Things that Should be changed For Next Season - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Things that Should be changed For Next Season

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  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 thank you for responding and getting back to this post.

    Just one last question, Have you guys thought about possibly adding a new legendary or something to make players want to play rank again?

  • What about giving extra points (1-2 tops) per top tier? Like if I got most kills in a match that would give me 1-2 pts (though in plat prob should be 1 pt per only). If I get kills, dmg, revives i'd get 3-6 pts. From what I have seen a lot of the people that get these tend to be stronger players. I guess what I am trying to say is that even if you are on the team lost, if you achieved several of these top tiers then you would lose less ranked points and it would also allow you to progress in ranked. It may also help out with toxic players who tend to quit the game. At least they can then go for top tiers and thus still play the match rather than "afking" at base or such. This would also get the better players in the ranked tiers they may actually belong in.

  • shadowpass.4236shadowpass.4236 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Thanks for your feedback and thoughts, even if I don't agree with all your points. Reading constructive posts gets us to think about these systems and evaluate changes to make, even if the changes we do aren't the suggested ones!

    Hi Ben,

    Would you guys consider letting everyone duo que again?

    Basically every single top player on NA gets on discord every night to hang out, this is one of the conversations that came up. After a lengthy debate, pretty much everyone agreed that removing duo ques hurt the game more than it helped it.


    These were some of the points we brought up:

    1. The current leaderboard isn't indicative of who is actually the best players. Why?
      • The only way to currently carry a ranked match is to play a high damage roamer/bruiser. As such, the best builds to carry on currently are mesmer and deadeye. These classes make up the majority of the top 10.
    2. The leaderboards and titles mean nothing at this point. There should just be a shiny reward for obtaining legendary rank, and the leaderboard should be done away with. Why?
      • The leaderboard just encourages toxicity and again, isn't indicative of who is actually the best. As for titles, there is a stigma tied to them. The people who have the best titles are constantly referred to as "wintraders" even though they have gotten them completely legitimately.
    3. Ranked matches aren't fun on their own. That's the reason most of us just log on for ATs or tournaments.
      • If the leaderboards mean nothing and we're not having fun, Anet should just add duos back in. At least in this case, we can play together and have fun rather than not play at all.

    These all came straight from the mouths of well-known top players in the community. I didn't have my mic set up at the time so I just listened for the majority of the discussion.

    Hopefully you read this and consider our opinions.

    Thanks,
    Shadow

    We've been talking about it internally. Honestly, I'm still on the fence. Duo queue certainly makes the game more fun for higher-skilled players, since it gives greater control of the match, and reduces risk. However, it's been proven statistically that it hurts matchmaking. Two Plat-2 players together very frequently results in a lopsided match.

    Thank you for the response!

    I actually edited in 2 more bullet points to my original post as well.

    Yes, you're right about duo que making the game more fun for higher-skilled players.


    With that being said, I have a question:

    1. Many of the top players don't play because they don't find the game fun unless they are playing with their friends. If you guys added duo back in, I'd bet most of them would start to que ranked regularly. So, would the heavy influx of players actually help improve matchmaking by solving some of the population issues?
      • It would also improve the quality of matches at the highest divisions because there is now a greater pool of players to choose from. This means that the skill/rating gaps wouldn't be as significant as they are now where top tier platinum players are matched against people in gold.

    I may be mistaken on this. But I believe that this was also one of the points we discussed last night on discord.

    There would have to be enough that return that we could pit 2 duo queues against each other at all times. I'm not confident that would happen, so making the change we would have to be willing to sacrifice some match quality in return.

    Would that be a trade-off you'd be willing to make as a test for the next season?

    The enjoyment, fun, and population increase for higher tier players vs. slightly lower match quality for the people rated 1600+

  • eksn.7264eksn.7264 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    Queuing now is a pretty big roll of the dice, I want to say almost more than any other PvP era in 5 years, in terms of skill level and builds of your teammates/opponents. This is just pure anecdotal evidence, but I think everyone has more or less of a similar experience once they reach plat. I'm sure it's a combination of many factors, some out of Anet's control, some fixable. For example, very hard to fix issue: adding more specs with expansions means the variance in builds is just going to keep getting higher and the chances of getting a solid teamcomp lower (although the variance narrows the higher rank you are). Fixable issues: try to keep improving matchmaking, more incentives to play, etc.

    It's also really easy to reach plat, but the difference in skill level from plat 1 to 2 is night and day, and it only takes 3-4 losses to go way back down to plat 1 because of how many points you lose. If I can reach top 100 and queue at an off time, it'll only take a few losses to not even be in the top 250. What's even the point of these divisions? As a serious PvP player of 5 years I take no pride in my rank in this current system, even legend doesn't seem to mean much. I only play for the reward tracks at this point.

  • Being back duoq rankedq already really has no substantial rewards or incentive so letting 1600+ players play together is in itself will bring back players to ranked.
    Also you can just make duoqs have longer qtimes as well.
    Also if you want to rank up on the ladder anything that isn't a high dps roamer isn't good.Bring back duoq will enable necros and firebrands/all other roles more playtime as you'd have someone you could count on.

