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Why do people hate Trahearne?


Adonan.8356

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I just finished the cleansing ritual of Orr, so maybe I haven't seen everything yet, but he doesn't seem too bad to me. I've heard that people think he's a Gary Stu, and while I would say he's dry in terms of character, he doesn't seem like a Gary Stu. The dialogue never gave me the impression he was the greatest necromancer in Tyria or anything like that, rather he was just competent. To me, he's like a tradesman with several years of work experience under his belt. He's probably rather special in the eyes of the Pale Tree, but nothing too extreme. His Wyld Hunt consisted of him cleansing Orr, but that's it.

He'll probably join the forces in taking down the dragon, but he's certainly not doing it alone. As such, I never got any kind of, "chosen one" vibe from him. If anything, the player character is closer to that niche. The only negatives I can think of is his marshal status and his lack of character development. He never goes through any kind of struggle, and he picks up his role as marshal with ease despite never leading such a large force before. As far as I remember, he's never made any mistakes, which is unbelievable. Overall, I do think he's a rather dry and boring character, but I don't hate him. Does he do something later to earn that ire?

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Really? I never got that impression. The annoying voice thing is subjective, but he's with us through most of the events after the attack on Claw Island. I would agree that most of the NPCs seem to congratulate him more often than not on a job that took a group of people. Still, he acknowledges our role at the very least.

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@Adonan.8356 said:Really? I never got that impression. The annoying voice thing is subjective, but he's with us through most of the events after the attack on Claw Island. I would agree that most of the NPCs seem to congratulate him more often than not on a job that took a group of people. Still, he acknowledges our role at the very least.

I hear people compare Trehearne to Kormir, because they feel their accomplishments and glory are being stolen. Though any sort of critical thinking would make you understand why these characters are needed, especially in an MMO.

I still hear complaints of how come the player character was not allowed to ascend to godhood in GW1... I mean come on people...

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Some say because he was just suddenly introduced in their personal story. Sylvari characters have known him from theirs at an early stage. If you played the Sylvari story, you may hate him less or not at all.

Some say he stole our glory. But that's the price you pay for having a branched-out storyline that eventually merges at the end with a VIP character that has so many variables i.e. - the Commander's gender, race and class ranges from a male Norn Mesmer to a female Charr Thief. The whole Personal story, the dialogues and interactions has to have a character that NPCs can interact with and address as a static entity, and not just "Commander without a Pronoun." Trahearne is that anchor.

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He was originally voiced to be awkward and unsure. Being a firstborn sylvari, he also never learned to socialize like other mortals do and does not express his emotions with his voice. He is a bookworm and not actually very comfortable with going out into the field, however, he is guided by the sylvari's wild hunt to do these things.

Basically his voice matches his backstory just fine. People just don't like that he is an awkward character.

And stealing glory. He never does that. He becomes the pact marshal and that is pretty much it. And he didn't even become pact marshal out of popularity. He is appointed that position exactly because he seems so aloof. He is neutral, so he brought the least complaints from the three orders.

Some players are just paranoid.

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@Tyson.5160 said:I hear people compare Trehearne to Kormir, because they feel their accomplishments and glory are being stolen. Though any sort of critical thinking would make you understand why these characters are needed, especially in an MMO.

I still hear complaints of how come the player character was not allowed to ascend to godhood in GW1... I mean come on people...

@"borgs.6103" said:Some say because he was just suddenly introduced in their personal story. Sylvari characters have known him from theirs at an early stage. If you played the Sylvari story, you may hate him less or not at all.

Some say he stole our glory. But that's the price you pay for having a branched-out storyline that eventually merges at the end with a VIP character that has so many variables i.e. - the Commander's gender, race and class ranges from a male Norn Mesmer to a female Charr Thief. The whole Personal story, the dialogues and interactions has to have a character that NPCs can interact with and address as a static entity, and not just "Commander without a Pronoun." Trahearne is that anchor.

@PseudoNewb.5468 said:He was originally voiced to be awkward and unsure. Being a firstborn sylvari, he also never learned to socialize like other mortals do and does not express his emotions with his voice. He is a bookworm and not actually very comfortable with going out into the field, however, he is guided by the sylvari's wild hunt to do these things.

Basically his voice matches his backstory just fine. People just don't like that he is an awkward character.

