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Open World Domination: Mirage


AliamRationem.5172

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So, this is pretty cool. I got into a discussion with one of my YouTube viewers and it turned me on to the idea of using deceptive evasion for clone generation rather than self-deception. The jury is still out on how much of an impact this will have on overall damage output, but for my first test of the new setup inspired by that discussion I went after the one HoT HP champion that has so far eluded me on my viper Mirage: Mushroom Queen.

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@"AliamRationem.5172" said:So, this is pretty cool. I got into a discussion with one of my YouTube viewers and it turned me on to the idea of using deceptive evasion for clone generation rather than self-deception. The jury is still out on how much of an impact this will have on overall damage output, but for my first test of the new setup inspired by that discussion I went after the one HoT HP champion that has so far eluded me on my viper Mirage: Mushroom Queen.

Personally I can't dream of using Axe mirage without deceptive evasion. It's like toast without butter or fish without chips.

Also that frees you up to take Renewing Oasis for additional sustain. :)

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@Curunen.8729 said:

@"AliamRationem.5172" said:So, this is pretty cool. I got into a discussion with one of my YouTube viewers and it turned me on to the idea of using deceptive evasion for clone generation rather than self-deception. The jury is still out on how much of an impact this will have on overall damage output, but for my first test of the new setup inspired by that discussion I went after the one HoT HP champion that has so far eluded me on my viper Mirage: Mushroom Queen.

Personally I can't dream of using Axe mirage without deceptive evasion. It's like toast without butter or fish without chips.

Also that frees you up to take Renewing Oasis for additional sustain. :)

I think you're right. I am just learning as I go! I am uploading a video of a solo kill of Adal, Unyielding Firmament as we speak. This is another boss I hadn't managed a solo kill of previously. It appears this is working better! Will share the video once it's uploaded.

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@AliamRationem.5172 said:Okay, here we go with another one I hadn't beaten before. Champion Adal, Unyielding Firmament bounty solo kill on Viper Mirage (chaos 3-2-1, Dueling 2-2-3, Mirage 2-3-1):I think that's the third build in this thread now? :)I'm glad you're still fine-tuning what works for your playstyle.

Does the 100 or so extra condition damage you get from Chaotic Transference make such a difference for you that you take it over getting Protection with Chaos Armor and the 20% CD reduction staff you get from Chaotic Dampening?

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@BrazenNL.9857 said:

@AliamRationem.5172 said:Okay, here we go with another one I hadn't beaten before. Champion Adal, Unyielding Firmament bounty solo kill on Viper Mirage (chaos 3-2-1, Dueling 2-2-3, Mirage 2-3-1):I think that's the third build in this thread now? :)I'm glad you're still fine-tuning what works for your playstyle.

Does the 100 or so extra condition damage you get from Chaotic Transference make such a difference for you that you take it over getting Protection with Chaos Armor and the 20% CD reduction staff you get from Chaotic Dampening?

I was using CD when I had two chaos storms, but I didn't feel like I was getting enough out of it with only one. But I doubt it makes a huge difference either way.

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@BrazenNL.9857 said:

@"AliamRationem.5172" said:Okay, here we go with another one I hadn't beaten before. Champion Adal, Unyielding Firmament bounty solo kill on Viper Mirage (chaos 3-2-1, Dueling 2-2-3, Mirage 2-3-1):I think that's the third build in this thread now? :)I'm glad you're still fine-tuning what works for your playstyle.

Does the 100 or so extra condition damage you get from Chaotic Transference make such a difference for you that you take it over getting Protection with Chaos Armor and the 20% CD reduction staff you get from Chaotic Dampening?

Let's make it four, shall we? Tweaking builds is fun!

Here is my first experiment adding Chaotic Dampening to my build. A worthy challenge: Dorrik the Wanderer with Exploiter and Polluter buffs!

Did CD make the difference in this fight? I can't say for certain, but it seems plausible. Dorrik is scary. I've never managed to defeat him before and I wasn't quite convinced that it would be possible for me. Yet, despite terrible DPS due to the exploiter/polluter draw and very defensive play (LoS, kiting) due to the extreme offense of this particular boss resulting in the fight going nearly the entire 10 minute distance, I somehow managed to avoid going down and even pulled off a win with 6 seconds remaining on the timer!

