Most OP(Over powered) class in game? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Most OP(Over powered) class in game?

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Comments

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    Can core guardian defeat Mesmer (mirage or chrono)? Sure, but that is not a measure of balance in any shape or form. Gurdian is solid in PvE and okayish in every other game mode. But claiming it is over performing is way beyond stretch.

    Btw, in sPvP Mesmer has a priority over gurdian. You can live without FB support after the nerfs. No other class comes remotely close to memsmer’s ability to contest side points. Guardian dps builds in sPvP are mediocre at best.

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 14, 2018
    Mesmer

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    the hell? mes has builds in every mode too, you are some salty mesmer main, trying to defend something that everyone who doesnt main it knows its broken, you are fighting a lost fight man
    the poll is not just salty players dude, there is a reason mesmer is that far ahead in votes

    @Lily.1935 said:
    I'd hope that all professions would get at least one vote on this. but it seems that the engineer is the only one without a vote. Poor thing. I don't think they're bad at all. I love my engineer. She's great.

    As for Which one is the most? Obviously Mesmer. This isn't even a question. Its been this way since day one. Mesmer has always been in top 4 and usually between 1 and 2 and frequently taking the number one spot. Its got solid roles in all game modes and is dominant in most content you find them in. Their tool box is unique and they're hard to pin and predict. Their one weakness is their low condi cleans. Which they still have some, they're not as bad with that as revenant is, but knowing that doesn't always help you since they can be very difficult to hit and pin down.

    Does this mean I think Mesmers should be nerfed? At the moment? No I don't. I think the other professions should be buffed to match mesmer's level. :P

    no just no, if you only buff everyone else all the time you will just have more and more powercreep, which is definately not healthy for the game, now i dont rly care how fast you clear your pve content, but everyone just oneshotting each other in both pvp modes is just no fun at all

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 14, 2018
    Mesmer

    There are so many variables, though.

    I can't vote because if we talk certain context some professions are miles ahead of others. I also speak for WvW/PvP and not PvE.

    Mirage is hands-down busted at the top end but requires a lot of skill to play at that level, with core and chrono being pretty much fine.
    Warrior/Spellbreaker can literally not be beaten by a number of builds unless the warrior just massively misplays and basically hands them the win.
    Guardian is generally the pillar of most metas.
    And Scourge just breaks larger-scale content while being faceroll easy, while core and reaper are downright weak.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.
    Quit/Inactive. No, you can't have my stuff.

  • Rysdude.3824Rysdude.3824 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @gateless gate.8406 said:
    Mesmer.

    Game balance is actually a joke right now. I'm betting 75% of the dev team main mesmers, and the marketing team wants to keep them OP because their theme/visuals are unique to GW2.

    Best tank: Mesmer
    Best support: Mesmer
    Best sPVP class: Mesmer
    Most wanted fractal class: Mesmer
    Both condi and power specs achieving 35k DPS: Mesmer

    I think they kept most of the PoF specs OP this long just to sell more of the expansions.

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 14, 2018
    Mesmer

    @Lily.1935 said:
    I'd hope that all professions would get at least one vote on this. but it seems that the engineer is the only one without a vote. Poor thing. I don't think they're bad at all. I love my engineer. She's great.

    Probably because engineer actually seems to have a balanced philosophy behind (some) of its design and it's a complicated class to play, like ele or rev. Holosmith can hit like a truck, but you never feel cheated because it takes a lot of resource management to pull it off and there is a guaranteed cooldown. Holo is powercreeped compared to core, to be sure, but you'll see it coming from a mile away. Scrapper is still in a bad state of not having a purpose (best it can do right now is support), and core engineer is simply underwhelming everywhere. The only class that has it worse is Revenant, and even then there are some weird design choices that can be OP under certain circumstances.

    And, I can say this with absolute certainty, if I kick a skilled player's kitten in 1v1 PvP, it's almost certainly my skill, not some weird gimmick or inherent class defensive/healing advantage.

    @otto.5684 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    Btw, in sPvP Mesmer has a priority over gurdian. You can live without FB support after the nerfs. No other class comes remotely close to memsmer’s ability to contest side points. Guardian dps builds in sPvP are mediocre at best.

    "THE MESMER IS FREECASTING! THE MESMER IS FREECASTING!"

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Guardian

    @otto.5684 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    Can core guardian defeat Mesmer (mirage or chrono)? Sure, but that is not a measure of balance in any shape or form. Gurdian is solid in PvE and okayish in every other game mode. But claiming it is over performing is way beyond stretch.

    Btw, in sPvP Mesmer has a priority over gurdian. You can live without FB support after the nerfs. No other class comes remotely close to memsmer’s ability to contest side points. Guardian dps builds in sPvP are mediocre at best.

    no its not a measure of balance i just thought it was kinda funny. guard is alot more then okayish in the other game modes. they are required in wvw zerg (pretty much in serious small team too unless everyone is running really mobile builds). in pvp im not entirely sure of whats what right now but historically theyve either been required or close to. not only do guards have meta or close to for all specs (core, hot, pof) they have them for basically every role (power, condi, support) with a few exceptions in pvp and pve.

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    the hell? mes has builds in every mode too, you are some salty mesmer main, trying to defend something that everyone who doesnt main it knows its broken, you are fighting a lost fight man
    the poll is not just salty players dude, there is a reason mesmer is that far ahead in votes

    if you could look beyond the state of them game right now you would realize what im talking about. since you cant and are resorting to accusations im afraid our enlightening conversation will come to an end.

    Te lazla otstra.
    nerf list

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @otto.5684 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    Can core guardian defeat Mesmer (mirage or chrono)? Sure, but that is not a measure of balance in any shape or form. Gurdian is solid in PvE and okayish in every other game mode. But claiming it is over performing is way beyond stretch.

