Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged]


Recommended Posts

Things I will buy: A skin or convenience item I want

Things I will NOT buy: A CHANCE at a skin or convenience item I want

"But it's just cosmetic..." Yes, but I often make purchase decisions outside the game based on cosmetics and would never do that through some kind of random process. If I want a red shirt, I go buy a red shirt. Not a box with a 3% chance of containing a red shirt.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of the reasons why GW2 got the nicest community in the mmo market is because of Arenanet's policies. You guys been different from other gaming companies. You guys always listened to us, the player base! So far all the policies you had, cared for the player base! That's why people keep coming back to the game because we had total control over everything in the game which is super rare! That's why people love the game, we do things on our own terms! But what you guys did with the mount skins last night, is shameful. It took away the control that we had over our own stuff. Mounts are very personal. It's part of the persona that we create with "Fashion Wars 2". To lock that away behind "loot boxes" is crazy! Say I want the starry jackal skin. Now I dont have the money to buy all 30 skins at one time, so what I have to do is farm 100 gold and hope to get it. Say it takes me 10 days to get the gold and if I get the skin on my 30th attempt, I have to wait 300 DAYS! That's a year to get A SINGLE SKIN that I want!

Fix it. Just fix it. Let me buy the skin I want to buy upfront. Don't make us dislike the company that we came to fall in love with. Don't do that. That's your unique component Anet, people love you. Don't lose that. Peace.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Skro.2691 said:Things I will buy: A skin or convenience item I want

Things I will NOT buy: A CHANCE at a skin or convenience item I want

"But it's just cosmetic..." Yes, but I often make purchase decisions outside the game based on cosmetics and would never do that through some kind of random process. If I want a red shirt, I go buy a red shirt. Not a box with a 3% chance of containing a red shirt.

Honestly, the "but it's a cosmetic" excuse especially does not fly in a game where the end game IS largely cosmetics.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been OK with Black Lion Chests for years:

  • You can play the game to get keys (reward tracks, quests, etc.)
  • Generally the same selection of items , small chance of rare items or limited time seasonal item

I am not OK with mount adoption licenses:

  • You do not get licenses from generally playing the game (reward tracks, quests, etc.)
  • 30 random skins at once making it so the chances of getting the one that you want tiny
  • Far too many simple recolors with no model change what-so-ever (Looking at you skimmer)
  • 1 license costs aprox. 4 times as much as a BLC Key

Let us buy the skins we want (just like gliders, imagine that) and we will keep playing & funding this game, treat us like cash cows and we will stop paying & eventually stop playing. Hell if you are desperate to have mounts in loot boxes hold on to some of the cool skins to drop in BLC as the limited time / seasonal item...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Whether you like it or not, participate it in or not, Fashion Wars and cosmetics are a huge part of GW2 and the end-game incentives to keep playing. If not for legendaries and glider skins and now most recently mount skins a lot of people - not all, certainly, but a lot - would not keep playing after they reached level 80 and finished out story modes and other non-cosmetic goals. It's true for GW2 and it's true for a lot of other games, MMO and otherwise, and Anet clearly knows this. You can argue until you're blue in the face why this doesn't or shouldn't matter, that people can just choose to ignore it if they don't like the price etc, but then you're also arguing against the very longevity of games in general.

