Best Solo Open World PvE Class (bounties, events, champions, etc)

[Atille.5047]

@"Opopanax.1803" said:

Would you mind sharing a link to your reaper build? I am pretty familiar with the mesmer ones, but not so much the reaper ones.

It's not one build that I'm mentioning, but kind of three. Keep in mind that you don't need to go ascended at all, just make sure you have 50% crit chance and you're good. Can get away with as little as 17% critchance to be still critcapped in shroud, but meh. Gear generally has a lot of leeway to it; just make sure you have sufficient crit to cap yourself with traits. Rune of the Pack is the cheap and fantastic option that also has Fury, I often run Durability because that's what I have on my WvW set -feels quite good too. Rune of Vampirism in mass murder scenarios (zergs) is great. Try with Blood Bank in Blood Magic for extra immortal. Rune of Speed or Strength if you don't mind spending and want a little bit more damage/more speed, respectively - though, tbh, both lose to Pack.

Most DPS build - generally for encounters you know well.Deeps. Feel free to;Switch Decimate Defences for Soul Eater to have lifesteal in melee, great when facing a ton of trash so you can benefit from hitting as many things as possible with your wells - keep in mind, healing only happens outside of shroud.Switch Axe to Dagger, the easiest "I kind of want more healing" option.Your Soul is Mine for Consume Conditions, if needed. Signet of Spite is the first thing to go, feel free to run Spectral Walk for some cleanse, stunbreak and minor LF gen, also utility of being able to teleport back to where you started - amazing at fetchquests like bringing pack supplies in VB or what have you. Wurm if you still want the same effect, but would take more than 10 seconds - keep in mind that Wurm has a range lock, Spectral Walk doesn't. Chilled to the Bone can be used when golem sucks - but keep in mind that flesh golem will be your main breakbar destroyer. It's CC damage is extremely strong.

Food, it depends. Generally Tin of Fruitcake is always good, and then you can go either something with + endurance if you feel dodgy, with lifesteal+power just because why not and full power - though avoid precision foods, you don't need those at all.

Zerging - Replace Soul Reaping with Blood Magic, go Ritual of Life - Vampiric Presence - Transfusion, Axe/Wh to Staff with Frenzy and Fire if tagging is involved. You'll get to feel like a badass hero saving people from certain death, would generally feel a lot safer from random "lmao lots of damage" things happening and you still have Spite to cover your might needs. I lowkey wish more reapers ran Blood Magic for group events, it's such an easy swap that helps the whole zerg. Well of Blood in healskill also becomes an option to have even more ressing power.

Soloing champs/legendaries; Nothing beats Minionmaster. Go all minions, skip the bone one because it's pretty bad and slot Rise instead.Replace Soul Reaping with Death Magic. Flesh of the Master, Necromantic Corruption, and then - if you run around with it and kill trash mobs, Death Nova for fun and profit, little undead army at your disposal. Quite fun. Can go Lich Form and press 4 for even more death nova memes. If you fight a champ, however. absolutely go Corrupter's Fervor. Just stabbing things with GS3 and autoattacking/ doing a bit of a shroud spin will get you pulsing protection that you can easily keep up. "Rise!" further cuts your incoming damage. Also, free toughness.

Hopefully that helpful, happy reaping.

[Antycypator.9874]

Everyone's talking about necro, but I will say: thief.Incoming damage? Just ignore it. Forget about your active heal.Need to fight ranged? Rifle deadeye. You have perma 25 might, protection, vigor, swiftness, regeneration.Melee? Staff daredevil. Infinite dodges.Need to skip something? Stealth.Just make you have marauder gear (more HP so you will never get one-shoted. This gear provides much more precision than berserker, which is better for solo play. Critical Strike > Raw Power) and invigorating precision.I carried many players in dungeons by soloing champs after everyone died. I helped countless people by doing bounties for them.

