Dantheman.3589 Posted November 7, 2020 Author Share Posted November 7, 2020 @"Arheundel.6451" said:Because the same people who ask for "constructive feedback" used "unconstructive feedback" while asking for nerfs on other professions........I laugh when I see this type of threads, I mean similar builds have been gutted to oblivion for far less . Why in hell should renegade take a free pass when Fire weaver was gutted to the ground while being even less stackable?.We seen teams winning tournaments while playing even 3 revenants.....still weaver got destroyed by nerfs while we never seen a team winning tournaments while using 3 weavers....not even 2....actually fire weaver even at its peak was sporadically used for AT.What are again the weaknesses of Kalla/Jallis....:-Lack of strong condi removal ?....Fire weaver wasn't exactly swimming in condi removal-Lack of range?.....Actually Kalla users have strong ranged pressure with that artillery shortbow compared to Fire weaver-Lack of teamfight potential?....Hell no...Renegade can teamfight/sidenode more than fire weaver, Jalllis alone can turn the tables in a teamfight-Lack of reflect?...Actually renegades have access to block projectiles so....Renegades even have more stability than Fire weaver pre-Feb patch.....the more I think...the more these double standards are apparentUhh excuse me, I don’t remember asking for nerfs with unconstructive feedback... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 @Dantheman.3589 said:@"Arheundel.6451" said:Because the same people who ask for "constructive feedback" used "unconstructive feedback" while asking for nerfs on other professions........I laugh when I see this type of threads, I mean similar builds have been gutted to oblivion for far less . Why in hell should renegade take a free pass when Fire weaver was gutted to the ground while being even less stackable?.We seen teams winning tournaments while playing even 3 revenants.....still weaver got destroyed by nerfs while we never seen a team winning tournaments while using 3 weavers....not even 2....actually fire weaver even at its peak was sporadically used for AT.What are again the weaknesses of Kalla/Jallis....:-Lack of strong condi removal ?....Fire weaver wasn't exactly swimming in condi removal-Lack of range?.....Actually Kalla users have strong ranged pressure with that artillery shortbow compared to Fire weaver-Lack of teamfight potential?....Hell no...Renegade can teamfight/sidenode more than fire weaver, Jalllis alone can turn the tables in a teamfight-Lack of reflect?...Actually renegades have access to block projectiles so....Renegades even have more stability than Fire weaver pre-Feb patch.....the more I think...the more these double standards are apparentUhh excuse me, I don’t remember asking for nerfs with unconstructive feedback...Apologies...wasn't exactly talking about you, should have specified.I am just angry in general at the direction this game has taken , I hate how gameplay options get removed from the game for being "too toxic"..only to be reintroduced later on another profession with double oppression rateRenegade is just being played like and old school fire weaver, they share the same weaknesses but the renegade offers even more dmg, from range with the addition of strong teamfight presence.......but they still destroyed fire weaver with a nasty vengeance set of nerfs...meanwhile teams in AT play with double/triple rev...the double standards are unrealI don't even care if they nerf or buff renegade...I am just pissed at the arguments people use "to defend" this build...like fire weaver was that much worst.....People tell you to outrotate the renegade or don't stand on the point...funny though, the same strategy would have worked against all specs previously played like renegade..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuma.1503 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 @Arheundel.6451 said:@Dantheman.3589 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:Because the same people who ask for "constructive feedback" used "unconstructive feedback" while asking for nerfs on other professions........I laugh when I see this type of threads, I mean similar builds have been gutted to oblivion for far less . Why in hell should renegade take a free pass when Fire weaver was gutted to the ground while being even less stackable?.We seen teams winning tournaments while playing even 3 revenants.....still weaver got destroyed by nerfs while we never seen a team winning tournaments while using 3 weavers....not even 2....actually fire weaver even at its peak was sporadically used for AT.What are again the weaknesses of Kalla/Jallis....:-Lack of strong condi removal ?....Fire weaver wasn't exactly swimming in condi removal-Lack of range?.....Actually Kalla users have strong ranged pressure with that artillery shortbow compared to Fire weaver-Lack of teamfight potential?....Hell no...Renegade can teamfight/sidenode more than fire weaver, Jalllis alone can turn the tables in a teamfight-Lack of reflect?...Actually renegades have access to block projectiles so....Renegades even have more stability than Fire weaver pre-Feb patch.....the more I think...the more these double standards are apparentUhh excuse me, I don’t remember asking for nerfs with unconstructive feedback...Apologies...wasn't exactly talking about you, should