This applies to Anet too - clearly cosmetics are a part of the business model to keep people invested and investing in the game, and no one wants to pay for things they don't want or won't use so this is a pretty obvious shakedown: pay for skins you don't want to get the ones you do want. It's ugly, it's greedy, it's disrespectful to their player base and it damages their brand and reputation - there's no two ways about it. I can only assume and hope that they'll be backtracking and finding a way to repair the damage done here, because in the great wise words of Tyra Banks: we were rooting for you, Anet, we were all rooting for you. How dare you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Skullboy.3562 said:As a loyal customer and fan of Gw2 and Gw1 I found the implementation of these mount skins very disrespectful to me as a fan. I have no problem with supporting the game with gem purchases (which I have done plenty of times, even buying the deluxe editions of the expansions), but this comes off as blatantly greedy in my eyes. Many of my guildmates feel very similarly to this lootbox. It would have been so much cooler to earn some of these mount skins by beating all the legendary bounties, or by completing the new raid wing that's most likely on the horizon. But no, you have decided to put all 30 of them into a box and charge money for a dice-roll on the one you get. If you want to sell them, fine, but don't force people to potentially pay for all 30 of them to get the one that they desire (assuming you roll 29 times and still don't get the one you were aiming for, which is theoretically and mathematically possible mind you). Because of this, I have considered never spending on gems again and that sucks. I love this game, and everyone in this discussion does, but we expected more from you as a company. You have stood out among the cream of the crop, until now and again that really sucks.

I think everyone here has good intentions, but quite a few of us are just disappointed.

Ultimate version of GW2 (twice so my alt did not suffer the indignities of having a base game), ultimate of both expansions, who knows how many gems (2 sets of gathering tools, copper-fed and silver-fed salvageomatics, a bunch of shared slots, about a dozen extra characters, plenty of bank tabs, oodles of skins/gliders/outfits/etc). I have no problem at all supporting this game but this is a cash grab, a pretty bad one at that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I doubt I'm saying anything that hasn't already been said but:I like the skins. I like the variations in dye channels, the chance at different models etc. What I don't like is that

  1. I can't pick which skin to get - okay, fair enough, people need incentive to buy more. However--
  2. The price quickly adds up. 400 gems for a skin is fine. 400 gems for a chance at the skin you want, but that you don't have a good chance to get unless you add another 400 gems, or another, or another is bad. The bulk prices are a bit much too - to get 30 cosmetic items costs more than buying both xpacs of the game itself.
  3. Really really good skins are trapped behind an RNG pool of actually quite average skins. Everyone wants the Starbound griffon, the jackalope springer etc. but most people are getting a raptor with slightly different horns or a skimmer with a slightly different dye channel.
  4. It comes down to two things ultimately: you either have luck, or you have money. And people without either get the short end of the stick while Fashion Wars becomes pay2win. I know, I know, fashion ultimately has no effect on gameplay, whatever, but it's an aspect of the game I massively enjoy and something that I'm now limited by compared to others - expensive armor skins or weapons can usually be crafted or bought, gold can be grinded and converted for outfits if necessary, but the RNG and the sheer number of skins means for a lot of people, the mount skin they really want may never be within their reach.

I know no solution here is perfect, and we'll probably never get a clean "fix" that everyone agrees on, but honestly, paying slightly more for the skins you want, or paying slightly less for the RNG aspect, would be a really good choice - it would allow people who want specific skins to get the ones they want, and would allow people who enjoy the gamble and collection to build it up without breaking the bank.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As many others have said, I'm not angry about the handling of the mount skins, just disappointed :/

There are a small handful of these skins that I like. I could definitely see myself buying at least one skin for each mount, and I would gladly pay 400-500 gems for the simpler ones, and 700-1000 for the more ornate ones, similar to how gliders have been priced in the past. Personally, I would gladly spend 2000-5000 gems for the skins I want.

Having the skins only available as an RNG drops, with no guarantee of getting the skins you want (unless you buy all 30) just feels really exclusionary. I want to buy skins. I want to support ArenaNet. I don't mind buying gems with real money now and then to do so. But I can't in good conscience support an RNG system where I can't purchase the skins I'm looking for without a gamble.

In its current implementation, the "loot box" method of acquiring these skins feels friendly only to those who intend to buy all 30, since duplicates are not possible. I think that's great for people who want all skins. But, again, it feels like this excludes those of us who may only want one or two. If it were up to me, I would much rather see a system that catered to both types of people (those who want all skins, and those who want just a few select ones).

