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New playable races study - Choose your favorite


Lonami.2987

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Skritt would actually be a very sensible fit. They're inquisitive and widespread, often seen out in the world assisting (or meddling in) the affairs of other races, and banding together in the fight against the dragons and other mutual threats is something they also (if timidly) are seen doing. Being located between the cracks of the world's major events and having such a simple social hierarchy/history would also lessen the load of writing a personal story for the race.

More pointedly, Skritt are built on the idea of teamwork, and having them as a playable race would be a tongue-in-cheek nod to the cooperative nature of open world content and the playerbase itself which becomes more intelligent when it works together (content guides, wiki contributions, etc).

Bonus points if Skritt characters gained a "Many Skritts!" buff when within range of other Skritt characters.

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@Ardid.7203 said:

@Ardid.7203 said:There are so many reasons playable Largos are a terrible idea.

Mind writing them out?

I've done it many times, and I'm tired, so please forgive me if I just quote myself.

 

@Ardid.7203 said:IMO, while the game is clearly oriented to "heroics", IMO it is much more oriented to Fashion Wars. This includes the imagined personality of your own main character. So you can make a feisty silvary, a gloomy asura, a menacing human or a suave charr. Or whatever combination you want. If you want a shining paladin, you can make it with any of the races. If you want a gray anti-hero, you can make it with any of the races.

That is the main problem with Largos, Drows or any group that is, by default, forced into a single stereotype. Put a Largos on land, and you lose half what makes them interesting. Change them into a frilly robe, and you lose another 25%. Now make such robe chick yellow, and bam, you've lost 95% of what makes a Largos a Largos.Go back to the beggining. Put your Largos in water, with its black leather on and its dangerous voice. Now take that mask off. You have now a wet human with a funny backpack and cool clothes. Bye bye 100% of Largosness in just one stroke.

Stereotypes doesn't make good characters, but they are even worse for making races.

 

 

 

@Ardid.7203 said:What about:"Not too similar to what we have" = Kodan out for Norn lookalikes. Largos only difference from humans are their clothes and fins, so out too."Not too generic, single-thematic or cliché" = Largos would need a lot of work to escape from this one."Not crashing with customization elements Anet need to monetize in the gemstore" = Largos totally bye bye.

@Ardid.7203 said:Why so many people like Largos is beyond my understanding. They are just pale human with black breathers, SM clothes and an oversized gemstore backpack, who try to pass as mysterious and menacing by actually don't saying anything and being always alone or hidden.

How would you customize a Largos? How would you put a normal backpack on them?Would they have an actual face now, or will always have those masks on them? If that's the case, how would you adapt the rest of the face-gear to them?If you customize a Largos the same way as a human, what would be the difference, if any?How would you justify a Largos being socially active and on the open? Would they dance, sing and use all the stupid magic-boxes? How could them continue to be mysterious if they began to delve in silly Rata Sum parties? Would they still be interesting with violet hair, pink clothes and the dreamer?

IMO Largos are only interesting for what we DON'T know of them, and the moment you remove their uninspired aqua-drow surface there will be nothing underneath.

 

 

 

@Ardid.7203 said:One of the reasons many people liked GW2 in the first place is because the playable
races
(species!) in the game world feel much more distinct and consistent than the typical copy-paste other franchises use and abuse. All I hope is for Anet to keep going in its own more detailed and dedicated path instead of joining the lame half work that is so usual in the market. That is why I don't believe Largos to be a good option for a playable race: the only merit they can offer is to be extremely cheap to implement. 98% humans, 2% ears, nothing truly remarkable or special. Everything unique on them would have to be removed to make them playable!

 

 

 

@Ardid.7203 said:Kodan are too close to the Norn to be considered interesting in any way. Even if they weren't so redundant, they are just the perfect example of "just a human with animal head" that cheap and boring fantasy uses all the time trying to cover its lack of any real creativity.And frankly, their "wisdom"...Most of what Kodan say are meaningless pseudo-mystic cliches taken directly form a patchouli organic shampoo commercial...

And Largos... were to begin?Largos are basically a pale humanoid with close fit black clothes, a mask, long ears and black butterfly wings. And they are "mysterious". In other words, Largos are a shallow, token placeholder for something that isn't there.Figure: they are just human rigs. What's the addition to enrich the game?Mask: they don't have a facial design, or even expressions. But their masks are crucial to their design... Take their mask off and people might even stop liking them, because they will stop being so "mysterious". Also, how will you customize them? A mask over a mask?Ears: so they are elven like. Why there must always be elves? Tyria don't need elves. Please don´t.Wings: Lets say the wings are part of their anatomy. Then they will ALWAYS clip with weapons and backpacks and everything. Lets say they are NOT part of their anatomy. Then they are nothing more than humans in scuba catsuits. Whats is the point with a race then? A "Largos armor set"would have the same impact. Even an outfit would.Culture: "We keep our secrets". "We work alone". "We compete with other assassin clans". "We don't talk much". "We are mysterious". "We wear black, and backstab things" "we live in he dark under water" ... If they become a race they will be breaking lore every single minute a player uses it: Imagine a group of Largos, colorful in their half naked fluffy pink buttcaps, jumping around in their clipping ugly-cloth gliders and tropical bird wings while shooting rainbow unicorns against a giant lava golem while inside a volcano. I know norn mustachios, sylvari mushroom heads and charr saijan manes have some similar effect... but IMO with Largos it would simply destroy whatever little they had of respectable in the first place. Because they are so cliche, they don't have anything besides being fishy bondage fetishists.

