Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged]

[Zero Day.2594]

@TheQuickFox.3826 said:WoodenPotatoes - MountGate

And if any gets to the end - WP has a point...

Vote with your wallet.

Engage with those that have bought into various cash-shop systems.

Realistically, we are to blame, because as he's saying, people are already running around with those damned skins... Personally, and this has been for awhile for me, in any game, when i see a player having something from a cash shop - i think "that's the fucker that's encouraging the publishers/game-companies to keep doing cash shops"

[Iason Evan.3806]

marvel heroes had a version of this with purchasing the playable characters. most characters were 400-600 of their earnable in-game currency. you could also get a random hero token for 175.

IF--and it's a big IF--ArenaNet kept it random but lowered the cost to 175 gems, I'd be ok with it but only IF--there's that big IF again--we could get exactly the one we want for 400 gems.

Once again, just to reinforce my opinion...RNG sucks. I just want to buy the thing I want. If I can't do that, then I don't want or need to play your game anymore.

[Wraith.1094]

@Zero Day.2594 said:

@TheQuickFox.3826 said:WoodenPotatoes - MountGate

And if any gets to the end - WP has a point...

Vote with your wallet.that's the fundamental problem with these types of cashshops, when they're set up this way, the average player has zero to a few votes, a smaller group that has dozens, and minor group of whales with hundreds or even thousands of votes. there's a reason companies do the RNG this way, it's to squeeze everything they can out of the whales and to squeeze a little bit extra out of the people willing to spend alot. the fact that some people who are driven away or refuse to pay into these systems is offset by the fact that for every 200 of them there's one guy willing to spend 201+'s players worth of money.

the non-shitty thing to do is set moderate-to-high prices for individual pieces of cosmetics like they did for gliders and backpacks, and let everyone buy specifically what they want without having to buy anything they don't. whales will still be whales, and the small to moderate spenders can still get what they want.

[Ewon.5903]

@Zero Day.2594 said:

@TheQuickFox.3826 said:WoodenPotatoes - MountGate

And if any gets to the end - WP has a point...

Vote with your wallet.

Engage with those that have bought into various cash-shop systems.

Realistically, we are to blame, because as he's saying, people are already running around with those damned skins... Personally, and this has been for awhile for me, in any game, when i see a player having something from a cash shop - i think "that's the kitten that's encouraging the publishers/game-companies to keep doing cash shops"

The problem is, there are far too many credit card warriors running around. When it comes to various gemstore cosmetics, if I see someone I can generally think "Well, that person supported the game for future content." The more of these people you see running around, the more game developers can push what their player base will accept.

Is gw2 the worst offender? Not by a long shot. Should they be getting the amount of anger they are? Probably not. This is a hot topic in other gaming communities right now, so seeing it here shouldn't be totally unexpected.

[GreyWolf.8670]

@Lilyanna.9361 said:

@GreyWolf.8670 said:

@pah.4931 said:

@GreyWolf.8670 said:

@pah.4931 said:

@SmirkDog.3160 said:

@pah.4931 said:They are trying to make MORE money. Which isn't inherently evil by itself. That is what I am saying.

Sorry to dispel the illusion for you here, but greed isn't exactly

not

evil.

But it's not greed. It's business. If this was the most played MMO with a sub, you'd have a point. But it's not. It's an aging game in a declining genre. It needs to show growth or it's harder to convince "the masters" to keep it running.

(I mean. Sure, it could be greed. But I am arguing that it probably isn't.)

((ask yourself ... if you ran a company, would you not take more money????))

It's greed. They could have just as easily put the separate skins on the store. They just wanted the capture the percentage of people that didn't get the skin they wanted the first time and make them pay more.

Wanting more money is NOT the definition of greed. You could easily work for $8 per hour. Do you? Or are you greedy? You are greedy aren't you!? (see.)

Maybe they are preventing layoffs by doing this. Is it greedy to keep people with families employed and thousands of people enjoying a video game? Hmmm.

Yes, it is the definition of greed. This really isn't difficult. My income and what I desire to spend have nothing to factoring into the definition of a word.

greed[ɡrēd]NOUN

intense and selfish desire for something, especially wealth, power, or food.

Then, we, as humans, are all greedy by definition.

You can label yourself if you choose.

[Blude.6812]

Merged and up to 60 pages--as if the devs are going to read this, let alone giving a care

[GreyWolf.8670]

@WingedLass.7456 said:

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

No different than buying an assorted pack of socks even if you're not going to use the tube socks. I doubt they will remove the randomness.

