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the grind for mounts needs to be toned down


KAipurge.2147

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Is it really that grindy for the mounts absolutely required to complete the story and most map achievements? Afaik some of the later added mounts are entirely for convenience and more speed maybe. I guess it is okay to make them harder to obtain. I mean there aren't many really hard to get things in this game. Except grinding money for legendaries. (I just did Aurora stuff while doing dailies on those maps to get some resources from there for saving for other things. And I don't even have money to guy the other things for this legendary. And the achievements did not feel grindy and a lot of people already complain there.)

What will be left of the game if you remove everything and make it as easy as possible? For some it is a feeling of having accomplished something - if it takes long. (Yeah ... you could also replace the "long" with "short but very hard" and then the disabled players, etc. would complain. There is optional and hard stuff elsewhere in the game. Clocktower JP or stuff like that - for me it actually is not that hard.)

Edit: And exp requirements ... really isn't an argument. I just finished Tyria and HoT masteries fully. Not even started with PoF (I play in realease order and want ot finish GW1 nightfall an I have tons of other stuff to do in my time that's why it takes a bit for me - befor going to PoF) and it didn't feel grindy. And HoT seems to have the highest requirements for masteries regarding exp. Maybe just do story and map achievements and while there some events ... making the exp bar automatically fill up by having fun and playing normally. Instead of saying "I need to force myself to get all mounts asap before I can start to play the game" lol. (Actually feels like some people play that way. :D )

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there is no grinding if you play the game since the beginning of do the story as they are meant to.

it is from a different perspective that players think there is grinding involved in getting certain things in the game

take me for examplei never play much of fractal, never even think of going to raid or farm dungeon, on my personal perspective those are grind if i want to get to where the other players are right now who have been playing since the early days of fractal, raid or dungeon map , is it fair for me to ask for them to be dumb down so i can fast track to where the rest of the players who have spent countless hours there? NO

SO the answer to you trying to dumb down "what you perceive to be grind " IS NOT OKAY BY ME. I do still have a super low level account, that I wish to level up, but not like this.

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@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

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@LucianDK.8615 said:

@"Nubarus.9268" said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

Yes ofcourse they would someone with those tools and salvager can run around harvest and fight forever and not having to visit a merchant once.Throw in ahttps://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Tarrktun_Personal_Delivery_Portal

And they can sell from everywere aswell.

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@Linken.6345 said:

@"Nubarus.9268" said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

Yes ofcourse they would someone with those tools and salvager can run around harvest and fight forever and not having to visit a merchant once.Throw in a

And they can sell from everywere aswell.

Adding to this conversation: what is "winning" defined as? What does one win here, if one "p2w"?

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

That is such a bad arguement that it´s just hilarious. Bag space is easy to manage if you carry salvage kits with you since you can salvage and deposit from any location on the map and random merchants ar all over the place to sell your junk. You can even sell loot in the black lion trade and pick it up later. The yelow, green and blue unidentified items that you loot can stack to 250 per slot too so that is 3 slots that can hold 250 each, same for loot bags that foes drop. Your arguement is based on lack of knowledge or just being lazy. I still do not see how convenience is pay2win..............

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@Linken.6345 said:

@"Nubarus.9268" said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

Yes ofcourse they would someone with those tools and salvager can run around harvest and fight forever and not having to visit a merchant once.Throw in a

And they can sell from everywere aswell.

Anyone can sell from anywhere on the map, just not pick up the cash but you can always do that later so what are you talking about? And we still have to find merchants to sell junk drops to but they are all over the maps anyway. PS: I got over 100 of them personal delivery portals in my bank but never bought one in the gems store ever. I also never use them since I pick up my sales at any other time since many maps have a trader npc...........