So... please.No more elves, no more black, no more emo solitary assasins. Please, keep GW2 original. No wings over wings. No aquadrows.And if Anet ever needs a new playable water dwelling race to fight against Steve I really hope they choose the Quaggans: I prefer cute rabid manatees over emo drowned Drizzt cosplayers, any day of the week.

 

Anet have shown in their previous playable race designs to be far superior and more committed to make truly unique, detailed and believable species than almost any other MMO. Largos conflicts with this philosophy from the beginning, because they have exactly the same base as humans, and nothing to differentiate them except very superficial things that don't play well with the rest of the game:
  • Largos need to be aquatic to be Largos. But 90% of the game happen to be in dry earth.
  • Largos need masks to be Largos. But masks don't allow facial expressions, and conflict with headgear.
  • Largos needs back fins to be Largos. But back fins conflict with backpacks.
  • Largos need white hair to be Largos. But white hair conflicts with free customization.
  • Largos need pale skin to be Largos. But pale skin also conflicts with free customization.
  • Largos need to be edgy to be Largos. But to be edgy conflicts with 80% of fashion wars and mmo culture.
  • Largos need to be mysterious to be Largos. But to be mysterious conflicts with being the protagonist of a cheesy mmo.
  • Largos need to be distinct from other races to be Largos. But making them playable makes them just humans with pointy ears.

Most of these are just cosmetic. But so are Largos, because they are nothing more than a cool but very shallow cliché, with very little to offer and many elements that conflict directly with playability and, even worse, with monetization.

Sorry, but most of it sounds like pure nitpicking, and inability to see further. Why would you think all largos are the same? We have only met a few. We don't even know if the wings and the masks are actually necessary, they might be assassin-exclusive gear for all we know. They don't appear to follow a swarm mindset either, individuals have personality, and you can't expect every single of them to have the same "spooky" mindset. Imagine you meet a ninja outside Japan, would it be smart to think everyone in Japan is a ninja? You're the one projecting a stereotype over them, instead of treating them like "real people".

If norn, who are just fat big humans, can be distinct enough, then largos would have no problems. I would go further and say they would be far more unique than norn. Same for tengu, you have a full catalog of bird features to choose from.

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All species have some relevant characteristic to them. If the wings, masks, colors and mood in the end aren't necessary, then Anet will be shooting themselves in the feet. They would need to create a huge amount of new lore that would thoroughly change what Largos currently are. This could be great, no doubt, but is a heavy risk: what guarantees people would still like them after such a heavy makeover?

I'm not "projecting a stereotype over them", because they, until now, are nothing more than that.I could say you are the one "projecting your wishes" on them. I could do it too, but it should be no more than speculation, and no base to create an effective new playable race.

TLDR: To make Largos a playable race, you would have to remove most of what we identify them with, create everything anew, and hope people will still like them. Too many IFs, too many risks. Super bad move, IMHO.

About the Tengu: They are far superior to every other species in Tyria for making a playable race. They have a distinct appearance, visual and cultural variety, a decently deep lore, their own 3d model, a defined starter zone, compatibility with the current armor system, big potential for gemstore monetization, don't depend on an specific environment, etc. Ideal material.

About the Norn: Right now they are, in fact, just oversized humans. No wonder they are considered the weakest and less valuable of the current species (If you doubt my words, you can look at the polls). I don't think Anet would want to make another race with the same flaws as the Norn.

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@Lonami.2987 said:

@Ardid.7203 said:There are so many reasons playable Largos are a terrible idea.

Mind writing them out?

I've done it many times, and I'm tired, so please forgive me if I just quote myself.

 

@Ardid.7203 said:IMO, while the game is clearly oriented to "heroics", IMO it is much more oriented to Fashion Wars. This includes the imagined personality of your own main character. So you can make a feisty silvary, a gloomy asura, a menacing human or a suave charr. Or whatever combination you want. If you want a shining paladin, you can make it with any of the races. If you want a gray anti-hero, you can make it with any of the races.