    Btw, in sPvP Mesmer has a priority over gurdian. You can live without FB support after the nerfs. No other class comes remotely close to memsmer’s ability to contest side points. Guardian dps builds in sPvP are mediocre at best.

    no its not a measure of balance i just thought it was kinda funny. guard is alot more then okayish in the other game modes. they are required in wvw zerg (pretty much in serious small team too unless everyone is running really mobile builds). in pvp im not entirely sure of whats what right now but historically theyve either been required or close to. not only do guards have meta or close to for all specs (core, hot, pof) they have them for basically every role (power, condi, support) with a few exceptions in pvp and pve.

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    the hell? mes has builds in every mode too, you are some salty mesmer main, trying to defend something that everyone who doesnt main it knows its broken, you are fighting a lost fight man
    the poll is not just salty players dude, there is a reason mesmer is that far ahead in votes

    if you could look beyond the state of them game right now you would realize what im talking about. since you cant and are resorting to accusations im afraid our enlightening conversation will come to an end.

    I think you misunderstand the point of this thread.

    Guardian as a whole is viable in every game mode. There is almost no doubt behind that -- all guardian e-specs have meta builds in every game mode, and core guardian is still solid. The difference is that it's not brokenly overpowered at the moment. Dragonhunter used to be overpowered, but it's been tuned down to an acceptable place.

    Mesmer on the other hand... can spam the same skill a few times and overwhelm people in a few seconds, even if you don't main the class or know it on an intuitive level. That's OP... just like scourge used to be for how braindead it is.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Guardian

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @otto.5684 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    Can core guardian defeat Mesmer (mirage or chrono)? Sure, but that is not a measure of balance in any shape or form. Gurdian is solid in PvE and okayish in every other game mode. But claiming it is over performing is way beyond stretch.

    Btw, in sPvP Mesmer has a priority over gurdian. You can live without FB support after the nerfs. No other class comes remotely close to memsmer’s ability to contest side points. Guardian dps builds in sPvP are mediocre at best.

    no its not a measure of balance i just thought it was kinda funny. guard is alot more then okayish in the other game modes. they are required in wvw zerg (pretty much in serious small team too unless everyone is running really mobile builds). in pvp im not entirely sure of whats what right now but historically theyve either been required or close to. not only do guards have meta or close to for all specs (core, hot, pof) they have them for basically every role (power, condi, support) with a few exceptions in pvp and pve.

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    the hell? mes has builds in every mode too, you are some salty mesmer main, trying to defend something that everyone who doesnt main it knows its broken, you are fighting a lost fight man
    the poll is not just salty players dude, there is a reason mesmer is that far ahead in votes

    if you could look beyond the state of them game right now you would realize what im talking about. since you cant and are resorting to accusations im afraid our enlightening conversation will come to an end.

    I think you misunderstand the point of this thread.

    i think i did. even so, imma stand by my argument haha.

    Te lazla otstra.
    nerf list

  • starlinvf.1358starlinvf.1358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I wanna change my answer to GMs. No stronger class mechanic then Cvar exists in the game.

  • FtoPScrub.5476FtoPScrub.5476 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    For ranked PvP

    1. Mirage
    2. Spellbreaker
    3. Holo
  • aimz.6287aimz.6287 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    Agreed Mesmer is broke

  • InsaneQR.7412InsaneQR.7412 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    The 4 dudes votibg for rev are hilarious.
    Egineer is sadly very representative.
    And mesmer is obviously OP atm. Good in every gamemode in every role.

  • Mesmer

    Mesmer. As hard as thief but way too rewarding and does far too much well.

  • Stalkingwolf.6035Stalkingwolf.6035 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    Mesmers current favorite song "Anything you can do I can do better"

    He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    You're confusing balanced with OP.
    This is why some people should first understand the terms of a discussion before participating.
    Just because Guardian can be meta in all game modes doesn't mean he's overpowered. Guardian is probably the best balanced class in the game. He's got decent damage (power and condi with FB), decent survivability, and decent support. But he's not excelling at any, hardly makes it overpowered. Nor does Guardian lack counters. He's just average or slightly above average.
    Mesmer, on the other hand, is equally present in all game modes, but it's actually mandatory for Raids and T4+CM fractals, has incredible burst damage, and pretty much has no counters in PvP.
    Scourge, for PvP and WvW is also, while not OP per se, poorly balanced, simply because it lacks proper counter-play for the shades, especially in terms of contesting small areas like in Conquest PvP.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Guardian

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    You're confusing balanced with OP.
    This is why some people should first understand the terms of a discussion before participating.
    Just because Guardian can be meta in all game modes doesn't mean he's overpowered. Guardian is probably the best balanced class in the game. He's got decent damage (power and condi with FB), decent survivability, and decent support. But he's not excelling at any, hardly makes it overpowered. Nor does Guardian lack counters. He's just average or slightly above average.
    Mesmer, on the other hand, is equally present in all game modes, but it's actually mandatory for Raids and T4+CM fractals, has incredible burst damage, and pretty much has no counters in PvP.
    Scourge, for PvP and WvW is also, while not OP per se, poorly balanced, simply because it lacks proper counter-play for the shades, especially in terms of contesting small areas like in Conquest PvP.

    dood my last post was over a week ago, in which i capitulated.

    Te lazla otstra.
    nerf list

  • Mesmer

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    mesmer, especially condi mirages are just absolute disgustig to fight against, sure they are having fun, but everyone else fighting against them just feels miserable. mesmer is just stacked with everything, they got it all, dmg, invuln, blocks, blinks, illusions to confuse, range and melee, did i forget something?

