WvW Abilities Mastery update — Guild Wars 2 Forums

WvW Abilities Mastery update

TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭
edited July 10, 2018 in WvW

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@TheBravery.9615 said:

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@hunkamania.7561 said:
When is this happening? What was the point of this post if you're not gonna do anything anytime soon? AC's are still OP. 11111111111111111111111 for the win

The point of the post was to put it up early to look at feedback. We did make one additional change to oil as a result. The user of boiling oil will now be immune to cc effects.

The changes are done, just going through QA now. Assuming nothing goes wrong with the planned release, the changes will be up by the end of the month.

One additional note. I should be more clear that the extra oil change requires oil mastery 3.

Speaking of which, are there any works in progress to update the wvw mastery system? It's a bit outdated - earning useless points unable to spend on and all that

We talk about it from time to time, but it hasn't yet bubbled up to the top of our priority list. You should make a new thread about it. I'd love to see suggestions on new masteries people would like to see.

OK

Just a thought, but how about we change the WvW abilities to something similar to character trait specializations? Create WvW specializations/Jobs?

  • Can make for some interesting mix-ups in this game mode, give all professions a role and place in WvW
  • Provide a refined sense of WvW progression, allow new players in WvW to be equally as effective in combat compared to a veteran with thousands of wvw playtime.

Rules

  • Characters may only have one WvW specialization at a time, only able to change "traits" (e.g. master 1/2/3) using the ability reset guide from the world ability master for 25 spirit shards.
  • May change traits (major traits) unlimited times for 25 spirit shards, but can only change wvw specializations once per reset for 100 spirit shards and some number of wvw badges.
  • All traits will need to be unlocked separately, specific to each character (not by account). Traits are unlocked as your character 'trains' in a WvW specialization, unlocking minor traits every 5 levels gained and a set of major (1/2/3) every 10 levels gained. Legendary traits are unlocked through prerequisites and a vendor purchase.
  • It will be assumed that all current wvw abilities are null when applying these changes with the exception of provisions mastery, in which all players will have access to in full from the start.
  • Some parts of siege mastery may be created baseline, basic gliding abilities may be baseline as well.
  • WvW ranks will change to something like.. Adept Commander, Grandmaster Sapper, Legendary Scout, etc instead of bronze/silver/gold/plat footman etc
  • Add Skimmer as a mount usable in wvw, with modified characteristics. moves at a slightly slower speed than the PvE variant. Can only mount outside of combat, can only move a certain distance before dismounting (moving will use up endurance, will dismount when endurance goes to 0) and going on cooldown. CC knocks players off mounts.

Commander

Theme: Siege supply, team support

  • Minor Adept: You can throw siege while moving now. Thrown siege blueprints deal damage and knocks down foes.

    • Major Adept 1: Gain all effects of defense against guards / guard killer
    • Major Adept 2: You are able to purchase soulbound siege at discounted prices
    • Major Adept 3: Siege you drop have 20% more health.
  • Minor Master: Throw siege faster, gain all effects of supply master.

    • Major Master 1: Allied NPCs in a radius around you are granted a level increase (deal more damage, receive glancing blows more often), and will assist in reviving the player you are reviving.
    • Major Master 2: Allied dolyaks near you are granted superspeed, Gain protection and deal +15% damage / condi damage when you are near an allied dolyak.
    • Major Master 3: Nearby ally players are granted a movement speed increase outside of combat and build the siege build sites you drop faster.
  • Minor Grandmaster: Increase supply capacity by 5

    • Major Grandmaster 1: Tactivators are set to a shorter cooldown when you activate them.
    • Major Grandmaster 2: Squad markers / targets on enemies will remain even if your target stealths. Markers/targets set on enemies will disappear if you haven't attacked the target in 10 minutes.
    • Major Grandmaster 3: Your squad rallies, gains all boons for 10 seconds, and refills endurance when you successfully stomp the enemy commander. Become immune to CC when stomping an enemy commander.
  • Legendary: You become able to see nearby enemy commanders on the mini-map. Deal 20% more damage/condition damage to enemy commanders as long as you are a commander. (Unlock prerequisite: 25,000 kills while training, 50 legendary spikes, all previous traits unlocked)

Scout

Theme: Surveying the enemy and defense

  • Minor Adept: WvW traps use less supply. Uses no supply if outnumbered.

