Overhaul power ranger to be wanted in wvw.

[anduriell.6280]

More than en overhaul a few tweaks to the traitline and weapons so they can be used in a more broad situations. If in my prior thread i touched the condition skills to make them to target multiple enemies my idea of a power ranger focus more in positioning and target damage in line.I think power damage is in line with other classes so my idea is not to increase the direct burst but to increase the offensive capabilities by support from increased attack speed and better access to unblockables for better sustained damage under specific conditions.

Trait line marksmanshipMinor tweaks to allow better sinergy between traits. Better access to ublockable under certain conditions to fight the amount of blocks and reflects in game. Removed the passive immunity for a CC alternative which offers better offensive trade of better suited for an offensive trait line.

• Opening Strike You and your pet inflict vulnerability and cripple with your first strike when entering combat.
• Alpha Focus You and your pet inflict Cripple in targets affected by vulnerability (icd 5s)
• Precise Strike Opening strike always crit. Opening strike is refreshed when you kill a foe.

Adept

• Earth Trap : Cast lesset muddy terrain when reach 50% health. 20 secs ICD. Lesser muddy terrain pulses(3) slow(3s) and cripple(5s), does not immobilise.
• Hunter's Gaze : adtionally gain Fury when a foe is hit under 50% health.
• Clarion Bond: Cast Lesser Call of the Wild when you swap pets. Unblocable effect from Lesser Call of the Wild affects you and your pet.

Master

• Brutish Seals : Activating a Signet grants fury (7 secs),quickness (3 secs). Attacks are Unblockable for short time (3secs) . (no CD reduction)
• Farsighted
• Strider defense. (ICD 5 secs) Evading an attack grant quickness (3s). While using a sword evading an attack additionally grants protection(5 secs) and resistance (3 secs). (no CD reduction on sword). This trait is better suited here as Sword is a power weapon and this trait line can benefit greatly of the synergy between LB and Sword.

Grandmaster

• Predator's Onslaught
• Remorseless. Additionally apply +10% damage to enemies affected by Vulnerability. Opening strike increased damage +15%. Opening strike is unblockable. Reduced burst damage from this trait to make easier to access sustained damage as a mean to contain the burst from soulbeast. without nerfing overall damage.
• Lead the Wind : Long bow pierces up 3 targets. Attack speed inc reased in 20%. (no CD reduction)

Weapons.Longbow.Small tweaks to make it better utility.

• Hunter's Shot: Additionally if it hits grants super speed to the ranger and the pet.
• Barrage: Reduce CD to 20 secs.

SwordSmall QoL improvements.

• Hornet Sting Apply Evade (1 second evade) from the beginning of the animation. Rollback increased to 500 units. If the skill is cast without target the leap is done in the direction the ranger is facing. The skill is a LEAP finisher.

Axe offhandSome Qol improvements so the weapon gain usability against players and bosses.

• Path of Scars Increase width of the path to 200 units. Pull increased to 600 units.
• Whirling Defense: Gain combat movement while executing the skill. Increased number targets to 5. Decreased CD to 20s (as the new trait in Skirmish does not reduce CD )

SkillsSignets

• Signet of Renewal: Pasive : Heal the ranger in an interval. Heal more the less hp the ranger has. From 75% 62 (.06) / 50% 124 (.08) / 25% 250 (.1) . Active: Clean 13 conditions from the ranger. Apply resistance to the ranger (removed the AoE effect to allies). Break stun.
• Signet of Stone: Active: Additionally apply stability 3 secs. does not break stun.
• Signet of the Hunt Passive the same. Active : Increase stats for 6 seconds +300 in power/ferocity/precision.
• Signet of the Wild: Passive: decrease condition duration 20%.

Additional notes.MoC needs rework as it is an gimick effect which mess up badly with soulbeast numbers.

What do you think? Could this changes make the ranger be able to do better damage in zerg fights?