I

knew

there was a reason I only buy socks I'm all going to use. (Sorry, yes, that was rather childish. True, though, I'll never get an assorted pack of socks that contains ones I know I won't use. I guess we're all different when it comes to these things.)

It might be best to agree to disagree on the subject. Clearly, we think on it differently, and I'm not sure either of us is going to convince the other. Considering the risk of this devolving into a back-and-forth, this is my final reply. Thank you for the serious discussion, though, and have a nice evening.

I don't think there's any point in arguing with him. He's not trying to prove anything, just annoy you.

[Mightymaxx.4801]

Some feedback from me (that hopefully doesn't get drowned in the avalanche of a heated discussion):What I hate about the situation: RNG aka gambling with real money without any other option. No, "buy all" is NOT another option.What I would want to see: Add a "buy specific mount skin I want" option for like 600 or 700 Gems for example. In line with armour sets and outfits. Or let us unlock other skins of the same quality in-game. Keep the lower price gambling option, keep the "buy all" bundle discount but scrap the one week limitation. Maybe add a "gamble on skin by mount" i.e. raptor adoption, springer adoption etc. As long as there a viable and worthwhile alternatives I don't mind the adoption gamble being there.

I personally will not pay anything for gambling. But I do see myself spending some gems on a skin I truly want. Additionally: what is supposed to happen further down the line with the current system? When you maybe add more mounts? Am I expected to gamble myself through even more unfavorable odds to get the latest skin that I happen to like?At the end of the day you are a business and money will probably dictate the course. And having a look around a lot of people don't seem to mind throwing a ton of money at you without any reserve. I for one am just so incredibly fed up with RNG loot-boxes. And that's what adoptions are. (Also those 2000 gems for a single skin are just downright ridiculous but whatever)

tl;dr (for ya lazy scrollers)Add "buy specific skin I want option" or other reasonable in-game alternative. Problem solved (in my opinion, of course ;) )

[Zero Day.2594]

@Ewon.5903 said:

@Zero Day.2594 said:

@TheQuickFox.3826 said:WoodenPotatoes - MountGate

And if any gets to the end - WP has a point...

Vote with your wallet.

Engage with those that have bought into various cash-shop systems.

Realistically, we are to blame, because as he's saying, people are already running around with those damned skins... Personally, and this has been for awhile for me, in any game, when i see a player having something from a cash shop - i think "that's the kitten that's encouraging the publishers/game-companies to keep doing cash shops"

The problem is, there are far too many credit card warriors running around. When it comes to various gemstore cosmetics, if I see someone I can generally think "Well, that person supported the game for future content." The more of these people you see running around, the more game developers can push what their player base will accept.

Yeah, at a time I would have agreed that "Well, that person supported the game for future content" - but that was some time ago. Publishers (tin hats on) are seemingly turning that into their focus... more and more of it floating up on purpose rather than gamers out of sense of charity supporting their games. Take a look at EA with their starwars battlefront fiasco. Activision patenting a matchmaking system that encourages players to buy their shit... It's no longer about gamers being able to support their games, it's becoming an active focus of publishers on how to get players to support their games. That's the concerning bit in all this. On a microscopic scale, w/e comes out of this for ANet doesn't matter so much (meh, another one bites the dust) as whats going on in general.

[GreyWolf.8670]

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@atomy.3817 said:

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@atomy.3817 said:

Nothing "predatory" about this at all. That's just an exaggeration by inappropriately labeling something they don't like.

Right, they just want to trick people into spending much more on multiple attempts at winning the skin they want, rather than just letting them buy it outright. Nothing predatory about that. /S

They are letting players buy them outright if you buy the bundle. It's not cheap, but it's there.

And you could win the lottery if you just buy a ticket for every possible combination of numbers.

That's ridiculous and you know it. To compare 1:30 chance to 1:1,000,000+ chance is absurd.

wince That is not how probability works. It starts at 1:30.

[GreyWolf.8670]

@Blude.6812 said:Merged and up to 60 pages--as if the devs are going to read this, let alone giving a flying you know what.

Yup. This is a trash bin now. They are not reading this despite what Gaile said. I'm out if they don't say anything by tomorrow.

[Salicia.5943]

Thanks Anet for the new mount skins even though some look like just recolors. I like the fact that I can buy a "chance" to get a good one at the price of 400 gems versus waiting for you guys to put the skins into the Shop for 2k each. I think 10k gems for only 5 "good" skins is complete crap so I quite enjoy having every single one for the same price. Unfortunately I don't real IRL money - only special promotions and things that I use everyday multiple times like the Copper Fed Salv-o-matic or a character slot.