[Atille.5047]

@Antycypator.9874 said:

That's all cool, but one thing's missing - giant scythe to reap people in half with. And incoherent babblings about being a death incarnate or how everyone's a weakling and you're going to eat their souls.

Memes aside, thief is also a very good pick and I do agree that it must be mentioned. Weird it wasn't so far.

~~bring back ricochet ~~

[HowlKamui.5120]

imo condi mirage is one of the strongest solo playstyle out there, and unless you dont like the playstyle/archetype there's no need to look further. Axe/pistol and staff. Axe/pistol for when you wanna deal damage while still being quite durable. Staff for lower dps but very good survival via kiting. Trailblazer for armor or even Dire.

[weaponwh.9810]

@Antycypator.9874 said:Everyone's talking about necro, but I will say: thief.Incoming damage? Just ignore it. Forget about your active heal.Need to fight ranged? Rifle deadeye. You have perma 25 might, protection, vigor, swiftness, regeneration.Melee? Staff daredevil. Infinite dodges.Need to skip something? Stealth.Just make you have marauder gear (more HP so you will never get one-shoted. This gear provides much more precision than berserker, which is better for solo play. Critical Strike > Raw Power) and invigorating precision.I carried many players in dungeons by soloing champs after everyone died. I helped countless people by doing bounties for them.

i'm curious what build or rotation you use to solo champ. i play DD and DE, but issue with champ they always come after me, and i can't outheal or out dodge all its attack.

[Antycypator.9874]

@"weaponwh.9810" said:i'm curious what build or rotation you use to solo champ. i play DD and DE, but issue with champ they always come after me, and i can't outheal or out dodge all its attack.

I can't just sit in one place at some champs (like Hydras, because of CCs). I'm always in movement, using dodges to get stealth and access to DJ (rifle). The "Ignore damage" is basicaly "don't be afraid to get hit, because you can't be one-shoted". Don't waste your dodge (while playing rifle deadeye). Use it to avoid damage, then get in stealth and continue dealing damage.Rotation? Never thought about this. Just load 7 malice (should be 3 hits) and dodge -> stealth -> DJ. Double Tap or Thee Round Burst for damage. Skirmisher's Shot pierces; sometimes I'm using it and I don't know why (maybe it's faster?).Death's Retreat sometimes can be used as a dodge; Shadowstep to run away (+ return, good for kneeling).

[weaponwh.9810]

@Antycypator.9874 said:

@"weaponwh.9810" said:i'm curious what build or rotation you use to solo champ. i play DD and DE, but issue with champ they always come after me, and i can't outheal or out dodge all its attack.

I can't just sit in one place at some champs (like Hydras, because of CCs). I'm always in movement, using dodges to get stealth and access to DJ (rifle). The "Ignore damage" is basicaly "don't be afraid to get hit, because you can't be one-shoted". Don't waste your dodge (while playing rifle deadeye). Use it to avoid damage, then get in stealth and continue dealing damage.Rotation? Never thought about this. Just load 7 malice (should be 3 hits) and dodge -> stealth -> DJ. Double Tap or Thee Round Burst for damage. Skirmisher's Shot pierces; sometimes I'm using it and I don't know why (maybe it's faster?).Death's Retreat sometimes can be used as a dodge; Shadowstep to run away (+ return, good for kneeling).

i see so you solo champ with rifle deadeye? i was using staff DD build.

[Obtena.7952]

The only problem I found with Theif is the complicated mechanics to achieve what is done easier with other classes. I guess if you want just ONE character that can do it all though ... it covers a wide range as long as you have all your builds down with it.

[Opopanax.1803]

@Obtena.7952 said:The only problem I found with Theif is the complicated mechanics to achieve what is done easier with other classes. I guess if you want just ONE character that can do it all though ... it covers a wide range as long as you have all your builds down with it.

One of the things that I love about mesmer is it's flexibility. The fact that it can condi, power, solo, group, and stealth gameplay is pretty cool.

