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Thoughts on DRMs?


lezbefriends.7516

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I thought eSports was PvP? (Specifically streaming PvP tournaments.)

I like the DRMs, although I've only done the public version without CMs so I'm not sure how different that is. They remind me of Season 1 content, but without the downside that if you don't do them right away they're gone forever and you've missed out. I've done all of the existing ones multiple times (enough to get all the rewards and a bunch of extra support marks or whatever they're called) and I expect I'll do the new ones multiple times too.

But no one's going to like everything in GW2 and there's no need to because there's plenty of other stuff available. If you prefer stikes and raids then the good news is they haven't gone anywhere so you can keep on playing them instead. :)

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The DRM that we got are basically single player experiences and it is not very exciting to play them as a group because of their linear progression. DRMs can be designed to be group content where players split up to obtain various objectives then culminating in a final boss. This would actually make them re-playable and fun.

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The problem with drms are the reward system. Something as small as adding account bound volcanic weapons to the vendor for 300 to 150 tokens each would add a reason to do them. Currently doing the cms are pointless because their rewards are awful, and you get the same amount of prismitite ore no matter now many cms there are.Compare dmrs reward system to strikes or raids. Even though getting enough prophet crystals to get the full runic set would takes about a month or two, every strike got you progressively closer to finishing the set. Same could be said about raid rewards, if you really wanted a dhumm chair, every successful raid clear got you a few tokens closer to completion. The lucky drops in both cases were time saver, not the intended way to earn the skins.

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I think they were good in the Story instances even if a little repetitive.

What I don't like is taking those story instances and trying to turn them into repeatable content. They boil down to being a Heart Vendor to Escort to Uninteresting HP sponge boss fight that take way too long and give little to no rewards.

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@"Mortifera.6138" said:So DRMs are continuing in the new Champions episode... am I the only one who doesn’t like them? I want eSports (Strikes and Raids), not another mini-game. Sigh.

Not a fan of the DRM's either: Ran the first 3, well 2.5 actually, last patch day and to be honest I just see them as " Recycled filler content implemented on a shoe-string budget": Old maps upcycled or downcylced idk with old mobs, no exciting mechanics well as exciting as watching "paint-dry": The 3rd DRM with my group we were so utterly bored with it we quit it there and then, so the longevity of the last exciting episode lasted less than 30-40 mins for us and have we never returned since. DRM's would probably more acceptable in starter maps as an entry level instance prior to Strikes. My 5 year old niece likes them though.

Personally I feel Devs are devoting all their time to 3rd Xpac, Legendary Armoury, Alliances? perhaps by 2025, Steam release already on the "back-burner" but likely to be relaunched some time in 2021 and that's about all they can manage at present with the resources they have. These new Saga/Chapters/Episodes to me are just " budget filler content inbetween the Festivals" to keep players bemused thinking they are getting frequent updates still, but really there is no actual filler in them. I actually look forward far more to our Annual Festivals and the servers seem a lot busier player wise during Festivals than any of this Recycled old content. Roll on Lunar New Year & Season Adventure Box.

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@sniperman.1738 said:

@Mortifera.6138 said:So DRMs are continuing in the new Champions episode

of course they are. we'r in the age of absolutly minimum effort on ANet's part

I wouldn't say Minimum effort, remember they are trying to finish up a living story while working on an expansion.

I love GW2, but the decision not to invest in its future by working on an expansion to follow PoF was disastrous. They've since corrected course, but all that time was wasted and now they are playing catch up, causing current content releases to suffer. I'm glad they're working on EoD, but DRMs as a means of advancing the story are indeed low-effort and not at all satisfying.

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DRM's are ok as part of the story, grinding them out for achievements is immensly boring as they are not challenging at all. If it wasn'tfor the AP, I wouldn't do them more thanonce per chr that does the story.(I know this first batch was ok when it comes to grindy achis, but I'm counting on a "do each DRM 100 times" achi at some point, given my experience with the "saga" so far)

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The thing to consider... is that this isn't the only content that ArenaNet is working on right now. Indeed, they're also chipping away at the Canthan expansion. This was—quite unfortunate as it is—an executive mandate from NCSoft. ArenaNet wanted to continue with sagas from this point onward, which I believe might have been the right choice, but the bigwigs at NCSoft are all about their bottom-line as a publically traded corporation so an expansion was foisted upon ArenaNet without aught in the way of warning.

