RIP weapon swapping in rotation — Guild Wars 2 Forums

RIP weapon swapping in rotation

Einsof.1457Einsof.1457 Member ✭✭✭
edited November 6, 2018 in Mesmer

I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

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  • Zhaid Zhem.6508Zhaid Zhem.6508 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2018

    Obviously it'll be a nerf, but I'm happy they revise runes and sigils.
    Let be honest :
    Pve : Scholar, renegade, berserker, and for support : leadership, monk.
    WvW : Scholar, strenght, Durability, Leadership, monk...
    PvP : Scholar, leadership, pack, Lynx, adventurer ...
    Some others runes and sigils are for niche build, and not always that much relevant.The 80% remaining is trash.
    It's a bit boring ; whatever the class, the build, you equip the sames runes and sigils.

    I hope there will be more synergy, or at least more choice, less disparity, with each class design and chosen roles.

  • Einsof.1457Einsof.1457 Member ✭✭✭

    @OriOri.8724 said:
    Being forced to carry a second weapon of the same type, along with a second SoC, just so you can swap it without changing your weapon skills, every 9 seconds for that boon duration was horrible game design. And there is absolutely nothing stopping you from continuing to do the same thing now if you honestly think that it makes the rotation more fun

    thanks for the laugh

  • @Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:
    I hope there will be more synergy, or at least more choice, less disparity, with each class design and chosen roles.

    There should be a significant amount of additional choices, particularly for deeply niche builds and top end variations.

  • Pyroatheist.9031Pyroatheist.9031 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:

    @Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:
    I hope there will be more synergy, or at least more choice, less disparity, with each class design and chosen roles.

    There should be a significant amount of additional choices, particularly for deeply niche builds and top end variations.

    That's certainly good to hear. The fact that the vast majority of sigils and runes are pretty useless has always been an area begging for an overhaul. There's a lot of interesting things that could be implemented there, so I'm looking forward to seeing what you have come up with.

    Ohey, I've got a signature

  • @OriOri.8724 said:
    Being forced to carry a second weapon of the same type, along with a second SoC, just so you can swap it without changing your weapon skills, every 9 seconds for that boon duration was horrible game design. And there is absolutely nothing stopping you from continuing to do the same thing now if you honestly think that it makes the rotation more fun

    Carrying only one type of weapon? I see you using the profession’s full potential here. :expressionless:

  • As somebody with tremors and pain in my wrists, elbows, and shoulders, I welcome dumbed-down and simple rotations.

    The giraffe is an animal which, for sociopolitical arguments, I like to pretend does not exist.

  • Einsof.1457Einsof.1457 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:
    As somebody with tremors and pain in my wrists, elbows, and shoulders, I welcome dumbed-down and simple rotations.

    Don't worry, anet is going to simplify this game into the ground because catering to the disabled over the abled is such a winning business strategy. In all seriousness 90% of profession builds are incredibly simple. Why can't you be happy with that and let those of us who like complexity have our 10%? Why must you take everything away?

  • @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

    @Einsof.1457 said:

    @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:
    As somebody with tremors and pain in my wrists, elbows, and shoulders, I welcome dumbed-down and simple rotations.

    Don't worry, anet is going to simplify this game into the ground because catering to the disabled over the abled is such a winning business strategy. In all seriousness 90% of profession builds are incredibly simple. Why can't you be happy with that and let those of us who like complexity have our 10%? Why must you take everything away?

    The hill that you're defending isn't worth anything. GW2 gets no benefit from having good performance barred behind fighting the interface. The difficulty of the game should come from the encounters and enemies in the game, and not from merely playing the game itself.

    Maybe you dont get that for chrono, encounteres were dificult because you had to plan your weaponswaps to be at the set you nned at specific times like on sloth focus when slublings spawns and shield when cc happens. You had to decide if you have time to swap or not. Now you dont need to plan anything (unless some new ultility is swap-based) and can cap wapon that you will need next. Basics of chrono were already very easy and this takes away more advanced stuff.

  • Jojo.6140Jojo.6140 Member ✭✭✭

    I welcome this change. As a main mes for open world i only played DPS in raids until now, part of the reason being the nature of the concentration-sigil and the need to constantly weapon swap. Now that it wont be needed any more, i might switch to chrono for raids. Its not as if they didnt have enough mechanics to deal with already anyway.