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You know what's a bad argument?Arguing that QoL stuff is P2W.It actually lose you gold, it doesn't earn you gold, in most cases.Take the gems you were about to spend on QoL and Gem>Gold and for most players there's more profit in this.QoL is simply to make the game less tedious.Are they creating problems to sell solutions? Oh yea 100%. Does that make it Pay 2 Win .. Nope ..This is needed in a game with no sub fee. Everyone can easily earn those items with gold over time.And here's my question for you. Because I've seen this a million times from people arguing it's pay2win.Why are you complaining about QoL items, instead of bringing up the fact that the game straight up SELLS YOU GOLD.I don't get it. You complain about QoL making the process of earning gold easier, but you never bring up the fact that you can buy gold.But then you would have to switch focus on something actually being P2W .. There isn't any.You say it's pay2win if you earn gold faster (in most cases you lose gold) but i'll play along ..What can you get with said gold that makes you win?I'm waiting ..

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@Nubarus.9268 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

Yes ofcourse they would someone with those tools and salvager can run around harvest and fight forever and not having to visit a merchant once.Throw in a

And they can sell from everywere aswell.

Anyone can sell from anywhere on the map, just not pick up the cash but you can always do that later so what are you talking about? And we still have to find merchants to sell junk drops to but they are all over the maps anyway. PS: I got over 100 of them personal delivery portals in my bank but never bought one in the gems store ever. I also never use them since I pick up my sales at any other time since many maps have a trader npc...........

FirstThat one is from a achievement and you can use it in a shared slot and sell junk without going anywere since it acts like a merchant for ecto gambling.So I very much dont think you have 100s of it.SecondSelling on the trading post and selling to a merchant is not the same thing, you have a chance of your things never selling unless you sell instantly and make the trading post barons happy.
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@Linken.6345 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

Yes ofcourse they would someone with those tools and salvager can run around harvest and fight forever and not having to visit a merchant once.Throw in a

And they can sell from everywere aswell.

Anyone can sell from anywhere on the map, just not pick up the cash but you can always do that later so what are you talking about? And we still have to find merchants to sell junk drops to but they are all over the maps anyway. PS: I got over 100 of them personal delivery portals in my bank but never bought one in the gems store ever. I also never use them since I pick up my sales at any other time since many maps have a trader npc...........

FirstThat one is from a achievement and you can use it in a shared slot and sell junk without going anywere since it acts like a merchant for ecto gambling.So I very much dont think you have 100s of it.SecondSelling on the trading post and selling to a merchant is not the same thing, you have a chance of your things never selling unless you sell instantly and make the trading post barons happy.

Ok fine, I mixed it up with the one use Merchant Express that I have over 100 of but never bought any. I also didn't say 100s but over 100. I am well aware that selling to the merchant and selling to the black lion trader is not the same thing, I fail to see how you even came up with the idea that I think it is..................You can open the black lion trade anywhere on the map and sell your stuff at all times, just not pick up your cash. That is what I said. I list many items and materials every week and they always sell, I only sell instantly if the price difference is 1 or 2 copper, otherwise I list and it will sell. I have made the vast majority of my gold doing this over the years. I salvage most of my loot, use the materials I need for crafting and sell the rest on the black lion market. I see now I thought it was a black lion access item since I didn't bother to open the link in the first place. You sure love to drag in every available item to try and prove how terrible this game is when it comes to a pay2win system. Even achievement items are included...............geez

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@Nubarus.9268 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You have a skewered idea of what pay2win is. If it gives you a combat advantage over other players whom havent bought it, then its pay2win.At most ascended stuff is the biggest noticeable upgrade for your character. If you buy gold with intention on making it fast, then it could be construed as pay2win. But most ascended gear is easy to get outside crafting these days.Extra coniviences is not p2w. Look at the copperfed salvageomatic. Or unlimited gathering tools, would you seriously claim those are pay2win stuff?

Yes ofcourse they would someone with those tools and salvager can run around harvest and fight forever and not having to visit a merchant once.Throw in a

And they can sell from everywere aswell.

Anyone can sell from anywhere on the map, just not pick up the cash but you can always do that later so what are you talking about? And we still have to find merchants to sell junk drops to but they are all over the maps anyway. PS: I got over 100 of them personal delivery portals in my bank but never bought one in the gems store ever. I also never use them since I pick up my sales at any other time since many maps have a trader npc...........