  • Panda.3620Panda.3620 Member ✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Rufo.3716 said:
    Just get rid of ranking all together. Unranked is by far more popular just due to the fact the toxicity is much much lower overall. My unranked matches are better games, less toxic, and much better quality overall. Just add PvP rewards to unranked and get rid of ranked all together. Face it, the way ranking is done in ranked is just bad and doesn't show an accurate skill level at all. I've watch high level pro players go on a streak of losing and almost falling out of plat all together.

    When you have players running around plat/gold that can't even grasp the basics of a map, or even a simple rotation, there is a major problem with how skill is determined.

    Numbers do not agree with your statement. While seasons are running, ranked has roughly double the number of matches as unranked.

    That's because it's a loot farm... Stop giving out rewards just for showing up and you'll see how that goes.
    Removing teams killed pvp, that's why unranked offers better matches.
    Until you realize how unsustainable the current mindset is, PvP will just keep going worse.
    No teams, reward farming, and lack of consistent balance are the true scourge of pvp.

  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    what are you talking about balance? are you anywhere in the 1600-1800 rating? Games are NOT balance anywhere at that level.

  • shadowpass.4236shadowpass.4236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    I hope you realize that this change will not really affect anyone beyond the 140 people in the 1600 range.

    This topic doesn't concern anyone below the 1600 threshold.

  • Panda.3620Panda.3620 Member ✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    I hope you realize that this change will not really affect anyone beyond the 140 people in the 1600 range.

    This topic doesn't concern anyone below the 1600 threshold.

    Exactly, thats why I said to do a official pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ.

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    what are you talking about balance? are you anywhere in the 1600-1800 rating? Games are NOT balance anywhere at that level.

    I am and I find it balanced, if you can't take a loss, don't play a competitive mode, everyone on the LB has a perfectly normal w/l rating to be on the LB, some matches will be one sided but that's normal and there is no way to avoid it, it's impossible.

    Im sitting between 1650 and can't go higher and I acknowledge the fact that there is a huge skill gap between me and a top 10~20 player, if they're on the enemy team I won't cry because the match will probably be one sided or hard, you can't balance players but you can balance classes. Matchmaking has been doing a fine job pairing players.

  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Panda.3620 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    I hope you realize that this change will not really affect anyone beyond the 140 people in the 1600 range.

    This topic doesn't concern anyone below the 1600 threshold.

    Exactly, thats why I said to do a official pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ.

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    what are you talking about balance? are you anywhere in the 1600-1800 rating? Games are NOT balance anywhere at that level.

    I am and I find it balanced, if you can't take a loss, don't play a competitive mode, everyone on the LB has a perfectly normal w/l rating to be on the LB, some matches will be one sided but that's normal and there is no way to avoid it, it's impossible.

    Im sitting between 1650 and can't go higher and I acknowledge the fact that there is a huge skill gap between me and a top 10~20 player, if they're on the enemy team I won't cry because the match will probably be one sided or hard, you can't balance players but you can balance classes. Matchmaking has been doing a fine job pairing players.

    You do understand that your rating anywhere in the 1600s won’t matter in the last week right ? Currently now to even get on the leaderboard is within the mid 1500s we won’t see actual good quality games till the last two weeks it’s been like this for a few seasons now.

    In no way should I been winning matches over 350 points or losing a match over 350 points that isn’t “balance” nor or horrible team comps going against “meta”. That with itself is a balancing issue for players within the 1600-1800 rating. If you consider everything that’s been happening “balance” then that’s on your opinion just how mines is to disagree this system for match making is Far from being anywhere near “balance” or fair at all.

  • Ithilwen.1529Ithilwen.1529 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Emtiarbi.3281 said:
    Have you guys though on reimplementing something like win streak?

    No! Absolutely NOT! Those win streaks and the corresponding loss streaks ( I ran approximately 68 straight losses at one point, ) are a big reason the population is as low as it is.

    Mesmerizing Girl

  • Panda.3620Panda.3620 Member ✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    I hope you realize that this change will not really affect anyone beyond the 140 people in the 1600 range.

    This topic doesn't concern anyone below the 1600 threshold.

    Exactly, thats why I said to do a official pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ.

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @Panda.3620 said:
    Do a official anet pool with 1600+ players if they want duoQ, I'm certainly it will be a no. Matches are pretty balanced now, the LB proves it, duoQ is just a excuse to secure your rating easier and lower the match quality for other players, but class balance should be looked at, balance patches takes way too long.

    what are you talking about balance? are you anywhere in the 1600-1800 rating? Games are NOT balance anywhere at that level.

    I am and I find it balanced, if you can't take a loss, don't play a competitive mode, everyone on the LB has a perfectly normal w/l rating to be on the LB, some matches will be one sided but that's normal and there is no way to avoid it, it's impossible.

    Im sitting between 1650 and can't go higher and I acknowledge the fact that there is a huge skill gap between me and a top 10~20 player, if they're on the enemy team I won't cry because the match will probably be one sided or hard, you can't balance players but you can balance classes. Matchmaking has been doing a fine job pairing players.

