally invisible but becomes visible in very high concentrations, what we call ley lines. It again depends on how its used; for example, the Inquest are known for using the life energy of living beings (and sometimes dragon minions) as their source of magic.

    Its been directly stated that as magic levels in the world drop over time, alot of abilities and technologies based upon magic will cease functioning, although right now we've ironically created the opposite problem.

    Simple answer: The Bloodstones have little if anything to do with magic availability/usage. They just served as a way to put the Elder Dragons to sleep, and later to grant very powerful magic to Humans without having to wait for the ED cycle. They do keep the ambient magic levels lower, though, as shown in Bloodstone Fen when the Maguuma Bloodstone was destroyed.

    Presumably the natural order is for races to gradually get magic over time as the dragons sleep, a slow evolution.

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