I also stayed in the ring for 10 minutes with the Forged Wildhound using this build. That's another very formidable boss. It's clear the build is pretty resilient, and CD contributes something to that. Thanks for bringing it up! I've gotten a lot of mileage out of other players providing their perspectives and questioning my choices and I'm improving every day as a result!

Chaos 3-3-1Dueling 2-2-3Mirage 2-3-1

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@Alexei.4698 said:Hey, Aliam. Not sure I understand the purpose of Chaotic Interruption in the Chaos line as your GM. Can you enlighten me?

I don't shatter much and the shatters I use most give me boons I already have plenty of, but I do have a few interrupts which I mostly use for breakbars. The immob adds extra CC and I can actually use the might. That's my thinking on it. Am I missing something?

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@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@Alexei.4698 said:Hey, Aliam. Not sure I understand the purpose of Chaotic Interruption in the Chaos line as your GM. Can you enlighten me?

I don't shatter much and the shatters I use most give me boons I already have plenty of, but I do have a few interrupts which I mostly use for breakbars. The immob adds extra CC and I can actually use the might. That's my thinking on it. Am I missing something?

Well, you're 100x the player I am, I assume I am the one missing something :) Where are the interrupts coming from?

I use pretty much the same build (played much more poorly, lol) but have Bountiful Disillusionment as my GM. I don't shatter much either, which is why I ask. I F4 if I need my bacon saved, F3 if a breakbar needs help, and I F1 to spike a little damage and get some Might if I can replace my illusions immediately.

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@Alexei.4698 said:

@Alexei.4698 said:Hey, Aliam. Not sure I understand the purpose of Chaotic Interruption in the Chaos line as your GM. Can you enlighten me?

I don't shatter much and the shatters I use most give me boons I already have plenty of, but I do have a few interrupts which I mostly use for breakbars. The immob adds extra CC and I can actually use the might. That's my thinking on it. Am I missing something?

Well, you're 100x the player I am, I assume
I
am the one missing something :) Where are the interrupts coming from?

I use pretty much the same build (played much more poorly, lol) but have Bountiful Disillusionment as my GM. I don't shatter much either, which is why I ask. I F4 if I need my bacon saved, F3 if a breakbar needs help, and I F1 to spike a little damage and get some Might
if
I can replace my illusions immediately.

Well, mostly from the signet really. I don't think the interrupt on torch phantasm triggers this since the source would be the phantasm? Not sure. I guess BD would be better, but it doesn't feel very useful either way. Honestly, I don't like my trait choices in that tier much at all and wish I could get more out of them!

And I don't doubt that I play well, but I am quite new to the class having only really played Mirage. I'm also mostly a solo player and I don't do any high-end content (raids, fractal CMs, etc.) where people care about sharpening up their game. So there's probably a lot of things about my game that could be improved from trait choices to rotation and timing! I'm just learning as I go!

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@Alexei.4698 said:

@Alexei.4698 said:Hey, Aliam. Not sure I understand the purpose of Chaotic Interruption in the Chaos line as your GM. Can you enlighten me?

I don't shatter much and the shatters I use most give me boons I already have plenty of, but I do have a few interrupts which I mostly use for breakbars. The immob adds extra CC and I can actually use the might. That's my thinking on it. Am I missing something?

Well, you're 100x the player I am, I assume
I
am the one missing something :) Where are the interrupts coming from?

I use pretty much the same build (played much more poorly, lol) but have Bountiful Disillusionment as my GM. I don't shatter much either, which is why I ask. I F4 if I need my bacon saved, F3 if a breakbar needs help, and I F1 to spike a little damage and get some Might
if
I can replace my illusions immediately.

Just to follow up. I switched over to BD. Maybe I don't use shatters much because of ANet's inexplicable decision to completely ruin them for damage output with condi mirage builds, but I use them more than I use interrupts! I don't expect this to be a game changer, but I expect I will get more out of BD than CI. Thanks for the help!