    You do understand that your rating anywhere in the 1600s won’t matter in the last week right ? Currently now to even get on the leaderboard is within the mid 1500s we won’t see actual good quality games till the last two weeks it’s been like this for a few seasons now.

    In no way should I been winning matches over 350 points or losing a match over 350 points that isn’t “balance” nor or horrible team comps going against “meta”. That with itself is a balancing issue for players within the 1600-1800 rating. If you consider everything that’s been happening “balance” then that’s on your opinion just how mines is to disagree this system for match making is Far from being anywhere near “balance” or fair at all.

    I've been playing since the introduction of the new rating system and never had a problem with the last weeks. Sure games got more competitive and toxic and there is a bigger influx of players but doesn't change my rating at all, usually it goes up.

    You're losing matches over 350 points because of team composition, that's class balance. Players that get on our matches are from close skill level, that's matchmaking pairing balance. When you pick a mirrored matchup the matches are pretty technical since all players are skilled but when you get stupid OP things on the enemy team like necro+firebrand combo + mirage and your team has a necro without support or people running off meta or a wild rev tmatches will be one sided even though all players are skilled.

  • Since we are entering season 12 now it really would not hurt changing the rules from time to time. One season with duoQ just to see how the it goes would spice things up a bit. What holds duoQ back in my opinion is the whole Mesmer class right now. A class should not be able fulfil nearly every role while being that mobile...but that's a different discussion...

  • Xtrverz.4069Xtrverz.4069 Member ✭✭

    Reintroduce duo q as a test for next season but lower the rating gain from duoing and increase rating gain from solo q ing?

    helia r-6xBest of the Best/God of PvP

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @Ithilwen.1529 said:

    @Emtiarbi.3281 said:
    Have you guys though on reimplementing something like win streak?

    No! Absolutely NOT! Those win streaks and the corresponding loss streaks ( I ran approximately 68 straight losses at one point, ) are a big reason the population is as low as it is.

    You clear don't understand what they were asking for when they say win streak.

  • Assic.2746Assic.2746 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    Adding some of this new achievements , or reward would generate more players to jump over and focus in playing rank(more people playing the better it is for everyone).

    We add new rewards as we get them. We have more rewards in the pipeline, though I can't tell you when they will be delivered. As far as new achievements, I'm not opposed. What kind of achievements would you like to see?

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 You know how we have those achivements for winning 150 games with each profession "Champion Shadow" etc. What about winning 150 games with elite specs : "Champion Firebrand", "Champion Scourge" etc. Winning a game as FB for example would progress your Guardian title by 1 and FB title by 1.

    Other than that I believe that if you want to bring more PvE audience into PvP you should make special events with special rewards - skins. Like a glove skin or helmet for winning a few tournament games. After the event is over skins could be acquired from PvP vendor for Tickets & Ascended shards. Add some good looking skin which can be acquired only via PvP and players will come. Maybe they will just get the skin and leave. Maybe they will stay. But at least they will give it a shot. Which is important. I recently tried to put together a guild team for ATs and 3 out of 200 people were interested :anguished: . There are players who haven't tried PvP since 2012.

  • Glider.5792Glider.5792 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    When it comes to new achievments, i just think that "Year of the Ascension" needs to end and be replaced with a new "Year" or something. The achievments can stay the same, people just need more reasons to play ranked, and some play it due to missing achievments.

    I can say for myself, pvp and especially ranked pvp stress me out every now and then, so i take really long breaks from it sometimes. But the missing achievments (class wins) are the main reason why i keep coming back.
    When year of ascension came, that was most likely the time i was most active in ranked. There was a whole new category of achievments for me to aim towards to, alongside the legendary.

    What is my signature?

  • nia.4725nia.4725 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    We add new rewards as we get them. We have more rewards in the pipeline, though I can't tell you when they will be delivered. As far as new achievements, I'm not opposed. What kind of achievements would you like to see?

    I'm thinking about titles for getting a specific top stat X times. Something like this:
    250 times earning the healing best stat > Life giver
    250 times earning the damage best stat > Master of pain
    250 times earning the kills best stat > Master of death
    250 times earning the offense best stat >Tireless assaulter
    250 times earning the defense best stat > Everlasting defender

    This maybe could make people interested into trying different kinds of builds and improving at playing them in order to get the cool title attached to it.

    Other things (requires more dev time tho):
    Letting players rate their teammates when the match ends (like giving that cool and friendly teammate a Loved Playing With You badge) and creating achievements with titles and maybe a small reward or gizmo (like a thing that gives you an aura of hearts for 5 minutes) for them.

    Handkiter slave. / Cat Fletcher, Cho Jinri, Elettra Hart, Anima Schirmer, La Que Ama, B I T T E R N E S S

  • @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    There would have to be enough that return that we could pit 2 duo queues against each other at all times. I'm not confident that would happen, so making the change we would have to be willing to sacrifice some match quality in return.