FirstThat one is from a achievement and you can use it in a shared slot and sell junk without going anywere since it acts like a merchant for ecto gambling.So I very much dont think you have 100s of it.SecondSelling on the trading post and selling to a merchant is not the same thing, you have a chance of your things never selling unless you sell instantly and make the trading post barons happy.

Ok fine, I mixed it up with the one use Merchant Express that I have over 100 of but never bought any. I also didn't say 100s but over 100. I am well aware that selling to the merchant and selling to the black lion trader is not the same thing, I fail to see how you even came up with the idea that I think it is..................You can open the black lion trade anywhere on the map and sell your stuff at all times, just not pick up your cash. That is what I said. I list many items and materials every week and they always sell, I only sell instantly if the price difference is 1 or 2 copper, otherwise I list and it will sell. I have made the vast majority of my gold doing this over the years. I salvage most of my loot, use the materials I need for crafting and sell the rest on the black lion market. I see now I thought it was a black lion access item since I didn't bother to open the link in the first place. You sure love to drag in every available item to try and prove how terrible this game is when it comes to a pay2win system. Even achievement items are included...............geez

Oh Im not arguing that its p2w at all, since I dont belive it is.I just replied to the other guy that the guy they quoted most likely think it is.

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@jokke.6239 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You know what's a bad argument?Arguing that QoL stuff is P2W.It actually lose you gold, it doesn't earn you gold, in most cases.Take the gems you were about to spend on QoL and Gem>Gold and for most players there's more profit in this.QoL is simply to make the game less tedious.Are they creating problems to sell solutions? Oh yea 100%. Does that make it Pay 2 Win .. Nope ..This is needed in a game with no sub fee. Everyone can easily earn those items with gold over time.And here's my question for you. Because I've seen this a million times from people arguing it's pay2win.Why are you complaining about QoL items, instead of bringing up the fact that the game straight up SELLS YOU GOLD.I don't get it. You complain about QoL making the process of earning gold easier, but you never bring up the fact that you can buy gold.But then you would have to switch focus on something actually being P2W .. There isn't any.You say it's pay2win if you earn gold faster (in most cases you lose gold) but i'll play along ..What can you get with said gold that makes you win?I'm waiting ..

it's only quality of life if it's FREE and given to everybody, eg: reducing harvest times across the board is an example of QoL.

Anet do not do QoL changes, they deliberately make something painful so they can sell items (P2W) to decrease the painfulness, eg: placing bank a long way from BLTC in Lion's arch and then selling access to prestige trading hubs, portable banks & BLTC merchants.

game is rife with P2W, it's literally everywhere. it's not super obnoxious P2W like a BLTC sword that instakills, but it's definitely P2W.

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You know what's a bad argument?Arguing that QoL stuff is P2W.It actually lose you gold, it doesn't earn you gold, in most cases.Take the gems you were about to spend on QoL and Gem>Gold and for most players there's more profit in this.QoL is simply to make the game less tedious.Are they creating problems to sell solutions? Oh yea 100%. Does that make it Pay 2 Win .. Nope ..This is needed in a game with no sub fee. Everyone can easily earn those items with gold over time.And here's my question for you. Because I've seen this a million times from people arguing it's pay2win.Why are you complaining about QoL items, instead of bringing up the fact that the game straight up SELLS YOU GOLD.I don't get it. You complain about QoL making the process of earning gold easier, but you never bring up the fact that you can buy gold.But then you would have to switch focus on something actually being P2W .. There isn't any.You say it's pay2win if you earn gold faster (in most cases you lose gold) but i'll play along ..What can you get with said gold that makes you win?I'm waiting ..

it's only quality of life if it's FREE and given to everybody, eg: reducing harvest times across the board is an example of QoL.

Anet do not do QoL changes, they deliberately make something painful so they can sell items (P2W) to decrease the painfulness, eg: placing bank a long way from BLTC in Lion's arch and then selling access to prestige trading hubs, portable banks & BLTC merchants.

game is rife with P2W, it's literally everywhere. it's not super obnoxious P2W like a BLTC sword that instakills, but it's definitely P2W.