    • Major Adept 1: Gain stealth when using a trap, trap effect radius is doubled and more effective.
    • Major Adept 2: Gain stability when throwing a siege disabler trap. Successful siege disablers inflict a 'rot' effect, increasing the dealing damage over time to the siege while it's disabled.
    • Major Adept 3: The stealth / supply trap sets instantly, has combined effects, and deals damage/stuns when triggered.
  • Minor Master: Gain all effects of war gliding mastery.

    • Major Master 1: Gain all effects of mortar mastery / cannon mastery / burning oil mastery.
    • Major Master 2: Gain all effects of repair mastery / build master / Mercenary's bane
    • Major Master 3: Gain superspeed when you kill a dolyak or lord.
  • Minor Grandmaster: Gain all effects of arrow cart mastery, ballista mastery, and shield generator mastery.

    • Major Grandmaster 1: When you are defeated in combat, you will create a waypoint only party members can see and use it (5 players maximum teleported per waypoint, 120s cd)
    • Major Grandmaster 2: You are granted combat abilities while gliding. (4 bomb drops, and 1 dive bomb, each skill able to be used once per glide, recharges when on the ground)
    • Major Grandmaster 3: Allied players in your squad/party deal 5% more damage / condition damage to your target (Stacks to maximum of 25% in a party of 5 similar spec players)
  • Legendary: Gain the ability to camouflage if you haven't moved in 15 seconds. Receiving damage or moving will break camouflage and reveal you. Enemies nearby you within controlled territory while camouflaged are marked for ally players. (Unlock prerequisite: 25,000 kills while training, 50 legendary spikes, all previous traits unlocked)

Sapper

Theme: Destruction of enemy objectives

  • Minor Adept: Gain all effects of siege might / Siege bunker

    • Major Adept 1: Siege weapons recharge faster and deal burn damage to structures.
    • Major Adept 2: Deal more damage to enemy siege engines, your attacks inflict 'rot', dealing damage over time to siege engines.
    • Major Adept 3: You are able to repair siege.
  • Minor Master: Gain all effects of siege golem mastery. Alpha/guild golems now use omega golem abilities.

    • Major Master 1: You become able to see enemy traps on the mini map and disarm them by interacting nearby.
    • Major Master 2: Steal supply off enemy players when you successfully stomp them.
    • Major Master 3: You are able to upgrade placed siege as long as the siege engine is at full health.
  • Minor Grandmaster: Gain all effects of catapult mastery, flame ram mastery, and trebuchet mastery.

    • Major Grandmaster 1: When you are defeated in combat, your corpse will activate a hidden bomb and detonate after a few seconds, dealing high damage.
    • Major Grandmaster 2: You are able to deal damage to lords / NPCs with righteous indignation, but receive 25% more incoming damage from them.
    • Major Grandmaster 3: You are able to sabotage enemy tactivators, in which when an enemy pulls them will trigger a large explosion, dealing massive damage and launching enemies away before being set into a short cooldown.
  • Legendary: You become able to convert enemy siege to allied siege. Interacting with allied siege engines grant a double decay timer (2 hour) and sabotages it to explode whenever it is destroyed dealing heavy area damage to nearby enemies. (Unlock prerequisite: 25,000 kills while training, 50 legendary spikes, all previous traits unlocked)

Calvary

Skimmer Mounts, Naval combat

  • Minor Adept: Underwater abilities recharge faster, move faster in or underwater.

    • Major Adept 1: You are able to build and man siege underwater.
    • Major Adept 2: Going in water removes the burning condition, you become immune to burning while in water.
    • Major Adept 3: Ghostly piranhas surround you while underwater, dealing damage to nearby enemies.
  • Minor Master: Unlocks the skimmer mount, which moves at a slightly slower speed than the PvE variant. Can only mount outside of combat, can only move a certain distance before dismounting (moving will use up endurance, will dismount when endurance goes to 0) and going on cooldown. CC will knock you off the mount.

    • Major Master 1: Unlock Skimmer mount ability 1: Fire a long range arcing projectiles that chills enemies
    • Major Master 2: Unlock Skimmer mount ability 1: Fire long range arcing projectiles that deal area damage
    • Major Master 3: Unlock skimmer mount ability 1: Rapidly fire short range projectiles in a spread that chills enemies
  • Minor Grandmaster: Skimmers are able to move indefinitely on water/lava without using endurance.

