Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Invisibility has Gotten out of Hand


Vlad Morbius.1759

Recommended Posts

@KeyOrion.9506 said:

@"saerni.2584" said:So you know where they are. Sniff to confirm they are there. Then toss a target painter and camp the spot to force them off and into the Marked section of the keep.

Also, Marked is a significant debuff because it forces the thief to burn cooldowns. If anyone is chasing a thief around it also reduces the initiative the thief has to gain stealth.

But none of this matters because spending 20 minutes hiding in a keep is usually a waste of time. If a Zerg can avoid being scouted to show up at a keep and then get ported inside that is a massive failure on the part of the defending team. Meanwhile that thief has to actively work to maintain stealth for an extended period on the off chance that the aforesaid Zerg will manage that, or even care enough to try. Most of the time that Zerg sneaking to the keep will be able to put down three or four catas and open it up pretty fast. That’s usually how keeps get flipped unless you are talking about a havoc group of five players stealth capping, which is entirely easy to defend against (and delay long enough for more defenders to show up).

Sniff against a STEALTHED opponant. mmmhmmm... As for the teams doing a "mesmer/thief sweep"....according to the commanders, "who cares". When your team no longer cares, that's left up to the solo artists, and they get frustrated to all hell trying to run down an individual without teammate support. I will agree, any time that gets the "I don't care" attitude of sweeps should lose that location. Even if it's my own team, I tell my fellow mates, "you didn't care enough to sweep, this is the consequance."

It still dings even when the enemy is stealthed FYI.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No it doesn't. And before you go of on a tangent saying yes it does....i've already had it tested by other players from guildmates, friends, and a few strangers. It does not. So stop argueing it does. Whether that is a BUG or a GLITCH, i don't care, or a nerf/change, i just DO not care to argue that you THINK it does. It does not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@DemonSeed.3528 said:It does an auditory ding but doesn't ping location on minimap. I have used this many times. When you use it and no enemies are within its radius whether they are visible/stealthed, it will not do an auditory ding.

@KeyOrion.9506 It does. As pointed out here. And how is responding directly to you “going off on a tangent?” It’s pretty much a direct refutation, based on actual experience with the mechanic. Your assertion of “I tested this so and it doesn’t” is either untrue or based on a minunderstanding on your part.

To clarify, the audio for detection plays even if the thief isn’t visible. If the auto-marked debuff is active then there are only a few spots where they can be hiding. It can help you figure out if the keep is clear or not (especially when it isn’t a fresh keep and won’t have the auto-marking effect active).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:6 sec non stack able stealth but replenisheable would be reasonable since the thief can re apply but not stack. Be a nerf but still serviceable by the thieves. That said any major changes to stealth this many yrs into the game are very unlikely

Since Guild Wars 2 beta; Thief Profession players gave countless, endless positive constructive suggestions, ideas and healthy advices to improve a near-healthy competitive experience for Thief Profession

What did Anet do? Ignore them.

Countless of Thief Nerf Wish lists and Thief Balance Suggestions Threads by Thief Profession players follow suit. What did Anet do in return?Threw all of them in the trash, setting a clear stage for creating a Toxic experience and a hostile environment for Thief Profession Players with the gaming community

As i said throughout the years; since the beginning; if Anet wanted to create a healthy competitive experience and a healthy environment for Thief Professions player...they would. They won't because, why not? we need 'A Bad Guy Profession'

It is like intentionally creating a 'Bad Guy Profession' to be used to control the gaming community...'to keep it in check' and for financial revenue.....why not? players will play will want to play 'The Bad Guy Profession' to feel like a Villain in increasing its Toxic influences with having Toxic Broken Bad Design Mechanics to cause strife to all Profession alike including new players and hope that they in return will chose to play 'The Bad Guy Profession' in hope of spending money in it to maximize its Destructive 'cool factor'...resulting in financial sale increase

I will continue to Sympathize with the community and Thief Profession players but the one who is solely responsible for the Toxic instability with Thief Profession Players with the gaming community is Anet

-They have the Power To Change or Continue To Rejoice Toxicity Doing Their Bidding-