have specified.I am just angry in general at the direction this game has taken , I hate how gameplay options get removed from the game for being "too toxic"..only to be reintroduced later on another profession with double oppression rateRenegade is just being played like and old school fire weaver, they share the same weaknesses but the renegade offers even more dmg, from range with the addition of strong teamfight presence.......but they still destroyed fire weaver with a nasty vengeance set of nerfs...meanwhile teams in AT play with double/triple rev...the double standards are unrealI don't even care if they nerf or buff renegade...I am just pissed at the arguments people use "to defend" this build...like fire weaver was that much worst.....People tell you to outrotate the renegade or don't stand on the point...funny though, the same strategy would have worked against all specs previously played like renegade.....Believe me, as someone who ended up in deleting his ele after getting tired of patch after patch of undeserved nerfs, I understand your frustration. If possible I'd like to see a reversal of this trend of just gutting things because "It's meta/ It won a tournament therefore nerf it". How to accomplish that goal? I'm at a loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megametzler.5729 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 @Kuma.1503 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Dantheman.3589 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:Because the same people who ask for "constructive feedback" used "unconstructive feedback" while asking for nerfs on other professions........I laugh when I see this type of threads, I mean similar builds have been gutted to oblivion for far less . Why in hell should renegade take a free pass when Fire weaver was gutted to the ground while being even less stackable?.We seen teams winning tournaments while playing even 3 revenants.....still weaver got destroyed by nerfs while we never seen a team winning tournaments while using 3 weavers....not even 2....actually fire weaver even at its peak was sporadically used for AT.What are again the weaknesses of Kalla/Jallis....:-Lack of strong condi removal ?....Fire weaver wasn't exactly swimming in condi removal-Lack of range?.....Actually Kalla users have strong ranged pressure with that artillery shortbow compared to Fire weaver-Lack of teamfight potential?....Hell no...Renegade can teamfight/sidenode more than fire weaver, Jalllis alone can turn the tables in a teamfight-Lack of reflect?...Actually renegades have access to block projectiles so....Renegades even have more stability than Fire weaver pre-Feb patch.....the more I think...the more these double standards are apparentUhh excuse me, I don’t remember asking for nerfs with unconstructive feedback...Apologies...wasn't exactly talking about you, should have specified.I am just angry in general at the direction this game has taken , I hate how gameplay options get removed from the game for being "too toxic"..only to be reintroduced later on another profession with double oppression rateRenegade is just being played like and old school fire weaver, they share the same weaknesses but the renegade offers even more dmg, from range with the addition of strong teamfight presence.......but they still destroyed fire weaver with a nasty vengeance set of nerfs...meanwhile teams in AT play with double/triple rev...the double standards are unrealI don't even care if they nerf or buff renegade...I am just pissed at the arguments people use "to defend" this build...like fire weaver was that much worst.....People tell you to outrotate the renegade or don't stand on the point...funny though, the same strategy would have worked against all specs previously played like renegade.....Believe me, as someone who ended up in deleting his ele after getting tired of patch after patch of undeserved nerfs, I understand your frustration. If possible I'd like to see a reversal of this trend of just gutting things because "It's meta/ It won a tournament therefore nerf it". How to accomplish that goal? I'm at a loss. I just wish for two things.Either actually delete every spec being "commonly used in ATs" (looking at you, holorevnecthief).Or Anet being able to properly balance things. Any weaver build got destroyed because of fire weaver (which needed tweaks, definitely agreed with that).Now we're stuck once more with this horribly boring support crap... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ollbirtan.2915 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 Imagine, saying Fire Weaver play style is similar to Renegade's....This is incorrect on so many levels. I'm not justifying weaver nerfs - actually I am sick of anet listening to 'OMGH NERF THIS' threads and gutting the game step by step. Renegade has never been seen even semi viable sometime until Feb- March. I used to play Rene for about 2.5 years in ranked and I would get so much toxicity from teammates when they see me on a Rene. Even back then Jalis/ Kala rene worked if you were good at it - same goes to every other class.Also, the only "buff" that rene received was Sevenshot pathing/tracing "fix". It's damage was reduced recently, that's on top of the blanket nerfs to call classes damage in Feb. Healing coefficients were gutted to being irrelevant. Mad King runes were also made