I may have to give a harder look at Rev and Thief at some point, I just havent liked their themes as much.

[Tuco.2419]

I'm having a lot of fun coattail riding on Aliam's fire weaver, but sometimes I'll roll up to a champion mob, start doing my thing and others will join in and frequently die :astonished:

I feel like I can "carry" a fight in that as long as I don't screw up I've got tremendous survivability and can continue to deal DPS while also staying in melee range which seems to attract the mobs attention. Plus the breakbar damage is decent. However I don't feel like I serve as a good "base" for a group to form on to defeat a tougher encounter. I don't do much healing to other players unless I cycle in water, I don't provide much besides some Might in terms of buffs and I can't resurrect players while keeping up the pressure on a boss.

I don't really know which classes do better but sometimes in small but difficult fights I wish I had the kind of constant pressure of a necromancer or the support of a firebrand or mirage.

[Crackmonster.2790]

Mesmer or trailblazer necro i'd reckon. Mesmer power mirage with stamina/energy runes of vampirism and double GS is best i think for killing tons of stuff eternally and tagging all, just people don't think out of the box to try it - only when it gets hard enough trailblazer setup gets more relevant which you can also on mesmer, illusion spamming with a scepter is also quite effective for them tanking hits plus the rest of your kit. But trailblazer scourge is so faceroll too. Haven't tried revenant but hear it's really powerful in the right hands too, maybe even condi zerker that's what i'm lvling to try right now. I guess thief and ele also if played well can avoid taking nearly all damage.

[Qaju.2058]

Diviner + Pack + celerity rifle DeadeyePerma quickness+25might+vigor+fury+swiftness+protection , self heal Invigorating Precision for the best heal in game.

[Buran.3796]

Trying to decide between condi Herald and power Renegade for that title. Condi Herald is more tanky and able to solo almost everything, but kills at slower pace and is pure mele, it's sustain is in part linked to the Tormenting runes, so changes could screw that status; power Renegade is a bit less tanky but does more damage, its boons last way longer and has more recovery, can be played both at range, mele or mixing both styles, and is not as vulnerable to balance patches because has tons of sources for sustain and survability.

[Nephalem.8921]

@Buran.3796 said:Trying to decide between condi Herald and power Renegade for that title. Condi Herald is more tanky and able to solo almost everything, but kills at slower pace and is pure mele, it's sustain is in part linked to the Tormenting runes, so changes could screw that status; power Renegade is a bit less tanky but does more damage, its boons last way longer and has more recovery, can be played both at range, mele or mixing both styles, and is not as vulnerable to balance patches because has tons of sources for sustain and survability.

Why not condi ren? Can use trailblazers and does more dmg than power ren. Condi fb with trailblazer/plagedoctor is quite op awell. The problems with the proposed trailblazer scourge or staff mirage in this thread is that their dps is extremely low.Condi ren and condi fb do a lot more dmg while being just as tanky. Condi fb is also quite op if adds are around because the main dmg skill resets after each kill.

[Buran.3796]

@"Nephalem.8921" said:

Why not condi ren? Can use trailblazers and does more dmg than power ren. Condi fb with trailblazer/plagedoctor is quite op awell. The problems with the proposed trailblazer scourge or staff mirage in this thread is that their dps is extremely low.Condi ren and condi fb do a lot more dmg while being just as tanky. Condi fb is also quite op if adds are around because the main dmg skill resets after each kill.