-Creating The Bad Guy Profession vs The Hero Profession/s is Guild Wars 2 Philosophy and it worked-

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Burnfall.9573"

I believe its more like... if they touch stealth code it m8 bork and they m8 have to take the game to a previous version >_> cause spagethi code to make at least stealth somehat playable will break the game.... stealth to "try" to render in time and reduce delay on enemy client must be like the spagethi monster it even m8 be optimazed on within the netcode.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Burnfall.9573 said:

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:6 sec non stack able stealth but replenisheable would be reasonable since the thief can re apply but not stack. Be a nerf but still serviceable by the thieves. That said any major changes to stealth this many yrs into the game are very unlikely

Since Guild Wars 2 beta; Thief Profession players gave countless, endless positive constructive suggestions, ideas and healthy advices to improve a near-healthy competitive experience for Thief Profession

What did Anet do? Ignore them.

Countless of Thief Nerf Wish lists and Thief Balance Suggestions Threads by Thief Profession players follow suit. What did Anet do in return?Threw all of them in the trash, setting a clear stage for creating a Toxic experience and a hostile environment for Thief Profession Players with the gaming community

As i said throughout the years; since the beginning; if Anet wanted to create a healthy competitive experience and a healthy environment for Thief Professions player...they would. They won't because, why not? we need 'A Bad Guy Profession'

It is like intentionally creating a 'Bad Guy Profession' to be used to control the gaming community...'to keep it in check' and for financial revenue.....why not? players will play will want to play 'The Bad Guy Profession' to feel like a Villain in increasing its Toxic influences with having Toxic Broken Bad Design Mechanics to cause strife to all Profession alike including new players and hope that they in return will chose to play 'The Bad Guy Profession' in hope of spending money in it to maximize its Destructive 'cool factor'...resulting in financial sale increase

I will continue to Sympathize with the community and Thief Profession players but the one who is solely responsible for the Toxic instability with Thief Profession Players with the gaming community is Anet

-They have the Power To Change or Continue To Rejoice Toxicity Doing Their Bidding-

-Creating The Bad Guy Profession vs The Hero Profession/s is Guild Wars 2 Philosophy and it worked-

All that has to happen in the game is to regulate Stealth Attack window. You're trying too hard to make it sound like you're fighting the good fight when pretty much every thief on these forums has had to correct you at some point. If you're going to be that emotional and make your posts that long at least give some details, unless you just don't know what you're talking about.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every single MMORPG has a stealth mechanic and/or a stealth based class,but only in GW2 it is this broken:

1) WoW :

  • u cannot stack stealth time by recast
  • there is a cd on use
  • anybody has a chance to detect an enemy in stealth mode (depending on distance & view angle)
  • cannot re-stealth in combat unless using specific skills

2) Archage: (and this game has a HUGE p2w problem)

  • available to everyone (just need to pick the talent)
  • any actions other than moving will cause stealth to end
  • decreases Move Speed -30%
  • chance to detect an enemy in stealth mode based on proximity in frontal(long range detection),lateral(medium range detection) and rear (close range detection) view

Number one is the "KING" of the industry the unkillable western bluprint for moneymaking,the evergreen WoWNumber two is that one f2p-ish eastern "sandbox-at-the-beginning" MMORPG launched as of right now several times with different payment methods.And ofc there are many other games with stealth mechanics,i just wanted to pick 2 titles at the opposite side on the industry.

What im trying to say is, it is not something new.So the moment u plan to have ANY sort of PVP you shuld be looking at ways to make a mechanic balanced before even PUSHING for COMPETITIVE MLG pvp for YEARS (failing at it,none the less).

I only listed 4 major points describing the 2 stealth mechanics built in 2 kinda of popular games.But each point has a HUGE impact on it.And i find it funny that the most FAIR stealth mechanic can actually be found in that mess of Archage instead of,i dont know, GW2!?!