I still see no valid arguement for your pay2win claims. You just keep rambling on about the same things but none of them help you win anything.

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Skyscale was...excessive. Took me 3 weeks, but mostly because there were days I could not be bothered.The collections were never ending and required way too much busy work. There is actually a really interesting quest in there if the steps we cut by about 30 - 40%.But that is the only one for whom complaints about how engaging the content was given the investment required feels justified.Rollerbeetle, Griffon, and Skimmer are all quick enough as not to matter. Even if Griffon is more expensive than I would have liked.

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You know what's a bad argument?Arguing that QoL stuff is P2W.It actually lose you gold, it doesn't earn you gold, in most cases.Take the gems you were about to spend on QoL and Gem>Gold and for most players there's more profit in this.QoL is simply to make the game less tedious.Are they creating problems to sell solutions? Oh yea 100%. Does that make it Pay 2 Win .. Nope ..This is needed in a game with no sub fee. Everyone can easily earn those items with gold over time.And here's my question for you. Because I've seen this a million times from people arguing it's pay2win.Why are you complaining about QoL items, instead of bringing up the fact that the game straight up SELLS YOU GOLD.I don't get it. You complain about QoL making the process of earning gold easier, but you never bring up the fact that you can buy gold.But then you would have to switch focus on something actually being P2W .. There isn't any.You say it's pay2win if you earn gold faster (in most cases you lose gold) but i'll play along ..What can you get with said gold that makes you win?I'm waiting ..

it's only quality of life if it's FREE and given to everybody, eg: reducing harvest times across the board is an example of QoL.

Anet do not do QoL changes, they deliberately make something painful so they can sell items (P2W) to decrease the painfulness, eg: placing bank a long way from BLTC in Lion's arch and then selling access to prestige trading hubs, portable banks & BLTC merchants.

game is rife with P2W, it's literally everywhere. it's not super obnoxious P2W like a BLTC sword that instakills, but it's definitely P2W.

Taking the bank as an example, most players have to travel to a bank in order to use it. I have to travel to a bank on the Tyria map to use it (or Eye of North, I've got most of the services there). How on earth is having to pay some silver, and go to a different map, to get to a bank P2W? Seriously, how?

I maxxed out all my trades. That took crafting and ingame gathering time. I can make ascended gear that gives me slightly better stats, plus infusion slots so I can go and do fractals. Is my ability to craft ascended (and legendaries) P2W?

Good grief.

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@"Nubarus.9268" said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

You know what's a bad argument?Arguing that QoL stuff is P2W.It actually lose you gold, it doesn't earn you gold, in most cases.Take the gems you were about to spend on QoL and Gem>Gold and for most players there's more profit in this.QoL is simply to make the game less tedious.Are they creating problems to sell solutions? Oh yea 100%. Does that make it Pay 2 Win .. Nope ..This is needed in a game with no sub fee. Everyone can easily earn those items with gold over time.And here's my question for you. Because I've seen this a million times from people arguing it's pay2win.Why are you complaining about QoL items, instead of bringing up the fact that the game straight up SELLS YOU GOLD.I don't get it. You complain about QoL making the process of earning gold easier, but you never bring up the fact that you can buy gold.But then you would have to switch focus on something actually being P2W .. There isn't any.You say it's pay2win if you earn gold faster (in most cases you lose gold) but i'll play along ..What can you get with said gold that makes you win?I'm waiting ..

it's only quality of life if it's FREE and given to everybody, eg: reducing harvest times across the board is an example of QoL.

You're wrong about it being p2w. And in what way does "QoL" have anything to do with "being free and given to everyone"? What are you even talking about? That's just wrong.

Anet do not do QoL changes, they deliberately make something painful so they can sell items (P2W) to decrease the painfulness, eg: placing bank a long way from BLTC in Lion's arch and then selling access to prestige trading hubs, portable banks & BLTC merchants.

Not painful, not pay to win. And can be bought by converting gold to gems if you're so pressed to get it without paying. I have stacks of those portable services and I never use them because there's just no reason to.

game is rife with P2W, it's literally everywhere. it's not super obnoxious P2W like a BLTC sword that instakills, but it's definitely P2W.