Is a theme which already has been debated in threads like this one:

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/121056/condition-renegade-or-condition-herald#latest

My take on that, which is based in a not that large PvE experience but in having a legenday armor and weapons to swap between loadouts and trying those builds against the same enemies:

Condition Renegade (in both raids and open world) usually run full condi viper stats, Nightmare runes (multi condition buffs) with Kalla and Mallyx, short bow & mace + axe, and Renegade (2,2,2), Corruption (1,3,1) and either Invocation (2,1,2) for more damage and energy or Devastation (3,3,3) for the extra sustain. Is a build focusing in dealing damage afap, so the trait selection is focused on enhancing bleeds with Blood Fury and Heartpiercer, and the concept is to melt enemies as fast as possible stacking conditions. Has a strong defiance bar-breaking game with Darkrazor's Daring, but lacks stability, protection and blocks/i-frames. You can see variants of that build in both meta battle and the snow crows page, and are mainly builds designed to work well inside teams with support, not so much soloing the game (albeit Nike DNT has a good variant which can be found in Youtube and is discused on those two threads. Paper

Now, the power Renegade is an entirely different beast. Mine is based on the Paper Roll's build but with changes in the stats to optimize boon duration:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmwAUxzltQHMNqhlROsN6hNSfMDKgJ11/rF-zRZYBJ1AY4wOC68MiVF0rUwjngA6t47rF-e

This build uses a mix between commander and cavalier/berserker stats with the Leadership runes to achieve almost 48% boon duration, weapons are short bow and dual swords with Kalla and Jalis as legends. Since conditions are secondary damage doesn't need to invest in Blood Fury or Heartpiercer, so takes instead Renegade (1,3,2) Ashen Demeanor and All for One, which means amazing crowd control and 6 seconds of protection every time we cast a Kalla summon (so perma-protection while in that legend). Devastation (3,3,3) for the Battle Scarrs life siphoning triunvirate complements the life leaching from Soulcleave's Summit, and Invocation (2,2,2) grants good mobility in combat (Rapid Flow) and plenty of energy (Charged Mist). Now, Jalis has his own damage mitigation with a heal which removes up to 5 conditions, the 20% damage reduction from Vengeful Hammers, the 50% damage reduction from Rite of the Great Dwarf (5 seconds). You can't get all of them forever but you have plenty of tools, which includes also perma-stability if needed (Inspiring Reinforcement) and the perfect bar breaker complement to Darkrazor's Daring: Forced Engagement. So: that build has huge damage mitigation and crowd control tools in a loadout which already has over 3000 armor and a base crit chance of 41,5% which edges 95% most of the time (with close to 190% crit damage).

When you solo open world with the condition variants you deal damage faster, and that works very well when you one shoot targets: a veteran chack? summon Darkrazor's, release Sevenshots and the target melts doing nothing... Which is more or less what happens with the power build, only a bit slower. But when you can't one shoot a target or crowd and the fight last longer (like versus a few bristlebacks or smokescales , or a champion or a bounty) the things change: then the condition variants rely just in recovering life through Soulcleave's and (if available) Battle Scars, whereas the power build has the same leeching capabilities while also having a large access to protection, damage mitigation, stability, more strong defiance bar-breaking tools and a valuable i-frame in sowrd #2.

I've soloed most of HP champions with power herald, condi herlad, condi renegade and power renegade. I've also tried to solo some bounties with those builds (albeit my skill dealing with magic unstabilities is poor due didn't focused in PvE in the past). The power Herald is my favourite vs most of champs due how fast it moves and breaks defiance bars, but being 100% mele is risky vs some monsters, and the AoE damage is very lacking. In bounties have been able to reach 60-65% of some foes before the times expires, but isn't the best build because with power you can't deal damage and evade/block/survive at the same time.

With condi Herald reached 70-75% of the HP on some bounties, and is for sure the tankies PvE build in the game. Some players way more skilled did solo almost everything with that build, and the only problem is that is a pure close range build which is risky vs some foes and is subpar for large events in which other players cloacks AoEs from enemies and you suddenly end in downstate because the framerrate dropped to single digits and the landscape was cluttered with visual effects.

The Renegades have the advantage of a functional ranged weapon which can also fight af mele if needed. The condition variants do damage faster but are also squishier. The power Renegade is closer to the condi Herald in tankiness and lets you to have mistakes, for a more relaxed gameplay which also requires less skill and that's a huge bonus for new players.