That is the main problem with Largos, Drows or any group that is, by default, forced into a single stereotype. Put a Largos on land, and you lose half what makes them interesting. Change them into a frilly robe, and you lose another 25%. Now make such robe chick yellow, and bam, you've lost 95% of what makes a Largos a Largos.Go back to the beggining. Put your Largos in water, with its black leather on and its dangerous voice. Now take that mask off. You have now a wet human with a funny backpack and cool clothes. Bye bye 100% of Largosness in just one stroke.

Stereotypes doesn't make good characters, but they are even worse for making races.

 

 

 

@Ardid.7203 said:What about:"Not too similar to what we have" = Kodan out for Norn lookalikes. Largos only difference from humans are their clothes and fins, so out too."Not too generic, single-thematic or cliché" = Largos would need a lot of work to escape from this one."Not crashing with customization elements Anet need to monetize in the gemstore" = Largos totally bye bye.

@Ardid.7203 said:Why so many people like Largos is beyond my understanding. They are just pale human with black breathers, SM clothes and an oversized gemstore backpack, who try to pass as mysterious and menacing by actually don't saying anything and being always alone or hidden.

How would you customize a Largos? How would you put a normal backpack on them?Would they have an actual face now, or will always have those masks on them? If that's the case, how would you adapt the rest of the face-gear to them?If you customize a Largos the same way as a human, what would be the difference, if any?How would you justify a Largos being socially active and on the open? Would they dance, sing and use all the stupid magic-boxes? How could them continue to be mysterious if they began to delve in silly Rata Sum parties? Would they still be interesting with violet hair, pink clothes and the dreamer?

IMO Largos are only interesting for what we DON'T know of them, and the moment you remove their uninspired aqua-drow surface there will be nothing underneath.

 

 

 

@Ardid.7203 said:One of the reasons many people liked GW2 in the first place is because the playable
races
(species!) in the game world feel much more distinct and consistent than the typical copy-paste other franchises use and abuse. All I hope is for Anet to keep going in its own more detailed and dedicated path instead of joining the lame half work that is so usual in the market. That is why I don't believe Largos to be a good option for a playable race: the only merit they can offer is to be extremely cheap to implement. 98% humans, 2% ears, nothing truly remarkable or special. Everything unique on them would have to be removed to make them playable!

 

 

 

@Ardid.7203 said:Kodan are too close to the Norn to be considered interesting in any way. Even if they weren't so redundant, they are just the perfect example of "just a human with animal head" that cheap and boring fantasy uses all the time trying to cover its lack of any real creativity.And frankly, their "wisdom"...Most of what Kodan say are meaningless pseudo-mystic cliches taken directly form a patchouli organic shampoo commercial...

And Largos... were to begin?Largos are basically a pale humanoid with close fit black clothes, a mask, long ears and black butterfly wings. And they are "mysterious". In other words, Largos are a shallow, token placeholder for something that isn't there.Figure: they are just human rigs. What's the addition to enrich the game?Mask: they don't have a facial design, or even expressions. But their masks are crucial to their design... Take their mask off and people might even stop liking them, because they will stop being so "mysterious". Also, how will you customize them? A mask over a mask?Ears: so they are elven like. Why there must always be elves? Tyria don't need elves. Please don´t.Wings: Lets say the wings are part of their anatomy. Then they will ALWAYS clip with weapons and backpacks and everything. Lets say they are NOT part of their anatomy. Then they are nothing more than humans in scuba catsuits. Whats is the point with a race then? A "Largos armor set"would have the same impact. Even an outfit would.Culture: "We keep our secrets". "We work alone". "We compete with other assassin clans". "We don't talk much". "We are mysterious". "We wear black, and backstab things" "we live in he dark under water" ... If they become a race they will be breaking lore every single minute a player uses it: Imagine a group of Largos, colorful in their half naked fluffy pink buttcaps, jumping around in their clipping ugly-cloth gliders and tropical bird wings while shooting rainbow unicorns against a giant lava golem while inside a volcano. I know norn mustachios, sylvari mushroom heads and charr saijan manes have some similar effect... but IMO with Largos it would simply destroy whatever little they had of respectable in the first place. Because they are so cliche, they don't have anything besides being fishy bondage fetishists.

So... please.No more elves, no more black, no more emo solitary assasins. Please, keep GW2 original. No wings over wings. No aquadrows.And if Anet ever needs a new playable water dwelling race to fight against Steve I really hope they choose the Quaggans: I prefer cute rabid manatees over emo drowned Drizzt cosplayers, any day of the week.

 

Anet have shown in their previous playable race designs to be far superior and more committed to make truly unique, detailed and believable species than almost any other MMO. Largos conflicts with this philosophy from the beginning, because they have exactly the same base as humans, and nothing to differentiate them except very superficial things that don't play well with the rest of the game:
  • Largos need to be aquatic to be Largos. But 90% of the game happen to be in dry earth.
  • Largos need masks to be Largos. But masks don't allow facial expressions, and conflict with headgear.
  • Largos needs back fins to be Largos. But back fins conflict with backpacks.
  • Largos need white hair to be Largos. But white hair conflicts with free customization.
  • Largos need pale skin to be Largos. But pale skin also conflicts with free customization.
  • Largos need to be edgy to be Largos. But to be edgy conflicts with 80% of fashion wars and mmo culture.
  • Largos need to be mysterious to be Largos. But to be mysterious conflicts with being the protagonist of a cheesy mmo.
  • Largos need to be distinct from other races to be Largos. But making them playable makes them just humans with pointy ears.

