World Restructuring

[Mr Green.4157]

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:

@Mr Green.4157 said:

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I think you can use this to argue against the idea of setting a home server too. Let me try.

What about the players that don't want to join servers but like playing with certain individuals on different servers? Or like to run around with certain servers but don't want to join any one servers? I feel we are being forced to join a server or get thrown into the manure pile.

What do you know it worked.

well being that at launch we joined servers and there was no other option your point is moot. good try at trolling tho.

Well why weren't we given that option I wonder? Perhaps, and I'm just spit balling here, there are times in the course of the life of a game where certain game functions harm the experience of the game. We weren't allowed to be serverless nomads at launch because it would cause population imbalances that would make the game less fun for everyone. Does that sound familiar?

[Sleepyy.1598]

Thank you Anet, changes are badly needed and I'm glad you've been working towards this.

[Roxanne.6140]

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

[Omega Zoa.3859]

"Change wvw its dying!" "How dare you change wvw its going to die!"

People do not know what they want, i approve of this change, god knows wvw needs a change from its current stale self.

[X T D.6458]

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

Simple, pretend they don't exist and don't matter. Because instead of being able to play how and when you want, there will now be pre-reqs!GG anet!

[Auroma.9126]

I recently returned to Guild Wars 2 after quitting it 3 years ago. Initially I was very dissapointed with the state of WvWvW and regretted my decision of buying HoT and PoF. WvWvW looks much worse now. I had quit after losing trust in ArenaNet's commitment towards improving WvWvW.

Reading this post gives me hope that ArenaNet is willing to work towards improving WvWvW. As long as the company is willing to implement changes that can revive WvWvW they have my support. Yes some of these changes may not work and they may need to modify them in future, it is still better to proceed with their implementation than do nothing.

You know what is worse than the current state of WvWvW, the feeling that we WvWvW players have been abandoned by the game developers. Hopefully upcoming months will make that feeling go away. GW2 WvWvW has so much potential.

Also roamers of each server who like to play with each other but are not in any guild can make a roamers guild and register it as their WvWvW guild. This way you can make sure you run into similar faces while roaming.

[Roxanne.6140]

@"Omega Zoa.3859" said:"Change wvw its dying!" "How dare you change wvw its going to die!"

People do not know what they want, i approve of this change, god knows wvw needs a change from its current stale self.

I do agree a change is needed. But as usual, there is going to be a bunch of people who suffer from these changes.

[Mr Green.4157]

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

Maybe what you could do is create a guild who's sole purpose is to be the guild for every like minded person on your server and convince the guild you like to follow to let you into their alliance as they know you and want you to be able to keep joining them? or have one of those guilds create a rank for you without any perms in their guild just so you can mark it and stay with them. My point is if you and these guilds want to stay together there are options.

[squeakers.5029]

I'm not saying this is a good or bad idea. However, what I'm taking from this is find a way to have an empty guild slot and either:

A. Try to join your friends' guild(s) and suck it up and abide by their rules (Because lets be honest, there is probably a reason you haven't joined it yet.) and just block the other 3/4 of the guild you cant stand so you can continue to hopefully play with the majority of your friends.orB. Create a new guild and invite your friends and hope they ALL either have an empty guild slot or are happy with leaving one of their current guilds.orC. Accept and/or become ok with being forced to make new friends and connections every 8 weeks to run around with in wvw. This should be acceptable according to quite a few posts on here because NO ONE on GW2 is actually REALLY introverted and the friendships that they do have on GW2 didn't take years to make (if not carry over from GW1).The last line was sarcasm just in case people needed clarification....

[EbonFreeman.4051]

Dear Anet, I love this and I'm sorry to drown you in questions.

When will this be implemented (approx. quarter)?Without saying too much about the algorithm, is alliance linked mainly limited by PPT skill, K/D skill, rank, (WvW) activity, or running coverage?Will/can we get the information about the alliance via the API?Can we get match awards for match wins like PvP with guilds? Guild with the most kills, most defensive/offensive points, most healing/revives?Something for winning a match even if its map selection?If a player changes their alliance server or main WvW guild, when or how long before it becomes active?When changed, does it still carry the stigma of no pips for a week?When a player is in WvW, are they required to rep their main WvW guild?In PvP, I have a tendency not to get linked with people I've blocked? Will the relinking be affect that? Or can we get a guild block list?For those running small guilds, you don't really have to worry. Many of the best guilds are small. Make a solid alliance and play :)Is there a way we could get a mechanism to hire small/guildless groups even if we had to pay gems to get in for a limited period of time?