    This. Mesmer is pretty ridiculous tbh, especially in pvp/wvw. Being strong in raids is fine but I’d like to see another class able to do the job, because currently, nothing is near as strong and effective than Chrono tank, making it a mandatory pick in every single group. Sad.

    As for PvP, Red Shark said it well, it has insane burst damage, melee, range, tons of blinks, stealth, evades, invulnerability, etc. Very mobile tanky assassin. Making thief irrelevant and envious.

    Good luck balancing it when the core design of mirage is so OP...

  • Mesmer

    @aspirine.6852 said:
    One thing. Engi seems way underpowered in this poll... hope they notice.

    They don’t seem underpowered, but - balanced - ! That’s what I think they are. Holo is very strong but not oppressive.

    Scrapper has its support use, could be buffed a bit as well as core Engie with some undertuned kits and weapon skills.

    I think it’s not beating the charts anywhere but is very good everywhere, so balanced.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    LOL buncha mes qq. guard hands down. has always had good pve dps, must have (repeat MUST HAVE) in wvw since the dawn of time, and has been in pretty much every single meta team in pvp.

    just because its needed because of the boons it can pump out doesnt mean its op, its just that hes the only one that can do it, and those boons are the only way to stay alive with the power creep thats going on, its not fault of the guard, hes just the only one that can provide what is needed

    and mesmer is pretty much needed in any other gamemode aswell, even in zergs mesmer is somewhat needed, even if it was just for the veil, in roaming mesmer is alot stronger than guard

    lol... just because of the boons. right. what about the insane heals / condi clears / reflects / overall tankiness. they are the linchpin in zergs. in roaming, guard counters mes lol. mes may be stronger overall but its kinda funny you bring that up. so mes beats guard in roaming, which isnt even a game mode, and guard wins pretty much everywhere else.

    Can't tell if trolling because you don't want mesmer nerfed or just a bad mesmer player. Outside if WvW Chronomancer is the most wanted support class, period, and Mirage is like thief but better. Guardian doesn't really push into any other profession's territory in such a direct way. Sure Guardian is good but not OP good. Mesmer can just do some of everything.

    so by outside of wvw you mean pve. ok.
    you guys dont get it. guard in wvw and arguably in pvp as well, has been MANDATORY. has always had a spot in pve as far as i can tell. ok mes is really good support in pve, fine. mandatory in pvp? maybe, but just because of portal. in wvw? no.
    this thread is about overall OPness not your tears or one thing or another, look at the big picture.

    You're the one not looking at the big picture though, one is good in 1-2 game modes, the other is in -all- modes. Even by your own description as flawed as it is it makes a better case for Mesmer being OP than Guardian. It's not some fluke that almost everyone voted mesmer. What makes you think you know better than everyone?

    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    You're confusing balanced with OP.
    This is why some people should first understand the terms of a discussion before participating.
    Just because Guardian can be meta in all game modes doesn't mean he's overpowered. Guardian is probably the best balanced class in the game. He's got decent damage (power and condi with FB), decent survivability, and decent support. But he's not excelling at any, hardly makes it overpowered. Nor does Guardian lack counters. He's just average or slightly above average.
    Mesmer, on the other hand, is equally present in all game modes, but it's actually mandatory for Raids and T4+CM fractals, has incredible burst damage, and pretty much has no counters in PvP.
    Scourge, for PvP and WvW is also, while not OP per se, poorly balanced, simply because it lacks proper counter-play for the shades, especially in terms of contesting small areas like in Conquest PvP.

    dood my last post was over a week ago, in which i capitulated.

    Sorry then, didn't catch that one...

  • aimz.6287aimz.6287 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    If anet doesn’t nerf Mesmer or buff all classes to be on par then who knows anymore lol

  • Hibiskus.8294Hibiskus.8294 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 26, 2018
    Mesmer

    Oh, YES i voted mesmer, but NOT because it is overpowered...i voted it because i think it is the only really good balanced class....

    And to all PPL who cry for "NERF MESMER" you are mostly pvp players i think....so let me tell you: i play mesmer for 3 years and it is the only class i have done the story and the map completition....and it was NOT EASY.... not a piece of cake...i played thief and ranger and i can say: in EARLY gameplay these classes are BETTER than mesmer...mesmer gets just OP when you can get your hands on the weapons, armor, sigils and runes...for NEW Players Mesmer is one of the most complicated classes and giving this class another nerf is not an option for new players...for veteran players that have the gear, (or the gold for good gear), it is easy to say that this class is op.... they can farm the gear for mesmer with another class and level the mesmer with tomes....and then they practice in wvw / pvp to see that this class needs some skill to play.....currently EVERY class needs skill....and i can say: i am mostly play pve it is not really easy because there are many elite / champion enemies in the newer maps and in wvw / pvp? well because i dont really play it i get oneshotted easily, because i dont have learned the skill that most pvp / wvw mesmers have....

    BUT: before you cry NERF Mesmer to the ground so new players who accidently pick mesmer as their first character will leave the game because it is too difficult for them..... i say NO: BUFF other classes so they can be on the same level of "OP" as mesmer is....or NERF mesmer JUST FOR PVP / WVW....but not for pve......

    also i would suggest to buff:

    -(for all classes) most auto attacks that have a cast time from 3/4 or higher - make the cast time lower, 1/2 is enough for a fluid gameplay, the cooldowns on the other skills can stay the same and faster projectile speed, i mean a projectile wich is so slow that an pve enemie can easily dogde and you can nearly run as fast as the projectile??? <3

    • give classes that have no weapon swap a weapon swap ( i mean ele and engi, it is totally outdated that they can not do that, they always have to choose if the equip a close range weapon, a mid range wepon or a range weapon....a weapon swap is good for more builds and more surviability).... <3