  • ButcherofMalakir.4067ButcherofMalakir.4067 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    @Jojo.6140 said:
    I welcome this change. As a main mes for open world i only played DPS in raids until now, part of the reason being the nature of the concentration-sigil and the need to constantly weapon swap. Now that it wont be needed any more, i might switch to chrono for raids. Its not as if they didnt have enough mechanics to deal with already anyway.

    Truth is, they dont.
    I started raids with chrono because I saw distorting greens on vg. Day before I finished my gear, distortion share was removed. Phantasm rework was great. Last changes are ok I guess but I am little worried about this one.
    Chrono already has easy rotation because
    a) it doesnt matter if your squad have 150% quickness and alacrity uptime or 110%. You can make mistakes that dont have any efect.
    2) you rotation have alot of free time. You cast one spell every ~20 seconds and second every ~16. Only thing you need to do now is time it with weaponswap.

    Basicaly all you were doing was dealing with mechanics or if you didnt have to, maximising the damage. With this change, basicaly all non chaos builds are nerfed and even more apart from dps builds and closer to chaos builds.

    And you dont have to plan swap ahead so you have right set for right mechanic. Now you can just camp shield...

    Hopefuly those ultility options bring something with interesting gameplay instead of passive buffs.

  • well personally as a guard main (not pvp/wvw oriented comment) i welcome the change to the scholar rune and dwayna rune . fitst one because the big 10% damage bonus reduced to 5% but with more ferocity, if my math is correct its around 8% more damage on crit, giving you more freedom from the "I MUST BE OVER 90% HP" principle. and i can finaly leave the rune of divinity, and use the dvayna rune for that juicy 10% more hp

  • SpinDashMaster.5680SpinDashMaster.5680 Member ✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    @Lucas.3718 said:
    well personally as a guard main (not pvp/wvw oriented comment) i welcome the change to the scholar rune and dwayna rune . fitst one because the big 10% damage bonus reduced to 5% but with more ferocity, if my math is correct its around 8% more damage on crit, giving you more freedom from the "I MUST BE OVER 90% HP" principle. and i can finaly leave the rune of divinity, and use the dvayna rune for that juicy 10% more hp

    It's 8% of the base 100% of the non-crit damage. The bonus to Ferocity is also additive as opposed to multiplicative. I've explained this in three discords already so I'm just gonna c/p for you:

    +8.2% crit and x1.05 is not stronger than x1.1 to your damage, especially for classes that already have high ferocity. Remember that ferocity becomes less valuable the more of it you have relative to your power. Raw multipliers have always been better because such bonuses are multiplicative and not additive, like ferocity.

    Essentially speaking, classes with high ferocity and an already high product of multipliers will benefit far less from new scholar vs old. Weaver, Deadeye, and Daredevil are obvious examples of this.

    Suppose, for instance, that a non crit attack does 100 damage, and the character has a critical damage stat of 220%, holding equal the first 5 pieces of the scholar set and all other aspects of the build, and the enemy being attacked (also holding equal the results of weapon RNG). That means the attack would crit for 220, for simplicity's sake.

    The current scholar runes would essentially just multiply this damage by 1.1, resulting in 242 damage.

    The new scholar runes would change the crit damage modifier to 228.2%, changing the damage to 228 instead of 220. This then gets multiplied by the 1.05 multipler, resulting in 239 damage.

    If a Power DPS character somehow had very low ferocity, your statement would be correct, because the 8.2% crit damage would be more impactful, relative to the already-present critical damage stat. But the problem here is that it's 8.2% of the base 100% of the damage. It's an additive bonus, and thereby falls short when Ferocity is sufficiently high.

    And this example was just with 220% crit damage. Looking at my daredevil in realistic raid buffs, I'm staring at 266%. So the gap would be even wider in my case.