For those afraid of losing your community, start creating your alliance now with what guilds you want. The limit for a match would be approx. 1000 active members so figureout who you want to play with. There are no current limits for an alliance size though. So for PS/TC, you could actually make your roster bigger by making an alliance of your current roster and recruit RPers from PvE. If you don't like toxic people, kick them from the guild. If you don't like who you're linked with on your alliance then change alliances. YOU GET TO CHOOSE WHO YOU PLAY WITH. If you don't choose who you play with then Anet will choose for you. On other servers there have been horrible links where people didn't want to play with the other link server. And now, you can predict outcomes in the server matches with coverage wars. Matches are mostly stale and you know who is going to win from the start. The only difference is when a server wants to drop like JQ or Mag.

[Namer.9750]

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@"Nocturnal Lunacy.8563" said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

Have you never been in a guild with a 'friends' role? Just ask them "Yo, I enjoy running with you, can you invite me and give me a 'friend' role so I can stick with your alliance?"

I know plenty of roamers who're members in bigger guilds and regularly cloud with them.

What's the massive aversion towards joining guilds? You're assuming every guild is like... ☆ 100% REP ☆ ONLY PLAY WHEN COMMANDER IS ONLINE OR GKICK ☆ 5g/raid GUILD TAX OR GKICK ☆ NO ROAM ONLY MEGABLOB OR GKICK ☆ PM SSN FOR INVITE ☆. There are plenty of guilds who go casual for fights and almost every guild I know people in will let friends in. Yeah, there are some freak cases, but I can only name like 3-4 of those out of all the guilds in NA.

Like, can you just name a guild your and your friends run with without wanting to join, who won't let you in if you just ask?

[ugrakarma.9416]

@"nekuxdesu.4796" said:Reminder that you use a server as an identity you really need to get some help. Seriously, server hasn't meant anything proper for years. Please stop kidding yourselves, you're not being constructive to the topic.

yeah, currently most of the servers are for "my old enemies" than "old friends".

I'm amazed the SoS have come up, months ago, the team chat was all about flame wars.

[Dukotje.4382]

I do have a suggestion to look into while constructing world and placing wvw players in them. What about the ammount of structural flips? A ppt heavy server like any German or French national server will focus on flipping objectives more then killing enemies, since skill is involved, might as well take structure flipping in consideration

Other then that, i'm a bit sceptical seeing that alliances can hold 500-1000 players o.o what about making wvw focussed guilds have a lower roster size? To decrease the match manipulation and guild stacking, downsizing wvw guild roster would make it a lot better for other guilds to stay alive.

Overal, i am getting more and more excited that you've all created an idea for a new system, that will finally eliminate imbalance and stacking unskilled players everywhere.

1 last question: What will happen to communication? I know guilds have their discords or private teamspeaks, but open tags generally use their worlds teamspeak. What are your thoughts on supporting open tagged commanders in their way of leading in voice coms?

[Chaba.5410]

@SkyShroud.2865 said:I remember very clearly BG raised from some bottom tiers because massive people transfer into it.

I remember that too. In fact, one of the first persons I talked to in WvW told me he was transferring to Blackgate before the free transfers were over simply because it was stacking to get into T1 and this was back when BG was in T3 facing my server. Five years later they are still T1. Talk about positive feedback loops...

[Blodeuyn.2751]

@"Phlogistn.7893" said:I realize that many servers no longer feel they have an "identity". That is not, I feel, the case for Tarnished Coast and some other servers I know of. Some people have been on their server since day one, have friends across guilds and have a history. Although "something" needed to be done with WvW I am sad to think that all the people we play with here will be dispersed to the winds. Even stating they can be in an "alliance" with alliances changing from season to season, makes the continuity of community null. Baby, bathwater.....

F L Ö Guild Leader/Commander Valkyrja Söngur [ODIN], a Tarnished Coast Server Admin

I haven't read all 11 pages of this thread yet, but please, please, please add QOP to the TC alliance so that we may follow you all to the new system. We don't want to be with anyone else. <3

[Norbe.7630]

@SkyShroud.2865 said:

Wait, isn't bg made by the same imperfect, biased, self-interested, prejudicial, human players? BG was never number 1 at the start, it was the Titan Alliance, remember? After they disbanded, BG took their remnant in, remember? I rmbeemer very clearly BG raised from some bottom tiers because massive people transfer into it. At the same time, massive people transfer into JQ and TC. Well, the start of all unbalance. So yea, imperfect, biased, self-interested, prejudicial, human players wrote the history.

they did that?please don't blame BG, they are the victim here you know...inb4 they are BeastGate, now they just bark for this change, BarkGate perhaps

[Mr Green.4157]

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:

@Mr Green.4157 said:

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:

@Mr Green.4157 said:

@Nocturnal Lunacy.8563 said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I think you can use this to argue against the idea of setting a home server too. Let me try.