And that's the reason why I think that power Renegade is probably the best solo build in the game. Not sure if at high level is able to achieve the same feats as the condi Herald, but has more variety in terms of mele and ranged combat and a stronger bar breaking game.

Finally, about the Firebrand: I mained Guardian before the Revenant, and I do play mostly both those classes (~8k hours in total). Past condi Firebrand was great. Currently Firebrand is hot garbage for solo content. I've been using power DH, condi DH, power FB and condi FB for PvE, PvP and even WvW. Related to the topic (PvE): Sustain in the FB class is currently bad, and you lose a lot of damage if you try to prevent that using traits. The FB open world builds from meta battle or guides like the one from Wooden Potatoes rely entirely on (bursting) killing the foes fast enough to activate Renewed Justice. That's great when you fight miniraptors, but works poorly vs tanky crowds of veterans and crumbles apart vs bounties. The condi Firebrand has also a very limited break breaking tools compared to a power Herald or a Renegade (you have to almost deplete all your tools to delete a blue bar). The best soloing build for Guardian/FB is the power FB which uses Lord Hizen in one of it latest videos, which is a variant from the quickbrander (but stats based in marauder/cavalier). It uses Valor instead of Zeal and Litany as the healing; uses quickness to achieve large burst while relying on Mantra of Lore for cleanses and Mantra of Liberation for stability, stacking regeneration, fury and well placed aegis to survive. It requires a huge skill to be played, because is a pure mele build which falls appart if gets interrupted, and you need to both known which attacks from the foes you need to block/evade and be familiar with the cooldown rotations of your 10 +15 skills and the cooldowns of each mantra. Is amazing once mastered, buy WAY harder to play than condi Herald or Renegades.

That are my two cents of the topic. Hizen (which is a master at soloing PvE content) thinks that the two easiest classes for that task are Revs and Necros, and I'm waiting to see if He makes any changes over his older builds for those classes. Imo condi Herald and power Renegade are the most friendly solo builds which perform the best at extra hard content.

[Nephalem.8921]

@Buran.3796 said:

@"Nephalem.8921" said:

Why not condi ren? Can use trailblazers and does more dmg than power ren. Condi fb with trailblazer/plagedoctor is quite op awell. The problems with the proposed trailblazer scourge or staff mirage in this thread is that their dps is extremely low.Condi ren and condi fb do a lot more dmg while being just as tanky. Condi fb is also quite op if adds are around because the main dmg skill resets after each kill.

Is a theme which already has been debated in threads like this one:

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/121056/condition-renegade-or-condition-herald#latest

My take on that, which is based in a not that large PvE experience but in having a legenday armor and weapons to swap between loadouts and trying those builds against the same enemies:

Condition Renegade (in both raids and open world) usually run full condi viper stats, Nightmare runes (multi condition buffs) with Kalla and Mallyx, short bow & mace + axe, and Renegade (2,2,2), Corruption (1,3,1) and either Invocation (2,1,2) for more damage and energy or Devastation (3,3,3) for the extra sustain. Is a build focusing in dealing damage afap, so the trait selection is focused on enhancing bleeds with Blood Fury and Heartpiercer, and the concept is to melt enemies as fast as possible stacking conditions. Has a strong defiance bar-breaking game with Darkrazor's Daring, but lacks stability, protection and blocks/i-frames. You can see variants of that build in both meta battle and the snow crows page, and are mainly builds designed to work well inside teams with support, not so much soloing the game (albeit Nike DNT has a good variant which can be found in Youtube and is discused on those two threads. Paper

Now, the power Renegade is an entirely different beast. Mine is based on the Paper Roll's build but with changes in the stats to optimize boon duration:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmwAUxzltQHMNqhlROsN6hNSfMDKgJ11/rF-zRZYBJ1AY4wOC68MiVF0rUwjngA6t47rF-e

