Rune & Sigil Blog: "Utility Option" clarification — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Rune & Sigil Blog: "Utility Option" clarification

'allo Tyrians,
I realized from your comments and feedback that one of the notes in today's blog gave the wrong impression and wanted to clarify/fix that.

Toward the end of the blog we mention "adding a couple utility options". We did not mean sigil options (though quite a few are coming with the re-works). We meant utility buff options, also known as Enhancements).

Sorry about that confusion.

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Comments

  • This just fans even more speculation. An alternative to Sharpening Stones?

  • @Kain Francois.4328 said:
    This just fans even more speculation. An alternative to Sharpening Stones?

    A few alternatives to grant some extra concentration. So you'll have a consumable trade-off option to help you get to potential boon durations thresholds.

  • Jski.6180Jski.6180 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Any thoughts on making lesser version that lets ppl get the all in armor type Potion Of Karka Toughness but easier to get for such content as wvw? Maybe other types as well a 150 vit one would be too much i think but what about a 100 or 50 vit version?

  • Kain Francois.4328Kain Francois.4328 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:

    @Kain Francois.4328 said:
    This just fans even more speculation. An alternative to Sharpening Stones?

    A few alternatives to grant some extra concentration. So you'll have a consumable trade-off option to help you get to potential boon durations thresholds.

    I heard Potent Maintenance Oil is pretty good? :trollface:

    edit: offtopic, but oh my god, the official ANET forums has a trollface emote... How much longer till we can get a :Kappa:?

  • Talindra.4958Talindra.4958 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    Tbh, don't like the changes.. doesn't give me a good feel.

    Death is Energy [DIE] in EU
    Envoy's Herald, CoZ, VitV, DD, SS, The Eternal, LNHB, Champion Magus, Champion Phantom, Wondrous Achiever etc.

  • Catchyfx.5768Catchyfx.5768 Member ✭✭✭

    @anduriell.6280 said:

    Am i wrong for feeling excited about all this changes more so than for a living world update?

    I feel it the same. Wondering how many builds will change.

    Jokaurene

  • LucianDK.8615LucianDK.8615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Will be interesting to see if Rune of the scholar finally stops being the defacto choice for power builds.

  • @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Will be interesting to see if Rune of the scholar finally stops being the defacto choice for power builds.

    It'll still be the best. Doubt we'll all change to rock dog over this.

  • @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:
    We meant utility buff options, also known as Enhancements).

    Doesn't this mean an additional +5% boon duration at best? How is this gonna help out all the professions losing 23% boon duration due to Concentration Sigil changes? Or are you planning on giving us +20% SINGLE boon or +20% Q&A after weapon swap only sigils instead? I also doubt you're gonna buff Leadership further. Or will there be a Chronomancer rune rework with very high Q&A ONLY uptimes? You don't have to answer that, I mean I'm aware you can't. Just wanted to let you know that forcing supporters into full support builds is not what you should aim for if you wanna fix the "Chrono Issues" or that only a handful DpS specs are viable at the same time.

    What I mean with this is - IF Chronomancers (for example) would be able to deal more damage (with that I mean noticably more) if they are NOT forced to provide all the boons aka playing one single build everywhere -> Chaos / Insp -> then it might generate slots for DpS specs with less than top DpS but providing a boon which then the Chronos don't have to.

    If you want to change the meta from 2 Chronos to 2 Chronos OR 1 Chrono + Firebrand/Renegade, if you want to let DpS professions like Firebrand or Soulbeast etc which atm are not really welcome in parties to be more viable - the right direction would be to reduce Chronomancers damage OR cc if they provide ALL boons, but increase the damage significantly if their only job is to apply Q&A. You basically would rather want a 30k DpS spec with boon X over a 35k one if the Chrono deals 20k instead of 10k. You can generate slots for specs that are atm not in a good spot this way.

  • hey anet, yeah, if you could like, not kill all future possibility of me being able to play condi chrono again with this change, that'd be greeeat

  • It would be great to have rune that fits condi Chrono, I agree, but who knows. We haven't seen all of it yet, so let's hope! It already was pretty close to run Illusions and Inspiration on condi Chrono means you might as well play power instead. :/

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 7, 2018

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:

    @Kain Francois.4328 said:
    This just fans even more speculation. An alternative to Sharpening Stones?

    A few alternatives to grant some extra concentration. So you'll have a consumable trade-off option to help you get to potential boon durations thresholds.