While in MOST games the biggest benefit you get from stealth is a "tactical one " (opening on someone when you want) in GW2 u can even miss your actual opener and still stay stealthed.So u can actually make a bad decision but since u stacked your invis to 40 seconds and noone is aware of you u can reset,wait for cds and redo.Plus ALL the other things u can do with it.

I dont want to be a jerk,but when in a game fast-paced like this u can play a class as a clicker in a PVP mode...m8 no.JUST NO

We can talk about reveal (and the DE counter),we can talk about stationary sentries (and the range) or what? anti-stealth traps?! yea sure.

These solutions dont work,most of the time.

Lets make it so:

  • u can stack invisibility all you want( untill a reasonable max) but then you also get a proportional cd on stealth.(you stack 20 seconds you get no stealth for 20 seconds)
  • you reveal yourself when you USE an attack

In this way you can still initiate whenever u want,u can stay in stealth how long you want but there is a trade off

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A clicker with slow as hell reaction times on top. 0 stun breaks. You'd get eaten alive against any normal roamer. Others can see your motions of laying traps under you. If they had any brain, they would just wait you out away from them, and you'd be toast. Because again, clicker, slow reaction times, and 0 stun breaks, 0 shadowstep. Only rifle4 for condi removal and your HiS.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"ilMasa.2546" said:I dont want to be a jerk,but when in a game fast-paced like this u can play a class as a clicker in a PVP mode...m8 no.JUST NO

Three things here:

  1. You could make a similar video with any class that has a big fat block. I remember a pretty funny one where a condi mesmer just stands in place slowly clicking skills (for dramatic effect) while a thief goes ham on him and accomplishes nothing.

  2. This is from before the damage nerf. Huge changes to viability of burst builds and a big shake-up to the meta in general.

  3. The Preparation gimmick he's trying to do isn't really working very well for him at all.

@"ilMasa.2546" said:We can talk about reveal (and the DE counter),we can talk about stationary sentries (and the range) or what? anti-stealth traps?! yea sure.

These solutions dont work,most of the time.

The counter to thieves isn't Revealed, it's burst mitigation, hard CC, and good sustain. A very powerful counter to Rifle Deadeye is reflect. Think of Revealed like Unblockable -- it's a helpful ability that sometimes lets you catch enemies with their pants down, but it doesn't completely negate the opponent's build (because, e.g., they've still got access to Protection and Invuln instead). The difference is that the WvW map isn't covered with Sentries and Towers that are constantly putting "Can't Block" on you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@kash.9213 said:Why not just limit Stealth Attack window instead of making a mess like that?Stealth attacks aren't the issue. The issue is thief literally has so many on command stealth abilities and that stealth is the best defensive (and offensive if you're a condi build) tool in the game with no real counter play.

Stealth is the
worst
defensive tool. Block, Evade, Invuln are all
far
better. Hell its so bad at it Im not even sure stealth counts as a defensive tool.

Sure it is. Except you can use it whenever you want and in combination with other skills. If stealth were one skill that lasted 3 seconds, required a channel, and had a 50s cd the way invuln does nobody would have a problem with it! But no. Stealth is an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it. Worst design in the game.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"ilMasa.2546" said:Every single MMORPG has a stealth mechanic and/or a stealth based class,but only in GW2 it is this broken:

1) WoW :

  • u cannot stack stealth time by recast
  • there is a cd on use
  • anybody has a chance to detect an enemy in stealth mode (depending on distance & view angle)
  • cannot re-stealth in combat unless using specific skills

2) Archage: (and this game has a HUGE p2w problem)

  • available to everyone (just need to pick the talent)
  • any actions other than moving will cause stealth to end
  • decreases Move Speed -30%
  • chance to detect an enemy in stealth mode based on proximity in frontal(long range detection),lateral(medium range detection) and rear (close range detection) view

Number one is the "KING" of the industry the unkillable western bluprint for moneymaking,the evergreen WoWNumber two is that one f2p-ish eastern "sandbox-at-the-beginning" MMORPG launched as of right now several times with different payment methods.And ofc there are many other games with stealth mechanics,i just wanted to pick 2 titles at the opposite side on the industry.