[oOStaticOo.9467]

I'd love to see Ranger more viable in WvW. Probably not going to happen though. Everybody is already trying to call for a Nerfing of the Soulbeast Roamer. Most people want in your face Melee, not pew pew from long distance. Pew pew is unbalanced and unfair. Druid was viable in zergs for a bit for their healing, but then Guardians complained and it got nerfed into oblivion. Something I'd like to see is that Rangers had some kind of ability to see and hunt people in Stealth. I think that would be good to balance against Thieves and Mesmers stealth one shoting people. But as soon as I say that some Thief or Mesmer will come in and cry foul. But yeah, I agree that Rangers should have more buffs for WvW.

[Blocki.4931]

I don't think it needs any changes. You can do your very own niche job of pinpoint sniping and you're the very best at it.

[Artyport.2084]

noooo.. stop. I get that they are doing overhauls for some things that were messed up but the ranger is not unviable. There are many different specs that the ranger works well with and just because your specific niche role isn't working doesn't mean the class needs a overhaul.

[Swagger.1459]

Ranger isn't struggling to have a power builds in wvw... I can guarantee that more players would be miffed if the devs started fiddling with power ranger "stuff" while ignoring the real issues like...

Pets are still not good, like at all. Condi ranger builds leave a whole lot to be desired. Druid staff and CA skills need a bunch of improvements. Daggers are very subpar weapons that need redesigns...

[Sznurek.8791]

@"anduriell.6280" said:Weapons.Longbow.

• Hunter's Shot: Additionally if it hits grants super speed to the ranger and the pet.That would be absolutely amazing. Especially as something balancing longbow after the incoming #1(autohit) nerf in WvW.Axe offhand
• Whirling Defense: Gain combat movement while executing the skill. Increased number targets to 5. Decreased CD to 20s (as the new trait in Skirmish does not reduce CD )

  This would be OP. I think axe offhand is in good place now.

I don't have strong opinion on traits changes.

[Krispera.5087]

@Sznurek.8791 said:

@"anduriell.6280" said:

Weapons

.Axe offhand

• Whirling Defense
  : Gain combat movement while executing the skill. Increased number targets to 5. Decreased CD to 20s (as the new trait in Skirmish does not reduce CD )
  This would be OP. I think axe offhand is in good place now.

Warrior says : https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Whirling_Axe, :). OP for Ranger, but not for Warrior ?

The least they could do is give Whirling DEFENSE stability and protection if they want to make it stationnary. Also, hitting 5 targets, smh.

Edit : DAT THREAD NECRO THO.

[Lazze.9870]

@Krispera.5087 said:

@Sznurek.8791 said:

@"anduriell.6280" said:

Weapons

.Axe offhand

• Whirling Defense
  : Gain combat movement while executing the skill. Increased number targets to 5. Decreased CD to 20s (as the new trait in Skirmish does not reduce CD )
  This would be OP. I think axe offhand is in good place now.

Warrior says :

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Whirling_Axe

, :). OP for Ranger, but not for Warrior ?

The least they could do is give Whirling DEFENSE stability and protection if they want to make it stationnary. Also, hitting 5 targets, smh.

Edit : DAT THREAD NECRO THO.

People need to stop pretending that Whirling Defense doesn't come with retaliation and reflect. I'd rather keep that than getting a copy of the warrior version. The skill has been buffed massively damage wise too. Path of Scars on the other hand... clunkiest CC skill in the entire game.

As for the changes suggested, I don't really want any of them. Opening Strike needs a refresh tied to each GM trait, the cripple should be a part of the first minor, and the second minor could be some damage modifier against foes with vulnerability on them. Third minor can stay as is, perhaps get refresh OP on kill for some extra QoL. The Opening Strike mechanic needs to be valuable for all three GM traits, and not just a guaranteed crit on your first strike. Other changes to Marskmanship and power ranger in general comes second imo.

[RangerThings.9810]

Signet of Stone Stability would be great for Core Ranger. When they halved the duration for WvW this would have been a great balance.

[KeyOrion.9506]

@"Artyport.2084" said:noooo.. stop. I get that they are doing overhauls for some things that were messed up but the ranger is not unviable. There are many different specs that the ranger works well with and just because your specific niche role isn't working doesn't mean the class needs a overhaul.