    • give classes that have no weapons (by default) with 1200 range...well buff some of their weapons to 1200 range, i mean not everyone want to play an elite just for the option to get an 1200 range weapon.... players without expansions should be able to choose whatever class they want and then play with an 1200 range weapon..... <3

    ok now for mesmer chronomancer: i wonder why the shield has no -20% CD reduction trait, every other weapon (exept pistol, but for pistol we could still get an elite spec so it is ok) has an -20% CD reduction trait and dont say: it is because of continuum split.....this thing has a recharge time (CD) from 105 seconds....that is not nearly enough for saying that shield needs no "CD Reduction Trait", i hope they add it somewhere in the future (i dont want a lower CD on the split...it is an op shatter skill so the high CD on CS is ok).... <3

    also at last for this long text: have you seen this poll in the general thread? Seems that most ppl like other classes and when you say mesmer is op, well then most players play pve with their favorite class and switch just for wvw / pvp to mesmer....so nerfing mesmer any further for pve is unfair to the mesmer mains...or when they decide to nerf it to the ground just because some ppl use the "i swap to mesmer for pvp / wvw and never use it for pve because in pve mesmer is not the best class"...well then i hope they bring an option to change the class ( i know they stated they never will do that)...well anyway here is the link for the "favorite profession thread":

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/44694/whats-your-favorite-profession#latest

  • Mesmer

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:
    i voted mesmer, but NOT because it is overpowered... i play mesmer for 3 years

    Gotcha.

  • Nimon.7840Nimon.7840 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Nivik.2961 said:
    Man it sucks so much that EVERYONE knows Mesmer is a complete gong show, and yet they just let it ride.
    Mesmer by a mile for my vote

    Hey, also everyone knew that ele was totally op, and it took them quite a long time to nerf it.

    So there's still hope for mesmer to get a nerf :D

    Well we could start with other classes as well.

    Pve:
    Engi is way to easy to play for the dmg it does
    Same goes for guard
    And as a necro main i want to say that scourge is too strong as well. But if you shift scourge to be more support, you need to give it a real good support spec or heavily buff core or reaper, so necro doesn't fall out of meta again.

    PvP:
    We'll i can't say much about spvp. It's the gamemode i dislike the most. It has so many bad players, that for example facetank everything that scourge throws at them, and then they cry scourge is op. (Just an example)

    As for wvw:

    Zergplay:
    Warriors are way too overtuned. Playing full berserker and still be able to walk into the enemy zerg and get out unharmed? Yeah that's warrior.

    Also it think guardians boonsupport is way too much.

    And scourge is still in top spot even after sand savant nerf. Again an indicator that necro needs a rework.

    But there are other things that are annoying as well.
    Eles can hit very hard while being pretty hard to kill due to blocks and invuln. Those meteors....

    Yeah well. Let's get to roaming:

    Warrior esp. Spellbreaker is almost brain-dead easy mode and even though it almost never play warrior, i can easily kill people with it.

    Mesmer esp. Mirage well i don't have to say much more. Look at the op votes.

    Thief way too mobile while having a lot of condicleanses and doing a kitten of dmg.
    Also you can jump into an enemy zerg, down some players and get out unharmed.

    And ranger and ele have way too much self healing without gearing for healpower. And if they do.... They get almost unkillable in 1v1

  • Hibiskus.8294Hibiskus.8294 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 27, 2018
    Mesmer

    @gateless gate.8406 said:

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:
    i voted mesmer, but NOT because it is overpowered... i play mesmer for 3 years

    Gotcha.

    Jupp, i play mesmer for 3 years now and it is my only class, but i can say that for new players mesmer is hard...very hard...and i am still not good in pvp / wvw because i dont play it really often, you could say i am not a very good player then, but it is the class that i like, i also like to stick with one character so i dont have any other character that has the same map completition / story as my mesmer, but when i see such a poll i know the Devs will nerf mesmer and for newbies is it then impossible to begin with mesmer and i will loose my only character with a full map / mostly played story and since there is no class change.......so yeah......i dont want more nerfing for pve.....

    Mesmer is not OP in pve...in pvp / wvw...well IT IS OP..... so i voted mesmer seeing the fact that for wvw / pvp it is op and it needs nerfs...BUT just for pvp / wvw...
    nerfing the mesmer any further in pve would ruin it for that sort of gameplay, but i find other classes need buffs....everyone crying for nerfing the mesmer, but when everyone cries everytime just for nerfing a class then someday no class will be good.....

    simply because the fun meachanics are also the mechanics that break wvw / pvp......so it needs nerfs for pvp / wvw but not for pve ( against some enemies in HoT / PoF i go into downstate when i am alone,but overall forpve it is balanced,when you see the fact that not every newbie starts with the best armor / sigils / runes / weapons / gold).

    So yes you got me...i just have a mesmer with full map / most story since i love to stick with one character, i have one or 2 other classes through the booster from the expansion on lvl 80, but they barely have any map completition......my biggest fear is that mesmer get more nerfs for pve, for wvw / pvp it is totally fine to get some nerfing,
    maybe then ppl stop swapping to mesmer just for pvp / wvw and play the classes for pvp / wvw they use for pve........... :/

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:
    Oh, YES i voted mesmer, but NOT because it is overpowered...i voted it because i think it is the only really good balanced class....

