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Bring back old sylvari for cantha as sub race.


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@sorudo.9054 said:

@anninke.7469 said:After thinking about this suggestion for a while I deciced I wouldn't want it to happen. And if the original concept should appear in the game, then please make it absolutely unrelated to sylvari we have now, because it looks more like mutated humans than sylvari.

sylvari are already plant humans, this will only allow ppl to make a sylvari with a smooth skin, something i really want since beta.

yeah i just want smooth skin so it looks cuter with armor.

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@lil muffin.1250 said:

@anninke.7469 said:After thinking about this suggestion for a while I deciced I wouldn't want it to happen. And if the original concept should appear in the game, then please make it absolutely unrelated to sylvari we have now, because it looks more like mutated humans than sylvari.

Well. The Druids of cantha were originally people and transformed themselves into what they were in factions.It could be a cool story seeing them become uncorrupted and turn to a softer variation of that.

Sylvari are not corrupted humans (or anything else). They are plant spawns of an already purified dragon (plant) minion. Nothing to "uncorrupt" there.Also - I do like elves and fairy-folks of all kinds. But I strongly dislike the idea of turning the sylvari into one because I like the twiggies even more.

I wasnt referring to the sylvari.I was referring to the wardens in cantha. i accidentally typed druids.I'm not making up lore for them.. just providing a (bad) possible reason for the cute race they originally where to be in the game.

Oh, okay, I misunderstood. The thing is, I'm not against getting the visuals in-game. I just think that if we're talking sub-races, the original sylvari concept seems more suitable for humans and for the real (ehm... :D ) sylvari something else might fit better.

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@lil muffin.1250 said:

@lil muffin.1250 said:Furries are a large popu.ation of people who enjoy playing cute animal like races.

IMO, this is what helps GW2 stand out from the rest of the genre: the decisions to not be like every other MMORPG.

who cares.. what you think the game needs more players.and actually one of the critics this games gets often is it has ugly races.

A lot of people care. And a lot of people play GW2 because it is not your generic fantasy world with generic fantasy races and furry bait.

You just proposed that GW2 become a sellout.

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@"lil muffin.1250" said:Ok. so cantha is coming.I am one of those lame people who really love elves and fae.and the original sylvari concept was so appealing to me.adding new races is really hard to guild wars because it would require another layer of voice acting.BUT if they were just sub races of current ones we wouldnt need that.also i feel like there is some way to do this with the old version of druids in cantha.so this sylvari would still use the voice acting of the first but they would bring a new aesthetic to the game.and this could be expanded to other races as well.

Furry taller asura who left the underground and evolved like savages with beards.charr that are softer and cuter and smallerhumans of utopia with maybe a mechanical twist.NORN who are constantly in the between stages of their chosen spirit of the wild.

kinda like wow did with some of their allied races just being an expansion of the current ones.

also add Largos

  1. What are the "original sylvari"? Basically elves?
  2. There likely are no Sylvari in Cantha. Their birth place where they were nurtured and raised by Ventari is known. Since travel routes to Cantha have been closed for a long time, I don't see how they would have gotten there.
  3. Asura actually were a lot more "furry" than what GW2 makes us think. They had facial (hair) growth in GW1.
  4. Taller Asura? :o Scary idea. Their heads are already five times as big as a human's - I don't want to imagine how monstrous they would look if they were generally taller.
  5. "Cute" Charr? Oh pleeeease. :s
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I'm a bit confused about what's being proposed here. I assume "original sylvari concept" means the original elf-like design, before they were redesigned to look more like plants. But the Wardens from Echovald Forest don't have anything to do with sylvari, and they're nothing like the old elf-like concept either. We don't really know where the Wardens came from, but we do know that they're ancient – whereas sylvari are the newest race in Tyria. I mean, I see that there are visual similarities, but I don't see how they could justify making them a "sub-race" of the sylvari. So perhaps I'm misinterpreting the OP.

@"lil muffin.1250" said:and actually one of the critics this games gets often is it has ugly races.