Most of these are just cosmetic. But so are Largos, because they are nothing more than a cool but very shallow cliché, with very little to offer and many elements that conflict directly with playability and, even worse, with monetization.

Sorry, but most of it sounds like pure nitpicking, and inability to see further. Why would you think all largos are the same? We have only met a few. We don't even know if the wings and the masks are actually necessary, they might be assassin-exclusive gear for all we know. They don't appear to follow a swarm mindset either, individuals have personality, and you can't expect every single of them to have the same "spooky" mindset. Imagine you meet a ninja outside Japan, would it be smart to think everyone in Japan is a ninja? You're the one projecting a stereotype over them, instead of treating them like "real people".

If norn, who are just fat big humans, can be distinct enough, then largos would have no problems. I would go further and say they would be far more unique than norn. Same for tengu, you have a full catalog of bird features to choose from.

Saddly i agree with them Lonami, Largos are little more than oceanic drow elves with all those things, and without them they are oceanic humans with an edge lord look. They need to have all those things they stated to be "largos". Also given that the "wings" are used for swimming, id say they need them, same with the masks. Players by and large would be dissapointed if they played one and didnt have those things, and we do see other Largos in the game not all of them are assassins but they do have the fins, and the mask. Outside of being known as silent and calculating killers we really dont have a reason to be playing them.

My feelings on the Tengu as a playable race ive already stated(dont remember if it was in this thread) so i wont say it again unless asked.

@ErikTheTyrant.4527 said:Why, because the Mursaat are awesome. It would be nice to float around and be a sub- par god.

the last of the Mursaats was killed, if they still existed the Eye of Janthir would also still be around as it was physically tied to their variety of magic, when that magic ceased to exist so to do the Eye.

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@derd.6413 said:

@"Lonami.2987" said:As promised, this is the full list of my 3 playable race ideas, designed to be released together with three distinct expansions.

You can read about the first expansion idea here:
. The other two aren't ready yet, but the races (
) have been for some time, so I figured I'd post them already, since I don't know if I'll ever get to finish the other two expansion ideas, and some people were genuinely interested in knowing more about these.

Some of you might argue new playable races aren't viable, because they're too expensive to produce. I don't think that's the case at all, but I don't want to discuss that here. Instead, I'll approach new playable races as a new monetization opportunity, as follows:
  • Expansion pack - 30€
  • Race pack - 20€
  • Complete pack - 45€ (Expansion + Race, you save 5€)

The new playable races would be released in standalone 20€ race packs, together with expansion prepurchases, 3-6 months before the actual expansion is released (to help fight the content drought, and later focus 100% on the expansion content instead of leveling up). If it wasn't obvious above, you don't need to buy both, you can buy the race pack and ignore the expansion, or ignore the race pack and only buy the expansion. F2P players who buy a race pack would get their restrictions removed, and unlock both revenant and core masteries.

This approach would let ArenaNet raise expansion prices without alienating players, since they can now choose if they want to pay more for the new feature or not, at the same time justifying the "supposed cost" new playable races would have. Race packs would have deluxe editions as well, including outfits and other bonus items. Gem Store purchase of races would not be an option, but upgrade to deluxe would, much like how expansions work.

Some important points, common for the three race packs:
  • The race packs include new zones, which can be accessed by anyone, whether they own their respective race pack or not. All the new zones include an improved new player experience, up to date with the latest game mechanics. New players might be encouraged to visit these zones instead of their natural zones, for a better experience.
  • Each new playable race includes a new Personal Story, from levels 1 to 30, with no branching paths. After level 30, they join the common storyline with the original playable races, eventually getting to lead the Pact and Dragon's Watch. The new playable races are thus introduced in the past, in the beginning of the game, and not at the time of their introduction. All three races were established before these events, and have members who are already part of the story, thus being compatible with the original story.
  • All future armor skins will be compatible with the new character models, but some older armor skins might not be compatible. Only the most important armor skins will be adapted for retroactive usage. Weapon and backpack skins should be compatible by default, already not needing different versions depending on the race using them.
  • Race packs will not include any exclusive features aside from the playable race itself. Complete packs (Expansion + Race) might unlock some expansion features early on, like mounts or even elite specializations, allowing ArenaNet to test them live before the final release, while rewarding loyal consumers with early access.

So yeah, that's it. Let's go with the three race packs.