    And to all PPL who cry for "NERF MESMER" you are mostly pvp players i think....so let me tell you: i play mesmer for 3 years and it is the only class i have done the story and the map completition....and it was NOT EASY.... not a piece of cake...i played thief and ranger and i can say: in EARLY gameplay these classes are BETTER than mesmer...mesmer gets just OP when you can get your hands on the weapons, armor, sigils and runes...for NEW Players Mesmer is one of the most complicated classes and giving this class another nerf is not an option for new players...for veteran players that have the gear, (or the gold for good gear), it is easy to say that this class is op.... they can farm the gear for mesmer with another class and level the mesmer with tomes....and then they practice in wvw / pvp to see that this class needs some skill to play.....currently EVERY class needs skill....and i can say: i am mostly play pve it is not really easy because there are many elite / champion enemies in the newer maps and in wvw / pvp? well because i dont really play it i get oneshotted easily, because i dont have learned the skill that most pvp / wvw mesmers have....

    BUT: before you cry NERF Mesmer to the ground so new players who accidently pick mesmer as their first character will leave the game because it is too difficult for them..... i say NO: BUFF other classes so they can be on the same level of "OP" as mesmer is....or NERF mesmer JUST FOR PVP / WVW....but not for pve......

    also i would suggest to buff:

    -(for all classes) most auto attacks that have a cast time from 3/4 or higher - make the cast time lower, 1/2 is enough for a fluid gameplay, the cooldowns on the other skills can stay the same and faster projectile speed, i mean a projectile wich is so slow that an pve enemie can easily dogde and you can nearly run as fast as the projectile??? <3

    • give classes that have no weapon swap a weapon swap ( i mean ele and engi, it is totally outdated that they can not do that, they always have to choose if the equip a close range weapon, a mid range wepon or a range weapon....a weapon swap is good for more builds and more surviability).... <3

    • give classes that have no weapons (by default) with 1200 range...well buff some of their weapons to 1200 range, i mean not everyone want to play an elite just for the option to get an 1200 range weapon.... players without expansions should be able to choose whatever class they want and then play with an 1200 range weapon..... <3

    ok now for mesmer chronomancer: i wonder why the shield has no -20% CD reduction trait, every other weapon (exept pistol, but for pistol we could still get an elite spec so it is ok) has an -20% CD reduction trait and dont say: it is because of continuum split.....this thing has a recharge time (CD) from 105 seconds....that is not nearly enough for saying that shield needs no "CD Reduction Trait", i hope they add it somewhere in the future (i dont want a lower CD on the split...it is an op shatter skill so the high CD on CS is ok).... <3

    also at last for this long text: have you seen this poll in the general thread? Seems that most ppl like other classes and when you say mesmer is op, well then most players play pve with their favorite class and switch just for wvw / pvp to mesmer....so nerfing mesmer any further for pve is unfair to the mesmer mains...or when they decide to nerf it to the ground just because some ppl use the "i swap to mesmer for pvp / wvw and never use it for pve because in pve mesmer is not the best class"...well then i hope they bring an option to change the class ( i know they stated they never will do that)...well anyway here is the link for the "favorite profession thread":

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/44694/whats-your-favorite-profession#latest

    sorry to burst your bubble friend, but balancing around skill is and should never be a thing, the line should be what you can do with the class, not what the individual is able to do with his personal level of play
    just imagine what would happen if every beginner can do everything from the start
    first, you would get bored and woulndt have any motivation to get better
    and second imagine what ppl can do with it that have more skill than you

    also your balancing ideas are givig me nightmares, i already see staff eles nuking the kitten out of their enemies at long range and then swapping to dd or something like that and go into melee mode, theres so mich wrong with your ideas, sorry bro

  • aimz.6287aimz.6287 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    Hopefully anet looks at this and does something if I see buffs on Mesmer I’m done

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    1-2? lol what are you talking about. core, dh, and fb have good builds in all game modes. can mes say the same? no.

    I'm affraid that being OP and having good build in every gamemode isn't the same thing. Guardian's builds are fine but most of them don't really stand out to the point of qualifying them as OP. The reason people point out at mesmer instead is that mesmer blow everything around him at the moment, even common sense.

  • Hibiskus.8294Hibiskus.8294 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    also your balancing ideas are givig me nightmares, i already see staff eles nuking the kitten out of their enemies at long range and then swapping to dd or something like that and go into melee mode, theres so mich wrong with your ideas, sorry bro

    Well, the Balacing ideas are just suggestions and nothing that they need to implement to 100%, also every other class can swap from range to melee, your fear that ele can do that too after they get weapon swapping is a bit big, i mean a thief with the deadeye elite can already oneshot, or go into stealth and kill you before you even see what was happening and he can swap weapons too (nothing against thief when they play really good They give me a shock but after i got oneshotted i will laugh because i find their tactical playstyle good .... B)

    For the reduce caststime for auto-attacks....i dont want to make classes op, i just want that classes that feel slow and cluncky feel more fluid in gameplay...and when that means to make the cast-time faster but balance the dmg out...well then they can nerf the dmg from the auto-attack so that the dmg output with faster cast- time is the same ammount of dmg from the slower cast - time....JUST the animation is faster so that it feels better. ;)
    (i mean asura run at the same speed as norn, but norn feel more cluncky because the animation is slower and asura feel faster because their animation is faster but in the end the speed is exactly the same....)

    For faster projectile speed from some auto attack ( for every class): well comapred to some bow-projectiles most staff projectiles are slow as...... you know....
    ask a friend (maybe a mesmer) if he could shoot a projectile with his staff and then run with the projectile, it is not much faster than you...an pve- enemie can dogde it easily when it is not in close range (and pvp / wvw ppl will laugh at you when you try to hit them from far away with staff auto attack)......so staff is (even when it is a ranged weapon with 1200 range) basically a close range weapon with a range that it dont need with this projectile speed, every bow can do better...and i dont ask for an increased dmg i just ask for more speed from the projectile for some classes to have the chance to get an hit on an enemie that is far away, calculating where this enemie might go next is not what a ranged weapon should be, bow is fine compared to staff....

