Zealots tempest for raids and fractals? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Zealots tempest for raids and fractals?

jihm.2315jihm.2315 Member ✭✭✭

hello will zealot work in those modes since i dont like playing full dps?
also i like scepter warhorn weapons but ill also carry a staff.

Comments

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2018

    I really dislike scepter except for single targets so I won't dwell on that. It also lacks fields to make auras.
    I feel as though the best use for tempest is dagger+warhorn using fresh air + aurasharing (especially since they CC indirectly).
    For utilities I feel "Aftershock!" is worth bringing in most cases.

    If you run zealot's you really won't crit for much , your crits will be half a zerker weaver's.

    You're better off running water traitline (+15% heal) + sigil of transference than investing too heavily in zealot's. The scaling on the heals on weapons is pretty terrible.

  • Feanor.2358Feanor.2358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Nah. Either go full heal or full damage. Dealing poor damage while poorly healing will get you nowhere.

  • jihm.2315jihm.2315 Member ✭✭✭

    well this stinks never gonna play zerker and dont wanna make another full healer RIP raids then and thanks for your answers

  • jihm.2315jihm.2315 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2018

    this game was supposed to played as you want but then they try to push you into mindless one dimensional roles maybe remove hybrid stats also from the game Arena Net

  • Feanor.2358Feanor.2358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Nobody stops you from playing hybrid. You'll just won't be as efficient and for 95% of the game this doesn't matter. You're just asking about the high-end content where it does.

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Nobody stops you from playing hybrid. You'll just won't be as efficient and for 95% of the game this doesn't matter. You're just asking about the high-end content where it does.

    And that's not Anets fault but the fault of the people playing this content. Elitism is the word.

  • Feanor.2358Feanor.2358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Nobody stops you from playing hybrid. You'll just won't be as efficient and for 95% of the game this doesn't matter. You're just asking about the high-end content where it does.

    And that's not Anets fault but the fault of the people playing this content. Elitism is the word.

    You say it like it's something bad. It's not. Elitism is nothing more than skilled players valuing their own fun and their own time. Why would you blame anyone for this?

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Feanor.2358 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Nobody stops you from playing hybrid. You'll just won't be as efficient and for 95% of the game this doesn't matter. You're just asking about the high-end content where it does.

    And that's not Anets fault but the fault of the people playing this content. Elitism is the word.

    You say it like it's something bad. It's not. Elitism is nothing more than skilled players valuing their own fun and their own time. Why would you blame anyone for this?

    The idea was just to push the blame on the people that deserve it instead of the ones that don't. Not everything wrong within the game is ANets fault, the community has to take some small responsibility of some things as well. I personally don't really care about maximum efficiency. I still do it because I don't like to pee in other peoples cereal. But who am I to say what's fun for whom? To each their own.

  • Feanor.2358Feanor.2358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Nobody stops you from playing hybrid. You'll just won't be as efficient and for 95% of the game this doesn't matter. You're just asking about the high-end content where it does.

    And that's not Anets fault but the fault of the people playing this content. Elitism is the word.

    You say it like it's something bad. It's not. Elitism is nothing more than skilled players valuing their own fun and their own time. Why would you blame anyone for this?

    The idea was just to push the blame on the people that deserve it instead of the ones that don't. Not everything wrong within the game is ANets fault, the community has to take some small responsibility of some things as well. I personally don't really care about maximum efficiency. I still do it because I don't like to pee in other peoples cereal. But who am I to say what's fun for whom? To each their own.

    I didn't say ANet are to blame. I said there is NO blame to be assigned at all in this case. There is no fault.

  • RAZOR.7246RAZOR.7246 Member ✭✭

    Faenor is right. This isn't a matter of blaming elitism or Anet or whoever. The game is designed in such a way that there are more "optimal" builds than others. We're not talking about open world or WvW where u can get away with running builds that don't make much sense relative to the class. This thread is specifically for Fractals and Raids which is high level endgame content. In this content, Raids especially, you're simply not going to be able clear if you have a group full of sub-optimal builds for the simple reason of enrage timers. Even 1 person on a DPS class who doesn't pull their weight is enough to pull the entire group down. I guarantee you, if you find a raid group that will accept such a build without payment then they won't be able to clear. It's not a dig at anyone, it's the reality.
    It's almost the same for fractal CMs. The lower your DPS the more mechanics you'll have to deal with which can get pretty aids if they're dragged out. The CMs are designed as such, you don't see the really nasty mechanics if you DPS the bosses down fast enough. 99CM even has a boss with an explicit DPS check if that's not a clear enough indicator of what is expected of players playing this content. The fact of the matter is that this is content designed to reward players who want to play at the higher level and are prepared to put in the effort to do it with regards to their builds, rotations and mechanics. From a run which takes you 40mins-1hour to clear all of Fractal CMs, T4s and Recs you'll probably take the same time to clear a single T4 fractal with a more difficult instability combination. At the end of the day, who gets more loot for the time they've put in?

