Mursaat are the "Exalted" asura

[Kovac.4372]

I was watching some lore videos on the asura, and how they were living in proximity to the Mursaat, architecture similar, magics similar ... so then I thought, well if the exalted were humans that sort of transformed due to the ED threat ... why not the asura transforming into the Mursaat in the previous cycle?

And considering how long ago it was, it's realistic to expect this connection to be lost. Especially in the records of the dwarves, if we imagine a scenario where only the asura elite became Mursaat and then interacted with the other races, while the other asura remaining hidden.

The asura are not exactly an egalitarian society ... it is not unimaginable that only the most privileged could be transformed while others were left to fend for themselves.

It also ties in nicely with asuran supremacist tendencies ... when the Mursaat appeared in Kryta it could've been an advanced force, a vanguard, preparing the asuran rise to the surface and eventual conquest ... but those plans were messed up with dragons waking again. Tough luck.

I mean, we can extrapolate lots of ideas, but I think the main can work ... the asura were there in the past cycle and they made the Mursaat to fight the dragons, just like Exalted were made ...

[The Greyhawk.9107]

Ok, provide evidence. Got too many people throwing out extreme theories on this Subforum without providing good reasoning as to why such could be accurate or at least potentially believable to anyone else. So please provide some here.

[Yasai.3549]

Yur already wrong off the bat since Mursaats are not "transformed" beings like Exalted are.Mursaats exist as an ancient race, with distinct physical features which are totally different from an Asurans.

And what's this about similar magic?Mursaats have a unique signature magic called Spectral Agony which no one in the game can produce, and the only instance a player can "use" this is by using Counter Magic when a Jade Construct channels yu with it. (And if yu do not use Counter Magic, yu will be crippled and yur entire healthbar disappears in seconds)

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

@"Kovac.4372" said:I was watching some lore videos on the asura, and how they were living in proximity to the Mursaat, architecture similar, magics similar

So either the video you watched was grossly misstating, or you misunderstood the video.

The player theory is that the ruins found in the Tarnished Coast that the asura took over after surfacing in 1078 AE were of mursaat origin. This, however, has been thoroughly debunked with Season 3, and the release of Bastion of the Penitent. The theory was even highly unlikely with the core release of GW2 and Rata Pten.

There is evidence suggesting that this isn't the case. First off, the only stone architecture we have of mursaat can be found in Bastion of the Penitent and it has zero resemblance to the Tarnished Coast ruins. Second, the ruins hold a high resemblance to the Central Transfer Chamber (this is even implied in one EotN quest) and to Rata Pten added in GW2 - both the CTC and Rata Pten being of asuran origins, the later being pre-Cataclysm (read: pre-1071 AE) asuran origin architecture.

As to similar magic... there is no similarity in asuran magic and the mursaat's Spectral Agony or phasing abilities.

The only similarity between asura and mursaat is the fact that both species have three large toes. But the shape of said toes (and the rest of the feet) are very, very different.

Ironically, the leading cause of the theory is that the origin of the ruins was never stated, and Rata Sum is an anagram of mursaat. The issue with the former is that even when unstated, there were hints of their asuran origins back in EotN (this was easily discredited by the re-use of textures to save time, however, but became less dismissable with Rata Pten); the issue with the latter, is that mursaat is a portmanteau of "murder" and "satan" while Rata Sum is a rough latin translation of "I have thought/considered" - the other asuran cities (Rata Novus, Rata Arcanum, and Rata Primus) all follow this rough latinizing (in order: new thought, secret thought, and first thought).

so then I thought, well if the exalted were humans that sort of transformed due to the ED threat ... why not the asura transforming into the Mursaat in the previous cycle?

Well, even ignoring the fact there's no reason to believe the asura were around then, the mursaat are a flesh and blood species - the exalted are decidedly not flesh and blood, as they are souls placed into constructs.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

Pretty sure an Asura who ends up with their soul in a golem would be more like the exalted and there's examples of that. If pretty rare ones.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

@Eekasqueak.7850 said:Pretty sure an Asura who ends up with their soul in a golem would be more like the exalted and there's examples of that. If pretty rare ones.

Prime example: Blish.

Also: Oola.

[TeeracK.3601]

The whole mursatt rata sum acronym thing turned out to be for nothing, because the dev's did a soft retcon of the buildings in gw1 and have outright said in gw2 the buildings in rata sum were asura buildings. It was the community that speculated those buildings were mursatt ruins the asura moved into when they came to the surface and nothing more.

There is a location in mount malesttrom Rata Pten that looks like the ancient guild wars 1 rata sum. You can talk to a priory researcher who are trying to make sense of the ruins and say that some of it its writing even reminds them of dwarfs. I think the implication youre meant to infer from it is that the asura lived on the surface at some point in the past before they returned to the surface in gw1.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

@TeeracK.3601 said:The whole mursatt rata sum acronym thing turned out to be for nothing, because the dev's did a soft retcon of the buildings in gw1 and have outright said in gw2 the buildings in rata sum were asura buildings. It was the community that speculated those buildings were mursatt ruins the asura moved into when they came to the surface and nothing more.

Not really a soft retcon, because it was never actually implied to be mursaat ruins, and there are hints even in GW1 that they could have been asuran ruins - from the Vlox Falls description to the Central Transfer Chamber using the same exact models, to similar designed architecture being found in various dungeons (and not the Bloodstone Caves dungeon at that).

People just took the anagram, ignored the second possible meaning, and ran with it a mile a minute until most of the gw1 vets left gw2.

[mandala.8507]

I've come to this same conclusion, it's just very hard to prove for certain. I'm working on it though. There's lots of good evidence for it, but nothing to convince the players that don't want to believe it.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

The Exalted were however created using magic similar to the Mursaat's, as several characters mark the similarities. Its directly stated by one character that all this magic has the same origins from that era, so presumably most of the old races shared information between each other, like a sort of alliance, before the fallout.

Edited August 14, 2022 by Mariyuuna.6508

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

On 8/14/2022 at 5:46 PM, Mariyuuna.6508 said:

The Exalted were however created using magic similar to the Mursaat's, as several characters mark the similarities. Its directly stated by one character that all this magic has the same origins from that era, so presumably most of the old races shared information between each other, like a sort of alliance, before the fallout.

The comparison made by Taimi is literally just "you notice how they all float". Though there's reason to believe jade constructs and Enchanted Armors were created using similar methods, and Exalted are "Enchanted Armors 2.0", the 2.0 being souls imbued into them via Exalting ritual.

 

Mursaat are beings of flesh, no reason to believe that they're magical constructs with souls in them. Especially since GW1 implies very heavily that is exactly what jade constructs are.

[DarcShriek.5829]

Asura and Mursaat can't be related.  Mursaat are cool, Asura aren't.

[Scalacious.4139]

Don't forget that the name of the asuran capital 'Rata Sum' is an anagram for 'Mursaat' !

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

10 hours ago, Scalacious.4139 said:

Don't forget that the name of the asuran capital 'Rata Sum' is an anagram for 'Mursaat' !

It's also psuedo-latin for "I have thought", similar to Rata Primus ("First thought"), Rata Novus ("new thought), and Rata Arcanum ("hidden thought").

I am still fairly sure the theme was Latin, like Primordus, rather than anagraming the race that is a coinage of 'murder satan'.