    And for one default 1200 range wepon for classes that have no 1200 range weapon by default: not every player wants to play an elite (and use a build slot) just for playing with 1200 range so buffing one of their non elite weapons to 1200 range would give (especially new players) us the option to play with every class in any situation without using an elite spec and yes even this request is nothing about an dmg upgrade...it is more a quality of life upgrade....

    I dont want to "balance around skill" i know i am bad in wvw / pvp and that will never change unless i try and get more practice with it, i also dont want an increased dmg for these changes, i know that would be a bad thing, i hope with this text i made it clearer...but seriously every other class can go from range to melee and kill you with that why should the poor ele and engi players dont have that for their surviability just because you see yourself dying from their weapon swap ability? In the end they need to be good at it or they will also die from your hands.... ;)

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    also your balancing ideas are givig me nightmares, i already see staff eles nuking the kitten out of their enemies at long range and then swapping to dd or something like that and go into melee mode, theres so mich wrong with your ideas, sorry bro

    Well, the Balacing ideas are just suggestions and nothing that they need to implement to 100%, also every other class can swap from range to melee, your fear that ele can do that too after they get weapon swapping is a bit big, i mean a thief with the deadeye elite can already oneshot, or go into stealth and kill you before you even see what was happening and he can swap weapons too (nothing against thief when they play really good They give me a shock but after i got oneshotted i will laugh because i find their tactical playstyle good .... B)

    For the reduce caststime for auto-attacks....i dont want to make classes op, i just want that classes that feel slow and cluncky feel more fluid in gameplay...and when that means to make the cast-time faster but balance the dmg out...well then they can nerf the dmg from the auto-attack so that the dmg output with faster cast- time is the same ammount of dmg from the slower cast - time....JUST the animation is faster so that it feels better. ;)
    (i mean asura run at the same speed as norn, but norn feel more cluncky because the animation is slower and asura feel faster because their animation is faster but in the end the speed is exactly the same....)

    For faster projectile speed from some auto attack ( for every class): well comapred to some bow-projectiles most staff projectiles are slow as...... you know....
    ask a friend (maybe a mesmer) if he could shoot a projectile with his staff and then run with the projectile, it is not much faster than you...an pve- enemie can dogde it easily when it is not in close range (and pvp / wvw ppl will laugh at you when you try to hit them from far away with staff auto attack)......so staff is (even when it is a ranged weapon with 1200 range) basically a close range weapon with a range that it dont need with this projectile speed, every bow can do better...and i dont ask for an increased dmg i just ask for more speed from the projectile for some classes to have the chance to get an hit on an enemie that is far away, calculating where this enemie might go next is not what a ranged weapon should be, bow is fine compared to staff....

    And for one default 1200 range wepon for classes that have no 1200 range weapon by default: not every player wants to play an elite (and use a build slot) just for playing with 1200 range so buffing one of their non elite weapons to 1200 range would give (especially new players) us the option to play with every class in any situation without using an elite spec and yes even this request is nothing about an dmg upgrade...it is more a quality of life upgrade....

    I dont want to "balance around skill" i know i am bad in wvw / pvp and that will never change unless i try and get more practice with it, i also dont want an increased dmg for these changes, i know that would be a bad thing, i hope with this text i made it clearer...but seriously every other class can go from range to melee and kill you with that why should the poor ele and engi players dont have that for their surviability just because you see yourself dying from their weapon swap ability? In the end they need to be good at it or they will also die from your hands.... ;)

    no, sorry, you clearly have not played the game long enough or on a atleast minimal competetive level
    staff ele is one of the hardest hitting ranged aoe specs out there, getting hit by 6k+ meteors with 3k armor is not a laughing mattern they are weak if you can close the distance and stick to them, this is their tradeoff, if they could swap to another weaponset which is good for melee combat theyd have not weakness anymore, let alone the amout of skills they would gain, with 1 weaponset they already have more skills to use than most classes with 2 sets
    those classes are balanced around the fact that they only have 1set, they dont need more, believe me
    and about the projectiles, im pretty sure mesmer staff autos follow the target...
    its also not always just about the dmg, some autohits have special effects, like guard hammer, spawning a symbol with every third hit, or gs granting might....

  • Hibiskus.8294Hibiskus.8294 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 27, 2018
    Mesmer

    I never saw the projectile from mesmer following a target for a long time, it dont hit when the range is bigger and the enemie steps more than 2 or 4 steps away from the location you shoot at...yes it bounces from target to target but when you miss the first hit then it missed....so i want it to be a more viable ranged weapon, because why having a 1200 range when it is just usefull in mid or close range combat? That is the reason i said faster projectiles and lower cast time but lesser dmg, ijust want to land a hit, currently i am using mostly gs because when you come to an pve fight and the enemie is already half dead you can be sure: gs gets a hit, staff not...

    Talking about the meteor from ele......well it hits hard you are right, but it is no auto attack and has a cooldown...and i am sure some other classes have hard hitting skills too, given that logic no class should be able to swap their weapons, ok when you see it that way than they should change it so that no class should be able to swap their weapons, so they too need to decide if they want to be strong at range OR melee, not both so they have the same weakness as ele or engi....and again my suggestions are mostly for PVE, never saw these little raptors from maguuma? i am pretty sure there are plenty of ele and engi players out there that wished to swap to a close range weapon to fight them...but then there are some monsters that you dont want to fight in close range...but changing the weapon from your bag while you are "in fight" is impossible...(and that is good, swapping weapons from the bag while in fight would be truly op)....

    And again compare ele and thief both are some sort of glass cannon, but while thief can swap their ranged one shot wepon for a deadly close range weapon, ele and engi players can not do that....and yes i know no class should be able to oneshot in pvp / wvw...but again the dmg is good for pve....and that is the biggest problem:

    good for pve means bad for pvp / wvw....and good for pvp / wvw means bad for pve....

    so when you have such big problems with giving ele and engi a weapon swap in pvp / wvw....maybe you are ok with giving them a weapon swap JUST for PVE???