And stealing glory. He never does that. He becomes the pact marshal and that is pretty much it. And he didn't even become pact marshal out of popularity. He is appointed that position exactly because he seems so aloof. He is neutral, so he brought the least complaints from the three orders.

Some players are just paranoid.

See, this all makes sense to me. In fact, I'll probably make a Sylvari just to learn more about Trahearne. He seems dry to me, but if what PseudoNewb said is true, there's probably more to him than what I see.

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If all these players complaining about Trahearne played GuildWars1, It would not be the case.Kittensss, Kormir in the last Nightfall missions to the abaddon fight, she's just here like, " I follow you but I'm not going to participate in your fights even if you'r next to me dying ".And then, at the end, takes all the glory, became a Godess, and tells you " It's your world, take care of it" or even " You'r not fighting alone ", and kitten leaves you alone, you and your efforts, not even a thanks, nothing, she caused all this , you fixed all, and she just go doing her godly manicure.

Yes I hate Kormir, that, much. Trahearne at least respects you.

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@"Teratus.2859" said:Most common complaints that I recall are.

  1. His voice is annoying.
  2. We do all the work and he steals all our glory.

I don't mind him personally but I can see why others dislike him so much.

These are the main complaints. There's a third though: That he comes out of nowhere to replace the mentor, who was much more liked.

Though Trahearne doesn't really steal any glory at all. He always credits us, except for one thing: Fort Trinity's name. But he was still the one who decided to use it, so his wording isn't wrong - he doesn't say "I came up with the name", he says "I decided to call it this".

And for the third complaint, he only "comes out of nowhere" for non-sylvari players. Which is the majority of players.

@"Only Even.6193" said:If all these players complaining about Trahearne played GuildWars1, It would not be the case.Kittensss, Kormir in the last Nightfall missions to the abaddon fight, she's just here like, " I follow you but I'm not going to participate in your fights even if you'r next to me dying ".And then, at the end, takes all the glory, became a Godess, and tells you " It's your world, take care of it" or even " You'r not fighting alone ", and kitten leaves you alone, you and your efforts, not even a thanks, nothing, she caused all this , you fixed all, and she just go doing her godly manicure.

Yes I hate Kormir, that, much. Trahearne at least respects you.

Most complainers about Trahearne actually call him a Kormir 2.0.

Also, to your "I will not fight" -Komir issue...

Do you really want a blind person throwing spears around?

And, to be fair, Kormir as a goddess doesn't do nothing. She did help - within the gods' rules of allowance - the Sunspears with Joko. It's just that the rules of "gods are not allowed to interfere" - which exists to prevent a second Desolation - prevented her from doing enough. (Same with Balthazar)

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I liked trahearne, and his voice actor. I did start out on a sylvari too, so i don't know if that made a difference.I kinda get tired of being the main hero in every mmo, but i didnt feel like he stole the glory in core game. It was more of teamwork to bring down zhaitan and help him with his mission to cleanse orr.

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@"Only Even.6193" said:If all these players complaining about Trahearne played GuildWars1, It would not be the case.Kittensss, Kormir in the last Nightfall missions to the abaddon fight, she's just here like, " I follow you but I'm not going to participate in your fights even if you'r next to me dying ".And then, at the end, takes all the glory, became a Godess, and tells you " It's your world, take care of it" or even " You'r not fighting alone ", and kitten leaves you alone, you and your efforts, not even a thanks, nothing, she caused all this , you fixed all, and she just go doing her godly manicure.

Yes I hate Kormir, that, much. Trahearne at least respects you.

The thing with Kormir is, in lore she fought alongside us.The fact that Kormir hardly did anything as an NPC, if anything at all (I can't remember), was to prevent a second Prince Rurik.Prince Rurik kept rushing at enemies, taking aggro and thus dying, making missions end failure semi-regularly (especially after the introduction of the hard mode).

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As a 2016 player, i had to look around to figure out why. ANet re-recorded his lines and replaced some of his dialogue around 2014. A lot of why people say they hate him now is because its a phunny GW2 memer. At the time (pre-2014), it seems like he had spotlight-stealing, poorly done dialogue that irked everyone. Now though, he's not really all that bad.I don't mind Trahearne, and from doing the the Sylvari story, i think he's alright.

I think 99.9% of the personal story is atrocious, though. As in, of the level i'd expect of a children's TV programme. Truly, truly dreadful writing, characters, storytelling -- all topped off with awful animations. Ugh...