Your "Fight Club" Commanders in WvW doesn't want ranger's, because in the Commander's own words, "The ranger class brings nothing useful to the combat ZERG". So ranger's are now relegated to ROAMING only. ROAMING ONLY! 1/2 the commanders refuse to have a ranger/soulbeast OR Druid inside their zerg combat team. They will get no invites. If they do get invited, it's accidental, and they are kicked out of the group immediately. By the commander's own words and ACTIONS, a ranger in the group will be kicked from the group in order to make room for a SCOURGE or a FIREBRAND, or any other USEFUL profession. The commander's own words. LISTEN. All I been reading for the past 3 months in Forums is HOW overpowered Ranger's are. And I don't see it. I really really don't see it. I'm seeing permaboon warriors that just eat up my bursts. I'm seeing Firebrands and Scourges that put down pulse wells and traps that do 30k damage in two seconds. WHY THE HELL ARE YOU PEOPLE SAYING RANGER IS OVERPOWERED?! Permastealth Deadeyes!? SERIOUSLY!? This was taken away from thieves. And now it's right back in the game again. My STOMP with bonded pet's damage was once 1/3. Now it's 2/5ths for damage. Our damage was lowered. Enemy weapon range was increased to match Ranger's reach. If anything every other class got a crap load of BUFFS. The last patch saw ONE change to ranger, because....we're overpowered. I highly doubt they did the one change because we're more perfectly balanced. I don't think Anet even knows what to do with Ranger's anymore. Pve we're great. PvP not so bad. WvW….well gee wiz, your just a ranger. You have a "niche". You might as well tell us as we're trying to get on the Zerg Bus, that we need to go the BACK of the bus, because that's how it feels like to play ranger in WvW with a bunch of commanders that think our class is garbage.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@KeyOrion.9506 said:

@"Artyport.2084" said:noooo.. stop. I get that they are doing overhauls for some things that were messed up but the ranger is not unviable. There are many different specs that the ranger works well with and just because your specific niche role isn't working doesn't mean the class needs a overhaul.

WHY THE HELL ARE YOU PEOPLE SAYING RANGER IS OVERPOWERED?!

Because regardless of how powerful a ranged attack is, it bugs the absolute $%^& out of people when something is up a hill at 1500 range and hitting them. They point and say "It's OP" but really what they mean is: "I don't like the way it feels when attacks can hit me at 1500 range." They need to work on their wording.

A good example of what I mean is: Even if Arenanet nerfed Ranger Longbow damage by 3/4ths, and it took 4x Rangers on a single target to do what 1x Ranger can do now, WE WOULD STILL see kids coming in here to the forums and saying Rangers were OP because someone got killed by 4x Rangers on the top of a tower who could hit them at 1500 range. The guy would STILL come in here with the mind frame of: "Even though the LB#1s were only doing 800 damage individually upon each strike, I still feel it is OP, cause it hit me from 1500 range."

I certainly hope whatever team is left within Arenanet that works on Guild Wars 2 balance, has enough wisdom to understand the difference between what is actually OP, and when something has a slightly annoying design. When these players say: "RANGER TEH LONGBOWERZ ARE SO STRONGZ" What they really mean is: "When I am playing my Spellbreaker, I feel that all other classes should have to engage me in melee range in the same way that I have to engage them in melee." <- Pretty much. Not too many people out there have any real respectable argument as to why they think Ranger is still so strong.

[Halbarz.3854]

@KeyOrion.9506 said:

@Artyport.2084 said:noooo.. stop. I get that they are doing overhauls for some things that were messed up but the ranger is not unviable. There are many different specs that the ranger works well with and just because your specific niche role isn't working doesn't mean the class needs a overhaul.