    My suggestion for a faster attack speed and lower dmg so that the dmg output is the same is mostly for ranged weapons and guard hammer is a close range weapon, also it already has a cast time from 1/2...and as i stated: 1/2 is good so it dont need to be changed....

  • Ghos.1326Ghos.1326 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    definitely mesmer. but, damage in general needs to be toned down on a lot of professions.

    The greatest enemy to improvement, is ignorance. But the desire to learn will cast ignorance into the fire.

  • Mesmer

    @Ghos.1326 said:
    definitely mesmer. but, damage in general needs to be toned down on a lot of professions.

    The power creep is real.

    #nornmodeisbestmode

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:
    I never saw the projectile from mesmer following a target for a long time, it dont hit when the range is bigger and the enemie steps more than 2 or 4 steps away from the location you shoot at...yes it bounces from target to target but when you miss the first hit then it missed....so i want it to be a more viable ranged weapon, because why having a 1200 range when it is just usefull in mid or close range combat? That is the reason i said faster projectiles and lower cast time but lesser dmg, ijust want to land a hit, currently i am using mostly gs because when you come to an pve fight and the enemie is already half dead you can be sure: gs gets a hit, staff not...

    Talking about the meteor from ele......well it hits hard you are right, but it is no auto attack and has a cooldown...and i am sure some other classes have hard hitting skills too, given that logic no class should be able to swap their weapons, ok when you see it that way than they should change it so that no class should be able to swap their weapons, so they too need to decide if they want to be strong at range OR melee, not both so they have the same weakness as ele or engi....and again my suggestions are mostly for PVE, never saw these little raptors from maguuma? i am pretty sure there are plenty of ele and engi players out there that wished to swap to a close range weapon to fight them...but then there are some monsters that you dont want to fight in close range...but changing the weapon from your bag while you are "in fight" is impossible...(and that is good, swapping weapons from the bag while in fight would be truly op)....

    And again compare ele and thief both are some sort of glass cannon, but while thief can swap their ranged one shot wepon for a deadly close range weapon, ele and engi players can not do that....and yes i know no class should be able to oneshot in pvp / wvw...but again the dmg is good for pve....and that is the biggest problem:

    good for pve means bad for pvp / wvw....and good for pvp / wvw means bad for pve....

    so when you have such big problems with giving ele and engi a weapon swap in pvp / wvw....maybe you are ok with giving them a weapon swap JUST for PVE???

    My suggestion for a faster attack speed and lower dmg so that the dmg output is the same is mostly for ranged weapons and guard hammer is a close range weapon, also it already has a cast time from 1/2...and as i stated: 1/2 is good so it dont need to be changed....

    dude tbh idc what they do with pve, but im sure alot of ppl would dislike that, because of balancing issues
    there are reasons these classes dont have weapon swaps, if you dont see why, i cant help you, its so obvious

  • Nimon.7840Nimon.7840 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 28, 2018
    Mesmer

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:

    @gateless gate.8406 said:

    @Hibiskus.8294 said:
    i voted mesmer, but NOT because it is overpowered... i play mesmer for 3 years

    Gotcha.

    Jupp, i play mesmer for 3 years now and it is my only class, but i can say that for new players mesmer is hard...very hard...and i am still not good in pvp / wvw because i dont play it really often, you could say i am not a very good player then, but it is the class that i like, i also like to stick with one character so i dont have any other character that has the same map completition / story as my mesmer, but when i see such a poll i know the Devs will nerf mesmer and for newbies is it then impossible to begin with mesmer and i will loose my only character with a full map / mostly played story and since there is no class change.......so yeah......i dont want more nerfing for pve.....

    Mesmer is not OP in pve...in pvp / wvw...well IT IS OP..... so i voted mesmer seeing the fact that for wvw / pvp it is op and it needs nerfs...BUT just for pvp / wvw...

    You are kidding right? You can almost heal a group alone, you are a boonspam bot while being tanky af.
    And you can even play dmg, Condi or power doesn't matter.

    Show me one other spec that is as good as mesmer.
    Either mesmer needs a nerf, or all other classes need heavy buffs.
    So warrior can be a healer with shouts.
    Or thief can be a healer.
    Or give necro way more boon output.
    Or.....

    You see. Mesmer has been meta since raids came out. Don't get me wrong, it's nice for all mesmer players to be wanted.
    But now you have to couple this with:
    Op in PvP
    And op in wvw roaming

    As a fellow necro player, i can only dream about doing what mesmer is able to do

    But even if it's just troll pre released patch notes that don't actually get live, where necro might get boonspam - every other non-necro player will cry like a little baby that it's op.

  • InsaneQR.7412InsaneQR.7412 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    This looks like freaking communistic election. Devs just need to look at this and tune Mes down. Its hilarious how this result looks.

  • Warrior

    For me it's warrior, if only for the tendancy to go completely invulnerable when totally outnumbered for what seems like forever. They often invariably go down eventually but the fight was lost well before.

    Then again I suppose keeping multiple opponents occupied facing certain death in WvW is a completely valid strategy.

    Exploring Tyria since before the fall of Ascalon.

  • Mesmer

    @InsaneQR.7412 said:
    This looks like freaking communistic election. Devs just need to look at this and tune Mes down. Its hilarious how this result looks.

    My thoughts exactly.