To do this, I would ensure the skins were purchasable in the following ways:

  1. In a discount multi-pack for all 30 skins
  2. In a discount combo-pack where you can choose 5 skins (perhaps one for each mount type?--though this could get hairy for those without a Griffon)
  3. Individually, where simpler skins are 400-500 gems each, and more ornate skins are 700-1000 gems each

If ArenaNet wanted to keep some level of RNG to the packs, then let that be another option, where players can choose to perhaps pay less for the RNG ticket:

  1. 200 gems for any one of the 30 skins at random
  2. 400 gems for any of the skins from a specific mount at random (i.e. Black Lion Jackal Adoption License)
  3. 600-1000 gems for a specific mount skin of your choice (depending on its effects)

Another option to ease the sting of the RNG route would be to perhaps have each "roll" pull up 3 random skins to choose from, or perhaps one skin from each mount, and allow the player to pick from that smaller pool so they can at least hopefully get something they will like and use. And maybe even allow a 1-time courtesy "re-roll", with subsequent re-rolls costing a nominal amount of gems (25?), to make it more likely for the player to be able to attain their skin of choice more easily and affordably. But still always give players who don't want to gamble a non-RNG option to acquire them, too.

Giving players more options on how they can acquire these skins (and thus spend their money) is key. The current implementation is great for some players who want all skins, but for those who only want some, it's very disheartening and alienating. Again--I want to support ArenaNet. I am willing to spend real money to do so. But please, give me the option and ability to buy what I want, and not just a chance at buying it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anet...You were the chosen one! you were supposed to destroy EA not join them! But all kidding aside, anet....How in the name of the spirits did you think this was a good idea? Did you not see how this worked out with EA's battlefront 2 loot boxes and to add to that you made a mount skin that you can buy for 2000 gems. What happen at anet headquarters? Did you hire someone that was greedy? I have no idea whats going on over there but I can say that with out a doubt this will hurt gw2.

When ever you came out with a skin I liked I would buy, when ever there was an expansion I had no doubts and would buy/pre-order right then and there. I even went to my local gamestop, bought your game, played it and loved it so much that I went back to gamestop and got the box set ( the one with Rytlock statue) and that was the last one in the store and it was $300. I think we can both agree I spent a lot on your game, but why? I will tell you why, because I loved your game. The story, the game play, the world events the list goes on. Now you do this, you add gambling to get skins...I can look past the black lion's chest but POF mounts...you make skins for them which by the way I was excited for and would pay for the one's I want but you make it that it's a gambling machine and on top of that you make the skins that you can buy for mounts very expensive. I am very disappointed in you anet and this will effect if I will buy your next big expansion. Congratulations on your path to becoming the next EA....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The PoF expansion costs around $30, the skins cost over $100. I am all for RNG boxes and I know I'm a sucker for gambling with guaranteed skins in other games, but I take issue with the price of a single unlock. 1 skin is almost $7 AUD or 400 gems. For this price I would expect 2 skins or maybe a small bonus RNG unlock. The idea at least in my case is to get a taste, feel like it's good value for money, and buy some more to see if I can get the skins I want. The middle step is definitely missing. I feel amazing when I buy RNG boxes and get one good skin and a few minor collectibles in other games, but this roll-out is definitely missing that feel-good vibe.

I would suggest adding 2 or 3 small bonus items such as minis, dungeon skins and rare dyes. Slightly better average drops than a black lion chest but none of the big ticket items like fancy weapon skins since the mount skin is the major unlock. I think that this would justify 400 gems.