So, here's a new video using chaos 3-3-3, dueling 2-2-3, mirage 2-3-1:

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@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@Alexei.4698 said:Hey, Aliam. Not sure I understand the purpose of Chaotic Interruption in the Chaos line as your GM. Can you enlighten me?

I don't shatter much and the shatters I use most give me boons I already have plenty of, but I do have a few interrupts which I mostly use for breakbars. The immob adds extra CC and I can actually use the might. That's my thinking on it. Am I missing something?

Well, you're 100x the player I am, I assume
I
am the one missing something :) Where are the interrupts coming from?

I use pretty much the same build (played much more poorly, lol) but have Bountiful Disillusionment as my GM. I don't shatter much either, which is why I ask. I F4 if I need my bacon saved, F3 if a breakbar needs help, and I F1 to spike a little damage and get some Might
if
I can replace my illusions immediately.

Just to follow up. I switched over to BD. Maybe I don't use shatters much because of ANet's inexplicable decision to completely ruin them for damage output with condi mirage builds, but I use them more than I use interrupts! I don't expect this to be a game changer, but I expect I will get more out of BD than CI. Thanks for the help!

So, here's a new video using chaos 3-3-3, dueling 2-2-3, mirage 2-3-1:

I love your build and have been using it quite a bit but I find CI better than BD even though you get more boons from shatters because of the break bars. If you look at the conditions it applies, all of them act as DoTs on the break bar. So each time you use something on the break bar it applies immob and one other soft CC. Also the interrupt from Phantasmal Mage still procs traits from your specialization lines because they had to fix a bug that it wasn't procing Confounding Suggestions. If it procs that trait it will proc Chaotic Interruption as well. Skills from your phantasms count as skills from you. In comparison I find that better than the boons you get from shattering, even if the stability is really nice but not as much needed in PvE since Mirage Cloak will still protect you while CCed.

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@Shadow.1345 said:

@Alexei.4698 said:Hey, Aliam. Not sure I understand the purpose of Chaotic Interruption in the Chaos line as your GM. Can you enlighten me?

I don't shatter much and the shatters I use most give me boons I already have plenty of, but I do have a few interrupts which I mostly use for breakbars. The immob adds extra CC and I can actually use the might. That's my thinking on it. Am I missing something?

Well, you're 100x the player I am, I assume
I
am the one missing something :) Where are the interrupts coming from?

I use pretty much the same build (played much more poorly, lol) but have Bountiful Disillusionment as my GM. I don't shatter much either, which is why I ask. I F4 if I need my bacon saved, F3 if a breakbar needs help, and I F1 to spike a little damage and get some Might
if
I can replace my illusions immediately.

Just to follow up. I switched over to BD. Maybe I don't use shatters much because of ANet's inexplicable decision to completely ruin them for damage output with condi mirage builds, but I use them more than I use interrupts! I don't expect this to be a game changer, but I expect I will get more out of BD than CI. Thanks for the help!

So, here's a new video using chaos 3-3-3, dueling 2-2-3, mirage 2-3-1:

I love your build and have been using it quite a bit but I find CI better than BD even though you get more boons from shatters because of the break bars. If you look at the conditions it applies, all of them act as DoTs on the break bar. So each time you use something on the break bar it applies immob and one other soft CC. Also the interrupt from Phantasmal Mage still procs traits from your specialization lines because they had to fix a bug that it wasn't procing Confounding Suggestions. If it procs that trait it will proc Chaotic Interruption as well. Skills from your phantasms count as skills from you. In comparison I find that better than the boons you get from shattering, even if the stability is really nice but not as much needed in PvE since Mirage Cloak will still protect you while CCed.

Thanks for the insight. I'm not sure which I prefer at this point. The boon generation overall is excellent with this build either way! But you may have a point. With chaos storm, phantasmal mage, the signet stun, and diversion you have access to many sources of interrupt to proc CI and those soft CCs add up! I will have to play around with both of them some more and see which feels right. It's hard to tell because either way you're just throwing boons on top of a good build!

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I am new to Mesmer, and just unlocked Mirage. Only have the first three points unlocked so none of the utility skills yet. I can't follow what you are doing from your video. could you post your rotation, without acronyms as I don't know all the skills, so I can give it a try? I am really wanting a champ killer. My soulbeast works for core champions, but gets rolled over by HoT champions.