What im trying to say is, it is not something new.So the moment u plan to have ANY sort of PVP you shuld be looking at ways to make a mechanic balanced before even PUSHING for COMPETITIVE MLG pvp for YEARS (failing at it,none the less).

I only listed 4 major points describing the 2 stealth mechanics built in 2 kinda of popular games.But each point has a HUGE impact on it.And i find it funny that the most FAIR stealth mechanic can actually be found in that mess of Archage instead of,i dont know, GW2!?!

While in MOST games the biggest benefit you get from stealth is a "tactical one " (opening on someone when you want) in GW2 u can even miss your actual opener and still stay stealthed.So u can actually make a bad decision but since u stacked your invis to 40 seconds and noone is aware of you u can reset,wait for cds and redo.Plus ALL the other things u can do with it.

I dont want to be a jerk,but when in a game fast-paced like this u can play a class as a clicker in a PVP mode...m8 no.JUST NO

We can talk about reveal (and the DE counter),we can talk about stationary sentries (and the range) or what? anti-stealth traps?! yea sure.

These solutions dont work,most of the time.

**Lets make it so:

  • u can stack invisibility all you want( untill a reasonable max) but then you also get a proportional cd on stealth.(you stack 20 seconds you get no stealth for 20 seconds)
  • you reveal yourself when you USE an attack

In this way you can still initiate whenever u want,u can stay in stealth how long you want but there is a trade off**

Put a cap on Stealth Attack duration and maybe some visual+audio indicator of a stealthed player that changes on proximity radius. That's it, all that trash from trash games you posted about isn't needed here, because those are different combat systems. Everything else about stealth is fine and done well in this game especially for how active and engaging it is to use but also for how easy it can be to counter a player in stealth apart from some immediate resetting potential. Stealth play has to be sustained and takes resource or slots shared with damage and control skills.

You're last bit there only really fucks with more balanced stealth builds that you probably wouldn't have a problem with but it still leaves a nice big window for gimmick builds who are likely going to reset the fight during that cooldown.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@kash.9213 said:Why not just limit Stealth Attack window instead of making a mess like that?Stealth attacks aren't the issue. The issue is thief literally has so many on command stealth abilities and that stealth is the best defensive (and offensive if you're a condi build) tool in the game with no real counter play.

Stealth is the
worst
defensive tool. Block, Evade, Invuln are all
far
better. Hell its so bad at it Im not even sure stealth counts as a defensive tool.

Sure it is. Except you can use it whenever you want and in combination with other skills. If stealth were one skill that lasted 3 seconds, required a channel, and had a 50s cd the way invuln does nobody would have a problem with it! But no. Stealth is an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it. Worst design in the game.

I'd take more blocks, evades, and invuln over stealth if I got to keep Initiative. Those would likely be passive secondary mods instead of sharing resource pool and skill slots making every stealth use a balance meter between stealth or damage and control.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Azreell.1568" said:Is there absolutely anything this player base will not complain about???

Stealth is easily countered in group play especially with hammer revs in the current meta on pushes so it's not like everyone doesn't have access to reveals.

Also other classes have access to reveals as well - add into that the Marked debuff.

I mean stealth is very balanced as it stands in group play.

Now, for roaming - which this game mode should never be balanced from sure stealth is an advantage but not overpowered. Some classes are designed with having stealth in mind.

But, lets be frank - dead eye riffle spec would be a free kill without it and is only viable in roaming - so that's it's thing. Its useless pretty much in all other game modes.

Here's what I got out of this post , "Stealth is OP and it makes me tink man. I know itz got dem counters but I have to use my brain. IT SHOULD BE NERFED. LONG LIVE THE OLD SCHOOL HAMMER TRAIN BOYZ".......

No thanx.............

So stealth is busted for roaming with classes designed around it. Answer: redesign?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@kash.9213 said:

@kash.9213 said:Why not just limit Stealth Attack window instead of making a mess like that?Stealth attacks aren't the issue. The issue is thief literally has so many on command stealth abilities and that stealth is the best defensive (and offensive if you're a condi build) tool in the game with no real counter play.