    Which is a terrible idea to please a vocal minority. Most players would suffer from this but it has been discussed so many times.
    There are already several complaints about matchmaking quality (personally I'm fairly satisfied currently, it is a LOT better than duoq and 5 man q times). Ranked would become a playground for a few number of duoq-ers which would eventually lead to a dead gamemode. Even the last vote we had about bringing back duoq here on the forums - where the vocal (complaining) minority is extremely overrepresented - people voted down this option.

  • Ithilwen.1529Ithilwen.1529 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zoopop.5630 said:
    Just going to list a few things that should be addressed and looked on by anet.

    1. Having the top 250 play 1 game every 2-3 days after meeting the total game requirement for the season kills the match making/population

    What I believe should be done in order to keep people from camping their rating/spot on the leader board is that anyone above Plat should be required to play 2-3 games per day before they get decayed or drop in rating from not playing long enough(for the "casual" players this would suck but then again rank shouldn't be so casual in the first place).

    I feel like decay is in an ok spot right now. I don't want to force someone to have to play every single day.

    1. Add New titles, Rewards, Or even add a new legendary that would requier a few season to complete.

    Adding some of this new achievements , or reward would generate more players to jump over and focus in playing rank(more people playing the better it is for everyone).

    We add new rewards as we get them. We have more rewards in the pipeline, though I can't tell you when they will be delivered. As far as new achievements, I'm not opposed. What kind of achievements would you like to see?

    1. Report system NEEDS to be adjusted/fixed so it can actually be useful to report x player for x amount of reasons.

    the current report system seems to be a "joke" toward a lot of negative players/trolls that just don't fear it at all. This needs to be looked into and buffed in terms of how it should be feared so we can get less toxic games/players. Can't have a proper report system if no one really respects it enough to fear it right?

    I can't comment too much on CS stuff like reporting players.

    1. Rating system NEEDS to be relooked into If the spvp Population is low

    If noting being done to attract more players into spvp, then the Rating system needs to be addressed big time. If one player has 30 wins over loses in rank but is rated at 1600 rating because he or she played over 150 games total and Player 2 has 25 wins over loses but under 150 games total played and yet is rated in the 1700s because he or she is playing the "minimal" games required then something doesn't add up at all. The current system in place at the moment seem to punishes players for playing to much which doesn't make sense at all and is a factor as to why match making/population really low when queuing up(when above plat rating).

    The formulas for skill rating are based on quality of win/loss. If you defeat a team that has a higher mmr average than yours, you will gain more points. Yes, someone playing more games takes more risks to lose, but they also have more opportunity to gain points. Generally, messing with the glicko rating system has been shown to make it worse. We don't want to do something to make skill ratings suddenly start climbing to infinity, which is what I think most people's suggestions would do.

    1. Soft reset after every season needs to be swapped into "hard" reset after every season or the very least after xx amount of seasons

    these soft resets haven't done a single thing besides keep the same 50-100 players in the same exact spot over and over. With a system that punishes players for spamming to much rank games how does this benefit silver/gold players if they are pretty much rest into the same setting they were before the season ended with a rating system that does more harm to your overall rating level even if you go 50/50?

    We've debated going to a hard reset internally from time to time. The only big pro to a hard reset is making everyone start from the same place, as you note. But the drawback is that the start of seasons would become even far more chaotic than they are now. Match quality is certainly much lower at the start of a season, and the soft reset is one of the reasons. A hard reset would make this even worse. Also, the idea that the top players only stay high because of the soft reset is wrong, I believe. Most of them have proven that they have the ability to get back there. With the reset, the highest someone usually starts is Plat 1.

    Just a few things i believe should be added/changed in order to help make things a lot smoother for players, however none of these are "facts" it's just an opinion of a player whos been around 5 season with the same rating level of plat 1 - plat 3 over and over. The game is enjoyable because the battle system is different and amazing but it gets really boring when matches end up 100-500 winning only 6 rating, but if i lose a match where it's 189-500 i lose out on 17-19 rating which is a reason why so many "smart" players play 1 - 3 game every few days after reaching over 100 games played total in the season. This kills the population and the fun from most players and should be deeply looked into @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 if you can please give us some details on any of the things listed ill highly appreciate it.

    P.S I didn't mention balancing because it's pretty obv we all know it's needed more frequently.

    Thanks for your feedback and thoughts, even if I don't agree with all your points. Reading constructive posts gets us to think about these systems and evaluate changes to make, even if the changes we do aren't the suggested ones!

    You already have a legendary reward, which is still available as far as I know..You just need to publicize it.

    Though I note: in Reality no one is going to want to play all the various classes in ranked... and get slaughtered. Unranked perhaps?

    Mesmerizing Girl

  • Faffin.6741Faffin.6741 Member ✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    We've debated going to a hard reset internally from time to time. The only big pro to a hard reset is making everyone start from the same place, as you note. But the drawback is that the start of seasons would become even far more chaotic than they are now. Match quality is certainly much lower at the start of a season, and the soft reset is one of the reasons. A hard reset would make this even worse. Also, the idea that the top players only stay high because of the soft reset is wrong, I believe. Most of them have proven that they have the ability to get back there. With the reset, the highest someone usually starts is Plat 1.