  • Pyroatheist.9031Pyroatheist.9031 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @SpinDashMaster.5680 said:

    @Lucas.3718 said:
    well personally as a guard main (not pvp/wvw oriented comment) i welcome the change to the scholar rune and dwayna rune . fitst one because the big 10% damage bonus reduced to 5% but with more ferocity, if my math is correct its around 8% more damage on crit, giving you more freedom from the "I MUST BE OVER 90% HP" principle. and i can finaly leave the rune of divinity, and use the dvayna rune for that juicy 10% more hp

    It's 8% of the base 100% of the non-crit damage. The bonus to Ferocity is also additive as opposed to multiplicative. I've explained this in three discords already so I'm just gonna c/p for you:

    +8.2% crit and x1.05 is not stronger than x1.1 to your damage, especially for classes that already have high ferocity. Remember that ferocity becomes less valuable the more of it you have relative to your power. Raw multipliers have always been better because such bonuses are multiplicative and not additive, like ferocity.

    Essentially speaking, classes with high ferocity and an already high product of multipliers will benefit far less from new scholar vs old. Weaver, Deadeye, and Daredevil are obvious examples of this.

    Suppose, for instance, that a non crit attack does 100 damage, and the character has a critical damage stat of 220%, holding equal the first 5 pieces of the scholar set and all other aspects of the build, and the enemy being attacked (also holding equal the results of weapon RNG). That means the attack would crit for 220, for simplicity's sake.

    The current scholar runes would essentially just multiply this damage by 1.1, resulting in 242 damage.

    The new scholar runes would change the crit damage modifier to 228.2%, changing the damage to 228 instead of 220. This then gets multiplied by the 1.05 multipler, resulting in 239 damage.

    If a Power DPS character somehow had very low ferocity, your statement would be correct, because the 8.2% crit damage would be more impactful, relative to the already-present critical damage stat. But the problem here is that it's 8.2% of the base 100% of the damage. It's an additive bonus, and thereby falls short when Ferocity is sufficiently high.

    And this example was just with 220% crit damage. Looking at my daredevil in realistic raid buffs, I'm staring at 266%. So the gap would be even wider in my case.

    Lemme just tl;dr this for you:

    Assume...you had 220 crit damage before the change with scholar runes.

    You will do ~1.2% less damage with the new runes.

    Previously if you did 5000 damage in an attack, the scholar 10% bonus would bring that to 5500.
    The new bonus + ferocity boost will bring it to 5439.

    Ohey, I've got a signature

  • kasoki.5180kasoki.5180 Member ✭✭✭

    @Einsof.1457 said:
    I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

    I play as chrono in T4 and get 100% boon uptime via harrier gear and chaos traitline. Sigil of Concentration was never a neccessity

  • Yasi.9065Yasi.9065 Member ✭✭✭

    @Einsof.1457 said:
    I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

    Tbh, I love the change. Why? Because its the right direction. Just providing boons is the most boring thing Ive ever done in any mmo. And thanks to the VERY rigid rotation of boon chrono in the past (before mimic change), the room for "other" things was just barely there.

    Id rather have providing boons take up max. 30% of my time in fights so I can concentrate on other stuff. Doing dps. CCing adds. Doing mechanics. Maybe healing. THATs exciting. Doing the same rigid rotation every week - with only minimal variations per boss - I do not understand how people can think thats fun, complex and exciting. A monkey can handle that. Or a bot. And thats excatly how I felt playing chrono in the past.

    Now with the mimic change chrono started to be fun. Finally I can DO things. And not being locked into weapon swapping? Im so excited now.

    I guess the reason why so many hate the chrono changes, is because chrono gameplay becomes more and more like druid gameplay, and less "dps-at-golem-like". No more fixed rotation you can semi-afk do on every boss, and more responsibilties outside of that boon-rotation.

    First thing Im going to test next week is how low I can now drop my boon duration as an off-chrono, how much dps stats I can squeeze in and if I can do cannons on off chrono now.

  • Einsof.1457Einsof.1457 Member ✭✭✭

    I disagree with literally everything you said lol

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    @Einsof.1457 said:
    I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

    Really? this one change affects your gameplay that much? That's hard to believe.

    Still, I would rather get a flat +10 than a short lived +33

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Einsof.1457 said:
    I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

    Really? this one change affects your gameplay that much? That's hard to believe.

