Add a tutorial about how break bars work — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Add a tutorial about how break bars work

And either put it in a painfully obvious location or make it mandatory as part of the story.

Too many people don't understand this basic combat mechanic and Anet isn't doing much to inform the newbies about it.

Comments

  • Myrdreth.6829Myrdreth.6829 Member ✭✭✭

    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

  • Daddicus.6128Daddicus.6128 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I agree, but there are many different kinds of break bars. Perhaps as they're considering this excellent idea, they could have different colored break bars for the various types.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

    Would it though? I mean they have dodge tutorials and players still dont dodge large Aoes when they are very clearly telegraphed

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • Myrdreth.6829Myrdreth.6829 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

    Would it though? I mean they have dodge tutorials and players still dont dodge large Aoes when they are very clearly telegraphed

    Well, at least it would help me! The dodge tutorial was great and since then I LOVE to dodge. I am not a good player but I am willing to learn. I want to get better. And a break bar tutorial would help me a lot because I still don't fully understand how it works. I feel stupid, but that's how it is. So yeah...I think the suggestion is great and it would benefit at least ONE person I know of(me) :P

  • PopeUrban.2578PopeUrban.2578 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2017

    @Daddicus.6128 said:
    I agree, but there are many different kinds of break bars. Perhaps as they're considering this excellent idea, they could have different colored break bars for the various types.

    Since when are there different kinds of breakbars?

    The only two states a breakbar is in are "vulnerable" (blue bar) "Invulnerable" (metal covered) and "Stunned" (Brown, refilling bar)

    The only difference is the amount of HP (BP?) the bar has, but all breakbars work in an identical fashion. Break it with CC abilities while it is blue to stun the target.

    Is there some other kind of breakbar I'm not aware of?

    All the perks, none of the responsibilities.
    PopeUrban - The Papacy [POPE]
    Dude in Charge, Chief Financier, and Cave-Polisher
    It's really just a club for lazy people! Join today and get big-guild services with no-guild schedules!

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

    Would it though? I mean they have dodge tutorials and players still dont dodge large Aoes when they are very clearly telegraphed

    Well, at least it would help me! The dodge tutorial was great and since then I LOVE to dodge. I am not a good player but I am willing to learn. I want to get better. And a break bar tutorial would help me a lot because I still don't fully understand how it works. I feel stupid, but that's how it is. So yeah...I think the suggestion is great and it would benefit at least ONE person I know of(me) :P

    Aw well, alrighty then :)

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • Lunarlife.5128Lunarlife.5128 Member ✭✭✭

    Please do.

  • pah.4931pah.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

    Would it though? I mean they have dodge tutorials and players still dont dodge large Aoes when they are very clearly telegraphed

    This could be for any number of reasons. Sometimes the ground effects are hard to see or maybe don't show up at all (not everyone is running super machines). Sometimes people have babies crying or dogs barking. Sometimes people are texting or watching TV. Sometimes people are dodge-happy and use up all their endurance before the most devastating attacks. Sometimes people are just zoned out and spamming their rotation. Sometimes people just aren't that good at the game and simply enjoy relaxing and playing a silly video game that LITERALLY means nothing in the grand scheme of just about any belief system (even nihilism... especially nihilism).

    And sometimes people don't need nor want to find their purpose or self-worth in a silly video game that LITERALLY means nothing in the grand scheme of just about any belief system.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2017

    @pah.4931 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

    Would it though? I mean they have dodge tutorials and players still dont dodge large Aoes when they are very clearly telegraphed

    This could be for any number of reasons. Sometimes the ground effects are hard to see or maybe don't show up at all (not everyone is running super machines). Sometimes people have babies crying or dogs barking. Sometimes people are texting or watching TV. Sometimes people are dodge-happy and use up all their endurance before the most devastating attacks. Sometimes people are just zoned out and spamming their rotation. Sometimes people just aren't that good at the game and simply enjoy relaxing and playing a silly video game that LITERALLY means nothing in the grand scheme of just about any belief system (even nihilism... especially nihilism).