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 From my point of view, the trouble with soft reset is that it tends to hold people in place. Having a bad streak in ratings matches (don't ever start the season minutes after it opens) it has been extremely hard to climb the ladder, as I have to win more often than someone who started higher. Then I have to face the same thing again next season because I haven't managed to get up there agsainst the odds before the season ends. Great incentive. Not. I also find it difficult to believe that a hard reset could make things much worse than they already are. Perhaps the a good solution would be to increase the number of rating matches?

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zoopop.5630 said:
    Just going to list a few things that should be addressed and looked on by anet.

    1. Having the top 250 play 1 game every 2-3 days after meeting the total game requirement for the season kills the match making/population

    What I believe should be done in order to keep people from camping their rating/spot on the leader board is that anyone above Plat should be required to play 2-3 games per day before they get decayed or drop in rating from not playing long enough(for the "casual" players this would suck but then again rank shouldn't be so casual in the first place).

    I feel like decay is in an ok spot right now. I don't want to force someone to have to play every single day.

    1. Add New titles, Rewards, Or even add a new legendary that would requier a few season to complete.

    Adding some of this new achievements , or reward would generate more players to jump over and focus in playing rank(more people playing the better it is for everyone).

    We add new rewards as we get them. We have more rewards in the pipeline, though I can't tell you when they will be delivered. As far as new achievements, I'm not opposed. What kind of achievements would you like to see?

    1. Report system NEEDS to be adjusted/fixed so it can actually be useful to report x player for x amount of reasons.

    the current report system seems to be a "joke" toward a lot of negative players/trolls that just don't fear it at all. This needs to be looked into and buffed in terms of how it should be feared so we can get less toxic games/players. Can't have a proper report system if no one really respects it enough to fear it right?

    I can't comment too much on CS stuff like reporting players.

    1. Rating system NEEDS to be relooked into If the spvp Population is low

    If noting being done to attract more players into spvp, then the Rating system needs to be addressed big time. If one player has 30 wins over loses in rank but is rated at 1600 rating because he or she played over 150 games total and Player 2 has 25 wins over loses but under 150 games total played and yet is rated in the 1700s because he or she is playing the "minimal" games required then something doesn't add up at all. The current system in place at the moment seem to punishes players for playing to much which doesn't make sense at all and is a factor as to why match making/population really low when queuing up(when above plat rating).

    The formulas for skill rating are based on quality of win/loss. If you defeat a team that has a higher mmr average than yours, you will gain more points. Yes, someone playing more games takes more risks to lose, but they also have more opportunity to gain points. Generally, messing with the glicko rating system has been shown to make it worse. We don't want to do something to make skill ratings suddenly start climbing to infinity, which is what I think most people's suggestions would do.

    1. Soft reset after every season needs to be swapped into "hard" reset after every season or the very least after xx amount of seasons

    these soft resets haven't done a single thing besides keep the same 50-100 players in the same exact spot over and over. With a system that punishes players for spamming to much rank games how does this benefit silver/gold players if they are pretty much rest into the same setting they were before the season ended with a rating system that does more harm to your overall rating level even if you go 50/50?

    We've debated going to a hard reset internally from time to time. The only big pro to a hard reset is making everyone start from the same place, as you note. But the drawback is that the start of seasons would become even far more chaotic than they are now. Match quality is certainly much lower at the start of a season, and the soft reset is one of the reasons. A hard reset would make this even worse. Also, the idea that the top players only stay high because of the soft reset is wrong, I believe. Most of them have proven that they have the ability to get back there. With the reset, the highest someone usually starts is Plat 1.

    Just a few things i believe should be added/changed in order to help make things a lot smoother for players, however none of these are "facts" it's just an opinion of a player whos been around 5 season with the same rating level of plat 1 - plat 3 over and over. The game is enjoyable because the battle system is different and amazing but it gets really boring when matches end up 100-500 winning only 6 rating, but if i lose a match where it's 189-500 i lose out on 17-19 rating which is a reason why so many "smart" players play 1 - 3 game every few days after reaching over 100 games played total in the season. This kills the population and the fun from most players and should be deeply looked into @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 if you can please give us some details on any of the things listed ill highly appreciate it.

    P.S I didn't mention balancing because it's pretty obv we all know it's needed more frequently.

    Thanks for your feedback and thoughts, even if I don't agree with all your points. Reading constructive posts gets us to think about these systems and evaluate changes to make, even if the changes we do aren't the suggested ones!

    I fully agree with everything you have written here and I hope you continue this stance.

    In my opinion the best thing you can do for PvP rewards is to allow players to get new items in PvP, WvW or PvE with minimal cross over needed which has mostly been accomplished with fairly non invasive reward tracks. They’re not the most fun way of doing things but it gets the job done and that’s what matters.

    I still think the biggest issue for PvP (WvW and to some degree PvE) is the snails pace of balance patches and how little they really change most of the time. I know it’s not your area and you’ve probably heard it before but having to wait months and months before most of the anti fun aspects are solved has really killed my drive to play the game. Sometimes like in the case of ele you’re looking at 2 years to see anything like a role change.