    Better than those that are already used (because, if not, what's the point)? Good enough to cover that +23% boon duration loss from the nerf (somehow i really doubt that)?

    And, if, so, i hope they won't be very expensive, because after already paying quite a lot for overpriced Concentration (that will probably still remain as necessary as before, because there is no alternative), i'd really hate for it to get nerfed only so i could pay even more to get some of that back with new consumables.

    That would be a change strictly for the worse.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • The utilities will be in line with what other utilities give.

  • TexZero.7910TexZero.7910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:
    The utilities will be in line with what other utilities give.

    So we're basically returning what was removed when you guys decided to streamline and "fix" stones/oils/crystals about almost a year ago even though they were deemed problematic back then ?

  • morrolan.9608morrolan.9608 Member ✭✭✭

    Hopefully these will not be bound on pick up so they can be sold.

  • eldrjth.7384eldrjth.7384 Member ✭✭✭

    They could just adjust boon duration on the skills themselves rather than rely on a sigil to bring certain skills inline with the kind of boon uptime they have in mind. But that would require a balance patch to be done. I think I read a post somewhere that some on the lost of boon duration will be put back into traits too so no all of the difference will be lost.

    Also 100% boon duration cap doesnt actually mean 100% up time on a buff (sometimes more or less is required), and realistically theres no reason why it should cap off at 100% anyways since its not like like crit chance where all hits will crit at that point (also condition duration doesnt really have to cap off at 100% either). Beyond 100% boon duration would mean a boon will last more than twice the original duration.

  • Jski.6180Jski.6180 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:
    Utilities, like most items, have a budget of attributes.

    There isn't a 'return' of anything that was removed.
    Stones/Oils/Crystals were standardized so that they would be easier to understand and there wouldn't be ones that were significantly out of budget or doing things that didn't make senses within each type.
    ie. Stones are power-centric, oils are concentration-based/support and crystals are condition damage.

    But that not all utilities just most of them.

  • Kunzaito.8169Kunzaito.8169 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    This may not be exactly the perfect place for this, but just to plant the seed: can we get a birthday gift one of these years that is an upgrade to the Birthday Blaster which gives a skill or skills to provide a generic utility buff to complement our generic food buff? Would be nice for those "don't wanna waste good food" moments, or helping out a group for pve stuff. Plus those empty 3-4-5 skills bug me. XD

  • Zlater.6789Zlater.6789 Member ✭✭✭

    I'm honestly a big fan of the changes that I've seen so far, but like the video on reddit elaborates, the way that these changes have been affecting chronomancer have been really brutal lately.

    To those of us with legendary armor its really not such a big deal, but for those without, its becoming really burdensome to have to go around and completely re-gear our characters every couple of months. I appreciate that the gearing system in gw2 is a blessing in the way it removes the grind, but when the frequency is like this, it still really sucks.

    Is there any additional information you can share with us regarding these issues? Anything, especially for newer players, would be appreciated.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:
    The utilities will be in line with what other utilities give.

    In other words, if they keep to the same stat budget, the new ones won't be better than what we already have (as we already have full concentration food and utils).
    In that case, what's the point even mentioning them? They won't be able to cover even a small fraction of the lost +23% boon duration from the sigil nerf.

    To be more precise: the best food available gives now 100 concentration (~7.5% boon duration), the best nourishment from 60 to 115 concentration (~4% to ~7.5% boon duration), depending on build used. If the new food/nourishment can't do better - and significantly better, then there's no way it can in any way help with the situation. At best they might end up being cheaper than the current choices, but they won't cover for the boon duration loss, and they won't help with sigil of concentration still being required. Which would make the change a clear and strict nerf.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • What about food that grants concentration after swap :D

  • Laila Lightness.8742Laila Lightness.8742 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    @eldrjth.7384 said:
    They could just adjust boon duration on the skills themselves rather than rely on a sigil to bring certain skills inline with the kind of boon uptime they have in mind. But that would require a balance patch to be done. I think I read a post somewhere that some on the lost of boon duration will be put back into traits too so no all of the difference will be lost.

    Also 100% boon duration cap doesnt actually mean 100% up time on a buff (sometimes more or less is required), and realistically theres no reason why it should cap off at 100% anyways since its not like like crit chance where all hits will crit at that point (also condition duration doesnt really have to cap off at 100% either). Beyond 100% boon duration would mean a boon will last more than twice the original duration.