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Feanor.2358 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Nobody stops you from playing hybrid. You'll just won't be as efficient and for 95% of the game this doesn't matter. You're just asking about the high-end content where it does.

    And that's not Anets fault but the fault of the people playing this content. Elitism is the word.

    You say it like it's something bad. It's not. Elitism is nothing more than skilled players valuing their own fun and their own time. Why would you blame anyone for this?

    The idea was just to push the blame on the people that deserve it instead of the ones that don't. Not everything wrong within the game is ANets fault, the community has to take some small responsibility of some things as well. I personally don't really care about maximum efficiency. I still do it because I don't like to pee in other peoples cereal. But who am I to say what's fun for whom? To each their own.

    I didn't say ANet are to blame. I said there is NO blame to be assigned at all in this case. There is no fault.

    It wasn't directed at you. Was directed at the OP as they were clearly casting blame around. Was merely using your earlier comment as reference.

  • starlinvf.1358starlinvf.1358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @jihm.2315 said:
    this game was supposed to played as you want but then they try to push you into mindless one dimensional roles maybe remove hybrid stats also from the game Arena Net

    Its not the game, its the Raid Community more than anything else. Things have been around log enough that they've fallen into Speed clear meta (even if they aren't hardcore about it)..... and the comps built around those are only flexible in the Support slots.

    Raids rely more on group comp then any other area of the game; but because of several difficulties associated with gear sets, most groups don't want to redo entire builds to adjust for a random hybrid build in the comp. And as much as it irks the kitten out of me, I do get why the meta comps push toward very narrowly specialized builds. As much as you can run a hybrid build and still beat the encounter, theres pretty much no reason to do this unless that build does something oddly effective for the fight in question.

    The problem with Zealot Ele is how their support traits and damage traits are in heavy competition for the same Spec slots. Water can do decent amounts of simple healing without any investment into healing power or traits..... good enough to recover from a mistake or near wipe at the temporary loss of damage output. But to get seriously productive sustained healing and condition clearing, you have to trait into it. It also means you're camping water unless you need utility from another element. In either case, you're not going to be in Fire... and Fire is where your sustainable damage comes from. You're trading a lot of practical damage for contingent healing..... which would only matter if you're group was already struggling with self sustain. That being the case, there are much better places to get healing or group sustain..... a Dedicated Support Tempest build, typical Druid build, Firebrands, Minstrel's Chorno. If its a question of personal sustain, trading in some stats for Vit lets you take a couple of extra hits and keeps you going until the next healing cycle of the Supports. It could maybe make sense for mid-tier fractals, since the comp adherence are less reliable there.

    The problem with your intended build is the general impracticality of it, given the class's design and build logic; on top of which, the mechanical aspects of what you could do with Sc/Wh can be had without needing much or any investment in Healing Power. In fact, the only reason you're even thinking of taking Healing Power is to boost healing from Water skills exclusively.

  • I run Zealot's Tempest in fractals on occasion. Though when I do, I basically build it as a full staff healer. Sometimes I'll do Fire/Water/Tempest instead of Arcane/Water/Tempest, depending on whether that fractal requires burst healing or constant healing.

    I do this because I have a general lack of trust in my teammates. Though it would be nice to go full healer with no consideration for offenses, I often find that merely keeping my teammates alive isn't enough to do certain content.

    "Self awareness is knowing when you're sitting at the throne of ignorance." --Leo G.

  • jihm.2315jihm.2315 Member ✭✭✭

    @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:
    I run Zealot's Tempest in fractals on occasion. Though when I do, I basically build it as a full staff healer. Sometimes I'll do Fire/Water/Tempest instead of Arcane/Water/Tempest, depending on whether that fractal requires burst healing or constant healing.

    I do this because I have a general lack of trust in my teammates. Though it would be nice to go full healer with no consideration for offenses, I often find that merely keeping my teammates alive isn't enough to do certain content.

    for t4 fract pugs ull probably wanna be full i changed my celestial to zealots that why i got mad and now i try to reverse it and i got only 9 gold to buy new one ill slowly rebuild my celestial and stick to wvw and t3 fracts and if i ever got the money and the mood i might make something for raids

  • narcx.3570narcx.3570 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The problem with running something like Zealots on an Ele is that the entire point of playing Heal Temp is for those times when your group needs lots of extra healing (and cleansing)... So you might as well just be running Full Magi (or even like full minstrel if you want to hard, hard carry something like a bad pug Matthias), since if they don't need a ton of healing, they don't really need a heal temp in the first place (since it's a purely defensive support role.)

    And if yer talking about tacking on Zealots for splash healing, but playing like a DPS, you'll prevent more damage by just gong zerk so that things die/phase faster, than you'd ever hope to end up healing in Zealots from within the scope of your dps rotation.

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