Your "Fight Club" Commanders in WvW doesn't want ranger's, because in the Commander's own words, "The ranger class brings nothing useful to the combat ZERG". So ranger's are now relegated to ROAMING only. ROAMING ONLY! 1/2 the commanders refuse to have a ranger/soulbeast OR Druid inside their zerg combat team. They will get no invites. If they do get invited, it's accidental, and they are kicked out of the group immediately. By the commander's own words and ACTIONS, a ranger in the group will be kicked from the group in order to make room for a SCOURGE or a FIREBRAND, or any other USEFUL profession. The commander's own words. LISTEN. All I been reading for the past 3 months in Forums is HOW overpowered Ranger's are. And I don't see it. I really really don't see it. I'm seeing permaboon warriors that just eat up my bursts. I'm seeing Firebrands and Scourges that put down pulse wells and traps that do 30k damage in two seconds. WHY THE HELL ARE YOU PEOPLE SAYING RANGER IS OVERPOWERED?! Permastealth Deadeyes!? SERIOUSLY!? This was taken away from thieves. And now it's right back in the game again. My STOMP with bonded pet's damage was once 1/3. Now it's 2/5ths for damage. Our damage was lowered. Enemy weapon range was increased to match Ranger's reach. If anything every other class got a kitten load of BUFFS. The last patch saw ONE change to ranger, because....we're overpowered. I highly doubt they did the one change because we're more perfectly balanced. I don't think Anet even knows what to do with Ranger's anymore. Pve we're great. PvP not so bad. WvW….well gee wiz, your just a ranger. You have a "niche". You might as well tell us as we're trying to get on the Zerg Bus, that we need to go the BACK of the bus, because that's how it feels like to play ranger in WvW with a bunch of commanders that think our class is garbage.

@ArenaNet Team.4819 @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 Read @Artyport.2084 his post.

Longbow suggestion:

Ranger longbow needs its own toggle skill: Can be changed every 30 seconds (could be done with a drop down menu or a skill swap as with the revenant)

• Explosive arrow - hitting a target also does damage to the foes around it (6sec) - (10sec cd)
• Toxic arrow - Hitting a target leaves a cloud of poison at the area draining the targets in said area's life. (6sec) - (10sec cd)
• Sharpened arrow - increase damage of your longbow skills by 15%, after every skill you become immobilize for 1 sec. (6sec) - (10sec cd)
• Spirit Arrow - Shoot arrows with the power of the ancient spirits, arrows bounce between targets allies (4) and foes (4) providing random boons and conditions. (6 sec) - (10sec cd)

I believe this would make the longbow more useful, give rangers more options to use it in builds.

Spirit suggestion

• Nature melts with your pet providing (based on what the spirit does now)
• Makes the pet invulnerable for 6 seconds.
• once the effect runs out it does the secondary effect of the spirits.

This could make pets stronger and more useful.

Signits

of Stone - gives periodically protection to you (1 sec, every 10 sec) on use grants stability and protectionof the hunt - passive remains, on use grants quickness for 3 sec and makes our attacks unblockable.of the wild - N/Aof renewal - passive remains, active: give resistance, converts the conditions of your you & allies into boons (2sec)

These are just some of the idea's I had, if they are balanced or not that I am not sure off but to me these could bring a whole new play-style to the ranger.

[Revolution.5409]

@"Halbarz.3854" said:

• Explosive arrow - hitting a target also does damage to the foes around it (6sec) - (10sec cd)

Breaking the defenses of a zerg with bullets is impossible, and this is one of the main reasons why the ranger has no place in zergs.I had also thought of a skill like that, by checking the skills that the ranger has in guild wars I found this.https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Splinter_ShotHaving this ability would allow us to have AoE damage and be able to do damage.Always, if anet does not decide to give the skills of rangers to other professions.

I agree that marksman's minor traits must be changed, 3 traits to do the same thing, I think they should also affect other and not just opening shots

Whirling Defense, removing extra effects from this ability and making it equal to a warrior's would not make this ability OP.

[KeyOrion.9506]

The AoE we have is relegated to hamstringing the enemy. You put a Superior Sigil of Fire on that AoE longbow #5...it actually triggers a nova blast on an enemy that is stealth or veiled on a critical. Other than that our one AoE is fricken useless without +2 extra Rangers. You get 3-5 Rangers with AoE #5 longbow...yah it can do some damage and melt NPC's in seconds. Against permaboon players, it's standing under a nice cool clean clear waterfall. It just flows right off them and does little to no damage. If ranger isn't viable for an allied zerg it's because Anet gave too much damage to what is called the "Meta Classes", and that's THEIR fault, and NO real fault of the player that decides they want to play ranger.

[Sandzibar.5134]

Ranger really needs some consistent boon removal for wvw to be viable in large scale combat.