What about the players that don't want to join servers but like playing with certain individuals on different servers? Or like to run around with certain servers but don't want to join any one servers? I feel we are being forced to join a server or get thrown into the manure pile.

What do you know it worked.

well being that at launch we joined servers and there was no other option your point is moot. good try at trolling tho.

Well why weren't we given that option I wonder? Perhaps, and I'm just spit balling here, there are times in the course of the life of a game where certain game functions harm the experience of the game. We weren't allowed to be serverless nomads at launch because it would cause population imbalances that would make the game less fun for everyone. Does that sound familiar?

at launch we had no choice cuz it was a new game. it was alright you chose usually where your gw1 guild xfered to. or friends from gw1. but after 5 yrs of playing and losing server identity and not being able to play with certain people cuz youre not in their guild isnt right. there are many people like me that like to play with certain guilds but dont want to join certain guilds. i for one to want to be thrown into a mess of strangers where I can't trust them in battle. i feel like the individual player is getting the boot continually by anet. cant just cater to the sheeple but ignore the individual. unless the intention of anet is to have mindless zombies and everybody eventually gets bored and quits.

Can't we use the same argument for not closing servers though? I want to play with friends on server x server x should therefor not be closed so I can always play with friends on server x.

[Roxanne.6140]

@Namer.9750 said:

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@"Nocturnal Lunacy.8563" said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

Have you never been in a guild with a 'friends' role? Just ask them "Yo, I enjoy running with you, can you invite me and give me a 'friend' role so I can stick with your alliance?"

I know plenty of roamers who're members in bigger guilds and regularly cloud with them.

What's the massive aversion towards joining guilds? You're assuming every guild is like... ☆ 100% REP ☆ ONLY PLAY WHEN COMMANDER IS ONLINE OR GKICK ☆ 5g/raid GUILD TAX OR GKICK ☆ NO ROAM ONLY MEGABLOB OR GKICK ☆ PM SSN FOR INVITE ☆. There are plenty of guilds who go casual for fights and almost every guild I know people in will let friends in. Yeah, there are some freak cases, but I can only name like 3-4 of those out of all the guilds in NA.

Like, can you just

name a guild your and your friends run with without wanting to join, who won't let you in if you just ask

?

Believe it or not, everything that you posted on the guild rules are true. lol.

100% rep; run only zerkers/maruaders; play this day and time only, commit to x days; no xx class allowed; call out every single skill you put on the battlefield; no voice-comm on button press allowed; gold tax; no girls allowed; no this and no that.

And then of course you have to deal with toxicity where the elitists will determine that it is your fault the group lost the last fight.

That being said, I am glad something is being done to balance the population (fingers crossed). I just want to point out that this is going the step of PVE raids and there will be a bunch of people who will lose out.

[Lion.6590]

These are great news!I don't think the world transfer at cost of gems is a good idea, it just looks like a way to break out of the balance system using money, a option to randomly reroll to a new server one time in each season would be better. Although, I see no problem in asking for gems to transferences between regions.

[Richard.8207]

If the goal is handling population fluctuations and balance, why not just let people join the underpowered sides? Either let anyone from any server join the underpowered side through a different WvW entrance, or make some servers queueless mercenary/pug servers that join whoever is in need.

I’d rather find a commander who wants to lead pugs than deal with needing to reorganize everything every 8-week cycle. And I’d definitely rather not have a system that virtually requires elitism.

[Namer.9750]

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@Namer.9750 said:

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@"Nocturnal Lunacy.8563" said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

Have you never been in a guild with a 'friends' role? Just ask them "Yo, I enjoy running with you, can you invite me and give me a 'friend' role so I can stick with your alliance?"

I know plenty of roamers who're members in bigger guilds and regularly cloud with them.

What's the massive aversion towards joining guilds? You're assuming every guild is like... ☆ 100% REP ☆ ONLY PLAY WHEN COMMANDER IS ONLINE OR GKICK ☆ 5g/raid GUILD TAX OR GKICK ☆ NO ROAM ONLY MEGABLOB OR GKICK ☆ PM SSN FOR INVITE ☆. There are plenty of guilds who go casual for fights and almost every guild I know people in will let friends in. Yeah, there are some freak cases, but I can only name like 3-4 of those out of all the guilds in NA.

Like, can you just

name a guild your and your friends run with without wanting to join, who won't let you in if you just ask

?