    • Major Grandmaster 1: Unlock skimmer ability 2: Dismount ability: Barrel Roll (Same as PVE)
    • Major Grandmaster 2: Unlock skimmer ability 2: Dismount ability: Barrel Roll (instead of healing, knocks back enemies)
    • Major Grandmaster 3: Unlock skimmer ability 2: Dismount ability: Barrel Roll (instead of healing, inflicts chill)
  • Legendary: You become able to glide in the air. You become able to ferry up to 10 players on your skimmer mount. (Unlock prerequisite: 25,000 kills while training, 50 legendary spikes, all previous traits unlocked)
Tagged:
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Comments

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    =) nice idea. having all masteries kind of beats the point of being a master at something hehe

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • Victory.2879Victory.2879 Member ✭✭✭

    Your unlock prereqs..lols. realm avenger? So people who gamed the system or omni blobbed to a title should have access but not others who contribute more to the server?

    The last thing we need is yet more power creep.

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    @Victory.2879 said:
    Your unlock prereqs..lols. realm avenger? So people who gamed the system or omni blobbed to a title should have access but not others who contribute more to the server?

    The last thing we need is yet more power creep.

    Subject of discussion, it can be modified.

  • GDchiaScrub.3241GDchiaScrub.3241 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 9, 2018

    Okay. So here we go. The following is my opinion/preferences if I don't otherwise indicate it.

    I would prefer WvW to be an inclusive mode as possible. To that end...

    My first issue is that it was a "progression system" in the traditional since of leveling up. Personally (as you somewhat indicated) is to remove "progression" and default the current WvW mastery's so that there is a level playing field. Currently, Veterans gain outright benefits for merely existing longer even though they should already have more experience anyway. I am fine if Veterans have easier access to cosmetic things (like rank requirements for prestigious armor). However, your suggestion indicates progression requirements for things that affect the actual game play (requiring kills or random drops). This is power creep for grinding to me, that I'm against. Luckily you're open to change as you said.

    @TheBravery.9615 said:

    @Victory.2879 said:
    Your unlock prereqs..lols. realm avenger? So people who gamed the system or omni blobbed to a title should have access but not others who contribute more to the server?

    The last thing we need is yet more power creep.

    Subject of discussion, it can be modified.

    Second issue is that you're introducing completely new systems to the mode because of mastery. Your example being a mount. The main practical issue is that the maps weren't designed with mounts in mind (they even had to be adjusted just to make Gliding tolerable). This is extra effort that affects another system, and wasn't a clean transition even for gliding (RIP ogrewatch tower).

    I also see a third issue being some of the above affecting non-objective game play (granting stealth). I would prefer that mastery be more about siege aspect of the game mode. That way we don't tamper with the combat balance.

    This is not to say I'm against the idea of "roles" for WvW. Currently the thematic roles are "Invader" and "Defender" as already indicated by enemy nameplates depending on the map. That sounds like a logical place to start. If anything I'd prefer temporary progression week to week whereby stages unlock each day opening up to new strategies tomorrow. This is in an effort to incentivize playing more WvW across the week instead of stopping on Wednesday.

    RISE guild best guild super RPers trash blob guild [RISE] always dies on inc masters of the Die On Inc technique where Prince Jarvan just died.

    Holy Warriors of [Kazo] following Kazo doctrine guided by, Our Lord and Commander, Zudo in the holy Trinity of Him and his two firm glutes.

  • LINKAZZATORE.8135LINKAZZATORE.8135 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 9, 2018

    some mastery for traps?
    5s/10s longer siege disabler
    5 extra supply removed from the supply trap
    longer aoe for the stealth traps

    maybe also add a few other traps that are gimmiks?

  • Samug.6512Samug.6512 Member ✭✭✭

    How about designing a couple of trait lines of which only one can be picked up and leveled? I don't except anything as big as OP suggested, but this would be a good base for similar system.

    [NUKE]

  • GDchiaScrub.3241GDchiaScrub.3241 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Hey folks! Just to set some expectations here. Any complete overhaul of the system is probably out of scope for the foreseeable future. However, I'm not saying never as priorities change somewhat quickly sometimes.

    I do encourage you to keep up the discussion though, as talking about pie in the sky changes can often lead to ideas on how to tweak the current system in a favorable way.

    You're working at 6:00 am already? That's impressive.

    :open_mouth:

    RISE guild best guild super RPers trash blob guild [RISE] always dies on inc masters of the Die On Inc technique where Prince Jarvan just died.