useless, so no more "insta heal". Renegade has never been "buffed". It's just became more viable due to overall blanket nerfs, and now people are crying that the class is OP. I get it - change can be sooooooooooo hard, but kitten get over it and adapt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virdo.1540 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 @Kachros.4751 said:@ollbirtan.2915 said:@Kachros.4751 said:Yeah when I 1v1 against one of the better rev players in the game it can feel like a different ball game, but still winnable if I don’t have to worried about being constantly 1v2d by a thief.There is honestly just no way to get the kill on a decent renegade without playing holo, burn guard or condi herald (burn guard n condi herald cant get the full kill because of kiting), and holo struggles alone hence why a thief +1 is needed. You just named THREE class counters to the rene yourself. And a +1 which is standard to counter any sidenoder. What is your problem, seriously? My problem is that its unhealthy for the game. I enjoy pvp and i want to see people get punished for a lack of skillhm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 @"ollbirtan.2915" said:Imagine, saying Fire Weaver play style is similar to Renegade's....This is incorrect on so many levels. I'm not justifying weaver nerfs - actually I am sick of anet listening to 'OMGH NERF THIS' threads and gutting the game step by step. Renegade has never been seen even semi viable sometime until Feb- March. I used to play Rene for about 2.5 years in ranked and I would get so much toxicity from teammates when they see me on a Rene. Even back then Jalis/ Kala rene worked if you were good at it - same goes to every other class.Also, the only "buff" that rene received was Sevenshot pathing/tracing "fix". It's damage was reduced recently, that's on top of the blanket nerfs to call classes damage in Feb. Healing coefficients were gutted to being irrelevant. Mad King runes were also made useless, so no more "insta heal". Renegade has never been "buffed". It's just became more viable due to overall blanket nerfs, and now people are crying that the class is OP. I get it - change can be sooooooooooo hard, but kitten get over it and adapt. I am not asking for more nerfs on renegade, the dmg nerfs on shortbow were enough I believe...what I am talking about is people's attitude , especially when we face a strong AoE presence on point, when it's their class...you should learn how to kite and LoS from them....when it's your class.....it's not possible to kite or LoS so nerfWhen I have compared renegade to fire weaver I wasn't specifically talking about the playstyle but rather the gameplay which is mostlyslow moving melee centered AoE cleave , renegade is all about creating AoE denial on a point.Fire weaver was the first damn thing eles could duel with after years spent on retarded healbot with Tempest...but it got nerfed.....not nerfed.....it got DESTROYED, fundamentally speaking yes the nerfs were necessary, was too tanky (possibly) but the build should have not be deleted from the freaking game : they nerfed its sustain first, they then nerfed its dmg, then they removed the access to stability ...then they nerfed the sustain some more...jesus.Then people tried to play FA weaver...people whined again and they nerfed that one too (arcane skills do now less damage than a thief auto-attack with cleric stats).....then people tried LR weaver......people whined again QQ "I am dying to ele pls nerf"....they nerfed that one too.Now eles went back full circle playing healbot..all because people can't fucking stand the idea of dying to an ele after years of healbotting , that's all ele should be played for apparently.yeah like you I wish Anet would stop listening to every whining thread on this forum and instead base balance on actual numbers and data...no whimsical drama charged "feedback"Apologies if I came too strong on you...I am not trying to direct my frustration at you, I am trying not to be too invested in this game anymore, I log in once in while to craft something and log out.....generally I am still angry that my main class is reduced to a semi viable sub-monk when in the previous installation of the game (GW1) I used to be the greatest damage dealer in the game as far as class goes and above average duellist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manny.1084 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 @"ollbirtan.2915" said:Nice flex indeed. Being in that pvp balance discord with the infamous 1/4 of a 'anet' dev is indeed something to be proud of. Wonder why so few of the proposed changes on that discord made their way to the game? Meanwhile, that infamous 'pvp dev' listens to the cries of the "forum warriors" who were stomped by [insert class here] and refuse to learn.Also, you should know by now that rank means absolutely nothing these days as MM is botched and wintrades are very common.Lastly, you are referring to condi herald and burn dh/guard -----this is old news man. While DH does see some use now in mats despite the last round of guard nerfs, condi herald has been gutted 2 seasons ago because of the posts like this. GJ dismantling the game piece by piece until all we have is AA and a loincloth. clown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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