    I mean chrono had focus or sword as second offhand because of the utility or DPS, but since you will need more concentration gear you can forget DPS imo so you can basically sit on sw/shield and do the rota from there... That is what affects gameplay, the thing that you can basically do the same as a thief for example but instead you will give boons and not do DPS
    Degrading a class to a level of brainless skill spam makes it boring

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Nepster.4275 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Einsof.1457 said:
    I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

    Really? this one change affects your gameplay that much? That's hard to believe.

    I mean chrono had focus or sword as second offhand because of the utility or DPS, but since you will need more concentration gear you can forget DPS imo so you can basically sit on sw/shield and do the rota from there... That is what affects gameplay, the thing that you can basically do the same as a thief for example but instead you will give boons and not do DPS
    Degrading a class to a level of brainless skill spam makes it boring

    It sure does ... the difference is that I'm not assuming this change takes a game from super genius level weapons swaps to brainless skill spam.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Einsof.1457Einsof.1457 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    @Dace.8173 said: You did X,Y,Z then swap and do A,B,C and then swap and do X,Y,Z all over again.

    Yeah right...you try doing CM100 like that without timing Aegis for orbs and see how your group likes you...really...you don't know the timing that high end pve requires of chrono to maximize support, which is one of the most fun aspects of the profession that will now be gutted.

    @Dace.8173 said: Also, making your game more accessible to people, which brings in more people, which increases revenue, which increases the number of players who are engaged in a game is a winning business strategy.

    Blizzard thought this was true as well recently. I'd rather anet not turn into the new blizzard, tyvm. Making content for high end folks while creating pathways for low-mid content players to progress is the winning business strategy. Gutting high-end content and playstyles to cater to low to mid content and low-mid skill players is a net loss. Always has been. WoW made this mistake. SOE made this mistake with star wars galaxies. Turbine made this mistake. Square Enix made this mistake(FFXIV currently dying because of it). I have been playing MMOs for 20 years and I see this mistake made over and over by MMO businesses. I have never loved a game more than GW2 and hope anet realizes the mistakes others have made in the past and does not repeat them. Unfortunately, it seems they are on that path.

  • Durzlla.6295Durzlla.6295 Member ✭✭✭

    I mean if you love weapon swapping pretty much on CD for your rotation you can always play druid, it’s got the added complexity in deciding whether to swap to the avatar state or swap your weapon...

    Personally I’m fine with not NEEDING to swap, bonus points if for whatever reason it lets me run scepter, I doubt it will, but I can dream.

    "But my children sing to me. Listen. They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family. As their mother, I have to grant them their wish."

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:

    @Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:
    I hope there will be more synergy, or at least more choice, less disparity, with each class design and chosen roles.

    There should be a significant amount of additional choices, particularly for deeply niche builds and top end variations.

    Any plans to extend additional choices to certain boons like alacrity and quickness that outside of chrono are only really available for guardian and revenant to provide to a group?

    Any plans for changing Signet of Inspiration in function so we can stop nerfing every other mesmer trait/skill for the sake of this one skill that is still giving permanent every boon?

    I stand with Mo.

  • Dace.8173Dace.8173 Member ✭✭✭

    @Einsof.1457 said:

    @Dace.8173 said: You did X,Y,Z then swap and do A,B,C and then swap and do X,Y,Z all over again.

    Yeah right...you try doing CM100 like that without timing Aegis for orbs and see how your group likes you...really...you don't know the timing that high end pve requires of chrono to maximize support, which is one of the most fun aspects of the profession that will now be gutted.

    @Dace.8173 said: Also, making your game more accessible to people, which brings in more people, which increases revenue, which increases the number of players who are engaged in a game is a winning business strategy.

    Blizzard thought this was true as well recently. I'd rather anet not turn into the new blizzard, tyvm. Making content for high end folks while creating pathways for low-mid content players to progress is the winning business strategy. Gutting high-end content and playstyles to cater to low to mid content and low-mid skill players is a net loss. Always has been. WoW made this mistake. SOE made this mistake with star wars galaxies. Turbine made this mistake. Square Enix made this mistake(FFXIV currently dying because of it). I have been playing MMOs for 20 years and I see this mistake made over and over by MMO businesses. I have never loved a game more than GW2 and hope anet realizes the mistakes others have made in the past and does not repeat them. Unfortunately, it seems they are on that path.