Interesting, do you have any references? (e.g. reviews where someone said this?) To me, the "ugliness" of the GW2 races is a real strength of their design – many other games seem to go in for races that are essentially just different-coloured humans with some animal features (horns, tails, fur, etc.) tacked on.

@"Ashantara.8731" said:"Cute" Charr? Oh pleeeease. :s

To be honest, even Rox is a bit of a step too far towards "cute" for my taste...

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@"Tommo Chocolate.5870" said:I assume "original sylvari concept" means the original elf-like design, before they were redesigned to look more like plants.

I didn't like their overly cute design, to be honest. Elves are my favorite fantasy race, I don't like when they aren't properly designed.

@"Ashantara.8731" said:"Cute" Charr? Oh pleeeease. :s

To be honest, even Rox is a bit of a step too far towards "cute" for my taste...

She looks downright creepy with those oversized eyes. Ugh.

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Honestly I'm down with the idea of a sub-race/allied race style customization option. Keep the same personal story, body-types and animations, just change some parts of the meshes/textures to give a new feel. Fairly cheap compared to adding a whole new race. (though I would prefer to see tengu first)

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Smaller, cuter charr? Dude, are you freaking insane?? We already have hideous abominations like THIS: https://gw2style.com/look.php?id=6872And that one is MILD compared to the big eyed pink kitty goo-goo I see running around Lion's Arch.If charr were smaller and cuter at baseline, people's "cute" characters would be even more vomit-worthy.

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@"Weindrasi.3805" said:Smaller, cuter charr? Dude, are you freaking insane?? We already have hideous abominations like THIS: https://gw2style.com/look.php?id=6872And that one is MILD compared to the big eyed pink kitty goo-goo I see running around Lion's Arch.If charr were smaller and cuter at baseline, people's "cute" characters would be even more vomit-worthy.

Hey, I represent that fact!I want a Charr, tiny little girl tiger Charr.

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@"Trise.2865" said:Translation: "I would like more cosmetic body, facial, skin, and hair options for my characters."

I agree, I would like that too.

This. We don't need new (sub) races, we just need a ton more cosmetic options for the existing races. Smooth skin Sylvari can be nearly achieved with new skin pattern options.For my part I'd appreciate an actual body weight/proportion slider, but even more body options will suffice in a pinch.And you know... more hair styles, especially for Sylvari. Can we get layers of flowing cascading leaves to mimic "long hair" already? I feel the Sylvari males have a better selection than Sylvari females. There's trying to stand apart from other MMO's, then there's being an amateur about it!

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Agree, kinda. If we get new playable races, I think we're going to get two at release, plus a bonus one as the following LW season's final reward.

  • Tengu are an obvious choice, based on the charr rig. They already got custom animations back in HoT's release.
  • Largos are pretty likely as well, since they have the same exact structure as humans/norn/sylvari, so they would barely take any work at all.
  • The third could be dwarves, but they don't fit the story, and they are far too different from the other races model-wise.

So the obvious answer for the third race is... Sidhe / Wardens. They would be some sort of alternate sylvari, except they would be part-plant part-stone. While the sylvari are childish, the sidhe would be ancient and majestic.

We would recruit them during the LW story after EoD, unlocking them as a playable race.

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@lil muffin.1250

In regards to the beta Sylvari look, this sounds like something that can just be accomplished with new additions to a total makeover kit. Merely add face and hair options that are a bit softer on the plant side of things. Likewise with adding in (if they ever did) more cultural armor, but just some that are more subtle in their details.

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i mean..The big reason I think sub races is the way to go is because of the voice acting.idk if they need to add another full voice actor even tho i'd really love the tengu.but if they can find reason for sub races to give them some distinction for being visually different while still using the main character voices i think thats the cheapest and easiest way to go.

and these are just my ideas for subraces.what are yours?