    I stand with Mo.

  • pah.4931pah.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Mutaatti.2789 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Rufo.3716 said:
    Just get rid of ranking all together. Unranked is by far more popular just due to the fact the toxicity is much much lower overall. My unranked matches are better games, less toxic, and much better quality overall. Just add PvP rewards to unranked and get rid of ranked all together. Face it, the way ranking is done in ranked is just bad and doesn't show an accurate skill level at all. I've watch high level pro players go on a streak of losing and almost falling out of plat all together.

    When you have players running around plat/gold that can't even grasp the basics of a map, or even a simple rotation, there is a major problem with how skill is determined.

    Numbers do not agree with your statement. While seasons are running, ranked has roughly double the number of matches as unranked.

    So how come Unranked Qpops happen in 1-2 mins, while Ranked goes up to 6-7 mins?

    And when they do, it feels like playing Unranked. Teams are so unbalanced that one team has 3 legendary players and 2 plat 2, while other team has one plat 3 and 4 plat 1 players? Happened, dont have pic so believe or not.

    I enjoy playing in Unranked more than in Ranked. Ppl arent so toxic, they play for fun or try something new. And no one gets offended by losing to lower tier team. (Or if they do, no one cares).

    Unranked is more fun for a couple of reasons.

    1) More casual and therefore less toxic, as you mentioned
    2a) Way more build variety (not only on opponents' team, but people are generally more cool with YOU playing something whacky)
    2b) Games without Scourge or Mesmer tend to be super fun (funny how that works out) and those profs aren't guarantees in unranked
    3) The game design of ranked encourages and rewards bad behavior ... because it's what I call "forced fun" ... instead of making a game mode that is really fun and engaging for players so that they WANT to play the game a lot, ranked sPvP incentivizes all the very things that make it unfun. Oppressive meta builds; not playing at all off peak (so if that's the only time you can play ranked, you might as well forget about it); not playing often to keep rank (and then ironically forcing you to play because decay, screw you vacation on the beach!); not allowing people to play in groups; etc.

    The solution is simple.

    RANKED - team-q only, really great rewards, leader boards, titles, all that. Ranked just doesn't make sense in conquest with solo-q. They don't make single-player raids, then why do we insist on single-player high-level pvp? If you REALLY want to compete and be "ranked" then find a team ... it's more fun for everyone that way. ATs aren't good enough to foster team-play.

    UNRANKED - solo- or team-q, good rewards (add pips and chests), and ideally more game modes. For casual, quick fun.

  • rank eleven monk.9502rank eleven monk.9502 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    @Faffin.6741 said:
    From my point of view, the trouble with soft reset is that it tends to hold people in place. Having a bad streak in ratings matches (don't ever start the season minutes after it opens) it has been extremely hard to climb the ladder, as I have to win more often than someone who started higher. Then I have to face the same thing again next season because I haven't managed to get up there agsainst the odds before the season ends. Great incentive. Not. I also find it difficult to believe that a hard reset could make things much worse than they already are. Perhaps the a good solution would be to increase the number of rating matches?

    There is no such a thing as holding people in place. It is fairly quick and easy to climb even if you were placed in lower divisions. You get tons of ratings and easy farms if you were placed in low divisions. This myth has been busted several times.

    as I have to win more often than someone who started higher.

    Seems that you don't really understand how matchmaking and ratings work. Yes, you need a higher winrate at start, but this won't really be a problem as you will be playing against lot worse players if you were placed lower. It evens out.

    @pah.4931 said:
    The solution is simple.

    RANKED - team-q only, really great rewards, leader boards, titles, all that. Ranked just doesn't make sense in conquest with solo-q. They don't make single-player raids, then why do we insist on single-player high-level pvp? If you REALLY want to compete and be "ranked" then find a team ... it's more fun for everyone that way. ATs aren't good enough to foster team-play.

    Might as well remove ranked altogether as there is no population to support team q, not even duoq

  • Abazigal.3679Abazigal.3679 Member ✭✭✭

    @rank eleven monk.9502 said:

    @Faffin.6741 said:
    From my point of view, the trouble with soft reset is that it tends to hold people in place. Having a bad streak in ratings matches (don't ever start the season minutes after it opens) it has been extremely hard to climb the ladder, as I have to win more often than someone who started higher. Then I have to face the same thing again next season because I haven't managed to get up there agsainst the odds before the season ends. Great incentive. Not. I also find it difficult to believe that a hard reset could make things much worse than they already are. Perhaps the a good solution would be to increase the number of rating matches?

    There is no such a thing as holding people in place. It is fairly quick and easy to climb even if you were placed in lower divisions. You get tons of ratings and easy farms if you were placed in low divisions. This myth has been busted several times.

    as I have to win more often than someone who started higher.

    Seems that you don't really understand how matchmaking and ratings work. Yes, you need a higher winrate at start, but this won't really be a problem as you will be playing against lot worse players if you were placed lower. It evens out.