    Timing is not complexity. You are also following a rotation. Most rotations someone thought out a set of moves that other people are to replicate in order to win. Rotations do not add much in the realm of complexity. They may be hard to do, but hard and complexity is not the same thing. Even then, you still have to time your moves. The new sigils don't remove timing, they just remove the need to weapon swap. This allows you to actually focus on other things.

    Also, removing weapon swap is not gutting high-end game content and playstyles. Making your game more accessible is also not a mistake. If your game is not accessible then people stop playing. Removing weapon swap for sigils is nowhere in the same league as making a game-ending mistake. High-end playstyles are a bit more involved than weapon swapping for sigil bonuses.

  • Zlater.6789Zlater.6789 Member ✭✭✭

    Just stick concentration on your shield and air/slayer sigils on your sword/focus. You still gotta swap, except the difference between good and bad chrono's will not be as much their boon uptimes, but their personal contribution to dps.

  • @Dace.8173 said:

    @Einsof.1457 said:
    I play chrono because of the complexity...but anet just keeps dumbing it down. What do you guys think of this change to sigil of concentration? My thought is that my T4/raid rotation is going to be super boring now...

    It's hardly dumbing things down. It's tweaking and improving. I love it when a gaming company makes a move to overall increase the playability of their game is always viewed as dumbing down. Also, if you drew your enjoyment from T4/Raids from weapon swap then yes, it will be boring. For most folks it won't be though. A constant 10% is better 33% that you only get if you change weapons. All this does to your rotation is make you have to think more about what you are doing. The whole weapon swap rotation was rote. You did X,Y,Z then swap and do A,B,C and then swap and do X,Y,Z all over again. As a matter of fact, following a rotation is not complexity in play. We have rotations to make play easier and less complex. You memorize the rotation and you'll do well.

    @Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:
    Obviously it'll be a nerf, but I'm happy they revise runes and sigils.
    Let be honest :
    Pve : Scholar, renegade, berserker, and for support : leadership, monk.
    WvW : Scholar, strenght, Durability, Leadership, monk...
    PvP : Scholar, leadership, pack, Lynx, adventurer ...
    Some others runes and sigils are for niche build, and not always that much relevant.The 80% remaining is trash.
    It's a bit boring ; whatever the class, the build, you equip the sames runes and sigils.

    I hope there will be more synergy, or at least more choice, less disparity, with each class design and chosen roles.

    That is my hope too, that Runes and Sigils become more interesting and there is more value in what you choose. The removal of randomness will add consistency in results and combat becomes less a factor of being lucky at the right moment and a matter of making the right moves.

    @Einsof.1457 said:

    @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:
    As somebody with tremors and pain in my wrists, elbows, and shoulders, I welcome dumbed-down and simple rotations.

    Don't worry, anet is going to simplify this game into the ground because catering to the disabled over the abled is such a winning business strategy. In all seriousness 90% of profession builds are incredibly simple. Why can't you be happy with that and let those of us who like complexity have our 10%? Why must you take everything away?

    Weapon swap on Sigil of Concentration did not make gameplay more complex. People constantly fell into patterned behavior in which they went through the rotation. Then they repeated the rotation. I love complexity in play but following a rotation is by no means complex. It's Easy Mode. Also, making your game more accessible to people, which brings in more people, which increases revenue, which increases the number of players who are engaged in a game is a winning business strategy. So making the game more user-friendly for disabled people (though I'm loathed to use the term disabled) is a good thing.

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

    @Einsof.1457 said:

    @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:
    As somebody with tremors and pain in my wrists, elbows, and shoulders, I welcome dumbed-down and simple rotations.

    Don't worry, anet is going to simplify this game into the ground because catering to the disabled over the abled is such a winning business strategy. In all seriousness 90% of profession builds are incredibly simple. Why can't you be happy with that and let those of us who like complexity have our 10%? Why must you take everything away?

    The hill that you're defending isn't worth anything. GW2 gets no benefit from having good performance barred behind fighting the interface. The difficulty of the game should come from the encounters and enemies in the game, and not from merely playing the game itself.