    And sometimes people don't need nor want to find their purpose or self-worth in a silly video game that LITERALLY means nothing in the grand scheme of just about any belief system.

    I wish we had a "funny" rating cause i laughed, thank you xD(no offense intended at all)

    I am guilty of being dodge happy, but im also twitchy too so i have that going for me which is nice.
    But, the tutorial would need to go into depth on just how much the breakbar is affected by certain things..i wish we had more info on breakbar health but we dont.

    @PopeUrban.2578 said:

    @Daddicus.6128 said:
    I agree, but there are many different kinds of break bars. Perhaps as they're considering this excellent idea, they could have different colored break bars for the various types.

    Since when are there different kinds of breakbars?

    The only two states a breakbar is in are "vulnerable" (blue bar) "Invulnerable" (metal covered) and "Stunned" (Brown, refilling bar)

    The only difference is the amount of HP (BP?) the bar has, but all breakbars work in an identical fashion. Break it with CC abilities while it is blue to stun the target.

    Is there some other kind of breakbar I'm not aware of?

    also this, when in the world did different breakbars become a thing?

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • Daddicus.6128Daddicus.6128 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PopeUrban.2578 said:

    @Daddicus.6128 said:
    I agree, but there are many different kinds of break bars. Perhaps as they're considering this excellent idea, they could have different colored break bars for the various types.

    Since when are there different kinds of breakbars?

    The only two states a breakbar is in are "vulnerable" (blue bar) "Invulnerable" (metal covered) and "Stunned" (Brown, refilling bar)

    The only difference is the amount of HP (BP?) the bar has, but all breakbars work in an identical fashion. Break it with CC abilities while it is blue to stun the target.

    Is there some other kind of breakbar I'm not aware of?

    No, they don't all work alike.

    • There are invulnerability bars, where as long as it is blue, you can't damage the creature.
    • Others are crowd-control (CC) only. Damage gets through, but you can't use some forms of CC until the bar is broken.
    • There are bars that regenerate and those that don't.
    • Many CC effects work on some creatures' bars, but not on other creatures'.
    • Some cannot be broken by a single character of certain classes, while others can. The bars on different creatures have wildly different "hit points". The most obvious ones are world bosses, but there are even some veterans in HoT whose bars reduce very differently from other veterans' bars.
  • @Dante.1763 said:

    @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    I like this suggestion a lot, it would be really helpful! :)

    Would it though? I mean they have dodge tutorials and players still dont dodge large Aoes when they are very clearly telegraphed

    Because Picolo is not there to scream "DOOOOODGE"

  • crashburntoo.7431crashburntoo.7431 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2017

    Honestly, I would benefit from a tutorial as well. I'm not unaware of breakbars and CC, but I could certainly improve. If the tutorial guided us through several scenarios and pointed out class-specific strategies, it would be great. I can't say that it's Anet's job to teach us how to play, but an in-game tutorial would be a good resource. That's what I'm agreeing with. Ultimately, it's the player's job to improve.

    Edit: Based on the posts that went up before I posted this... I have a significant amount of learning to do.

    Let's be neighbours.

  • pah.4931pah.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2017

    I do think level 80 boosts should have come with some sort of basic tutorial -- that is only skippable if you already have a character at 80 or maybe with a certain % of map completion.

    What THAT said, tutorials are really really hard to design. I can't remember what game it was (Wildstar maybe?) but they had a scaling tutorial based on gaming experience (you chose from 3 different levels before starting). Most the time with tutorials, you have to design for lowest common denominator and then for everyone else they are the worst thing int he world. If you make them skippable, then often people who actually need them skip them anyways.