Stealth is the
worst
defensive tool. Block, Evade, Invuln are all
far
better. Hell its so bad at it Im not even sure stealth counts as a defensive tool.

Sure it is. Except you can use it whenever you want and in combination with other skills. If stealth were one skill that lasted 3 seconds, required a channel, and had a 50s cd the way invuln does nobody would have a problem with it! But no. Stealth is an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it. Worst design in the game.

I'd take more blocks, evades, and invuln over stealth if I got to keep Initiative. Those would likely be passive secondary mods instead of sharing resource pool and skill slots making every stealth use a balance meter between stealth or damage and control.

I'd prefer it. This game has good combat feel, but it's ruined by class design that makes it too difficult for people to actually fight each other. Too much mobility, stealth, and CC. I think it would feel better with less auto disengage and more fighting.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@kash.9213 said:Why not just limit Stealth Attack window instead of making a mess like that?Stealth attacks aren't the issue. The issue is thief literally has so many on command stealth abilities and that stealth is the best defensive (and offensive if you're a condi build) tool in the game with no real counter play.

Stealth is the
worst
defensive tool. Block, Evade, Invuln are all
far
better. Hell its so bad at it Im not even sure stealth counts as a defensive tool.

Sure it is. Except you can use it whenever you want and in combination with other skills. If stealth were one skill that lasted 3 seconds, required a channel, and had a 50s cd the way invuln does nobody would have a problem with it! But no. Stealth is an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it. Worst design in the game.

I'd take more blocks, evades, and invuln over stealth if I got to keep Initiative. Those would likely be passive secondary mods instead of sharing resource pool and skill slots making every stealth use a balance meter between stealth or damage and control.

I'd prefer it. This game has good combat feel, but it's ruined by class design that makes it too difficult for people to actually fight each other. Too much mobility, stealth, and CC. I think it would feel better with less auto disengage and more fighting.

I don't think you'd prefer it, there would be less tells and far more aggravating sustain. You don't want to take away something that people have to work for and throw in a bunch of passive mods.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@"kash.9213" said:Why not just limit Stealth Attack window instead of making a mess like that?Stealth attacks aren't the issue. The issue is thief literally has so many on command stealth abilities and that stealth is the best defensive (and offensive if you're a condi build) tool in the game with no real counter play.

Stealth is the
worst
defensive tool. Block, Evade, Invuln are all
far
better. Hell its so bad at it Im not even sure stealth counts as a defensive tool.

Sure it is. Except you can use it whenever you want and in combination with other skills. If stealth were one skill that lasted 3 seconds, required a channel, and had a 50s cd the way invuln does nobody would have a problem with it! But no. Stealth is an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it. Worst design in the game.

"You can use it whenever you want", uh, as opposed to blocks, invulns and evades which ... you also can use whenever you want? Hell, its worse than that, because Evades, Blocks and Invulns tend to activate instantly, whereas stealth does not, and usually has a lengthy cast time. Also, "you can use it in combination with other skills", in that case its those other skills doing all the work, and invisiblity provided next to nothing. Stealth is not "an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it" (quite the opposite, its the only way a thief can get himself killed). Shortbow 5 is that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@"kash.9213" said:Why not just limit Stealth Attack window instead of making a mess like that?Stealth attacks aren't the issue. The issue is thief literally has so many on command stealth abilities and that stealth is the best defensive (and offensive if you're a condi build) tool in the game with no real counter play.

Stealth is the
worst
defensive tool. Block, Evade, Invuln are all
far
better. Hell its so bad at it Im not even sure stealth counts as a defensive tool.

Sure it is. Except you can use it whenever you want and in combination with other skills. If stealth were one skill that lasted 3 seconds, required a channel, and had a 50s cd the way invuln does nobody would have a problem with it! But no. Stealth is an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it. Worst design in the game.