This build uses a mix between commander and cavalier/berserker stats with the Leadership runes to achieve almost 48% boon duration, weapons are short bow and dual swords with Kalla and Jalis as legends. Since conditions are secondary damage doesn't need to invest in Blood Fury or Heartpiercer, so takes instead Renegade (1,3,2) Ashen Demeanor and All for One, which means amazing crowd control and 6 seconds of protection every time we cast a Kalla summon (so perma-protection while in that legend). Devastation (3,3,3) for the Battle Scarrs life siphoning triunvirate complements the life leaching from Soulcleave's Summit, and Invocation (2,2,2) grants good mobility in combat (Rapid Flow) and plenty of energy (Charged Mist). Now, Jalis has his own damage mitigation with a heal which removes up to 5 conditions, the 20% damage reduction from Vengeful Hammers, the 50% damage reduction from Rite of the Great Dwarf (5 seconds). You can't get all of them forever but you have plenty of tools, which includes also perma-stability if needed (Inspiring Reinforcement) and the perfect bar breaker complement to Darkrazor's Daring: Forced Engagement. So: that build has huge damage mitigation and crowd control tools in a loadout which already has over 3000 armor and a base crit chance of 41,5% which edges 95% most of the time (with close to 190% crit damage).

When you solo open world with the condition variants you deal damage faster, and that works very well when you one shoot targets: a veteran chack? summon Darkrazor's, release Sevenshots and the target melts doing nothing... Which is more or less what happens with the power build, only a bit slower. But when you can't one shoot a target or crowd and the fight last longer (like versus a few bristlebacks or smokescales , or a champion or a bounty) the things change: then the condition variants rely just in recovering life through Soulcleave's and (if available) Battle Scars, whereas the power build has the same leeching capabilities while also having a large access to protection, damage mitigation, stability, more strong defiance bar-breaking tools and a valuable i-frame in sowrd #2.

I've soloed most of HP champions with power herald, condi herlad, condi renegade and power renegade. I've also tried to solo some bounties with those builds (albeit my skill dealing with magic unstabilities is poor due didn't focused in PvE in the past). The power Herald is my favourite vs most of champs due how fast it moves and breaks defiance bars, but being 100% mele is risky vs some monsters, and the AoE damage is very lacking. In bounties have been able to reach 60-65% of some foes before the times expires, but isn't the best build because with power you can't deal damage and evade/block/survive at the same time.

With condi Herald reached 70-75% of the HP on some bounties, and is for sure the tankies PvE build in the game. Some players way more skilled did solo almost everything with that build, and the only problem is that is a pure close range build which is risky vs some foes and is subpar for large events in which other players cloacks AoEs from enemies and you suddenly end in downstate because the framerrate dropped to single digits and the landscape was cluttered with visual effects.

The Renegades have the advantage of a functional ranged weapon which can also fight af mele if needed. The condition variants do damage faster but are also squishier. The power Renegade is closer to the condi Herald in tankiness and lets you to have mistakes, for a more relaxed gameplay which also requires less skill and that's a huge bonus for new players.

And that's the reason why I think that power Renegade is probably the best solo build in the game. Not sure if at high level is able to achieve the same feats as the condi Herald, but has more variety in terms of mele and ranged combat and a stronger bar breaking game.

Finally, about the Firebrand: I mained Guardian before the Revenant, and I do play mostly both those classes (~8k hours in total). Past condi Firebrand was great.