    There is already some skills give one boon with less duratiin than another even with 100% . We could always take a herald with facet of nature

  • Klypto.1703Klypto.1703 Member ✭✭✭

    Unless there is some sigil or rune that makes renegade viable outside of pve I'm not really interested.

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2018

    @Kunzaito.8169 said:
    This may not be exactly the perfect place for this, but just to plant the seed: can we get a birthday gift one of these years that is an upgrade to the Birthday Blaster which gives a skill or skills to provide a generic utility buff to complement our generic food buff? Would be nice for those "don't wanna waste good food" moments, or helping out a group for pve stuff. Plus those empty 3-4-5 skills bug me. XD

    What do you do with the lunar newyear, halloween and wintersday food and utility stuff?

  • @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:
    Utilities, like most items, have a budget of attributes.

    Is that "budget" getting adapted tho? Like the best food I could imagine would just give us 5% more boon duration than what we have right now. At the same time we lose 23% boon duration. Or are you actively planning on removing 18% boon duration from Chronomancer just like that?

    This will be the death sentence for the already struggling condi Chrono. :( Build diversity is what we enjoy the most. Or will there be a rune or sigil that will help us out by only granting quickness / alacrity duration maybe? At this point I'd really take anything to not be forced to play one build with 0 impact aside from providing boons everywhere. We'd love to have more diversity, more condi Chrono, more Dueling, more Illusions, less Chaos, less forced Inspiration.

  • Kunzaito.8169Kunzaito.8169 Member ✭✭✭

    @Linken.6345 said:
    What do you do with the lunar newyear, halloween and wintersday food and utility stuff?

    LNY doesn't have any utility drops, just food. Halloween utility items are really only useful for large-scale pve where you expect to be rezzing people frequently. The Wintersday utility items are indeed nice, since they are functionally the same as a lv 80 stone/oil/crystal, but because of that they don't drop in big quantities and get used up soon enough.

    This would be an "ah, kitten, I ran out of stones" alternative, like the cakes are. Maybe something like +50 power, +50 concentration, +50 condition damage - something that would work out to be a 2-3% boost to each of those things, if you were to use a standard stone/oil/crystal, depending on your stats. (picking a single stat to boost off of as a percentage would probably not lead to good balance). So it offers a better-than-nothing option when you don't have (or don't want to waste) a buff, or want to be nice and boost your neighbors, with a little karma/xp on the side.

  • alchemist.6851alchemist.6851 Member ✭✭✭

    @Irenio CalmonHuang.2048 said:
    'allo Tyrians,
    I realized from your comments and feedback that one of the notes in today's blog gave the wrong impression and wanted to clarify/fix that.

    Toward the end of the blog we mention "adding a couple utility options". We did not mean sigil options (though quite a few are coming with the re-works). We meant utility buff options, also known as Enhancements).

    Sorry about that confusion.

    In the news post, it says there is sigil of vision. Does it completely replaces Sigil or intelligence or are they two different ?

  • Psientist.6437Psientist.6437 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2018

    My questions don't pertain to the "utility option". However this appears to me as a place where it is at least minimally appropriate to ask more general questions regarding the upcoming change.

    If BLTP salvage kits and Upgrade Extractors produce an upgrade, is it appropriate to assume, here at least, that we use upgrade as whole sigil or rune?

    My question will require some context. The production of runes and sigils is being separated into 2 clear work paths. This dos does depend on runes and sigils as upgrades. One path is 100% direct from 1 100% offering reward event to upgrade. The other path is diffused across a population of many nearly 100% rewards. I encourage using the broad Tyrian collection of activities to produce ingredients that would be used along with lucent motes, symbols and charms.

    The need for context becomes clear as the three-legged widget asks after the broader approach to upgrade binding. A third, or is it a fourth ingredient offers a diffused approach.

    edit: I would describe making the uniquely sixth upgrade account bound through a third reciped type as chordal.

    all primes work and not tearing down has value
    ready purrlayer @ any parsed feels enhance the value of something that is already worth everything
    what other chordal approach but penultimate singing along to quantum cuddle clocks

  • Lily.1935Lily.1935 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'm really curious as to how this will impact condi builds. As of right now a few professions need 2x trapper and 4x nightmare to get the duration they need to be effective. Which is not ideal, but it's what we got. It would be nice to have some complete rune sets that offer this much like the normalization of scholars runes.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'd rather they didn't try to "balance" that, because, based on past experience, we'd end up with a straight nerf (like what's already happening with Concentration).

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

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