Thus, they have limited resources at hand. It isn't their fault that they find themselves in this position. Just as it isn't their fault Apple made continuing development on Mac platforms impossible. There are just a number of undesirable factors in confluence right now and they've no power to decide elsewise.

I'm not pleased about what's happened as I believe that the Cantha expansion could've happened at a much later date, I worry about crunch. I don't blame ArenaNet, though. I mean, this is what capitalism does for better and worse.

I am impressed, however, by what they've managed to achieve as I quite enjoyed the DRMs. Then again, my drive is for story, I don't find ephemeral numericals or "cheevos" as compelling as I reailse many do, so perhaps the ward system requires tweaking as they say. I wouldn't know. I do, however, agree that the bosses are a touch spongy. As a narrative experience to be taken as part of the greater whole of this Saga? I enjoy them. It was nice to see Taimi again and—shameless Icebrood cheerleader and Jormie proselytiser that I am—I was very excited to romp around alongside Ry-Ry. I might just be easy to please, especially where this storyline is concerned.

This, of course, brings us to the pricklier part of this assembly's proceedings: The obvious disenfranchisement of the hardcore.

I have discussed this topic at length. Raiding is a dopamine addiction, there's no end-point. I mean, it isn't just the drive for more difficult content because if it were, then one would chase the inverse-meta. One could equip sub-par items and utilise a strange, suboptimal build. This is about rewards and how they must be earned—if a reward is earned, it results in the dopamine hit that raiders simply need. However, this increases their power potential which means that future content must be more difficult. It's a never-ending cycle of difficulty vs. reward, and the further you strive down that sordid path, the less accessible to casual players your product becomes.

So here's the problem: Casuals are money, hardcore players are not. In the hardcore mindset, the need for reward dictates that ArenaNet should be doing all they can to sate that desire for the raider's "hard work." There is little concept of recompense that I have borne witness to in raid culture. What this means is that any product that isn't that one (World of Warcraft, yes) is doomed to bankruptcy. See: WildStar.

It's a matter of logistics. You have to consider the number of hardcore players (very few compared to other demographics), the cost of producing content entirely for them, and the profitability of that demographic. Unlike casuals, hardcore players are not money.

This is especially true in Guild Wars 2 where you know as well as I do that you can convert gold to gems—and who has the most gold? Raiders, the hardcore players. If you can convert gold to gems, you have no need to buy gems, and in conversing with any of the raiders I've met? They don't buy gems! Why would they? They can convert their excess masses of gold so why bother? ArenaNet has actually created a scenario in which hardcore players are even less profitable than they would be in other scenarios.

On the flipside? Casual players are money, as stated. We spend a lot of actual money on gems. ArenaNet needs actual money, not gold. I don't mean to be especially sardonic and patronising here (only a little) but NCSoft isn't interested in an ephemeral numerical. They care naught for however much gold you might have, their concern is only for filthy lucre, real world money to sate the ravenous hunger of their shareholders. If you've chosen to not be a source of this lucre, your words have no weight.

So this is a two-pronged issue: It's expensive to develop content for only one audience at the expense of all others, and that audience is the least profitable audience of all. That's why they've been throwing bones at best, it's why they're reusing content. You simply aren't profitable. You don't buy gems and what you want is unattainable.

Look at it this way: When you get to the point where ArenaNet can no longer deliver unto you that juicy, delectable, cajunga dopamine hit that you so desperately need, you'll all leave Guild Wars 2 in droves. This is what raiders do. They'll turn up at some game's doorstep as a minuscule yet ceaselessly chirruping mob, and they'll have unreasonable demands. I've seen it before so many times. Yes, trying to force any developer down this path—a path to bankruptcy—is unreasonable.

So you're not profitable and eventually you'll all leave anyway. NCSoft is a corporation interested in their bottom-line. Where's the profit to be made from appealing to you as a potential audience? Where's the money? The not-gold money?