  • TwilightSoul.9048TwilightSoul.9048 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    Mesmer.
    I mean, is there any type of content where you wouldn't want a mesmer in your team? No? Exactly - that's why Mesmer is in the lead in this poll by a large margin.
    Mesmer has an incredible array of useful tools while beeing pretty much whatever you want it to be.
    Tanky? Can do
    1-shot-wonder? Can do
    Boon B****? Can do (better than any other class could ever be)
    Healer? Well.. it's possible but outclassed by others, still a possibility though if you're desperate
    DPS? Can do (not top dps of course but mixed with mesmer's other upsides still good dps)

    No other class is that versatile nor that good in that many points.
    Sure Ele has the highest DPS and a somewhat decent Healing/Support Build but thats about it.
    Sure Spellbreaker is pretty strong and easy to play but outside of PvP it's still pretty useless and even in PvP it's not exactly dominating it's just very good while beeing accessible even for less experienced players.

    Scourge would be my top contender besides Mesmer because he does one thing and does it incredibly well, he dishes out a lot of damage in a huge area while beeing incredibly tanky and supporting at the same time. But since that's the only thing he's good at and since in most gametypes his role can easily be replaced by other classes like Ele or even Ranger, sometimes Engi or even other Necro builds like base or Reaper, he only makes it in second which isn't enough to get a vote here.

    Honorary mention goes to Thief, or more specificly Daredevil. The better a player is at playing Daredevil the stronger the spec gets, it doesn't feel like there's a cap. When you meet a Daredevil and you yourself don't play Daredevil and the other guy is really good at his class you don't have a chance even if you've mastered whatever class you play, the Daredevil will most likely beat you because his spec has a much much higher cap than all other classes. That beeing said, the number of players that are THAT good at Daredevil is (thankfully) pretty low but still, Daredevil is a Spec that should always be looked at in every balance patch (not neccessarily changed, but looked at) otherwise there might be a day where they start taking over Tyria.

    As the old worlds fall behind
    Our spirit reaches wide
    With no fear breathing new life
    Awaken from the dark dark slumber

    Wintersun - Awaken from the dark slumber (Spring) - Part II The Awakening

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 28, 2018
    Mesmer

    @Remus Darkblight.1673 said:
    For me it's warrior, if only for the tendancy to go completely invulnerable when totally outnumbered for what seems like forever. They often invariably go down eventually but the fight was lost well before.

    Then again I suppose keeping multiple opponents occupied facing certain death in WvW is a completely valid strategy.

    you just remember them, because you hit so long on them, but in the end you finally kill them, mesmer and thief will just run away at the sight of your group and will come back later to annoy you, or oneshot you when you arent looking
    keeping you occupied without facing certain death

  • Chay.7852Chay.7852 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 28, 2018
    Mesmer

    Mesmer ofc. They are most wanted or at least welcome in all game modes - never saw a group saying "no mesmer" . And look at what they "can" potentially.. Stealth, blink, reflects, boon remove (even with their main/meta weapon - sword!!), evade blocks.. PORTAL (the most unique feature even now after the necro got their portal for poor ppl) - they can condi, power, support (as someone mentioned above) - so yeah.. thats how i would define OP. Lets ask the other way.. is there something they cant?
    I even have 2 of them but i wont touch them anymore until they are brought in line with other classes.

  • Ghos.1326Ghos.1326 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @Chay.7852 said:
    Mesmer ofc. They are most wanted or at least welcome in all game modes - never saw a group saying "no mesmer" . And look at what they "can" potentially.. Stealth, blink, reflects, boon remove (even with their main/meta weapon - sword!!), evade blocks.. PORTAL (the most unique feature even now after the necro got their portal for poor ppl) - they can condi, power, support (as someone mentioned above) - so yeah.. thats how i would define OP. Lets ask the other way.. is there something they cant?
    I even have 2 of them but i wont touch them anymore until they are brought in line with other classes.

    I don't mind that they can do all of these. But I do mind when they can do all of these at the same time. Professions should be able to perform a specific role well depending on build choice, and if they can perform another sub role half as good, then I'd say it's balanced. But when a profession can do well in every role in one build, that's when something's gotta give.

    The greatest enemy to improvement, is ignorance. But the desire to learn will cast ignorance into the fire.

  • Necromancer

    I need to know what game mode before I can express an opinion

  • Ivantreil.3092Ivantreil.3092 Member ✭✭✭
    Mesmer

    @bearshaman.3421 said:
    I need to know what game mode before I can express an opinion

    This in general for all the gamemodes

  • Necromancer

    @Ivantreil.3092 said:

    @bearshaman.3421 said:
    I need to know what game mode before I can express an opinion

    This in general for all the gamemodes

    I won't comment then. I don't pvp, and don't have enough experience with wvw (though I hear scourge is the most insane in wvw).

  • Thief

    Mesmer first, thief second.
    Engage & disengage at will by stealth was never a good idea.
    Mesmers are everywhere, thieves at least are less viable on PvE. Unless there's content to skip, then again- Invisibility was a mistake.

  • Loboling.5293Loboling.5293 Member ✭✭✭

    Revenant is ridiculous OP. They can spam 20k attacks from range, while evading constantly. Do I need to even mention the Shiro/glast/Balthazar build that allows them to equip two elite specs at once?.…. Do I?... Cause I can't. Haha

    But I do hope during my years playing rev, that I could be responsible for one of those votes. Rev can certainly blow some people up pretty darn fast.

    Not as fast as a few condi ticks from mirage, but it's close.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Catchyfx.5768 said:
    Mesmer can do everything best And Warrior high reward low effort.

    i would prefer to see a group mostly of warriors than actually with mostly scourges...

  • Zaviel.1245Zaviel.1245 Member ✭✭
    Necromancer

    lol @ the 1 vote for engineer. If there is ever a sign of the community thinking a class is weak then idk what is. Engi is not weak, is my favorite class, but most players claim it is outclassed in many roles.

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