First race pack - Day of the Tengu

The Tengu are an isolationist race of avian humanoids. For centuries, conflicts with other races took a heavy toll on their numbers, shrinking the extent of their lands and driving them close to extinction. It was then, in their darkest hours, when the Great Tsunami devastated the coasts across the Sea of Sorrows. The tengu saw this as a signal, and amidst the desolation, the clans united against Zhaitan's undead armies and built the walled city of Dominion of Winds. For decades thereafter, they have remained neutral to the conflicts outside their fortress, but the threat of the Elder Dragons grows further each passing day. Soon, the races of Tyria will march to war once again, and the tengu won't be able to weather the storm alone.

Long ago, the tengu clans were widespread throughout the world, weakened and divided. The Rising of Orr and the Great Tsunami heralded the journey home, to the Dominion of Winds. To fight the armies of Zhaitan, they had to cooperate with one another, and thus the tengu clans unified becoming the four houses - North, South, East, and West, like the winds - allowing them to preserve their unique cultures while unifying as a whole. Each house has a different culture, but all uphold the tengu ideals: Honor, Family, and Tradition.

For a hundred of years since then, the Dominion of Winds has been the home of the tengu. Ruled by their emperor, the dominion remains the only completely tengu-controlled location in the world, last remnant of their fallen empire and last link to their old traditions. Wary of the other races and protective of their own culture, they do not allow anyone but tengu inside the city, and few of them ever leave it. No one bothers them in their dominion, and they do not bother others. Only in times of necessity or for trade do they venture beyond the walls.

However, the path to serenity is fraught with peril, specially in these dark days. If they don't stand together, even the strong will perish when the dragons make their move. Even the tengu, safe inside their walls. And as an old Angchu proverb says, Idle wings attract evil claws. The tengu need to make their own move soon.

When you create your tengu character, you will choose which one of the four houses you belong to. The North house gathers the clans from along the Shiverpeak Mountains, stalwart and strong warriors forged in freezing gales atop the highest peaks. West is formed by the clans from the Maguuma Jungle, renown explorers across torrential rains deep into the wilderness. The East house assembles the mystic clans from the faraway Elonian sandstorms, gifted listeners to the secrets whispered by the wind. Finally, South gathers the intrepid sailors of Cantha, riding sea storms across the waves of the Unending Ocean.

Your story begins at the Meridian Isles, a wild archipelago full of dangers, south of your people's home at Dominion of Winds. Here, at the southernmost border of the Sea of Sorrows, you will answer the call to arms against the undead, and reclaim a place of honor for your people in the world and the coming battle against the Elder Dragons. May your ancestors guide your path.
Map of the new tengu zones.

The
Sea of Sorrows (region)
, once called the Bay of Sirens, is the body of water in central Tyria. A hundred years ago, the Rising of Orr devastated the human towns across its coasts, including the Krytan capital of Lion's Arch. In due time, the surviving sailors and pirates rebuilt Lion's Arch as a free city, and managed to banish Zhaitan's undead minions and recover control over the sea. While the humans rebuilt, tengu from all around the world saw the disaster as a signal, and traveled back to Tyria, settling in the western coast where they built their new home, the Dominion of Winds. Wary of the other races because of past conflicts, they built a wall surrounding their new lands, staying isolated and neutral to the world outside. However, the undead infest the waters once again, and the influence of the other dragons spreads more and more with each passing day. Some tengu believe they can't ignore the world outside anymore, and so they'll fight, even if it that makes them enemies to their own people.

The capital of the tengu race, the
Dominion of Winds (city)
is an immense walled fortress, surrounded by sea and mountains in every direction. The tengu have everything they need inside their walls, and seldom leave them. Some merchants venture outside looking to trade their goods, and some brave fishers dare taste the dangerous waters beyond the walls, but most have never seen the outside world, and do not wish to.

Further south, the
Meridian Isles (1-15)
are the last stop before the Orrian waters. The krait infest these waters, holding one their largest known settlement to the west, and Dead Ships invade from the south constantly, bringing the Risen hordes with them. The zone houses various fishing communities, surviving as best as they can. Recent volcanic activity led to the rising of a new island further south, now called Southsun Cove.

The
Bay of Merchants (15-30)
lies to the west, at the heart of the Sea of Sorrows. The human kingdom of Kryta and the city-state of Lion's Arch claim part of these waters, the Wizard's Tower and Claw Island dominating the seascape. The only tengu settlement in the zone is a small monastery on the northern coast, marking an ancient burial site for the Caromi tribe. Multiple pirate crews infest the zone, assaulting lonely merchant ships.

Second race pack - Mark of the Largos

The Largos are a secretive race of underwater humanoids, famous for their bounty hunters. Their true origins are a closely guarded secret, and asking too many questions might land a dagger in your back. Those who keep an eye on their movements suspect they might hail from the Isles of Janthir, an out of bounds archipelago in northern Tyria, famous for its treacherous mists, and its fabled connection with the mursaat.