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

Guys guys guys. Hold out for just another 15 hours. Just wait a bit.If you check the [News] Gemstore items: new/returned/sales's topic, it say certain items/sales ending in 24 hours. Any time items disappear or removed, it means the gem store will be updated.

Simply wait and see if maybe it will be changed/addressed/altered by then.

Chances are it won't... but that's like the last real chance of seeing if they will change this or not.

[Fire X.5184]

@GreyWolf.8670 said:

@Blude.6812 said:Merged and up to 60 pages--as if the devs are going to read this, let alone giving a flying you know what.

Yup. This is a trash bin now. They are not reading this despite what Gaile said. I'm out if they don't say anything by tomorrow.

I here you

[Tearthy Flame.1463]

I wonder what will happen next. My veiw is different about the quality put into the 2000 gem mount, after looking at the quality of other mounts in MMO's like ESO and TERA, which isn't worth the price for lazy animation and model quality. The Reforged Warhound has a lot of quality for 25$ realisticly. But I know exactly what I paid for and wanted, it's beyond anything I could've imagined to match my Heavy Legendary Armor, i'm ugly and beautiful all around. Lol.

I do want to see a change to the 400 gem skins, the quality is not beautiful to me but it dosen't deserve RNG, obviously they were easy to produce and shouldn't demand such a high cash grab like the mounts that will be alike the Warhound.

The value of something is different to every player, and players that have low end budgets shouldn't feel cheated by the Mount Adoption RNG. I would value each of those skins at 200 gems each, personally.

[AlexanderDracul.7492]

I don't know if I can add any unique opinions to this already huge conversation; however, I can say this new RNG mount skin system sucks. I don't want to guess whether it'll take 400 gems or 2000 gems to get that skin I'd really like. I get this was a move for the company to make profit on a game with a very dynamic player count (being popular near an expansion before dwindling until the next), but if Anet knows it's consumers then they had to have known how this would turn out.

For the majority, outfits and glider skins can be bought individually. Those stuffed into Black Lion Chests are more tolerable just because there are a large number elsewhere in the gem shop. Compare that to these skins where there is no majority of mount skins elsewhere on the gem shop where you can individually purchase them. A similar situation would be putting every single outfit in the gem store into one of these RNG boxes that unlocks a random one. Few would tolerate it and fewer would purchase the boxes.

I'm also concerned about the reputation of GW2 that follows. This outrage has leaked past the forums to where Dulfy and Jim Sterling have given disapproval on this RNG system where both have a larger audience than those that just play GW2. This system has already damaged Anet's reputation which won't easily be repaired.

[Palador.2170]

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:Guys guys guys. Hold out for just another 15 hours. Just wait a bit.If you check the [News] Gemstore items: new/returned/sales's topic, it say certain items/sales ending in 24 hours. Any time items disappear or removed, it means the gem store will be updated.

Simply wait and see if maybe it will be changed/addressed/altered by then.

Chances are it won't... but that's like the last real chance of seeing if they will change this or not.

If they were going to change something during that update, they'd be working on it by now. They'd know they're doing something by now. And they'd be able to say something about it by now.

It's 6pm at ANet. They're going home. There is no change coming.

[pallas.8150]

I think the 2000 gem mount is a LOT. I would consider it at 800, but 2000 is just excessive on so many levels that I can't in good conscience purchase it.

That said, I bought all 30 of the mount skins. I didn't intend for it, I actually wanted two skins more than the rest. The first I got within three tries, the second I got with the last four. I think there would be less outrage if they released perhaps a few at a time instead of an immense amount... we live in a 'I want it NOW' society and I think some of the outrage is tied to that. People could simply buy 2-4 a week/ month/ whatever and pace themselves. They simply don't want to.

My biggest beef stands with the RNG is essentially the griffon mount. I don't have it yet and I'm in no hurry to get it. But it sits behind a gold sink wall and the fact you need to complete the entire PoF game to unlock the Quest to grab it. I don't like paying for something that I essentially can't even use. I would have LOVED if you could just buy the skins in a pack associated with the mount, personally. The Skimmer skins are honestly boring and again my complaint regarding the griffon stands... I would have preferred to invest in neither collection.

If I had my choice, I would have probably invested in like 15 of the 30 skins as I honestly like a lot of them. Some of them, however, are definitely are not as creative and fun as others. The RNG ensured I pretty much bought them all to get what I wanted. I'm not complaining, but I would have preferred a system that I didnt have to waste more money than I would have preferred to get exactly what I wanted.