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I was fine with the character, but I really found the voice acting awful. He sounds like an Oblivion NPC. So flat and disconnected. It didn't read like a deliberate character choice to me, just an actor that wasn't very good. Otherwise I didn't really have an issue with him. Echoing the sentiments of a few people here, characters like Trahearne are necessary to give MMO stories some consistency and cohesion, though they could've better employed Trahearne as a figure in the other racial origins so he doesn't feel like a random addition to non-sylvari.

I never understood the Kormir hate, but again I don't have issue with NPCs having important roles in the plot. Some people just lose it when they're not endlessly catered to.

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Teratus.2859" said:Most common complaints that I recall are.
  1. His voice is annoying.
  2. We do all the work and he steals all our glory.

I don't mind him personally but I can see why others dislike him so much.

These are the main complaints. There's a third though: That he comes out of nowhere to replace the mentor, who was much more liked.

Though Trahearne doesn't really steal any glory at all. He
always
credits us, except for one thing: Fort Trinity's name. But he was still the one who decided to use it, so his wording isn't wrong - he doesn't say "I came up with the name", he says "I decided to call it this".

And for the third complaint, he only "comes out of nowhere" for non-sylvari players. Which is the majority of players.

Aye, there is quite a lot of this within Gw2's core world story.

Another one of these uninformed situations is the Human Charr peace which you'll only witness come to pass if you play the Vigil story line over the other orders, prior to this it's actually kind of weird for them to cross territory but that isn't reflected in the game until later maps which are post peace treaty where you can see human and charr soliders are at odds and arguing a lot around certain Ascalon regions.

The early dungeon story's are all screwed up as well in terms of canon if you don't have preexisting knowledge of their chronological order.Ascalon Catacombs story takes place after meeting Destiny's Edge in Lions arch which is a story instance level locked 10 levels higher than the required level for the dungeon itself.

Caudecus Manor story takes place after the Charr Human peace talks which as said above you'll only experience if you play the Vigil storyline.

Twilight Arbour and the rest of the dungeons I believe take place after the events of A Light in the Darkness which is the only time I can recall a main character within the personal story note how essential Destiny's edge will be in the overall story.. basically the biggest hint you'll get to play the dungeon story modes.Traherne: "These visions represent a possible future for Destiny's Edge should they not resolve their quarrels. We need them to reconcile if we're to defeat Zhaitan."

Since you get mail about the dungeons at certain levels rather than at the appropriate time within the personal story (which is often much later than the level cap) this is easily one of the most messy, confusing and annoying problems with the core game's story.

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@Teratus.2859 said:Another one of these uninformed situations is the Human Charr peace which you'll only witness come to pass if you play the Vigil story line over the other orderCaudecus Manor story takes place after the Charr Human peace talks which as said above you'll only experience if you play the Vigil storyline.

The treaty has been a thing the Vigil pushed in the book Ghosts of Ascalon though.There was also the part in the book Edge of Destiny when Logan freed Charr prisoners who then fought alongside humans against the Branded.Even as early as GW1, we have had Humans fight alongside Charr during the EotN campaign.

Not everyone likes transmedia narratives, but the Human-Charr treaty shouldn't come out of nowhere, even for non-Vigil players.

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@Fueki.4753 said:

@Teratus.2859 said:Another one of these uninformed situations is the Human Charr peace which you'll only witness come to pass if you play the Vigil story line over the other orderCaudecus Manor story takes place after the Charr Human peace talks which as said above you'll only experience if you play the Vigil storyline.

The treaty has been a thing the Vigil pushed in the book
Ghosts of Ascalon
though.There was also the part in the book
Edge of Destiny
when Logan freed Charr prisoners who then fought alongside humans against the Branded.Even as early as GW1, we have had Humans fight alongside Charr during the EotN campaign.

Not everyone likes transmedia narratives, but the Human-Charr treaty shouldn't come out of nowhere, even for non-Vigil players.

Yeah but the treaty wasn't officially put in place until the Vigil story in game.Prior to that it was at best a tense truce.. early days of Human/Charr post war mistrust etc. much of which was build more on a common enemy (Dragons) rather than a desire to end hostilities.Many Charr and Humans still hated one another even after the peace was officially declared by the Legions and the Ministry.

What I was getting at though wasn't that the Human-Charr treaty comes out of nowhere, it's that it happens specifically at a certain point in the Personal story and you only know what that point is if you joined the Vigil.