    Holy Warriors of [Kazo] following Kazo doctrine guided by, Our Lord and Commander, Zudo in the holy Trinity of Him and his two firm glutes.

  • Etheri.5406Etheri.5406 Member ✭✭✭✭

    OP your ideas are very very unrefined. I appreciate the effort but there's certain "upgrades" which make no sense at all.

    Minor Master: Gain all effects of siege golem mastery. Alpha/guild golems now use omega golem abilities.

    I'll use this as example. This trait is a straight downgrade. Alphas and guild golems are STRICTLY STRONGER than omegas because omegas are countered by any reflects; unlike alphas and guild golems.

    Overall your entire change adds a lot of "flavor" which further buffs defending objectives without providing any meaningful ways to flip them. I do not see how your proposed changes make sense, or improve gameplay.

    We need another mastery in "supply master" giving supply for players you stomp / kill. Killing players with supply or players inside objectives which have supply should allow you to steal a small portion of their supply (2-5).

  • Limodriver.4106Limodriver.4106 Member ✭✭✭

    JUST COPY DAOC's rank abilities

  • GDchiaScrub.3241GDchiaScrub.3241 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Hey folks! Just to set some expectations here. Any complete overhaul of the system is probably out of scope for the foreseeable future. However, I'm not saying never as priorities change somewhat quickly sometimes.

    I do encourage you to keep up the discussion though, as talking about pie in the sky changes can often lead to ideas on how to tweak the current system in a favorable way.

    You're working at 6:00 am already? That's impressive.

    :open_mouth:

    I'm up before 6 nearly every day. I have a 19 month old. ;)

    Raise them right, and they'll become a better Mist Warrior than yourself. Toodlez!

    RISE guild best guild super RPers trash blob guild [RISE] always dies on inc masters of the Die On Inc technique where Prince Jarvan just died.

    Holy Warriors of [Kazo] following Kazo doctrine guided by, Our Lord and Commander, Zudo in the holy Trinity of Him and his two firm glutes.

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Hey folks! Just to set some expectations here. Any complete overhaul of the system is probably out of scope for the foreseeable future. However, I'm not saying never as priorities change somewhat quickly sometimes.

    I do encourage you to keep up the discussion though, as talking about pie in the sky changes can often lead to ideas on how to tweak the current system in a favorable way.

    Eventually, the wvw mastery system warrants this sort of change as opposed to a completely linear upgrading system. The current system is not very beginner friendly and doesn't offer much in the ways to customize your wvw experience.

    Perhaps start with small steps, add new abilities at first, but redesign it over time.

  • Zero.3871Zero.3871 Member ✭✭✭

    Since some People have thousands of unused Points there should be some hard upscaling abilities. for example:

    Supply capacity:
    atm you spend total 145 Points to have +5 supplies.
    now add new lvls of that mastery for +6, +7 until +10
    with 300 Points for lvl 6.
    another 450 Points for +7
    another 600 Points for +8
    another 800 Points for +9
    finally again 1000 Points for +10 (so you can take max 30 supplies with guildbuffs)

    so you spend additional 3150 Points to get +10 sups

    Repair- and Buildmaster:
    current maximum is spending 10 supplies at once.
    add a 5th lvl to that masteries to spend ALL your supplies directly to the wall or siegeprint.

    cost 300 Points each.

    also add new masteries like trap mastery:

    lvl 1: reduce supplycost of traps from 10 to 5 (cost 20 points)
    lvl 2: reduce casttime of traps to 0 (cost 50)
    lvl 3: you can place 2 (atm its 1) of each trap per map (cost 100)

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭

    They already went and dropped the required amount of mastery points for everything to make it easier for entry level players, now we want to add more to the system?

    Having specialization seems interesting, don't agree with all that's presented, the commander one looks like it would be broken and would encourage just everyone to run a tag. Would prefer if specialization was unlocked after getting all masteries completed, and had nothing to do with stat or movement boosting, because they would be broken and would be right back to where we were with guard stacks which was taken out.

    Zero.3871 has a good list there.

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    Maguuma: Free ppt, come and get it!

  • Gorani.7205Gorani.7205 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 9, 2018

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/504312#Comment_504312

    I pitched a less "complicated" idea than TheBravery.9615 a few months back (see link) and have thrown the hat into the ring for the Action Key a few times.
    Do not use a trait system, add an action key ability (which can include stuff in the trait line suggestion). Activating the action key could e.g. affect the use of traps (less supply cost to drop, bigger AoE etc.). Having one Action Key available at a spawn NPC (or wherever you have Invulnerability from a location), can prevent power creeps (the single skill can be balanced) and will make you be able to change your role on the map every time you WP.