Currently Firebrand is hot garbage for solo content

. I've been using power DH, condi DH, power FB and condi FB for PvE, PvP and even WvW. Related to the topic (PvE): Sustain in the FB class is currently bad, and you lose a lot of damage if you try to prevent that using traits. The FB open world builds from meta battle or guides like the one from Wooden Potatoes rely entirely on (bursting) killing the foes fast enough to activate Renewed Justice. That's great when you fight miniraptors, but works poorly vs tanky crowds of veterans and crumbles apart vs bounties. The condi Firebrand has also a very limited break breaking tools compared to a power Herald or a Renegade (you have to almost deplete all your tools to delete a blue bar). The best soloing build for Guardian/FB is the power FB which uses Lord Hizen in one of it latest videos, which is a variant from the quickbrander (but stats based in marauder/cavalier). It uses Valor instead of Zeal and Litany as the healing; uses quickness to achieve large burst while relying on Mantra of Lore for cleanses and Mantra of Liberation for stability, stacking regeneration, fury and well placed aegis to survive. It requires a huge skill to be played, because is a pure mele build which falls appart if gets interrupted, and you need to both known which attacks from the foes you need to block/evade and be familiar with the cooldown rotations of your 10 +15 skills and the cooldowns of each mantra. Is amazing once mastered, buy WAY harder to play than condi Herald or Renegades.

That are my two cents of the topic. Hizen (which is a master at soloing PvE content) thinks that the two easiest classes for that task are Revs and Necros, and I'm waiting to see if He makes any changes over his older builds for those classes. Imo condi Herald and power Renegade are the most friendly solo builds which perform the best at extra hard content.

The enire fb part is completely wrong. I really dont understand why you mentioned the viper sc build. you can use full trailblazer as condi without really losing damage. Condi ren does A LOT more dmg than herald and the battle scars variant has enough sustain to solo all the bounties. Condi ren is not squishier than power. The opposite thanks to op trailblazer.Going herald makes you even more tanky but you lose a lot. Lord Hizen builds focus way too much on survivability. You are the only dmg source in solos so thats not a good approach.Regarding fb. It has currently the fastest fractal cm solos. saying its only good for burst is just wrong. Well it is like that if you use a Lord Hizen build. Use instead:

That Lord Hizen build you mentioned is only good vs normal mobs. The builds i linked are better vs everything else.

[Buran.3796]

@"Nephalem.8921" said:

The enire fb part is completely wrong. I really dont understand why you mentioned the viper sc build. you can use full trailblazer as condi without really losing damage. Condi ren does A LOT more dmg than herald and the battle scars variant has enough sustain to solo all the bounties. Condi ren is not squishier than power. The opposite thanks to op trailblazer.Going herald makes you even more tanky but you lose a lot. Lord Hizen builds focus way too much on survivability. You are the only dmg source in solos so thats not a good approach.Regarding fb. It has currently the fastest fractal cm solos. saying its only good for burst is just wrong. Well it is like that if you use a Lord Hizen build. Use instead:

That Lord Hizen build you mentioned is only good vs normal mobs. The builds i linked are better vs everything else.

I'll watch the examples and respond later after doing my own research and testing (probably this weekend or in a few days) because I'm not dogmatic and I'm trully interested in to learn more about using different playstyles and maybe finding out ways which could fit me/serve me the best. So I'll test that with an open mind and genuine interest. Will come to share my impressions later.

But about trailblazer instead of viper, I don't thing that changes the things too much: the damage is very close (~90%) while giving us way more HP and armor to prevent one shoots, but a trailblazer Renegade doesn't change its features: lives on fastly refilling HP from damage suffered, but lacks active mitigation, stability and the same amount of CC that the power variant has. And despite trailblazer is arguably strong due you only need two stats to do condi damage (condition and condition duration) I don't find that stat "op" because due the power creep from the expansions a lot of power builds only need two stats also (power and crit damage) because now there's a lot of skills and traits which enhance critical chance to the point that crit chance is no longer mandatory, making some builds based on Cavalier stats as "op".

[AliamRationem.5172]

What kind of sustained DPS do you typically see using these power sustain rev builds or the tanky condi variants? How about bursts (5-10s window?)?

[mizaru.1385]

Actually for Hizen's upcoming revenant build for open world, the strongest one where he mentioned is actually core revenant. We shall wait and see his upcoming updated build.