The event's of Caudicus Manor's story mode is directly tied into that side narrative since the reason for the party at the manor was to celebrate the officially declared peace between Humans and Charr which is also the reason for the attack on the manor as well to destroy that peace.The problem is you not only get access to this story mission before you can access the personal story mission where the peace talks happen it's that you get made aware of this content via in game mail which advertises story content based on events you can't possibly have witnessed yet.

The same problem happens with Ascalon Catacombs if you play the content when it's first advertised to you, Why is Eir in the Tomb annoying ghosts?.Well you don't find out the setup for that dungeon until a personal story mission you can only access 10 levels after the dungeon and the mail that notifies you about it.This story instance is also the first time you'll ever meet the other members of Desiny's edge as well.

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The same problem happens with Ascalon Catacombs if you play the content when it's first advertised to you, Why is Eir in the Tomb annoying ghosts?.Well you don't find out the setup for that dungeon until a personal story mission you can only access 10 levels after the dungeon and the mail that notifies you about it.This story instance is also the first time you'll ever meet the other members of Desiny's edge as well.

This specific problem didn't even exist when the game launched.Back then, when the personal story was not ripped apart and locked behind every 10 levels, the pacing made much more sense.I distinctly remember getting the letter about Eir in the catacombs around the time I witnessed that scene in Lion's Arch.I still don't know why Arenanet had to put in the hard locks on the story.

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@Fueki.4753 said:

The same problem happens with Ascalon Catacombs if you play the content when it's first advertised to you, Why is Eir in the Tomb annoying ghosts?.Well you don't find out the setup for that dungeon until a personal story mission you can only access 10 levels after the dungeon and the mail that notifies you about it.This story instance is also the first time you'll ever meet the other members of Desiny's edge as well.

This specific problem didn't even exist when the game launched.Back then, when the personal story was not ripped apart and locked behind every 10 levels, the pacing made much more sense.I distinctly remember getting the letter about Eir in the catacombs around the time I witnessed that scene in Lion's Arch.I still don't know why Arenanet had to put in the hard locks on the story.

Yea this was something they really overlooked when they started messing with the personal story structure.It's probably not a big deal to most players but it really really bothers me.

Story is the main thing I enjoy about the Guildwars franchise.

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@Teratus.2859 said:

The same problem happens with Ascalon Catacombs if you play the content when it's first advertised to you, Why is Eir in the Tomb annoying ghosts?.Well you don't find out the setup for that dungeon until a personal story mission you can only access 10 levels after the dungeon and the mail that notifies you about it.This story instance is also the first time you'll ever meet the other members of Desiny's edge as well.

This specific problem didn't even exist when the game launched.Back then, when the personal story was not ripped apart and locked behind every 10 levels, the pacing made much more sense.I distinctly remember getting the letter about Eir in the catacombs around the time I witnessed that scene in Lion's Arch.I still don't know why Arenanet had to put in the hard locks on the story.

Yea this was something they really overlooked when they started messing with the personal story structure.It's probably not a big deal to most players but it really really bothers me.

Story is the main thing I enjoy about the Guildwars franchise.

It bothers me, too.They should have split the meeting with Destiny's Edge off of the other mission and put it at the end of the level 30 missions.

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@PseudoNewb.5468 said:He was originally voiced to be awkward and unsure. Being a firstborn sylvari, he also never learned to socialize like other mortals do and does not express his emotions with his voice. He is a bookworm and not actually very comfortable with going out into the field, however, he is guided by the sylvari's wild hunt to do these things.

Basically his voice matches his backstory just fine. People just don't like that he is an awkward character.

And stealing glory. He never does that. He becomes the pact marshal and that is pretty much it. And he didn't even become pact marshal out of popularity. He is appointed that position exactly because he seems so aloof. He is neutral, so he brought the least complaints from the three orders.

Some players are just paranoid.

The bolded is likely the most important but unspoken reason. An awkward character dared compete for any story focus. Imo, most of the criticisms are trying to rationalize why the PC shouldn't have to compete with a weak or awkward character for attention.

20/20 is hindsight, but I would given Trahearne a skill bar that better mirrored their character. Perhaps a unique skill bar based on being a scholar/supporter and not a fighter. The voice direction for all Sylvari makes them come off as a prep school drama club which doesn't help either.

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