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Can I just convert the extra points into skirmish tickets or something??

  • hunkamania.7561hunkamania.7561 Member ✭✭✭

    I'm sure you can add more mastery lines but you'll never be able to cover the 8000-9000 points that are left over. Need to make it some sort of currency to buy ascended stuff i guess? SHouldn't be capped at 10k but i don't think you guys can change that without changing the current system too much? Wvw needs more profit and this could boost it up a bit

    Maguuma

    VR

  • Hesacon.8735Hesacon.8735 Member ✭✭✭

    @hunkamania.7561 said:
    I'm sure you can add more mastery lines but you'll never be able to cover the 8000-9000 points that are left over. Need to make it some sort of currency to buy ascended stuff i guess? SHouldn't be capped at 10k but i don't think you guys can change that without changing the current system too much? Wvw needs more profit and this could boost it up a bit

    Trait lines that decrease prices would be straightforward to implement, without destroying the actual points. The map Dry Top has a system in place that could be used as the framework for such a change.

    The fractal Mist Attunement addition added a few months ago can be used as a model. There are some parallels in terms of costs.

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Account_Augmentation

    Fractal Matrices --> Memories of Battle
    Fractal Relics --> Badges of Honor
    Pristine Fractal Relics --> Testimonies of Heroics

    Rewards can follow a similar pattern, wxp instead of xp, karma, perhaps pips and permanent account reward track gain instead of agony resistance.

    Mastery points unlock the ability to acquire these augmentations, maybe 500 points each, 5 levels each costing 100 points. So then it becomes:

    5 tiers of wxp gain, +5% exp per tier (25% max)
    5 tiers of karma gain, +5% karma per tier (25% max)
    5 tiers of reward track gain, +5% per tier (25% max)
    5 tiers of cost reduction, -5% prices at siege and skirmish vendors per tier (-25% max)
    5 tiers of pip gain, which would be the super duper expensive thing like Mist Attunement line is.

  • Evolute.6239Evolute.6239 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 9, 2018

    As long as there is some rework to how the points work. I did not bother touching siege for the longest time because I didn't have the points to get the essential abilities (cata dome, shield gens, golems and treb masteries to name a few) which sounds awful to me now

    It felt pretty bad to think I'm just way less effective than some other players because I didn't pop boosters and ktrain for a while before I got into WvW. A player is essentially trolling on a shield gen if they don't have the arrow cart mastery point. A lot of the mastery points are flat out required for general play such AoE looting, endless gliding, and guard damage. Until you're rank 400+ you don't feel like you have any flexibility in where you can put points and then after that you basically just pick between all the mediocre and situational stuff.

    As a new player coming to WvW that felt really bad. The only light at the end of the tunnel is that eventually you'll hit 1k and get everything. That's pretty poop because then progression stops completely and it's a useless system.

    I know a lot of vets have high WvW ranks and never experienced this, but I've only been playing WvW actively since January and it was hella annoying. I'm finally over the 500 rank hump and it's just now that I feel like I can get in everything and be useful.

    The points don't feel like a reward to me, they feel like an artificial gate.

  • Jski.6180Jski.6180 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Node mastery would be fun. More things from the nods buff when and after you node.

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Hey folks! Just to set some expectations here. Any complete overhaul of the system is probably out of scope for the foreseeable future. However, I'm not saying never as priorities change somewhat quickly sometimes.

    I do encourage you to keep up the discussion though, as talking about pie in the sky changes can often lead to ideas on how to tweak the current system in a favorable way.

    Curious question-

    What would you consider 'within the scope for foreseeable future'? (e.g. what were you expecting?)

    • Add more mastery abilities to spend mastery points on? - not a good idea in grand scheme of things - will further distance veteran players away from novice players as @Evolute.6239 pointed out.
    • Cap mastery points after all abilities are earned? - possibly the most conservative option on the table, but limits any potential for future development on wvw abilities.
    • Earn currency for excess ability points earned? - A fair solution and a quick fix, but also limits any potential for future development on wvw abilities.
  • Tinnel.4369Tinnel.4369 Member ✭✭✭

    Auto salvage by settable item rarity threshold. i.e. you loot something below the threshold it automatically gets salvaged. It'd make loot wars way more fun if you didn't perpetually have 20+ unique worthless pieces of gear crowding your inventory.