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@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@BrazenNL.9857 said:Does the 100 or so extra condition damage you get from Chaotic Transference make such a difference for you that you take it over getting Protection with > Here is my first experiment adding Chaotic Dampening to my build. A worthy challenge: Dorrik the Wanderer with Exploiter and Polluter buffs!Did CD make the difference in this fight? I can't say for certain, but it seems plausible. Dorrik is
scary
. I've never managed to defeat him before and I wasn't quite convinced that it would be possible for me. Yet, despite terrible DPS due to the exploiter/polluter draw and very defensive play (LoS, kiting) due to the extreme offense of this particular boss resulting in the fight going nearly the entire 10 minute distance, I somehow managed to avoid going down and even pulled off a win with 6 seconds remaining on the timer!

I also stayed in the ring for 10 minutes with the Forged Wildhound using this build. That's another very formidable boss. It's clear the build is pretty resilient, and CD contributes something to that. Thanks for bringing it up! I've gotten a lot of mileage out of other players providing their perspectives and questioning my choices and I'm improving every day as a result!

Chaos 3-3-1Dueling 2-2-3Mirage 2-3-1

That's exactly my build. Given that it's next to impossible to not drag other enemies into any fight, I like the survivability.

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@"schmots.6803" said:I am new to Mesmer, and just unlocked Mirage. Only have the first three points unlocked so none of the utility skills yet. I can't follow what you are doing from your video. could you post your rotation, without acronyms as I don't know all the skills, so I can give it a try? I am really wanting a champ killer. My soulbeast works for core champions, but gets rolled over by HoT champions.

It's more of a priority queue. Use skills when they're available and when it makes sense to do so. Skills do more than just deal damage, so the priority may not always be using the skill that deals the highest DPS.

So how do you know when to use each skill? Well, the first priority is obviously staying alive. Remember that you can dodge while performing other actions. A common use of this feature is to dodge while performing axe skill 2 (lingering thoughts). This will apply some damage and conditions and generate 2 clones without leaving you vulnerable.

Okay, so now I have 2 clones and I haven't given the enemy an opportunity to hurt me. What next? Make another move without leaving yourself vulnerable, of course! And this is how mirage survives. By chaining together all of this active avoidance and making yourself extremely difficult to hit!

Consider your list of defensive options:Mirage Cloak (1s dodge, 2s reflect following successful evade)Distortion (1-4s invuln)Axes of Symmetry (3/4s evade + target break)The Prestige (3s stealth)Mirror (4s reflect)Illusionary Ambush (1s evade + target break + teleport)Jaunt (teleport)Phase Retreat (teleport)Chaos Armor (protection)Chaos Storm (aegis, protection) Note: You can use combo leaps like jaunt, axes of symmetry, and phase retreat to produce more protection!

Also consider your endurance regen. Vigor and endurance regen food will passively increase the rate at which you recover your ability to dodge. However, don't forget adventurer runes and energy sigil! This gives you access to a dodge-on-demand every 12 seconds from your heal and every 9 seconds from your weapon swap! In fact, you have so much endurance regen that you will have to manage it. You want to avoid using these instant endurance gains when your endurance is above 50%, which means you will have to keep an eye on your endurance and burn a dodge before swapping. That's no big headache, though. It just makes it easier to chain those evades!

You will also want to try to separate dodges wherever possible. If you dodge too soon after a dodge/ambush combo you sometimes miss out on the ambush from the second dodge. A good way of handling this is to try and slip an auto-attack chain inbetween evades. Don't be afraid to dodge during the AA chain if you need to. It's Mirage, so you won't interrupt your attack and you have a full second to follow up with the ambush attack.

Axe is your best damage. If a boss isn't pressuring you at melee range, forget about swapping to staff unless you need it. If they are, staff is generally easier to stay alive with. Proximity is a factor in most enemy threat mechanics. With staff you are not only further away, but you will usually have clones that are closer to the boss than you are. Using target breaks like Illusionary Ambush is also a great way to set a boss off of you and onto one of your clones!