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

@Palador.2170 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:Guys guys guys. Hold out for just another 15 hours. Just wait a bit.If you check the [News] Gemstore items: new/returned/sales's topic, it say certain items/sales ending in 24 hours. Any time items disappear or removed, it means the gem store will be updated.

Simply wait and see if maybe it will be changed/addressed/altered by then.

Chances are it won't... but that's like the last real chance of seeing if they will change this or not.

If they were going to change something during that update, they'd be working on it by now. They'd know they're doing something by now. And they'd be able to say something about it by now.

It's 6pm at ANet. They're going home. There is no change coming.

They don't have to say it at all though.They sure as hell did not say skritt before this popped up.Could easily quietly fix this and hope to slide it under the rug.

Once again, I'm like 85% sure they won't (would say 100% but I rather not Asura myself on this as it could easily be changed as I don't know anything on the whole situation as I don't work for them), but it's better to at least wait and see than anything.

The skimmer's handlebars were glitched up to hell and back on the halloween mounts when they 1st came out, and in the last update they fixed it.Yeah yeah yeah yeah it's a bug fix and not even related to a store thing, but the thing is they never really mentioned that they fixed this or not.

[DadEO.9063]

This is Ridiculous and Greedy of you Ane,t I expect more from you, why I love Gw2 never as greedy and games like Wow anyone of its copy cats. I always felt like content you put out was to see you community enjoy it and the cost was there was to have us help fund this work.( and of course you guys need to make money) which I've always been happy to do. but this is straight greedy and need to be remedied. As long time player going back to Gw1 days I'm am extremely disappointed in this.

I'm not against the RNG but keep it where it belongs, in world meta event or in achievements and stuff like that. but with how many options are in this mount pack its take a small fortune ( or crazy dumb luck) to get the one mount skin I want. I would have gladly spent 800-1000 gems on the mounts that struck me. but this is outrageous. I wish i could support you guy in making mount skins but this is awful and I refuse to accept. you've lost my business till this is fixed.

And why we are at it 2000 for 1 skin! what happened to 5 for 2000 on a discount for 1600! 1200 is more then enough for a single skin and 800 for a high end and 400 for low should be fine. I don't know what the cost to make a skin is, but this is outrageous.

[Fire X.5184]

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@Palador.2170 said:

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:Guys guys guys. Hold out for just another 15 hours. Just wait a bit.If you check the [News] Gemstore items: new/returned/sales's topic, it say certain items/sales ending in 24 hours. Any time items disappear or removed, it means the gem store will be updated.

Simply wait and see if maybe it will be changed/addressed/altered by then.

Chances are it won't... but that's like the last real chance of seeing if they will change this or not.

If they were going to change something during that update, they'd be working on it by now. They'd know they're doing something by now. And they'd be able to say something about it by now.

It's 6pm at ANet. They're going home. There is no change coming.

They don't have to say it at all though.They sure as hell did not say skritt before this popped up.Could easily quietly fix this and hope to slide it under the rug.

Once again, I'm like 85% sure they won't (would say 100% but I rather not Asura myself on this as it could easily be changed as I don't know anything on the whole situation as I don't work for them), but it's better to at least wait and see than anything.

The skimmer's handlebars were glitched up to hell and back on the halloween mounts when they 1st came out, and in the last update they fixed it.Yeah yeah yeah yeah it's a bug fix and not even related to a store thing, but the thing is they never really mentioned that they fixed this or not.

Well if they wont change it then it's time for me to find another game to play. If this is the future of there skins and how to get them then no ty I will play wow before I concede to this gambling practice. I am curious to see how this pans out. Will anet smarten up and do whats right or will they go down in history as many gaming companies have done and soiled their reputation.

There is a saying. When the business is hot you can do no wrong, when the business is cold you can do no right. What it mean's is when things are going good and you have a good reputation you can do no wrong as people will let it slide because you did right for so many years. But when you mess up so much and it starts to stick no matter how many time's you say sorry the people wont care, your business is cold now. Is this the straw that broke the camel's back? Who know's but the rot can set in at any moment even when your on the high train and if you don't stop it when it show's it's ugly head it maybe to late.

[Palador.2170]

@DadEO.9063 said:And why we are at it 2000 for 1 skin! what happened to 5 for 2000 on a discount for 1600! 1200 is more then enough for a single skin and 800 for a high end and 400 for low should be fine. I don't know what the cost to make a skin is, but this is outrageous.