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@kharmin.7683 said:

@Lonami.2987 said:Agree, kinda. If we get new playable races, I think we're going to get two at release, plus a bonus one as the following LW season's final reward.Wow, that's optimistic for the amount of work that would need to be put in to introduce a new race.

What amount of work? New races will be introduced straight into the new storyline, which means they won't get a new Personal Story, and will be transformed into other races when they replay all previous stories. Also, new races won't be able to use all armor skins and outfits, only those which are easy to adapt. As for the animations, many of the playable race candidates already have quite a few of them.

You're vastly overestimating the amount of work new races would take.

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@Lonami.2987 said:

@Lonami.2987 said:Agree, kinda. If we get new playable races, I think we're going to get two at release, plus a bonus one as the following LW season's final reward.Wow, that's optimistic for the amount of work that would need to be put in to introduce a new race.

What amount of work? New races will be introduced straight into the new storyline, which means they won't get a new Personal Story, and will be transformed into other races when they replay all previous stories. Also, new races won't be able to use all armor skins and outfits, only those which are easy to adapt. As for the animations, many of the playable race candidates already have quite a few of them.

You're vastly overestimating the amount of work new races would take.

I think that you're vastly underestimating what the community wants in a new race. Have you read the previous threads on the topic? Introduce a new race with no personal story and with limited ability to use armor skins and outfits? That, in my opinion, would be a terrible idea.

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@kharmin.7683 said:

@Lonami.2987 said:Agree, kinda. If we get new playable races, I think we're going to get two at release, plus a bonus one as the following LW season's final reward.Wow, that's optimistic for the amount of work that would need to be put in to introduce a new race.

What amount of work? New races will be introduced straight into the new storyline, which means they won't get a new Personal Story, and will be transformed into other races when they replay all previous stories. Also, new races won't be able to use all armor skins and outfits, only those which are easy to adapt. As for the animations, many of the playable race candidates already have quite a few of them.

You're vastly overestimating the amount of work new races would take.

I think that you're vastly underestimating what the community wants in a new race. Have you read the previous threads on the topic? Introduce a new race with no personal story and with limited ability to use armor skins and outfits? That, in my opinion, would be a terrible idea.

So you'd rather have no new playable races at all? Now that's a terrible idea.

ArenaNet won't waste a single penny updating old (and mostly bad) content that 99% of the players don't care about anymore. It doesn't make any sense from a business+development perspective.

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@Lonami.2987 said:

@Lonami.2987 said:Agree, kinda. If we get new playable races, I think we're going to get two at release, plus a bonus one as the following LW season's final reward.Wow, that's optimistic for the amount of work that would need to be put in to introduce a new race.

What amount of work? New races will be introduced straight into the new storyline, which means they won't get a new Personal Story, and will be transformed into other races when they replay all previous stories. Also, new races won't be able to use all armor skins and outfits, only those which are easy to adapt. As for the animations, many of the playable race candidates already have quite a few of them.

You're vastly overestimating the amount of work new races would take.

I think that you're vastly underestimating what the community wants in a new race. Have you read the previous threads on the topic? Introduce a new race with no personal story and with limited ability to use armor skins and outfits? That, in my opinion, would be a terrible idea.

So you'd rather have no new playable races at all? Now that's a terrible idea.Where did I say that? No, I just thought that your post about adding three additional races was very optimistic.ArenaNet won't waste a single penny updating old (and mostly bad) content that 99% of the players don't care about anymore. It doesn't make any sense from a business+development perspective.Hyperbolic arguments will get you nowhere. 99%? Really?
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@"Lonami.2987" said:So you'd rather have no new playable races at all? Now that's a terrible idea.

part of the "problem" is the way Guild Wars 2 introduced it's playable races.