    Completly wrong. I've experienced it past seasons, lose streaks and having to remain in gold 2 several days due to unplayable matchs ( to give you an idea, i've had people complaining and afking at 60-40 2-1 caps ). You still manage to get back to your rank on the long run, but this is nowhere something " fairly quick and easy ".

    I agree also however with Faffin regarding season's begin. First matchs out of placement have a too big impact. Having 8 games( i don't know how many games until points stabilize) counting for +/- 25 is to much, and you can have bad luck on these.

  • @Abazigal.3679 said:
    Completly wrong. I've experienced it past seasons, lose streaks and having to remain in gold 2 several days due to unplayable matchs ( to give you an idea, i've had people complaining and afking at 60-40 2-1 caps ). You still manage to get back to your rank on the long run, but this is nowhere something " fairly quick and easy ".

    I agree also however with Faffin regarding season's begin. First matchs out of placement have a too big impact. Having 8 games( i don't know how many games until points stabilize) counting for +/- 25 is to much, and you can have bad luck on these.

    Completely wrong? That's how the matchmaking algorythm works. Your personal experience might differ. I can also give you an example: playing on my alt account, I got placed in silver t1 with a core ranger iirc, and climbed to low platinum in an additional - roughly - 30 games.
    There are uncarriable matches obviously, and the number of these are dependent based purely on your luck, but people make too much out of placement matches (e.g. you have the same ppl in higher tiers as well, afking after 1 wipe or whatever).

  • Seffen.2875Seffen.2875 Member ✭✭✭

    I will give my two Cents.

    I tried to build the legendary back or let's say i am still building it, though i stopped playing pvp.

    why have i stopped? It is just not fun enough compared to other modes. This is nothing i can actually say where it is coming from. Rather a General Feeling here. Especially losses feel incredibly worse compared to how god wins feel. So if you would add wins and losses to your Feelings the more you Play you will always end up negative. Most of the times, it is not even about the rewards. They are okish. Even the Balance is not such a big deal for me as it is for most of the People here.

    A huge part is the missing "doing something with others". PvP feels like a do it alone Thing. This combined with all this toxicity and all the flaming makes pvp a rather unpleasant Event.

    I think the real Problem of pvp is the atmosphere in pvp.

  • Emtiarbi.3281Emtiarbi.3281 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ithilwen.1529 said:

    @Emtiarbi.3281 said:
    Have you guys though on reimplementing something like win streak?

    No! Absolutely NOT! Those win streaks and the corresponding loss streaks ( I ran approximately 68 straight losses at one point, ) are a big reason the population is as low as it is.

    I'm not sure what it had to do with the low population right now? But what i'm thinking is about giving more pips (reward) for win streaks. Not related to the rating :)

  • nia.4725nia.4725 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @nia.4725 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    We add new rewards as we get them. We have more rewards in the pipeline, though I can't tell you when they will be delivered. As far as new achievements, I'm not opposed. What kind of achievements would you like to see?

    I'm thinking about titles for getting a specific top stat X times. Something like this:
    250 times earning the healing best stat > Life giver
    250 times earning the damage best stat > Master of pain
    250 times earning the kills best stat > Master of death
    250 times earning the offense best stat >Tireless assaulter
    250 times earning the defense best stat > Everlasting defender

    This maybe could make people interested into trying different kinds of builds and improving at playing them in order to get the cool title attached to it.

    Other things (requires more dev time tho):
    Letting players rate their teammates when the match ends (like giving that cool and friendly teammate a Loved Playing With You badge) and creating achievements with titles and maybe a small reward or gizmo (like a thing that gives you an aura of hearts for 5 minutes) for them.

    The problem with giving titles for top stats is I don't want to incentivize going after them over going after wins. We'd see people just spamming heals, needed or not. Or chasing people down for kills rather than playing to win strategically.

    The titles could require earning the top stat and winning the match. Losses could not count towards the achievement. Just like map achievements (win 25 matches where you cap the bell, etc)?

    Handkiter slave. / Cat Fletcher, Cho Jinri, Elettra Hart, Anima Schirmer, La Que Ama, B I T T E R N E S S

  • @zoopop.5630 said:
    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 thank you for responding and getting back to this post.

    Just one last question, Have you guys thought about possibly adding a new legendary or something to make players want to play rank again?

    We do talk about a new legendary backpack. It's not off the table, but it's probably not happening any time soon.

    Ben Phongluangtham
    Game Designer
    Reddit: ANET_BenP
    Twitch: AnetBenP

  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zoopop.5630 said:
    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 thank you for responding and getting back to this post.

    Just one last question, Have you guys thought about possibly adding a new legendary or something to make players want to play rank again?

    We do talk about a new legendary backpack. It's not off the table, but it's probably not happening any time soon.

    any reasons as to why though?

  • @zoopop.5630 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zoopop.5630 said:
    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 thank you for responding and getting back to this post.

    Just one last question, Have you guys thought about possibly adding a new legendary or something to make players want to play rank again?

    We do talk about a new legendary backpack. It's not off the table, but it's probably not happening any time soon.

    any reasons as to why though?