Also remember that you have VERY strong reflect capability, which is far more relevant when you're at range. This is especially important to keep in mind when using your heal. With the traits we have selected, you gain a full 4s reflect when you use your heal. So, if you're in trouble where do you want to use your heal? At close range where the next hit is likely to down you? Or at range, where most attacks the boss could perform will get reflected? Easy choice, huh? By the way, swap to staff, phase retreat, chaos armor, mirror - you are instantly at range, with a clone in the enemy's face, with protection up on top of a 4s reflect to cover your heal cast. Cool!

A quick note on stealth. You don't have a lot of it, so keep this in mind: Projectiles in flight will reveal you if you activate stealth before they land! So, if you're going to use a skill like The Prestige to buy a few seconds, try to make sure you don't do it immediately after ambushing!

CC. If you're going to solo bosses, you need to know your CC skills. This is incredibly important against PoF bounty bosses because their unstable magic buffs aren't in effect for a period of time following breaking their defiance bar. You have solid CC with this build including: chaos storm, diversion, signet of domination, arcane thievery, phantasmal mage, and several "soft" CCs like cripple and blind attached to various skills. You can also gain a bit more via Chaotic Interruption which will add an immob plus chill/cripple/blind to an interrupt on a 3 second cooldown.

Teleports. Aside from evades, blocks, invuln you can simply not be where the attack lands! Jaunt and phase retreat are amazing for this purpose and you will see me use them again and again to escape danger. It's also worth noting that Illusionary Ambush adjusts the teleport distance from the target to your weapon range. So, if you use it with axe you will land closer to the enemy while using it with staff can teleport you an incredible distance (potential maximum of 2400 units!) - and it ignores Z-axis and many obstacles so you can teleport around corners, on top of buildings, even through walls (or inside of objects! oops!). This can be a life-saver...but do be careful as it is completely random and you will also teleport into some not-so-desirable situations. Be ready to dodge when you pull this move!

Arcane Thievery. I wanted to explain this one because it does a lot of things. It's a CC (4s slow), grants quickness, transfers conditions, and strips boons! This can be useful in many ways. Use it before a big axe burst to greatly improve damage for a few seconds. Use it to break defiance bars. Use it for condi cleanse. But especially keep an eye out for the rare enemy that has boons to steal! I get a lot of mileage out of this one against the Legendary Bandit Executioner because those veteran casters constantly stack might on him, giving me a nice 25 stack to steal! Great skill!

Okay, if that's not enough to get you started, I don't know what is! But if you have any followup questions, feel free to ask!

Edit: Thought of one more thing that really applies to any class: Keep moving! Ground-targeted area effects center on the target. If you're in motion, you can often avoid damage by simply continuing in the direction you're moving. However, if you get caught flat-footed you might take a couple of hits before you can escape. But if you do get caught, don't panic! Just dodge. Mirage cloak applies super speed while you're evading, so you can quickly move to safety. You also have those teleports!

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@schmots.6803 said:@AliamRationem.5172 - Wow, that is far more help and information than I am used to getting. I really appreciate it, and think its going to help me understand this class so much better, so thank you again.

Well, I've gotten plenty of help from other players commenting in this forum and on my youtube channel. What good is making all these videos if I can't share what I've learned with others?

Having said that, mine is a bit of an odd perspective. I expect you'd get some different advice from a source more focused on instanced group PvE like raids/fractals. For instance, the guys over at snowcrows.com know how to put out maximum damage. So they use axe/torch, axe/pistol. They use the same stats (Viper) and sigils I do, but swap in Renegade runes for extra damage where I use Adventurer runes for more evasion. They also use the same trait lines I do, but their picks are all damage-oriented where mine tend to be more focused on survival.

You're going to get a lot more damage out of their build, despite the similarities. And it's still quite survivable, especially in a group with a little bit of added support/healing from allies. The major issue for a solo player going up against tough challenges is that it really isn't feasible to stay at melee range 100% of the time without support! Using axe/torch, axe/pistol produces amazing damage...but you'll deal next to nothing if you're forced out to range for any reason, and prioritizing damage 100% is going to make you significantly more vulnerable in general.

That's the difference between a full on raid DPS meta build and one that is similar, yet adapted for solo open world play.

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