for each playable race (norn/sylvari/asura/human/charr) you have:⇒ a starter city -- complete with NPCs, voiced, and idle chatter along with story/lore related dialogue⇒ starter zone + 2~4 zones linked to it⇒ extended backstory lore+ personal story sets at level 10 & 20 (3 variants for each set) + tutorial mission⇒ cultural armour (3 tiers and 3 armour weights per tier)⇒ male+female voice acting (for personal story levels 10~20 * 3 variants, personal story level 30~80, all seasons, HoT~PoF~Icebrood Saga)⇒ male+female voice acting (for profession specific call outs, rare item finds, merchant/vendor/npcs goodbye phrase, etc. etc.)⇒ a destiny's edge member (though this is optional but all 5 original-playable races are tied to the personal story because of destiny's edge)

--- and a few more i might've missed or forgotten ---so if you skimp on one of these for the new race, we'd inevitably get one-two-few-many threads complaining about: "this new favourite race of mine is being shortchanged! why don't we have the stuff norn/asura/human/charr/sylvari have??? why ANET why? why even make a new race if it's not complete!" 


 meanwhile look at Final Fantasy 14

they way they setup their playable races:

⇒ choose your sub-race (ie. Hyur Midlander or Highlander)⇒ choose your in-game birthday⇒ choose your starter city⇒ each race has racial armour but only 1 set and you start with it equipped (as far as i remember)

--- all races in that game can start in any of the available starting cities + starter zones, they have no race-specific personal story (the MSQ is the same for everyone and only differs based on which starting city you chose), they have no voice acting at all outside of grunts, shouts, emotes and reactionary movements (your character basically doesnt speak for the whole game), they nothing that makes a race unique or tied to the game's MSQ (main scenario quest) in a special way → everyone is just the "Warrior of Light" / "Hikari no Senshi" --- 


 see how easy it is to add a new race to another mmorpg that set itself up to make races easily added? now is FF14's way better? not really .. then is GW2's way better? also not.

on one hand you have a game with a lore-rich playable race that you can easily attach to and immerse yourself into for RP, on the other hand you have a game where it's really easy to just add another flavour to your roster of playable races without the complexity/work_required/etc. associated with the aforementioned. both games can be lore rich it's just the manner of how it's made/presented/etc. and for GW2, it's going to be a lot of work to add another race -- if they want to do it while pleasing all fans --

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@Asturias.1064 said:New races could start at Lion's Arch.

not viable because gendarran fields, lornar's pass and bloodtide coast which are directly linked to it are level 25~ and level 45~ zones a level 2 character straight out of tutorial would get one shotted (or two shotted) by anything -- and assuming they only have the new expansion (EoD without PoF and HoT) they wont have mounts either to help soak up damage.... soo yeah bad idea to throw newly created characters of any race to lion's arch.

(you can go there already at level 2 if you're not free to play but not for story because it's not a level 1~15 zone)

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@Asturias.1064 said:New races could start at Lion's Arch.And miss out on all of this?@Astyrah.4015 said:

@"Lonami.2987" said:So you'd rather have no new playable races at all? Now that's a terrible idea.

part of the "
problem
" is the way Guild Wars 2 introduced it's playable races.

for each playable race (norn/sylvari/asura/human/charr) you have:⇒ a starter city -- complete with NPCs, voiced, and idle chatter along with story/lore related dialogue⇒ starter zone + 2~4 zones linked to it⇒ extended backstory lore+ personal story sets at level 10 & 20 (3 variants for each set) + tutorial mission⇒ cultural armour (3 tiers and 3 armour weights per tier)⇒ male+female voice acting (for personal story levels 10~20 * 3 variants, personal story level 30~80, all seasons, HoT~PoF~Icebrood Saga)⇒ male+female voice acting (for profession specific call outs, rare item finds, merchant/vendor/npcs goodbye phrase, etc. etc.)⇒ a destiny's edge member (though this is optional but all 5 original-playable races are tied to the personal story because of destiny's edge)

--- and a few more i might've missed or forgotten ---so if you skimp on one of these for the new race, we'd inevitably get one-two-few-many threads complaining about:
"this new favourite race of mine is being shortchanged! why don't we have the stuff norn/asura/human/charr/sylvari have??? why ANET why? why even make a new race if it's not complete!"
 

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