Well, it's basically an outfit for one race (Jackal) and one gender (neutral). Compare it to some of the outfits we've gotten, and you should get a good idea of what it costs to make one that's for 5 races with 2 genders each.

[Chickenooble.5014]

@DadEO.9063 said:This is Ridiculous and Greedy of you Ane,t I expect more from you, why I love Gw2 never as greedy and games like Wow anyone of its copy cats. I always felt like content you put out was to see you community enjoy it and the cost was there was to have us help fund this work.( and of course you guys need to make money) which I've always been happy to do. but this is straight greedy and need to be remedied. As long time player going back to Gw1 days I'm am extremely disappointed in this.

I'm not against the RNG but keep it where it belongs, in world meta event or in achievements and stuff like that. but with how many options are in this mount pack its take a small fortune ( or crazy kitten luck) to get the one mount skin I want. I would have gladly spent 800-1000 gems on the mounts that struck me. but this is outrageous. I wish i could support you guy in making mount skins but this is awful and I refuse to accept. you've lost my business till this is fixed.

And why we are at it 2000 for 1 skin! what happened to 5 for 2000 on a discount for 1600! 1200 is more then enough for a single skin and 800 for a high end and 400 for low should be fine. I don't know what the cost to make a skin is, but this is outrageous.I think you're greedy. ArenaNet probably did quite a bit of market research before releasing this purchase option. Judging by what I see in Lions Arch there are no shortage of people buying these mounts. All I see here is half a thread -- often the same voices -- crying about this issue. They release free content every few months, have cheap expansions, high production value and no subscription fee... and you call them greedy for selling optional skins that -- guess what -- you don't have to spend a dollar on but can obtain using in-game gold. Yea, they're the greedy ones... Sure thing, kid.

[Fire X.5184]

@Chickenooble.5014 said:

@DadEO.9063 said:This is Ridiculous and Greedy of you Ane,t I expect more from you, why I love Gw2 never as greedy and games like Wow anyone of its copy cats. I always felt like content you put out was to see you community enjoy it and the cost was there was to have us help fund this work.( and of course you guys need to make money) which I've always been happy to do. but this is straight greedy and need to be remedied. As long time player going back to Gw1 days I'm am extremely disappointed in this.

I'm not against the RNG but keep it where it belongs, in world meta event or in achievements and stuff like that. but with how many options are in this mount pack its take a small fortune ( or crazy kitten luck) to get the one mount skin I want. I would have gladly spent 800-1000 gems on the mounts that struck me. but this is outrageous. I wish i could support you guy in making mount skins but this is awful and I refuse to accept. you've lost my business till this is fixed.

And why we are at it 2000 for 1 skin! what happened to 5 for 2000 on a discount for 1600! 1200 is more then enough for a single skin and 800 for a high end and 400 for low should be fine. I don't know what the cost to make a skin is, but this is outrageous.I think you're greedy. ArenaNet probably did quite a bit of market research before releasing this purchase option. Judging by what I see in Lions Arch there are no shortage of people buying these mounts. All I see here is half a thread -- often the same voices -- crying about this issue. They release free content every few months, have cheap expansions, high production value and no subscription fee... and you call them greedy for selling optional skins that -- guess what -- you don't have to spend a dollar on but can obtain using in-game gold. Yea, they're the greedy ones... Sure thing, kid.

Someone did not see the star wars battlefront 2/COD loot boxes system controversy I see.

[Shaaba.5672]

I think WPs video was well reasoned and rational. The parts that really hit home are that this is just another step in the predatory/sleezy however you want to term it gem store practices. Is it the worst? No. That doesn't make it good or laudable. It's disappointing and tiring to be on this slope though and I can't see it getting any better. The anger and outrage over the mount skins is not just about the mounts, but is an outlet for other failings the game has regarding the gem store and meaningful loot (or lack of) in game. I said it in a reddit thread, but I just hate how GW always seems to be on a cycle of Good Will - Bad Move - Baby Steps to build back the good will and reputation - Good Will - rise and repeat.

I was vocal about the exclusive skins in BLC boxes and now I'm being vocal about this. It feels like yelling at a brick wall, however. One thing WP did say is that boycotting the gem store is not the entire answer. Also buying things that belong on the store that you agree with is also voting with your wallet. it's not always going to be the same line for everyone, but not buying keys and adoption licenses and dye boxes is half of it. Buying individual skins or convenience items, or anything that isn't RNG is the other half.