[taara.3217]

@Buran.3796 said:Condi Herald is more tanky and able to solo almost everything, but kills at slower paceI have tested Condi Herald and Condi Ren in Mordrem Flower Hero Point (Auric Basin), about 10 cycles, found not any significant distinctions in time to kill it.is pure meleyes, its really so power Renegade is a bit less tanky but does more damage as I said above, I found not any significant distinctions can be played both at range, mele or mixing both styles that's right, but as another point of view, its can be some pain with creatures that has reflect projectiles abilities

[taara.3217]

@Nephalem.8921 said:Condi ren does A LOT more dmg than heraldHave you tested, say, on some real Champ in OpenWorld both and have seen a LOT difference?

Going herald makes you even more tanky but you lose a lot. Lord Hizen builds focus way too much on survivabilityIt makes sense. You can make 100% more DPS, but if the result of you fight is your death - what for?

[Nephalem.8921]

@taara.3217 said:

@Nephalem.8921 said:Condi ren does A LOT more dmg than heraldHave you tested, say, on some real Champ in OpenWorld both and have seen a LOT difference?

Yes. Renegade comes with vigor and perma 25might and a 10%mod. 25%vs bleeding. Also range and easy vuln access. Even a 15% condi dmg mod if you can melee and stack a bit might with mace.

Going herald makes you even more tanky but you lose a lot. Lord Hizen builds focus way too much on survivabilityIt makes sense. You can make 100% more DPS, but if the result of you fight is your death - what for?

You have to try really hard to die as a tb ren. Devastation + icerazor make you immortal.

[taara.3217]

@Nephalem.8921 said:Yes. Renegade comes with vigor and perma 25might and a 10%mod. 25%vs bleeding. Also range and easy vuln access. Even a 15% condi dmg mod if you can melee and stack a bit might with mace.I have tested both in Mordrem Flower Hero Point (Auric Basin) and found not any significant distinctions in time to kill it (the same equipment, stats, runes - all the same, except for, of course, Short Bow and Renegade trait). If Renegade were a LOT more damager, I would've seen this, wouldn`t I (say, 2 min to kill as Herald vs 1 min as Renegade)?

On the other side, sure, I have not much experience playing Ren (I tried, but found nothing interesting to me), that is why maybe I did something wrong... Can you make video with Ren in Mordrem Flower Hero Point ? It will be interesting to me to look at real Ren they're talking about. Or somebody can?

[AliamRationem.5172]

@taara.3217 said:

@Nephalem.8921 said:Yes. Renegade comes with vigor and perma 25might and a 10%mod. 25%vs bleeding. Also range and easy vuln access. Even a 15% condi dmg mod if you can melee and stack a bit might with mace.I have tested both in Mordrem Flower Hero Point (Auric Basin) and found not any significant distinctions in time to kill it (the same equipment, stats, runes - all the same, except for, of course, Short Bow and Renegade trait). If Renegade were a LOT more damager, I would've seen this, wouldn`t I (say, 2 min to kill as Herald vs 1 min as Renegade)?

On the other side, sure, I have not much experience playing Ren (I tried, but found nothing interesting to me), that is why maybe I did something wrong... Can you make video with Ren in Mordrem Flower Hero Point ? It will be interesting to me to look at real Ren they're talking about. Or somebody can?

Mordrem Flower is not a good test of sustain because it's too slow to hit you if you just keep circling around to its flank. Both builds should survive just as well in this environment. I'm sure you know how well you perform with these builds, but I'm not you. This test doesn't shed much light on the relative strengths of these builds.

[taara.3217]

@AliamRationem.5172 said:Mordrem Flower is not a good test ...If one a LOT more damager than other, I will see it, that is enough and that is all that I want to see. Mordrem Flower is good only because it simple enough not to spend much time in defence, but cause damage + there are not many people around and you can fight solo much time - only those reasons.

P.S. Your Weaver is cool )