Their mysterious technology and architecture reinforces this theory, though it's unknown whether they are actually related, or they merely adopted their abandoned artifacts. Nevertheless, their contribution to the fight against the dragons, even if tiny in numbers, has proven quite valuable for the rest of Tyria.

Largos are a rare sight, mostly known for their bounty hunters, who conceal themselves by wearing masks and wings. This popular depiction couldn't be further from the truth. Albeit used to underwater environments, they can't breath underwater, thus the masks, nothing but fancy respirators. The wings are artificial as well, used to maneuver and teleport away to safety, not just to scare their preys. A largos civilian could walk in public, disguised as a human or a sylvari, with almost no one noticing. They take their sinister image and reputation very seriously, as a defense mechanism.

Their skin tones include pale whites, blues, and greens. Facial and body features are sharper than those of humans, norn, and sylvari, but not very different. Noses are still noses, and ears are still ears. Members of their species wear scars with pride, elders having dozens of them all across their bodies. Body earrings are common as well.

The largos story begins at Alcazia Cape, in the southern coast of Maguuma Jungle, right between Rata Sum and The Grove. This coastal zone is brimming with risen minions, drifting ashore right from Orr, making it a paradise for largos bounty hunters. Asura and sylvari from the nearby cities avoid going too far from the coast, making the zone a no man's land.

The largos have a large hunting post in the zone, called the Black Lodge. New recruits compete against each other in these waters full of risen, only the best being promoted to official bounty hunters. You must rise above the rest and best the training's challenges, less you tarnish the honor of your family.

Once you have the approval of your master, you will be given your own shadow wings, and set free to go and hunt bigger prey.
Map of the new largos zone.

Largos have no capital city of their own, using the Black Lodge instead, much like Ebonhawke. Located at the southernmost island of Alcazia Cape, both largos and other races use the lodge to run a black market operation. The lodge is in the middle of risen waters, keeping it safe from unwanted attention. Clients can travel to the lodge safely and discreetly, using an asura gate linked to an undercover fishing village right outside the outskirts of Lion's Arch.

Largos begin their adventure at
Alcazia Cape (1-15)
, where they will fight against the risen, up until they're deemed ready to start their own hunt, and become official bounty hunters.

Their training continues by crossing the lodge's asura gate into the
Bay of Merchants (15-30)
, where krait replace the risen as the biggest game in the water.

Third race pack - Memories of the Barathrum

The Barathrum are the last remnant of the noble dwarven race. To defend the world against Primordus and his destroyers, the last dwarven king carried out the Rite of the Great Dwarf, turning their race into immortal stone warriors. The stone dwarves faced the destroyers, and were vital in preventing Primordus's first awakening, 250 years ago.

However, a heavy toll was paid that day, for the future of their whole race was sacrificed. Unable to bear children anymore, the stone dwarves were condemned to a future of extinction. Knowing the dragon menace had only been delayed, they abandoned their homeland in the Shiverpeak Mountains, and went underground.

Deep below the surface, in the Depths of Tyria, the dwarven race has been fighting against the destroyers for centuries. To replenish their ranks, they started reforging their fallen brothers. The process was far from perfect, and the fallen soldiers lost part of them after every death. Eventually, stone dwarves were no more, and the Barathrum were born.

The Barathrum are the natural evolution of stone dwarves. Their original stone bodies are no more, having been upgraded with different minerals and metals. Moss and mushrooms grow on their backs, and glowing crystals have grown to replace their hair and beards.

Most of them can't even remember their own names, their whole identity lost in the reforging process. They never forgot how to fight and craft though, and they won't give up easily, taking their war against the dragons to the very surface if necessary.

Barathrum begin their story at the ancient past. You'll relieve the Rite of the Great Dwarf, and fall fighting against the Great Destroyer. You'll wake up centuries later, unable to tell memories apart from dreams, as a forgesmith repairs your body for the thousandth time.

You're part of an expedition to the surface. Your group used an ancient asura gate, now collapsed. The expedition leader, your racial mentor, calculates you must be in the Ice Tooth Caverns, right below Anvil's Rock, a sacred site for your people. Legends tell the Great Dwarf himself used this mountain as his personal forge. Your people hopes to find answers to their future here.

First encounters with surface natives have been rough. They crave the gemstones powering your own bodies, seeing your people as nothing more than walking chunks of ore waiting to be mined. Centaurs and dredge plague the zone, but so do destroyers and icebrood. Concealing your identity and finding allies is paramount.
Map of the new barathrum zone.

Barathrum have no capital city of their own, using their base at Ice Tooth Caves as their headquarters instead, much like Ebonhawke. The repaired asura gate links their makeshift city to Hoelbrak, where some of them have taken shelter, refurbishing an ancient dwarven outpost below the southwestern mountains. Once the Depths of Tyria expansion is released, this outpost will be upgraded to become a hub of asura gates for the new expansion zones.