    Maybe you dont get that for chrono, encounteres were dificult because you had to plan your weaponswaps to be at the set you nned at specific times like on sloth focus when slublings spawns and shield when cc happens. You had to decide if you have time to swap or not. Now you dont need to plan anything (unless some new ultility is swap-based) and can cap wapon that you will need next. Basics of chrono were already very easy and this takes away more advanced stuff.

    There is nothing about this change that interferes with the gameplay you describe. You will still need to time your weapon swaps at specific moments. The only difference now is that your weapon swaps will be about changing what you are actually doing as opposed to trying to keep a 33% bonus going for as long as you can. They idea that you won't need to plan anything is simply false. With a potential increase in viable runes and sigils you will actually have to do a lot more planning as you figure out what new runes/sigils will be good for what situations and incorpating new bonuses into your playstyle.

    This in no way takes away advanced stuff. Weapon swap to maintain a 33% increase for 7 secs is not advanced.

    There is a change. Now if you dpnt have time for swap and you swap you suffer. But if you have and dont you suffer too. After this chamge there is almost 0 punischment for just camping shield and swaping/not swaping for that specific encounter.

  • kasoki.5180kasoki.5180 Member ✭✭✭

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    There is a change. Now if you dpnt have time for swap and you swap you suffer. But if you have and dont you suffer too. After this chamge there is almost 0 punischment for just camping shield and swaping/not swaping for that specific encounter.

    Clone generation? Dps? Blocks? I mean, you currently need to have 3 clones for your CS to maximise quickness uptime. If your Echo of Memory/Deja Vu fails you are in a bit of a pickle

    I play T4 with no sigil of concentration. Have 100% boon uptime. And yes I have to swap weapons.

  • @Zlater.6789 said:
    Just stick concentration on your shield and air/slayer sigils on your sword/focus. You still gotta swap, except the difference between good and bad chrono's will not be as much their boon uptimes, but their personal contribution to dps.

    Why would you care how much dps have your chrono ? He could run full tank gear and do 0 damage but provide perma boons ,no one ever would tell him he have low dps and kick him. You have dedicated DPS classes /facepalm

  • Can we finally let runes of chronomancer work on groups =) ? Could probably even let duo wells compete with leadership/recall/time warp but I'm too lazy to do the calculations.

    [RED] Crimson Sunspears...your small family guild since 2015.

  • @kasoki.5180 said:

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    There is a change. Now if you dpnt have time for swap and you swap you suffer. But if you have and dont you suffer too. After this chamge there is almost 0 punischment for just camping shield and swaping/not swaping for that specific encounter.

    Clone generation? Dps? Blocks? I mean, you currently need to have 3 clones for your CS to maximise quickness uptime. If your Echo of Memory/Deja Vu fails you are in a bit of a pickle

    I play T4 with no sigil of concentration. Have 100% boon uptime. And yes I have to swap weapons.

    No. You need one clone man. Why do you need 3 clones??? You can cast tides of time, signet of inspiration, well of action, mimic (and all shatters if you time correctly) in one clone cs. Those are all your quickness and alacrity spells so you dont get better uptime if you have longer cs. In fact you will have less uptime because you lose those few seconds you are in cs when you dont need to be.

    And yes, you can swap to increese dps or to get specific spell but it will not affect your quickness and alacrity generation. Right now you need to chose if you swap for boons or swap for damage/cc/pulls...(if you dont plan your swaps to be there when swaping for boon duration).

    Truth is, after this change you can be lazy and camp one set without losing any boons.

  • @tinyreborn.1938 said:

    @Zlater.6789 said:
    Just stick concentration on your shield and air/slayer sigils on your sword/focus. You still gotta swap, except the difference between good and bad chrono's will not be as much their boon uptimes, but their personal contribution to dps.

    Why would you care how much dps have your chrono ? He could run full tank gear and do 0 damage but provide perma boons ,no one ever would tell him he have low dps and kick him. You have dedicated DPS classes /facepalm

    Because some players want to do best possible job they can. That is fun for them. Its the same argument as why shouldnt warrior run magi gear when he is taken for banners and not damage ...