Even then boon application is so easy and prevelent that I doubt it would help.

Its an impossible to solve issue all down to the short sighted boon related power creep that anet has allowed to happen. Stop buying gem.s

[Anput.4620]

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@KeyOrion.9506 said:

@"Artyport.2084" said:noooo.. stop. I get that they are doing overhauls for some things that were messed up but the ranger is not unviable. There are many different specs that the ranger works well with and just because your specific niche role isn't working doesn't mean the class needs a overhaul.

WHY THE HELL ARE YOU PEOPLE SAYING RANGER IS OVERPOWERED?!

Because regardless of how powerful a ranged attack is, it bugs the absolute $%^& out of people when something is up a hill at 1500 range and hitting them. They point and say "It's OP" but really what they mean is: "I don't like the way it feels when attacks can hit me at 1500 range." They need to work on their wording.

A good example of what I mean is: Even if Arenanet nerfed Ranger Longbow damage by 3/4ths, and it took 4x Rangers on a single target to do what 1x Ranger can do now, WE WOULD STILL see kids coming in here to the forums and saying Rangers were OP because someone got killed by 4x Rangers on the top of a tower who could hit them at 1500 range. The guy would STILL come in here with the mind frame of: "Even though the LB#1s were only doing 800 damage individually upon each strike, I still feel it is OP, cause it hit me from 1500 range."

I certainly hope whatever team is left within Arenanet that works on Guild Wars 2 balance, has enough wisdom to understand the difference between what is actually OP, and when something has a slightly annoying design. When these players say: "RANGER TEH LONGBOWERZ ARE SO STRONGZ" What they really mean is: "When I am playing my Spellbreaker, I feel that all other classes should have to engage me in melee range in the same way that I have to engage them in melee." <- Pretty much. Not too many people out there have any real respectable argument as to why they think Ranger is still so strong.

Why every ktrainer on this forum think otherwise is beyond me, holo, mirage and core warrior are fine but ranger which was worse than all 3 of those pre-nerf already can get nerfed.

[GUFF.5692]

Unfortunately, I don't see the devs making any significant changes to ranger as we know it to be useful in WvW. My guess is that the next epec will be designed to help this issue.

[anduriell.6280]

@GUFF.5692 said:Unfortunately, I don't see the devs making any significant changes to ranger as we know it to be useful in WvW. My guess is that the next epec will be designed to help this issue.Ok i see your process there and i understand it.

Now let me share a no so secret with you. It wont happen.

One traitline, 5 skills and one weapon can not and will not fix an underwhelming class. And the systems team because they dont know what to do with the game their only option is to nerf.It happened with the druid, it is happening with the soulbeast and it will happen with any new spec.

We should focus to ask for the core to be fixed and balanced properly.

[Abyssisis.3971]

@GUFF.5692 said:Unfortunately, I don't see the devs making any significant changes to ranger as we know it to be useful in WvW. My guess is that the next epec will be designed to help this issue.

I’m guessing our next espec will be a melee frontline brawler with shouts to share boons and some projectile hate to help in Zerg fights. ANET nerfed our current melee set ups for no reason, so I’m guessing they are setting it up so that when the espec arrives, the power creep isn’t as bad as POF specs were.

[Lalary.3561]

Unless Anet removes down state rangers will never be viable in zerg battles.

[VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.]

make ranger attacks line of sight and reduce the range and people would stop complaining. Or just half the damage and keep the rest the same. Same outcome.

[Substance E.4852]

@GUFF.5692 said:Unfortunately, I don't see the devs making any significant changes to ranger as we know it to be useful in WvW. My guess is that the next epec will be designed to help this issue.

We've had 2 specs that should have been good in zergs but are totally BTFO by other similar options because anet didn't commit to making our team support worth a damn

-Druid heals are garbage, even more so now with heal scrapper and firebrand on the scene-Stance share was a wet fart in a WvW that is now about repeatedly spamming boons to counter rips, not simple application like pre HoT

Third time's not gonna be a charm I'm afraid.

Edit - Forgot to mention the unfortunate fact that any third spec means we also once again have to deal with the pet evaporating and doing nothing useful in big team fights