Their first zone is
Anvil Rock (1-15)
, where the barathrum players will work together to fortify their new refuge against surface and underground threats alike. This zone can be accessed by anyone, whether they own the race pack or not.

New players will continue their adventures in
Snowden Drifts (15-25)
, joining the rest of the playable races.

Final list of zones and their connections:
  • Dominion of Winds (city):
    Lion's Arch (city), Caledon Forest (1-15), Meridian Isles (1-15), Kessex Hills (15-25), Bay of Merchants (15-30).
  • Meridian Isles (1-15):
    Dominion of Winds (city), The Grove (city), Bay of Merchants (15-30), Sparkfly Fen (55-65).
  • Bay of Merchants (15-30):
    Lion's Arch (city), Dominion of Winds (city), Meridian Isles (1-15), Kessex Hills (15-25), Gendarran Fields (25-35), Bloodtide Coast (45-55).
  • Alcazia Cape (1-15):
    Rata Sum (city), The Grove (city), Metrica Province (1-15), Bay of Merchants (15-30).
  • Anvil Rock (1-15):
    Hoelbrak (city), Snowden Drifts (15-25), Harathi Hinterlands (35-45), Frostgorge Sound (70-80).

@"otto.5684" said:I think anything outside Tengu is not going to happen. Not to only do they need to have easily accessible animations for all weapons (which Tengu mostly do), you also need a city with access to a leveling areas. We already have Domain of Wind with access to low leveling areas. In addition, the race has to thematically fit in GW2 at lunch, which some of the ones the op mentioned will not.

Majority of the other races will require massive level of development which I do not think will ever happen.

I don't think every single race needs a capital city, that's just a player assumption. One single zone per new race would be more than enough.

The "massive level of development", if true, could always be justified by selling playable races separately.

@"Erasculio.2914" said:

I'd rather they not make skritt a playable race, because then I'd have to delete all my current characters and replace them all with skritt.

Race change services would be potentially available at release, since, well, it's free money for ArenaNet. They can easily charge 1000 gems for it, or upgrade the
so you can change your race with it too.

the more i read this the more i find wrong with it

Yeah, I don't see Quaggan anywhere in this.

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@"Biff.5312" said:It won't happen but I voted Tengu - I'd like to see those areas opened up on the map, even if it's just to access an NPC city and surrounding area or the like.

I was hoping this was our gateway into Cantha. Like you, I don't think they'll be playable, but they could "need help" and be all about the big picture. They don't like to open their city up to outsiders, so It could be like amnoon, instead of being full sized because we'll have kaineng for that. Even if it's somewhere in the half way point of the story and we hit an "oh kitten" moment. I'll stop here before i get carried away haha

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@Balsa.3951 said:if more races say goodbye to any new armor ever, a combat tonic could fix all race desires people have

I'd actually go for Outfits over Tonics/novelties if at all possible. The lich outfit is something of a prime example, since it changes the entire body.So there could be a market for a heavy/medium/light armor set of Tengu outfits that still allow things like riding mounts and combat.

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I find the argument in the OP flawed. 6 year old MMOs never really get the spotlight again. Most of what you create, you create for people playing now. It's true you do get new players from time to time, but none of them are coming for a new race, since all the old races are new. The best you can hope for from a new race is to get some players to return, assuming those people aren't playing another game and have time to restart, assuming those people like the new race (tengu wouldn't get me personally to return because I have little interest in them).

While I would enjoy a new race, it wouldn't necessarily change the number of people playing the game. My point is, changes to the game at this point need to be made for those playing rather than trying to get people who are not playing which at this point would be a pretty tall task over all.

I'm not saying I hate the idea of a new race. I rather like the idea of a new race. I'm just wondering what we'd have to trade to get it.

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Once (if ever) we go to explore the Unending Ocean this would be a crazy good opportunity to go with the Largos. I like that "anti-hero" idea. I wonder if ANet will ever decide to go underwater.If this will never be a thing I'd go with Margonite / Jotun. I'd love to take a leap back in time to see how Jotun were doing in their greatest time.

  • Woah, Racial Skills reworked into global mastery system? Great idea!
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The list needs a bit of adjustment:

  • Extremely unlikely:
    • Tengu. They have all that a playable race needs to exist. All except development resources. Story, lore, culture, background, room for a city and a starting area, possibilities of customization, appropriate physical shape... they have it all. If we ever get a new race, they are already waiting at the front of the line.
    • A new previously unknown race. In the extremely unlikely case that they ever make a new playable race, it will be either tengu or a new race. None of the other existing races work as well as tengu, or at all for that matter. If it can't be tengu, it'll have to be something new.
  • Simply impossible.
    • Grawl, Ogre, Quaggan, Skritt, Hylek, Harpy, Centaur, Jotun, Troll, etc: They are too tribal. Most of them won't even wear pants. A playable race needs to be advanced and populated enough that you can find all 9 professions within them as a normal occurrence, and that it makes sense for them to wear and use all the gear and customizations playable races have. They don't have to be equally distributed, but all 9 professions should be common and plausible within them.
    • Forgotten, mursaat, seer, margonite: They are essentially extinct. All remaining Tyrian forgotten have been branded. The last murssat on Tyria was eliminated. If the last seer we saw in GW1 are still around, they are still too few to support a playable population. And Jackals are all that's left in Tyria of the torment realms, margonites and their inscribed constructs
    • Dwarves: They turned into stone. Clothes and all. No new dwarves are being born. Their numbers only decrease. This was done purposely in Eye of the North to burn the bridges on them becoming playable.
    • Centaur, forgotten, seer, krait, naga, harpy, largos, quaggan: Their body shapes lack the necessary humanoid shape required to make them usable for the same skills and abilities all other races have. How would a centaur ride a mount? How would a krait kick and stomp or wear pants and boots? How would a harpy or a largos wear a back item with their back stuff in the way? The only way a playable largos would be possible is if their fins are actually a racial back item, or that playable largos lose their fins in an accident in the starting instance, or as punishment for not completing an assassination.
    • Dredge, kodan: They all look the same, and they have been designed to look the same. No room for customization. Even if someone somehow came up with several different variants of kodan, they would still look too similar, because all bears look very similar. Polar bears and brown bears can even have fertile offspring because they are hardly differentiated even genetically. Charr are so diverse because they are not just 'cat people', they are "beast people". They have physical traits from all sorts of carnivore creatures and a few from ungulates too. Some charr heads even had bear-like snouts or fox-like eyes. Possibilities of customization are an integral part of a playable race because GW2 is funded by it.
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@"MithranArkanere.8957" said:The only way a playable largos would be possible is if their fins are actually a racial back item, or that playable largos lose their fins in an accident in the starting instance, or as punishment for not completing an assassination.

I agree, the Tengu are the most probable race to be added as they check all the boxes but I have to add something to this part, the Norn are supposed to be much larger than what we got in-game, their size was "adapted" to make them playable characters. Their shape-shifting capabilities were reduced to some weak racial skills. In order to adapt the Largos they could make the wings a racial skill too. There are ways to make Largos playable, although the Tengu are a much much better (and probable) future race. At the very least I want to finally visit the Dominion of Winds, that blurry part of the World map is really bothering me!

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@TheBravery.9615 said:Tengu, largos, dwarves are most likely because they're not revealed as much. Tengu has a blatant 'hidden city' with a closed off portal in lions arch that's hinted at becoming new content.

Tengu were supposed to be the 5th playable race, but got replaced by sylvari.

@Vayne.8563 said:I'm not saying I hate the idea of a new race. I rather like the idea of a new race. I'm just wondering what we'd have to trade to get it.

Nothing? If we ever get playable races, they will be the selling point of an expansion, much like mounts were with PoF.

And to be fair, we don't have many selling points left.

@"DonArkanio.6419" said:Once (if ever) we go to explore the Unending Ocean this would be a crazy good opportunity to go with the Largos. I like that "anti-hero" idea. I wonder if ANet will ever decide to go underwater.If this will never be a thing I'd go with Margonite / Jotun. I'd love to take a leap back in time to see how Jotun were doing in their greatest time.

  • Woah, Racial Skills reworked into global mastery system? Great idea!

We definitely need more "dark grey morale" races, with a society that is outright disgusting for the other races. I'm really tired of this world of happiness where everything is so perfect and civilized, except your usual Inquest or charr brute, who get shunned quickly by their own peers.

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@"MithranArkanere.8957" said:The only way a playable largos would be possible is if their fins are actually a racial back item, or that playable largos lose their fins in an accident in the starting instance, or as punishment for not completing an assassination.

I agree, the Tengu are the most probable race to be added as they check all the boxes but I have to add something to this part, the Norn are supposed to be much larger than what we got in-game, their size was "adapted" to make them playable characters. Their shape-shifting capabilities were reduced to some weak racial skills. In order to adapt the Largos they could make the wings a racial skill too. There are ways to make Largos playable, although the Tengu are a much much better (and probable) future race. At the very least I want to finally visit the Dominion of Winds, that blurry part of the World map is really bothering me!

Exactly, nothing is set in stone. For all we know, largos wings could be special equipment, used only by largos assassins. If we ever get to experience largos society first-hand, we might discover we knew nothing about them all along. As I said before, it's like meeting a ninja, and then pretending him to be the face of Japanesse culture as a whole.

There's another important thing to consider, which way too many people is stubbornly blind at: Humanoid races sell. And not only that, all of them have backwards compatibility with the human/norn/sylvari rig armor pool. Of the three most popular playable race ideas, largos is the easier to implement. Hell, even the likes of margonites, awakened, or jotun would be easier to implement than the most popular playable race idea, tengu.

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