"You can use it whenever you want", uh, as opposed to blocks, invulns and evades which ... you also can use whenever you want? Hell, its worse than that, because Evades, Blocks and Invulns tend to activate instantly, whereas stealth does not, and usually has a lengthy cast time. Also, "you can use it in combination with other skills", in that case its those
other skills
doing all the work, and invisiblity provided next to nothing. Stealth is
not
"an auto disengage with way too few restrictions on it" (quite the opposite, its the only way a thief can get himself killed). Shortbow 5 is that.

Like I said. Too much stealth and mobility. Too few counters and restrictions. A class that is designed to be unhittable and to escape from any fight whenever they want is poor design.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"AliamRationem.5172" said:Like I said. Too much stealth and mobility. Too few counters and restrictions. A class that is designed to be unhittable and to escape from any fight whenever they want is poor design.

As someone who dabbles in Thief myself, I would like to add that the problem isn't only "too much" but also "too often"This is a serious Initiative mechanic problem which needs a balance rework eventually, or Thief is forever going to be the scourge of competitive modes.

Stealth, whenever they want, as much as they need.Immob, whenever they want, as much as they want until resource runs out.Mobility, whenever they want, as much as they need.Damage, whenever they want, as much as they need. (which essentially spits in the face of the 33% Power nerf across the board because they can just make up for reduced damage by simply going at it longer until the target dies, not to mention the oppression mainly comes from Condi builds anyway)

Only thing they don't poop out is Heals after popular heal or regen traits being hammered into the dirt.

Pretty sure every Thief main is gonna hate on me, but I think Ini mechanic needs to have a 1 second global cooldown on all weapon skills.

It's simply too much too often too fast, even if the cost of that is resource downtime, because yu can always put yurself out of the reach of the enemy in 2 utility skills and try again in 10 seconds, while the opponent has like, a 10 - 15 second long cooldown on most of their weapon skills, and their utilities are as long or longer than Thief's.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ASP.8093 said:

@"ilMasa.2546" said:I dont want to be a jerk,but when in a game fast-paced like this u can play a class as a clicker in a PVP mode...m8 no.JUST NO

Three things here:
  1. You could make a similar video with any class that has a big fat block. I remember a pretty funny one where a condi mesmer just stands in place slowly clicking skills (for dramatic effect) while a thief goes ham on him and accomplishes nothing.
  2. This is from before the damage nerf. Huge changes to viability of burst builds and a big shake-up to the meta in general.
  3. The Preparation gimmick he's trying to do isn't really working very well for him at all.

@"ilMasa.2546" said:We can talk about reveal (and the DE counter),we can talk about stationary sentries (and the range) or what? anti-stealth traps?! yea sure.

These solutions dont work,most of the time.

The counter to thieves isn't Revealed, it's burst mitigation, hard CC, and good sustain. A very powerful counter to Rifle Deadeye is reflect. Think of Revealed like Unblockable -- it's a helpful ability that sometimes lets you catch enemies with their pants down, but it doesn't completely negate the opponent's build (because, e.g., they've still got access to Protection and Invuln instead). The difference is that the WvW map isn't covered with Sentries and Towers that are constantly putting "Can't Block" on you.

I do understand that,but the point is an other tho.I cannot spam hard cc,i cannot spam reflects 24/7.What im saying is i pay the price for my decisions,as it is supposed to be.So if i see a thief coming and i manage to dodge or block his opener i shuld get rewarded cos i played it good,right?Like i timed my dodge,i used a counter in the best moment possible and denied his dmg.

In reality it is not the case,cos i lose a dodge and/or i get a big cd on a block.Where is the reward?Did i blocked the dmg? YesSo now i shuld be able to answer him because he should be vulnerable,is this the case?Cause if it is not the case it's going to be just an other reset,after an other.

My CDs cannot be refreshed as much as stealth.You talk about reflect,i have ONE reflect and if i use it ill get a 20 sec cd at best.How long is a reveal cd:15/20 secs or even more?And we are talking about a class that keeps the stealth up even if it attacks the target BUT miss the attack. Where is the trade off?

just like the warrior signet was passively healing for too much,stealth in this game gives too much

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ASP.8093 said:

@"ilMasa.2546" said:I dont want to be a jerk,but when in a game fast-paced like this u can play a class as a clicker in a PVP mode...m8 no.JUST NO

Three things here:
  1. You could make a similar video with any class that has a big fat block. I remember a pretty funny one where a condi mesmer just stands in place slowly clicking skills (for dramatic effect) while a thief goes ham on him and accomplishes nothing.
  2. This is from before the damage nerf. Huge changes to viability of burst builds and a big shake-up to the meta in general.
  3. The Preparation gimmick he's trying to do isn't really working very well for him at all.