Raid culture is its own self-fulfilling prophecy of doom. The problem is is that like gambling, operant conditioning chambers are addictions. If you really want an MMO to appeal to you above all else? Here's what you have to do: First of all, learn to temper yourself so that your addiction doesn't rule and ruin you. In order for this to be in any way sustainable, you have to be willing to accept a decreased dopamine flow. Next, remind yourselves that you're customers partaking of a product. You have to be profitable. If you're not? You won't get anywhere.

This is something I've explained countless times. The most profitable group is casual players who play in groups of 1-3, 3 as the upper-limit. 1-2 will be even more common an amount. This is why the content is focused around appealing to them, whereas other demographics get table scraps. Blame capitalism if you want, I mean that is fair. That's a good start as you could try to fashion your own product. If you do, though, be sure to teach these lessons to your customers or you'll end up just as bankrupt.

You have to meter yourselves and you have to be profitable. It might make you angry but that's the reality we live in. This is why MMOs have failed so often. Only the original—World of Warcraft—stands as an appeal to the hardcore raider. Every other MMO that has managed to survive caters to a more casual audience.

I mean, it makes sense. It's why outfits and mounts are sold rather than gated behind content one has to grind for—it's also why they're the best looking in the game. Casuals are money. If they weren't, content for other demographics would be the focus.

@Tazer.2157 said:DRMs can be designed to be group content [...]

This is a very bad idea. The core profitable demographic doesn't enjoy forced grouping, that's a raid thing. In doing this, ArenaNet would alienate their paying customers. I mean, you have to realise that. This is why they don't do it.

You could say that they could develop a system where players could replace NPCs, and certainly, they could do that! However, that costs development time and money (and time is also money!). The truth of the matter is, as I explained above, the raider demo isn't really a profitable one. In order for them to take their very limited resources away from developing other content, it would have to be towards a profitable goal.

They might do this in Cantha as it would be a less expensive way to keep their raider audience around. They can develop single-player content where AI characters hold the other roles, and then multiplayer content where players step into the bodies of other characters. That's something they might do, but you can't count on it.

You always have to consider the looming monolith of NCSoft. If ArenaNet does anything that really displeases them, it could mean a reshuffle and lost jobs or even the closure of their studio and the sunsetting of Guild Wars 2.

If you want that to change—as I've said—be profitable and be patient! If the data shows that your demographic is profitable, that's something ArenaNet can show. As it stands, there are only table scraps because there are voices at ArenaNet that do enjoy more hardcore content—just as you do—but it's a bad idea to make too much of it when it doesn't increase the value of ArenaNet or Guild Wars 2.

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@sniperman.1738 said:

@"Mortifera.6138" said:So DRMs are continuing in the new Champions episode

of course they are. we'r in the age of absolutly minimum effort on ANet's part

I wouldn't say Minimum effort, remember they are trying to finish up a living story while working on an expansion.

So are you implying "minimum effort" could have been getting nothing from here to new expansion?

Because nothing is the only worse thing than these pseudo-episodes.

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@"Hypnowulf.7403" said:So here's the problem: Casuals are money, hardcore players are not. In the hardcore mindset, the need for reward dictates that ArenaNet should be doing all they can to sate that desire for the raider's "hard work." There is little concept of recompense that I have borne witness to in raid culture. What this means is that any product that isn't that one (World of Warcraft, yes) is doomed to bankruptcy. See: WildStar.

Anet is right, "raid economy" hurts the game. first they create a "elite group" aka experienced speed runners, then later, these speed runners just sit themselfs on LFG selling runs. but the Catch-22 of this content kill itself in long-term, so starts complaints about "no ones play its anymore", at same time they still blame pugs for game mode ruin. in WvW we see this sometimes, dudes complaining about game mode dying at same time complain when Anet try attract pugs/casuals to the game mode.

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So far, the DRM are annoying. Having to listen to our boss Taimi tell us all the things that we have to do is like fingers on a chalkboard. Neville Chamberlain would be proud of her approach. Isn't she supposed to be dead yet or did that part of the story just get wiped away with a line of dialog like the 'balance' for the Elder Dragons or how the destroyers no longer have the other magic from the dragons as happened in Ember Bay.....

Maybe that's my issue. The poor and inconsistent story telling more so than these boring missions.

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