    Do it here or at least make it a feature of the coin fed salvagers.

  • Brigg.3961Brigg.3961 Member ✭✭

    I'd love to be able to salvage runes also. As far as extra masteries go, I would LOVE some damage reduction type stuff, like 5% less damage from conditions or something. If anything, I'd like to trade in all the extra points I get for something like wvw kegs or tickets or something useful

  • Korgov.7645Korgov.7645 Member ✭✭

    Let there be no vertical progression in WvW. Or reset it every matchup/season. Extra damage/defense/skills are ill-fit for a competitive game mode.

    Horizontal progression is fine. Seasoned players would appreciate build savers, squad composition tools, keeping track of friends/guilds and their transfers, glory rewards, swapping toons without leaving WvW, auto-managing the reward track box spam, purchasing BiS gear without leaving WvW.

  • Seed.5467Seed.5467 Member
    edited July 10, 2018

    You could achieve (almost) the same idea by simply buying those benefits with Mastery Points in a form of Temporary buff. An example would be : 200 Mastery Points = 1Hour of 15% Faster skill recharge on Rams or siege in general. 250 Mastery Points to buy a 10% damage increase on siege or 300 Mastery Points to gain 25% Running Speed for 1 hour. I do not know how feasible from technical point of view to implement a system like that, but it would be an alternative to complete overhaul, and will help in spending all those gathered Mastery Points.

  • That part you mentioned about the immune to CC on boiling oil I think would be a nice trait you have to spend points on, but you probably wouldn't want it on all siege, just ones on the edge of a wall where you have to put yourself at risk. So I'd like to see that added to cannon as well, but like I said you have to spend points to get it. Perhaps another Siege trait that allows you to use your right skill bar while on siege but each slot requires ability points to be spent to use (heal slot requires 3 points to unlock, utility 7 requires 7 points, utility 8 requires 10 points, utility 9 requires 15 points, and the elite skill requires 25 points), I think that might make it more useful to have different professions on certain siege, use of some skills would kick you off siege (skills that change your 1-5 skills such as, ele weapon summons, warrior rampage, etc.). Another thought on that though might be that you get additional skills for 6-0, each piece of siege could be it's own ability line for that which could eat up allot of points for those of us that have additional points to spend. Another thought that I had that might not be very popular (I'm just listing it because it could burn up allot of points for people) but would give those of us with a plethora of points to spend, maybe for 1000-2000 points we can get 1-2 additional pips.

    #nornmodeisbestmode

  • Sarrs.4831Sarrs.4831 Member ✭✭✭

    As far as WvW masteries go the main thing I'd like to see would be a change for the system to more directly analogue the PvE mastery system; you pick a mastery, you start playing WvW, and eventually you've gotten enough experience or ranks to be able to master the ability.

    I'd also really like to see consistent additions to the Mastery lineup; something to make you go "ooh, I can spend a bit of time in WvW and unlock XYZ" with this patch. This'd really benefit from the other change, too, as you wouldn't just instantly buy your masteries as soon as they're released; you actually develop into them, which seems to me a much healthier way for mastery progression to work.

    Maybe some new, utterly massive masteries would be nice. An extra 5 supply capacity that costs a total of 3k mastery points? Something to work towards on the long term. Once you have full mastery, the main thing you have to look forward to in the long term is +pip from rankups, and that feels quite skinny.

  • Jski.6180Jski.6180 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Nothing stop wasting your time on it we cant have nice things with out losing sight on balancing it seems. Keep to balancing skill / classes in wvw setting and work on the new alliances system. Any thing else is just a detracting.

  • Already my class (necro) has been pushed into a Zergling role by balances, now you wish to further restrict my gameplay locking me into a role thru masteries?
    Why not just wipe everyone's mastery points and start a new system where you get more points for defending objectives then assaulting, and less points for being in a party with even less points for being in a squad. Also give points for building and refreshing siege, also repairing and esc0orting yaks.

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018

    That would be great, I'd just sit on the piece of siege I built and continue to refresh it for wxp, and if the enemy comes by I'll wait for them to damage whatever so I can repair and get more wxp than them. I'll leave the escorting yaks to the 50 roamers though, "roamers" since you get less wxp for being in a squad or party.

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    Maguuma: Free ppt, come and get it!