A more on-theme route could be adding RNG cosmetic unlocks for home instances to the mount adoption licence. Chance of a drinking trough, a mount-specific bed (think griffon nest or pile of straw), or 'accidental' painted footprints coming from an NPC's attempt at art that was rudely interrupted. The mounts don't need to be actually in the home instance for this to work, and it makes a nice mount themed addition to the skin unlocks. I would be happy to pay 600 gems for mount unlocks if it had the chance of unlocking one of these.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Menadena.7482 said:

@Nile.5614 said:Here's the real way to "fix" this, or at least make it less of a sting to people that don't want a large pool chance.Because I doubt the RNG aspect is going to be removed, it's just kinda how these things work nowadays.Why aren't these being treated like gemstore dye kits?
  1. Purchase a Mount Adoption License.
  2. Double-click to use the item once purchased.
  3. Select from a prompt window of what type of mount you'd rather adopt: Raptor, Springer, Skimmer, Jackal, Griffon.
  4. Now the RNG is restricted to only ONE type of mount.
  5. This makes targeting easier. This makes people happier with the concept. It makes it less painful and less obviously exploitative.

EDIT:And one more thing. The "natural" mount skins should be just obtainable in game. The special ones, like Pyroclast for the Jackal or any of the "magical" ones? Those probably can stay where they are.

There would still be problems but it would solve a biggie. Right now this can 'give' you a skin for a mount you did not have. So if you never intend to get the griffon but unlock a griffon skin that is 400 gems up in smoke.

Honestly, if you don't have the griffon, you should convert that 400 gems to gold and put it toward getting the griffon instead of gambling on mount skins.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Windemere.6534 said:I absolutely will not participate in any RNG based schemes that have a likelihood of giving me something that I was never interested in.

I would go one step further on general principle. I refuse to participate in a loot box system even if I was guaranteed a skin that I wanted. Not only are they a cash grab but done in a way that the most vulnerable people are the ones most likely to fall victim to it. They are the slot machines casinos put near the entrance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The skins themselves are nice, but I am really disappointed none of them are rewards for playing Path of Fire. Mounts were the main selling point of the expansion, so it would be only fitting if you could get some of their skins as rewards.

I really wish some of them were heart rewards or meta event drops.

It just seems like more and more of the game is locked behind the cash shop. The number of updates the gem store gets compared to the rest of the game is rediculous.

They are really expensive, and the RNG nature of it makes it even worse. Honestly I couldn't think of a worse way to release skins.

I hated the fact that they started putting skins in the black lion chests, but this is even worse. It seems as time goes on the game is more about monitization and less about interesting and repeatable content.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On a further note, Don't bother a> @Zaklex.6308 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:2.take risky action in the hope of a desired result.

You defined exactly what it is. Cheers for that.

Wrong, you are risking absolutely NOTHING, there is no RISK involved, since you think it is:noun1.a situation involving exposure to danger."flouting the law was too much of a risk"verb1.expose (someone or something valued) to danger, harm, or loss.No danger, no harm, no loss...therefore no RISK.
If you say you lost gems, you didn't, because you still got a skin(whether it's one you wanted or not is immaterial).

That's like saying a slot machine which spits out a penny isn't gambling because you're guaranteed a payout.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We've supported Anet with thousands of dollars over the years but I cannot support this massive leap into such a questionable abyss. People need to realize that there are many types of players and this is paramount to thumbing their nose to all but those with a lot of disposable income. I may have that, but i can't condone a practice that has gone so far awry it literally starts to split the classes between the haves and have nots.This was a very irresponsible poorly thought out decision.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:There are a lot of conversations about the mount adoption option that was released today. Many of the comments in the individual threads repeat ones made by the same person in another thread. We very much want to hear your feedback, but have found that a single feedback thread offers the best opportunity for you to share your thoughts and for us to review it in the context of a wider set of feedback.

So here's a thread into which you're invited to post your thoughts on the subject of the Black Lion Stables Mount Skins.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts!

Wow... 36 pages of thoughts in just over 24 hours. That's got to be a record, from what I've seen in my time on the forums.

Might be time for a little feedback to the feedback.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@DorDor.8617 said:Welp, it looks like Jim Stirling is gonna cover this Mount Skin thing. And knowing him, he won't be saying anything nice: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/7bm3z0/a_storm_is_brewing/

Everyone at Arenanet worked for years to restore the studio's reputation after HoT. One of the reasons I'm so passionate about this game is because I see how much its creators care about their work and their audience. And now all that effort is gone. Jim Stirling is a very influential voice. When he speaks, people listen, and he's about to pillory the game.