    The best "tutorial" is to slowly introduce mechanics organically before thrusting them into the hard stuff. For example -- the Eater of Souls encounter SHOULD have had preceding encounters with similar, but more forgiving, mechanics, and then NPCs telling the player what to do (this is assuming there is no tutorial for level 80 boosters, which there currently isn't). Maybe instead of just watching memories and chasing after a raven for 26 minutes, the player could have been given little hints and tips on what was to come. OR, these hints and tips could have been earlier stories. This way, it's not burdensome for vets and it helps newbies learn. Everybody wins!

  • Purgatori.3645Purgatori.3645 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2017

    Like this?

    I edited this because I understand that the OP means a tutorial in game but Youtube and MMO's go hand in hand and there isnt any content about GW2 or any other MMO that isnt already online. I doubt Anet is going to put in a tutorial - hence the links I put here - so maybe point newbs to youtube for this and all content they dont understand :)

    When life knocks you down ... Rollover and look at the Stars

  • Purgatori.3645Purgatori.3645 Member ✭✭✭

    or like this?

    When life knocks you down ... Rollover and look at the Stars

  • Rauderi.8706Rauderi.8706 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Purgatori.3645
    Thanks for the video links, but this is something that should be in game.
    Really though, thanks. Hopefully some players see this on the front page. :+1:

    Many alts! Handle it!

    "A condescending answer might as well not be an answer at all."
    -Eloc Freidon.5692

  • PopeUrban.2578PopeUrban.2578 Member ✭✭✭

    @Daddicus.6128 said:

    @PopeUrban.2578 said:

    @Daddicus.6128 said:
    I agree, but there are many different kinds of break bars. Perhaps as they're considering this excellent idea, they could have different colored break bars for the various types.

    Since when are there different kinds of breakbars?

    The only two states a breakbar is in are "vulnerable" (blue bar) "Invulnerable" (metal covered) and "Stunned" (Brown, refilling bar)

    The only difference is the amount of HP (BP?) the bar has, but all breakbars work in an identical fashion. Break it with CC abilities while it is blue to stun the target.

    Is there some other kind of breakbar I'm not aware of?

    No, they don't all work alike.

    • There are invulnerability bars, where as long as it is blue, you can't damage the creature.
    • Others are crowd-control (CC) only. Damage gets through, but you can't use some forms of CC until the bar is broken.
    • There are bars that regenerate and those that don't.
    • Many CC effects work on some creatures' bars, but not on other creatures'.
    • Some cannot be broken by a single character of certain classes, while others can. The bars on different creatures have wildly different "hit points". The most obvious ones are world bosses, but there are even some veterans in HoT whose bars reduce very differently from other veterans' bars.

    These are literally all the same mechanic. Use crowd control on the blue bar to break it. What you're saying is "we should have different health bars because some monsters have damage immunities, different HP, or regenerating health" which is silly. They all do the same thing, and are interacted with in exactly the same way. "Hit the break bar to stun creature"

    Certain foes have different interactions with them, such as invuln, or charging up an instakill attack, or flying away to burn foes on the ground, but they are all the same exact mechanic. Hard CC does instant damage to the bar, soft CC does a DoT to the bar in stead of its normal effect (and is displayed in grey) Your misunderstanding of how break bars works leads you to believe the second example is functionally different despite the fact that it is not. Soft CC works the same for all break bars. If an enemy has a break bar, it is immune to the normal effects of soft CC (and those conditions will apply with a grey icon) but those effects acts as a DoT on the breakbar if it is in its blue vulnerable state and if applicable will apply damage during the stunned state.

    There are no break bars where certain types of CC will and will not damage the bar unless the creature is specifically listed as immune to that specific effect. That is a simple text-based property that doesn't warrant new bar displays any more than "Immune to burning" should change the color of a foe's HP bar.

    All the perks, none of the responsibilities.
    PopeUrban - The Papacy [POPE]
    Dude in Charge, Chief Financier, and Cave-Polisher
    It's really just a club for lazy people! Join today and get big-guild services with no-guild schedules!