  • So let's all become one massive blob with our roles assigned to us by the Bens. We have such poor defensive mentality because it's far easier to join a squad, get big rewards and pound your chest about how good you are because you killed 10 players alongside 30. EOTM made ranks even more laughable, that map needs reworked or deleted. Also if your goal playing WvW is to merely xp then just stay away from WvW, we don't need dead baggage, we need players who actually contribute to our server group's effort.

  • Lahmia.2193Lahmia.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Hey folks! Just to set some expectations here. Any complete overhaul of the system is probably out of scope for the foreseeable future. However, I'm not saying never as priorities change somewhat quickly sometimes.

    I do encourage you to keep up the discussion though, as talking about pie in the sky changes can often lead to ideas on how to tweak the current system in a favorable way.

    You're working at 6:00 am already? That's impressive.

    :open_mouth:

    I'm up before 6 nearly every day. I have a 19 month old. ;)

    I know the feeling. My cats wake me up at 6 each morning.

    "Surrender and serve me in life, or die and slave for me in death."

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018

    @DaVid Darksoul.4985 said:
    So let's all become one massive blob with our roles assigned to us by the Bens. We have such poor defensive mentality because it's far easier to join a squad, get big rewards and pound your chest about how good you are because you killed 10 players alongside 30. EOTM made ranks even more laughable, that map needs reworked or deleted. Also if your goal playing WvW is to merely xp then just stay away from WvW, we don't need dead baggage, we need players who actually contribute to our server group's effort.

    At least in a squad you're out fighting for wxp whether that be actual fighting or ppting, rather than sitting safely in your keep refreshing siege for wxp.
    Think about what rewarding defending more than assaulting will do to players mentality. Because I will tell you this, if defenders got more wxp than me assaulting some place, I wouldn't bother attacking something that had defenders, I would attack empty places so I get my share of wxp and give none to the defender. Give you nothing to defend against, let's see how exciting that becomes for you.

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    Maguuma: Free ppt, come and get it!

  • @XenesisII.1540 said:

    @DaVid Darksoul.4985 said:
    So let's all become one massive blob with our roles assigned to us by the Bens. We have such poor defensive mentality because it's far easier to join a squad, get big rewards and pound your chest about how good you are because you killed 10 players alongside 30. EOTM made ranks even more laughable, that map needs reworked or deleted. Also if your goal playing WvW is to merely xp then just stay away from WvW, we don't need dead baggage, we need players who actually contribute to our server group's effort.

    At least in a squad you're out fighting for wxp whether that be actual fighting or ppting, rather than sitting safely in your keep refreshing siege for wxp.
    Think about what rewarding defending more than assaulting will do to players mentality. Because I will tell you this, if defenders got more wxp than me assaulting some place, I wouldn't bother attacking something that had defenders, I would attack empty places so I get my share of wxp and give none to the defender. Give you nothing to defend against, let's see how exciting that becomes for you.

    Again, if all you care about is xp, we don't need you in WvW. My argument was against being forced into a role and the rest was to call attention to the fact that defending should be more rewarding then it is now. We have tons of players whom zerg, but soon as a tag leaves they leave. Also many times we lose an objective due when we could have saved it due to all our map being on a tag fighting in the middle of nowhere. Keep xp the way it is but lets give some reward for building and refreshing. Much love to those whom do so and those whom hold the BLs down whilst our main force goes on the defensive for us. It's all about teamwork defending/ assaulting not just blobbing K-trains.

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018

    Pardon me sir, but are you not the one in here complaining about not getting enough xp for doing easy task in wvw? Soooo, turn that statement right around, if all YOU care about is xp, than maybe we don't need you in wvw? You also don't know how I play, so lay off on the I only care about xp claim. I have over 3k ranks and have no need for wxp since I have all my mastery points and ranks for mistforged armor. I don't play wvw for wxp, I play to have fun with fights, I've served in every role in roaming defending havocing gvging zerging blobing, only got gw2 because of wvw from day one, so I am in fact here for the love of wvw not the xp.

    My argument is about what xp will do to wvw and what mentality it will develop and drive players into. Whether or not people choose to defend something is up to them and you can't expect everyone to answer every call, you have commanders out there that have different priorities, some will defend, some won't, some will only come for t3, some will only come if no queues. Changing xp for defenders does not encourage any of that to change, it only gives siege humpers free xp and encourages them to build even more siege.