@"ilMasa.2546" said:We can talk about reveal (and the DE counter),we can talk about stationary sentries (and the range) or what? anti-stealth traps?! yea sure.

These solutions dont work,most of the time.

The counter to thieves isn't Revealed, it's burst mitigation, hard CC, and good sustain. A very powerful counter to Rifle Deadeye is reflect. Think of Revealed like Unblockable -- it's a helpful ability that sometimes lets you catch enemies with their pants down, but it doesn't completely negate the opponent's build (because, e.g., they've still got access to Protection and Invuln instead). The difference is that the WvW map isn't covered with Sentries and Towers that are constantly putting "Can't Block" on you.

He m8 be reaveaeled, but enemy m8 not see that in time due delay/desync,l lag etc....

its like a "perma quickness" with 40-50+ using superspeed+quickness+alacrity out of a stealth bomb, 1st u die then u see the aoe then the enemy atacks....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@AikijinX.6258 said:The Problem is that Anet gave Stealth access to almost every class, when it was supposed to be unique to Thieves and I suppose Mesmers. Every class has some type of uniqueness to them, while ironically Thieves have had their uniqueness in Stealth stolen as well as heavily neutered, with all these abilities placing Reveal and Marked on them.

Too much stealth- People complainToo much evade- People complainToo much damage- People complainToo much mobility- People complainToo many teleports- People complainToo much blind- People complainToo many spammable skills- People complainToo much access to poison- People complainToo much condition capability- People complainAbility to Teleport allies- People Complain

People need to chill.

Mh, what makes thief powerful is the WvW maps. Maximum mobility + stealth + huge maps allowing the thief to break combat. Initiative regenerates and the thief can come back to try the burst again. It's more just too much evade and mobility with any amount of stealth on a big map where the thief can just go in any which way (And hitting a stealthed target doesn't show any sort of tell or give any sort of feedback that, yes, you've found them.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Yasai.3549 said:

@"AliamRationem.5172" said:Like I said. Too much stealth and mobility. Too few counters and restrictions. A class that is designed to be unhittable and to escape from any fight whenever they want is poor design.

As someone who dabbles in Thief myself, I would like to add that the problem isn't only "too much" but also "too often"This is a serious Initiative mechanic problem which needs a balance rework eventually, or Thief is forever going to be the scourge of competitive modes.

Stealth, whenever they want, as much as they need.Immob, whenever they want, as much as they want until resource runs out.Mobility, whenever they want, as much as they need.Damage, whenever they want, as much as they need. (which essentially spits in the face of the 33% Power nerf across the board because they can just make up for reduced damage by simply going at it longer until the target dies, not to mention the oppression mainly comes from Condi builds anyway)

Only thing they don't poop out is Heals after popular heal or regen traits being hammered into the dirt.

Pretty sure every Thief main is gonna hate on me, but I think Ini mechanic needs to have a 1 second global cooldown on all weapon skills.

It's simply too much too often too fast, even if the cost of that is resource downtime, because yu can always put yurself out of the reach of the enemy in 2 utility skills and try again in 10 seconds, while the opponent has like, a 10 - 15 second long cooldown on most of their weapon skills, and their utilities are as long or longer than Thief's.

If thieves were the "scourge of competitive modes" people would ask for them more, if ever.If "whenever they want, as much as needed" were a reality no one would play anything else.Leave Initiative alone, what are you even trying to accomplish besides making unnecessary changes just to make it look like something's being done about something?Just to add one more thing to your list, I can get enough self healing or leeching to make a difference in a fight so you can make it sound like one class has one more thing and no one else has it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...