Believe it or not, everything that you posted on the guild rules are true. lol.

100% rep; run only zerkers/maruaders; play this day and time only, commit to x days; no xx class allowed; call out every single skill you put on the battlefield; no voice-comm on button press allowed; gold tax; no girls allowed; no this and no that.

And then of course you have to deal with toxicity where the elitists will determine that it is your fault the group lost the last fight.

That being said, I am glad something is being done to balance the population (fingers crossed). I just want to point out that this is going the step of PVE raids and there will be a bunch of people who will lose out.

What guild is that tho lmao. Definitely not on NA, we don't allow such acoustics here.

Why would you even run alongside those people instead of memeing them 24/7 lol.

But I get your point. Freak cases do exist.

[Draeyon.4392]

Question: How will inactive players becoming active again affect alliances. E.g. An alliance is close to the max capacity and a few inactive guildies return, mark their guild as their WvW guild and put the alliance over the population cap.

Obviously a situation that will not affect a whole lot of people but information to work with when setting these things up is always appreciated.

[Mr Green.4157]

@Richard.8207 said:If the goal is handling population fluctuations and balance, why not just let people join the underpowered sides? Either let anyone from any server join the underpowered side through a different WvW entrance, or make some servers queueless mercenary/pug servers that join whoever is in need.

I’d rather find a commander who wants to lead pugs than deal with needing to reorganize everything every 8-week cycle. And I’d definitely rather not have a system that virtually requires elitism.

Because who is going to want to play on the losing side over playing on their server?

[Mr Green.4157]

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@Namer.9750 said:

@Roxanne.6140 said:

@"Nocturnal Lunacy.8563" said:The adult in me is excited over what wvw is about to become, but the child in me is suicidal over what wvw will become.But seriously anet, I'm feeling like this is going to push the last remaining roamers from wvw. What about the players that don't want to join guilds but like playing with certain individuals in guilds? Or like to run around with certain guilds but doesnt want to join any guilds? I feel we are being forced to join guilds and alliances or get thrown into the manure pile.

I agree with you. I know of many others who do not want to join a guild but enjoy running with them and these people are not low-skilled newbies at all. Now, they will mainly be used as fillers and thrown into the dailies people. How do you satisfy their expectations?

Have you never been in a guild with a 'friends' role? Just ask them "Yo, I enjoy running with you, can you invite me and give me a 'friend' role so I can stick with your alliance?"

I know plenty of roamers who're members in bigger guilds and regularly cloud with them.

What's the massive aversion towards joining guilds? You're assuming every guild is like... ☆ 100% REP ☆ ONLY PLAY WHEN COMMANDER IS ONLINE OR GKICK ☆ 5g/raid GUILD TAX OR GKICK ☆ NO ROAM ONLY MEGABLOB OR GKICK ☆ PM SSN FOR INVITE ☆. There are plenty of guilds who go casual for fights and almost every guild I know people in will let friends in. Yeah, there are some freak cases, but I can only name like 3-4 of those out of all the guilds in NA.

Like, can you just

name a guild your and your friends run with without wanting to join, who won't let you in if you just ask

?

Believe it or not, everything that you posted on the guild rules are true. lol.

100% rep; run only zerkers/maruaders; play this day and time only, commit to x days; no xx class allowed; call out every single skill you put on the battlefield; no voice-comm on button press allowed; gold tax; no girls allowed; no this and no that.

And then of course you have to deal with toxicity where the elitists will determine that it is your fault the group lost the last fight.

That being said, I am glad something is being done to balance the population (fingers crossed). I just want to point out that this is going the step of PVE raids and there will be a bunch of people who will lose out.

The entire point of the alliance system seems to be to give those who want to play together but don't want to join one single guild a means to do so. If the guild you are following likes you they should allow you into their alliance as that is what alliances are for. If they don't like you enough to do that that means they don't care if you are following them or not or don't know you. Which raises the question, are you following them because you like the people or because you like the bags?

[Richard.8207]

@Mr Green.4157 said:

@Richard.8207 said:If the goal is handling population fluctuations and balance, why not just let people join the underpowered sides? Either let anyone from any server join the underpowered side through a different WvW entrance, or make some servers queueless mercenary/pug servers that join whoever is in need.

I’d rather find a commander who wants to lead pugs than deal with needing to reorganize everything every 8-week cycle. And I’d definitely rather not have a system that virtually requires elitism.

Because who is going to want to play on the losing side over playing on their server?

If your server is massively undermanned at a given moment, wouldn’t you rather join a random server that has a balanced fight? And if that doesn’t appeal to you, can you truly not imagine anyone would choose the balanced fight?