That'll mean fewer new players coming in to try out Guild Wars. Lower populations as old players leave and don't get replaced. Less revenue to support further development. It's not going to kill the game, but it'll seriously impact future growth.

Mike himself emphasized the importance of word-of-mouth just a few months ago, talking about how it can make or break an MMO. He asked us to spread the good word and bring people into the game. We've been doing that, and we still want to do that. Problem is, this whole incident is about to make that job a thousand times harder. Negative word-of-mouth will turn people off of trying the game, and we all lose.

Gaile, I know you're still reading this, and despite some of the irrational hatred being thrown around in here, I know you care. So please take this message to heart: You can still fix this. All Arenanet needs to do is remove the random chance element. Get rid of that, you'll get rid of the anger. Don't just eat the negative PR. You don't deserve it.

So much respect for this comment. It's funny because I was just thinking about WoodenPotatoes and his competition, and how much harder it would be for him and the fanbase to get the word out. But I hope they do rectify this. So much love has gone into this game, and perhaps the developers now have to suffer because of things like marketing, or whoever is in charge of this stuff. It's really sad.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Afity.5138 said:

@DorDor.8617 said:Welp, it looks like Jim Stirling is gonna cover this Mount Skin thing. And knowing him, he won't be saying anything nice:

he's already done with covering it

Well... skritt.

But as grim as things are, this is not the end. I'm subscribed to Jim, and I know how he operates. If a situation he previously covered changes, he'll do a follow-up video. And if the random chance bit is removed, he will absolutely consider that a victory worth celebrating.

Arenanet, you know what must be done. Please just get on with it already.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no problem with supporting Anet and understand that they are a company that needs to make a profit. But when you bring something so strongly desired and throw it behind RNG lootboxes essentially, it just leaves such an abused and taken advantage of feeling being the consumer.

If you allowed me to purchase the skins I wanted I probably would of ended up buying 5-10 skins, thus giving my support to Anet. But to do it through this RNG system will make it so I purchase nothing.

Now everyone says to just show them with your wallet, but the problem is the whales will still purchase. I'm not who they are counting on purchasing the new mounts. As long as the whales purchase them, then they will make their profit.

I feel this leaves me voiceless and powerless as i watch a game that I love take such a negative turn. I have played this game since the 3 day advance launch. With this RNG mount system, I fear this new path they are taking... This is the first time in 5 years that I don't feel that I can recommend this game to someone new. To get to this end game point where it will be lootboxes and credit cards....

This is my first post on these forums in 5 years because of how important I feel this issue is.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This lootbox stuff, including the vastly overpriced mount skin lootboxing, is showing disrespect against me as as player and customer. It makes me believe, that Arenanet thinks, I'm stupid. Stupid enough to buy skins at the price of the whole game. The obfuscated wording of the offer ("mount adoption license" instead of "random mount skin") confirms this attitude against me, the player.

1 Game = $30. 1 skin lottery ticket = $5. No sane human with a sense of what money is worth can buy a box at this price that only gives random stuff. Additionally, they offer one non-randomized skin at $25. This pricing is even worse than the lottery ticket. One skin - $25. I cannot believe it. Skin = $25, whole game = $30.I don't buy stuff from people who show no respect for me. A good business is of mutual benefit and mutual respect between seller and buyer. This gambling and pricing is single-sided where only the seller will benefit. From a legal point of view it is not illegal, but it doesn't make me want to ever buy in the gem shop again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would much rather spend 800 or even 1000 gems on a skin I want, rather than 400 gems to most likely get I skin I will dislike. Anet definitely won't be getting 400 gems from me for a random skin. It's seems that the entire gaming community is on the same boat so I don't understand why they would do this when no one has any interest in it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...