    Commanders and players are already weary of attacking t3 structures because of the siege that's usually in it, and when you encourage even more siege humping by giving out free xp for building and refreshing siege you'll see more on the walls, and less people bothering to attack you when your zerg is parked in there, better to just take it when you have no one around in your off hours.

    The reason why attacking needs to maintain more xp is because you need to encourage conflict in wvw, because if you don't the game goes into a stand still and everything becomes boring. You certainly aren't getting any defense xp if no one is attacking, giving out free xp for easy non combative task is not a solution, it'll just promote even more lazy play like repairing walls then afking for participation.

    P.S That's not to say there shouldn't be defense xp, because there should be but it should be balanced, giving out xp for the defense event is a good thing because it means you're actually getting attacked (even though sometimes it's just a tap but hey free exp from repairing something).

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    Maguuma: Free ppt, come and get it!

  • Hmmm seems you aren't reading right. My posts was about not being locked into a role and encouraging more players to experience more about WvW then just zerging. You are the one that bashed my suggestion by saying people would just sit by siege. Anyone that would do that would be bored out of their skull. I agree that it should be balance play between the roles available, which is why defenders need to be able to draw exp/rewards for their actions as well as those that zerg. I also am high rank with the vast majority of my time roaming/sieging/defending, and for someone close to my rank to use the excuse that people would just sit on siege is merely the same type of scare tactics I see the fascist liberal parties in America use on our President. The reason commanders don't attack well defended objectives is due to it being too hard like you have said, but to me that just makes it more fun and satisfying after you win. I have a hard time believing people would just repair walls then afk when they get bored fast in zergs if they aren't always winning, I only see players who normally siege/repair/refresh/ roam get better recognition for their efforts. Oh and since I take offense to the seigehumper comment this is my last post in here, so feel free to post again and feel like you won the argument, don't melt now.

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DaVid Darksoul.4985 said:
    Hmmm seems you aren't reading right. My posts was about not being locked into a role and encouraging more players to experience more about WvW then just zerging.

    Maybe if you read my very first post in this thread you would know I don't exactly agree with that either. Either way people should play however they want to play, but they should be rewarded for active play.

    You are the one that bashed my suggestion by saying people would just sit by siege. Anyone that would do that would be bored out of their skull. I agree that it should be balance play between the roles available, which is why defenders need to be able to draw exp/rewards for their actions as well as those that zerg.

    Because you want to promote passive play that would in fact encourage people to sit on siege, why wouldn't you spend more time building and repairing and refreshing when it's the easiest non combative thing to do in wvw and get rewarded for it? You need to be active to be rewarded, like I said at least a zerg is out fighting or ppting is being active for their reward, someone refreshing some siege in an empty borderland is not being active and should not be rewarded.

    I also am high rank with the vast majority of my time roaming/sieging/defending, and for someone close to my rank to use the excuse that people would just sit on siege is merely the same type of scare tactics I see the fascist liberal parties in America use on our President.

    Ho hum politics in a gaming forum. I happen to like Trump actually, even though being canadian.. I'm not part of the reeeeee's.

    The reason commanders don't attack well defended objectives is due to it being too hard like you have said, but to me that just makes it more fun and satisfying after you win.

    Win after 3 hours of attacking under heavy siege fire? or win after sitting on siege for 3 hours making the enemy dance under siege?

    I have a hard time believing people would just repair walls then afk when they get bored fast in zergs if they aren't always winning, I only see players who normally siege/repair/refresh/ roam get better recognition for their efforts.

    Well it happens, dunno what to tell you, usually happens in smc, easiest place to find a broken wall and then sit on inner afk to keep up participation.

    Oh and since I take offense to the seigehumper comment this is my last post in here

    Sorry but you gotta be one in order to get offended by it, if not you can just laugh about it like I do because I sure ain't one.

    so feel free to post again and feel like you won the argument

    Thanks for letting me win.

    don't melt now.

    Have no choice, it's summer and pretty hot today 27c feeling like 37c.

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    Maguuma: Free ppt, come and get it!

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    I mean the 'scout' wvw specialization kinda suits you- defending objectives, defensive siege, and repairing

  • Kageseigi.2150Kageseigi.2150 Member ✭✭✭

    @TheBravery.9615 said:

    Calvary

    I like it! True Deus Ex Machina.

    A Grandmaster trait that allows you to sacrifice your life in order to revive all downed/dead teammates on the map!
    Perhaps it can be accompanied by an angelic choir harmonizing with regal trumpets?

    The cooldown must last for 3 days, of course.

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