No, it's not.

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@Fallesafe.5932 said:Any old Everquest players who find it hilarious to see GW2 mounts described as 'a grind in need of toning down?'? Is there even a mount in this game that takes more than a week to get??

Yeah...

Back in WoW around 2006/7 when I started, it took me about 3 or 4 months to get enough gold to afford my first mount.

The longest mount grind I have had here was just shy of a week to get the war claw. It took that long ONLY because I'm NOT a WvW player and I spent most of that time randomly running from here to there then back over here because I had no idea what people were calling out in map chat...

According to the wiki, it takes '8 hours of play' to do that grind if you're competent in WvW... which I was not.

  • I did notice that about half of the entire grind was spent on the very first 1/4th of the progress bar... because I started to get what was going on as I was playing there which resulted in things speeding up.

I do still have the newest mount left. So maybe I will finally find this horrible multiple months long grind people are complaining about... because anything less would not be an actual grind...

The only reason I lack the current mount is I am refusing to go get it until I get to that point in the Living Story - and I am 'catching up' on years away from here still, about halfway through season 4 right now, yet spending most of my time in Fractals and trying to get my craft skills up to 500...

If we want to have a conversation about grind... I will be there when we get to talking about the last 35 points of crafting... from about 465 to 500... trying to that without crafting any 'vendor / sell / toss' items...

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

Less bank and bag space, means you sell stuff more and have more gold. I had less gold when I had more bank space because I saved more stuff. When I run out of space, I start making money. Thus not pay to win.

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@scerevisiae.1972 said:

@Nubarus.9268 said:So how is a bigger bank or bag space going to make you win over other players? Those are easy to obtain with game gold exchange when they are on sale to begin with. So we are so called white knight defenders for not seeing how those are pay2win? I never spend real money in the gems store, yet I have extra bank tabs, more resource space, extra shared inventory space as well as unlimited harvest tools. So explain to me how that is pay2win for having these none cosmetic items I obtained with game gold vs someone who used real money................

more bag/bank space means more gold earned & saved over time. i don't understand how that isn't obvious.

i'll say again: if it's not PURELY COSMETIC, it provides an in-game advantage and is therefore pay2win.

whether you can buy the P2W items with in-game gold or real money doesn't matter, it's still pay2win.

Less bank and bag space, means you sell stuff more and have more gold. I had less gold when I had more bank space because I saved more stuff. When I run out of space, I start making money. Thus not pay to win.

some trumpian levels of logic there.

Not really, Before I expanded my material storage and bank tabs I sold way more materials than I do now. Now I tend to hoard stuff until I reach max capacity and even then sometimes move it to the bank tabs to hoard even more. Once I am getting low on bank space I start selling stuff. Your P2W claims are falling short and you just keep repeating the same things over and over hoping it will stick.

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@"scerevisiae.1972" said:P2W is so common in the games industry today that expect all the white knighting is from younger players who are just used to it.

This is the second time you have accused us of this: https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/6v7spt/eli5_what_is_white_knighting/

Insulting others who disagree with you, and who have valid points, is perhaps not the strategy you seem to think it is.

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@"scerevisiae.1972" said:doesn't need to stick. if you can buy it for real money, and the item/upgrade is not purely cosmetic, it's a pay-to-win item/upgrade by definition, even if the "win" impact appears small.

most people would say just being able to purchase gold for real money automatically makes a game P2W.

P2W is so common in the games industry today that expect all the white knighting is from younger players who are just used to it.

That’s nice but you are still not forced to use it. Therefore it is not pay to win.

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@"scerevisiae.1972" said:doesn't need to stick. if you can buy it for real money, and the item/upgrade is not purely cosmetic, it's a pay-to-win item/upgrade by definition, even if the "win" impact appears small.

most people would say just being able to purchase gold for real money automatically makes a game P2W.

P2W is so common in the games industry today that expect all the white knighting is from younger players who are just used to it.

Most people you say? So far I do not see most people agree with your claims at all so where are all these so called "most people" you talk about?

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