  • @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    @tinyreborn.1938 said:

    @Zlater.6789 said:
    Just stick concentration on your shield and air/slayer sigils on your sword/focus. You still gotta swap, except the difference between good and bad chrono's will not be as much their boon uptimes, but their personal contribution to dps.

    Why would you care how much dps have your chrono ? He could run full tank gear and do 0 damage but provide perma boons ,no one ever would tell him he have low dps and kick him. You have dedicated DPS classes /facepalm

    Because some players want to do best possible job they can. That is fun for them. Its the same argument as why shouldnt warrior run magi gear when he is taken for banners and not damage ...

    I dont even know what you have instead of a brain there lad. His gear doesnt increase bonus of his banners thus he can play any spec he want condi bers or power spb. Mesmer need concentration in order to provide boons so they have to get it from gear. Why i even have to exlain it ?

  • sigur.9453sigur.9453 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    @tinyreborn.1938 said:

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    @tinyreborn.1938 said:

    @Zlater.6789 said:
    Just stick concentration on your shield and air/slayer sigils on your sword/focus. You still gotta swap, except the difference between good and bad chrono's will not be as much their boon uptimes, but their personal contribution to dps.

    Why would you care how much dps have your chrono ? He could run full tank gear and do 0 damage but provide perma boons ,no one ever would tell him he have low dps and kick him. You have dedicated DPS classes /facepalm

    Because some players want to do best possible job they can. That is fun for them. Its the same argument as why shouldnt warrior run magi gear when he is taken for banners and not damage ...

    I dont even know what you have instead of a brain there lad. His gear doesnt increase bonus of his banners thus he can play any spec he want condi bers or power spb. Mesmer need concentration in order to provide boons so they have to get it from gear. Why i even have to exlain it ?

    a bit offensive, aren´t we?
    what s/he meant was obviously that if for mesmer, boons should be anything to worry about, then for bs it should be enough to drop banners and autoatack for EA, since that is the reason to be in the squad. BUT some players don´t want to just fullfill there role, they want to master it by reaching the highest dps possible within the limitations of there role/build. for experienced chronos a good boonuptime is "easy to achive" so the only thing to improve on is there personal dps. Same goes for any other support spec. is it neccasary? no. but if its is their goal, why not.

  • ButcherofMalakir.4067ButcherofMalakir.4067 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    @tinyreborn.1938 said:

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    @tinyreborn.1938 said:

    @Zlater.6789 said:
    Just stick concentration on your shield and air/slayer sigils on your sword/focus. You still gotta swap, except the difference between good and bad chrono's will not be as much their boon uptimes, but their personal contribution to dps.

    Why would you care how much dps have your chrono ? He could run full tank gear and do 0 damage but provide perma boons ,no one ever would tell him he have low dps and kick him. You have dedicated DPS classes /facepalm

    Because some players want to do best possible job they can. That is fun for them. Its the same argument as why shouldnt warrior run magi gear when he is taken for banners and not damage ...

    I dont even know what you have instead of a brain there lad. His gear doesnt increase bonus of his banners thus he can play any spec he want condi bers or power spb. Mesmer need concentration in order to provide boons so they have to get it from gear. Why i even have to exlain it ?

    Well. You said that dps doesnt matter as chrono. It does. 10 k vs 2.5 k dps is 4 times more. Tell me what is better.
    Both commander and minstrel provide same concentration. Why is minstrel bezter if commander brings more damage and minstrel nothing that is worth it?
    And lastly, i have a brain. In fact my IQ makes me statisticaly a genius. Sorry if my post was too clever for you.

  • @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:
    Well. You said that dps doesnt matter as chrono. It does. 10 k vs 2.5 k dps is 4 times more. Tell me what is better.
    Both commander and minstrel provide same concentration. Why is minstrel bezter if commander brings more damage and minstrel nothing that is worth it?
    And lastly, i have a brain. In fact my IQ makes me statisticaly a genius. Sorry if my post was too clever for you.

    Your post tell otherwise . Compare warrior banners that unaffected by gear and chrono that does . Especially hilarious that you think BS taken for banners only
    Dont bring your low IQ into discussion if you dont understand what I disliked in quoted post that wasn't addressed for you

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