  • I remember when I first encountered one, for weeks (maybe months) I thought they were just shields that reduce my damage :'(

  • Nilkemia.8507Nilkemia.8507 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 7, 2017

    Agreed. A tutorial would be helpful, or at least a hint/tip from the game noting what those are for.

  • Also agree this should be in-game. I didn't realise half of the information about them until reading this thread.

  • castlemanic.3198castlemanic.3198 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @pah.4931 said:
    This could be for any number of reasons. Sometimes the ground effects are hard to see or maybe don't show up at all (not everyone is running super machines).

    Can absolutely confirm this, recently was forced to swap to a crappy computer temporarily, and it just so happened that enemies wouldn't even appear on the screen (had to turn on npc names and even then, i'd occasionally be forced to fight an enemy i couldn't see the name of either). Which lead to situations like fighting the herald with her clockwise one hit kill move that I couldn't even see when she used it.

    Now i'm back and it feels great to finally SEE enemies again. So yeah, can absolutely confirm this

    If you join a debate and provide little to no proof when the other side provides lots of evidence, you can't then declare yourself the winner of that debate. Veterans can make signatures apparently.

  • Daddicus.6128Daddicus.6128 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PopeUrban.2578 said:

    @Daddicus.6128 said:

    @PopeUrban.2578 said:

    @Daddicus.6128 said:
    I agree, but there are many different kinds of break bars. Perhaps as they're considering this excellent idea, they could have different colored break bars for the various types.

    Since when are there different kinds of breakbars?

    The only two states a breakbar is in are "vulnerable" (blue bar) "Invulnerable" (metal covered) and "Stunned" (Brown, refilling bar)

    The only difference is the amount of HP (BP?) the bar has, but all breakbars work in an identical fashion. Break it with CC abilities while it is blue to stun the target.

    Is there some other kind of breakbar I'm not aware of?

    No, they don't all work alike.

    • There are invulnerability bars, where as long as it is blue, you can't damage the creature.
    • Others are crowd-control (CC) only. Damage gets through, but you can't use some forms of CC until the bar is broken.
    • There are bars that regenerate and those that don't.
    • Many CC effects work on some creatures' bars, but not on other creatures'.
    • Some cannot be broken by a single character of certain classes, while others can. The bars on different creatures have wildly different "hit points". The most obvious ones are world bosses, but there are even some veterans in HoT whose bars reduce very differently from other veterans' bars.

    These are literally all the same mechanic. Use crowd control on the blue bar to break it. What you're saying is "we should have different health bars because some monsters have damage immunities, different HP, or regenerating health" which is silly. They all do the same thing, and are interacted with in exactly the same way. "Hit the break bar to stun creature"

    Certain foes have different interactions with them, such as invuln, or charging up an instakill attack, or flying away to burn foes on the ground, but they are all the same exact mechanic. Hard CC does instant damage to the bar, soft CC does a DoT to the bar in stead of its normal effect (and is displayed in grey) Your misunderstanding of how break bars works leads you to believe the second example is functionally different despite the fact that it is not. Soft CC works the same for all break bars. If an enemy has a break bar, it is immune to the normal effects of soft CC (and those conditions will apply with a grey icon) but those effects acts as a DoT on the breakbar if it is in its blue vulnerable state and if applicable will apply damage during the stunned state.

    There are no break bars where certain types of CC will and will not damage the bar unless the creature is specifically listed as immune to that specific effect. That is a simple text-based property that doesn't warrant new bar displays any more than "Immune to burning" should change the color of a foe's HP bar.

    You are wrong, but I don't feel like arguing about it.

©2010–2018 ArenaNet, LLC. All rights reserved. Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2, Heart of Thorns, Guild Wars 2: Path of Fire, ArenaNet, NCSOFT, the Interlocking NC Logo, and all associated logos and designs are trademarks or registered trademarks of NCSOFT Corporation. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.