    It's mainly a matter of getting art. Getting new armors/weapons takes a large amount of time and schedules are set pretty far in advance.

    Ben Phongluangtham
    Game Designer
    Reddit: ANET_BenP
    Twitch: AnetBenP

  • Allarius.5670Allarius.5670 Member ✭✭✭

    Has anyone heard of a timeline or progress for another round of skill splits? Last I remember the Devs knew there was more work to be done after the first set, but I haven't heard of or seen any discussion regarding content or progress on another set.

  • Ario.8964Ario.8964 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Thanks for your feedback and thoughts, even if I don't agree with all your points. Reading constructive posts gets us to think about these systems and evaluate changes to make, even if the changes we do aren't the suggested ones!

    Hi Ben,

    Would you guys consider letting everyone duo que again?

    Basically every single top player on NA gets on discord every night to hang out, this is one of the conversations that came up. After a lengthy debate, pretty much everyone agreed that removing duo ques hurt the game more than it helped it.


    These were some of the points we brought up:

    1. The current leaderboard isn't indicative of who is actually the best players. Why?
      • The only way to currently carry a ranked match is to play a high damage roamer/bruiser. As such, the best builds to carry on currently are mesmer and deadeye. These classes make up the majority of the top 10.
    2. The leaderboards and titles mean nothing at this point. There should just be a shiny reward for obtaining legendary rank, and the leaderboard should be done away with. Why?
      • The leaderboard just encourages toxicity and again, isn't indicative of who is actually the best. As for titles, there is a stigma tied to them. The people who have the best titles are constantly referred to as "wintraders" even though they have gotten them completely legitimately.
    3. Ranked matches aren't fun on their own. That's the reason most of us just log on for ATs or tournaments.
      • If the leaderboards mean nothing and we're not having fun, Anet should just add duos back in. At least in this case, we can play together and have fun rather than not play at all.

    These all came straight from the mouths of well-known top players in the community. I didn't have my mic set up at the time so I just listened for the majority of the discussion.

    Hopefully you read this and consider our opinions.

    Thanks,
    Shadow

    We've been talking about it internally. Honestly, I'm still on the fence. Duo queue certainly makes the game more fun for higher-skilled players, since it gives greater control of the match, and reduces risk. However, it's been proven statistically that it hurts matchmaking. Two Plat-2 players together very frequently results in a lopsided match.

    Thank you for the response!

    I actually edited in 2 more bullet points to my original post as well.

    Yes, you're right about duo que making the game more fun for higher-skilled players.


    With that being said, I have a question:

    1. Many of the top players don't play because they don't find the game fun unless they are playing with their friends. If you guys added duo back in, I'd bet most of them would start to que ranked regularly. So, would the heavy influx of players actually help improve matchmaking by solving some of the population issues?
      • It would also improve the quality of matches at the highest divisions because there is now a greater pool of players to choose from. This means that the skill/rating gaps wouldn't be as significant as they are now where top tier platinum players are matched against people in gold.

    I may be mistaken on this. But I believe that this was also one of the points we discussed last night on discord.

    There would have to be enough that return that we could pit 2 duo queues against each other at all times. I'm not confident that would happen, so making the change we would have to be willing to sacrifice some match quality in return.

    I don't know if I speak for everyone, but I would be more than willing to see a bit of a decline in match quality if it means I can play with my friends again. Matchmaking from my PoV is already terrible and I get more stressed out than I have fun when it comes to ranked. Having friends around would allow it to be fun even if the match is garbage so I'd be all for a change like that.

    Insert impressive information about me that surprises you and earns respect.

  • Vetch.6307Vetch.6307 Member ✭✭

    Can I add my two cents here:

    One of the issues I have with the way matchmaking works is the rating gain/loss ratio for wins and losses.

    What would everyone think of some form of regain system? (Please excuse my very basic maths). For example, my rating on Sunday was 1802, I lost a match and got -20, then won a match and gained +9. I then lost another match and lost a further -20. This took me down to 1771. (Let's not get into the semantics of the matchmaker thinking I should have won all those games).

    A regain system would look something like this: I start at 1802, I lose a match for -20, I then win a match and win back my previous points from a loss (+20). I then lose a further match for -20 with a final score of 1782, essentially regaining the points I lost from a previous loss by winning.

    This way, players that win more games than lose will continue to climb, those that lose more than the win will continue to drop, and those in 50/50 matchmaking have found their correct division and should largely remain quite stable position-wise.

    If I have overlooked something and this is actually a really stupid suggestion feel free to point it out!

  • trixantea.1230trixantea.1230 Member ✭✭
    edited May 16, 2018

    Personnaly, I'd like to see a capture the flag mode added to GW2 PvP.
    From my experience with gaming, I've noticed that CTF has a very different gameplay than capture and hold (a.k.a conquest) which makes PvP experience feel new and fresh.
    This mode will allow players to develop new builds around mobility, defence, croud control or buffs in order to become an effective flag defender, flag carrier or a support... CTF will also allow some weak classes in conquest to shine in CTF.

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