do we need a passive lifesaver in rated SPvP — Guild Wars 2 Forums

do we need a passive lifesaver in rated SPvP

DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭

Self-Regulating Defenses
Defy Pain
Instant Reflexes
Stoneform
Final Shielding
Earth's Embrace
Last Gasp
etc...

do we need a passive lifesaver in rated SPvP 65 votes

Yes because
32%
Durzlla.6295Warscythes.9307Axl.8924Chaith.8256sephiroth.4217Arheundel.6451Mikezaner.1524zinkz.7045Coolguy.8702Jeknar.6184Falan.1839DerJoker.9081Yannir.4132Biguyshrooms.2051Chung.3420ollbirtan.2915LazySummer.2568Triggymash.9425Krieger.4712Pati.2438 21 votes
No because
67%
BlaqueFyre.5678Glider.5792Nimrod.9240Delweyn.1309FaboBabo.3581Fenrir Bartea.5917Rodzynald.5897Arkantos.7460Kumouta.4985Flumek.9043Simonoly.4352Slapinator.4196mortrialus.3062Raiden The Beast.3016otto.5684bigo.9037Zero.3871Highlie.7641apharma.3741Manimarco Devil.1790 44 votes

Comments

  • Vancho.8750Vancho.8750 Member ✭✭✭

    Really hard question on one side if these traits become ammunition and have 2 of these to use when you want, but there could be a lot of new one shot (kill in 1cc) builds and that wouldn't be fun for anyone. The other issue is that spvp has to change the traits fully but they are normally tied to WvW and there you open whole new can of worms.

  • No because

    .... yes ....

    Nerf is over the hill !

  • Yes because

    Because what else would you post complaint threads about constantly?

  • Falan.1839Falan.1839 Member ✭✭✭
    Yes because

    it would literally be oneshot fiesta otherwise with current bursty meta.

    Falásya / Caissech

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes because

    If the META is going to be bursty then yes.

    If it's going back to Hambow, Turret Engies, chronobunks and builds with sustain, then no.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion

  • Yes because

    If damage wasn't so overwhelming, life saving wouldn't seem so powerful.

  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes because

    @Chaith.8256 said:
    Yes because classes without instant defenses need burst protection.

    The classes that force passive lifesavers are the same ones advocating for it....amusing to say the least, would the burst dmg of the class you play be toned down, there would be no need for passive gameplay in pvp...ofc we would need to nerf all other insta burst dmg in game and that would never happen as it would send the pve playerbase in frenzy mode

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭
    No because

    All passive procs should be removed. No exceptions.

  • No because

    @otto.5684 said:
    All passive procs should be removed. No exceptions.

    Less passive carried baddies o/

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I’d prefer no passive life saving procs. Or really any passive procs. There are better design alternatives than these utilities.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭
    No because

    No, auto procs saving your bacon allow you to make mistakes and not be punished for them as severely as you should have been. If people are blowing up in half a second maybe that should be addressed as many classes are balanced around reducing damage and healing back up with sustain like ele, necro (through shroud), guardian and in some ways ranger though it's got far too many evades and kiting to have that now.

  • Sylosi.6503Sylosi.6503 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 27, 2018

    You got to laugh at this thread, only in a game with a playerbase as tragically bad as GW2 do you have players crying about passives like this going off every 60 secs or so, whilst the game passively aims for you. /facepalm

  • Durzlla.6295Durzlla.6295 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes because

    I’d say yes just because it gives you counterplay to getting instakilled by certain builds.

    However, I think that these abilities need to have a visual either on the players helthbar, or around the character themselves that shows they have this effect up so both them and their opponents can play around such an effect. Or to at least show when it’s on CD if they want to keep whether this particular warrior has defy pain a mystery.

    "But my children sing to me. Listen. They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family. As their mother, I have to grant them their wish."

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27, 2018
    No because

    Not really. I took defy and endure pain off of my war and was able to function pretty well.

    **Take that with a grain of salt though. **The existence of passive lifesavers affects people building glass builds by dissuading them from just funneling everything into instakills.
    If their build gets invalidated in the 2-3 seconds of passive immunity someone they planned to gank gets, most likely they will consider something more balanced in an effort to prevent (immediately die if your opponent slotted this trait.)

    With those passives gone, the threat of them maybe being slotted is gone, and we will probably see a resurgence of instagib builds, particularly thief builds.
    Passive lifesavers have their place in the meta. They may be obnoxious, but so are instant death builds.

    Should you learn to dodge? Yes.
    Should you be forced to play with no passives? I'd say yes, but we both know the community is going to lean hard into instant kill builds the moment there's no stopgaps.

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    Weird on how peep's complained on EM for making Mirage evade bursty CC one shot's. But when it comes to there own class it's like -Oh no..we be so vulnerable to be one shoted ourselves. We can't have that! Do what mirage did, L2dodge...

    Adorably cheeky how you imply that Mirages have to learn to dodge. Not new material, but cheeky nonetheless.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • Jeknar.6184Jeknar.6184 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes because

    Damage is way too high and there are quite a few builds that will burst you even before you can react without those.

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  • coro.3176coro.3176 Member ✭✭✭
    No because

    @Chaith.8256 said:
    Yes because classes without instant defenses need burst protection.

    I would argue that protection should be dodging. If a burst or cc can't be dodged or otherwise reacted to (eg. moving out of the hit area) but is powerful enough to burst someone for a significant amount of their health, that's a problem with the skill.

  • Chaith.8256Chaith.8256 Member ✭✭✭✭
    Yes because

    @coro.3176 said:

    @Chaith.8256 said:
    Yes because classes without instant defenses need burst protection.

    I would argue that protection should be dodging. If a burst or cc can't be dodged or otherwise reacted to (eg. moving out of the hit area) but is powerful enough to burst someone for a significant amount of their health, that's a problem with the skill.

    One problem with that philosophy is that there are plenty of skills that are capable of doing a significant amount of enemy health %, but when you combine them with offensive stealth, teleports, or both, this totally prevents any reaction in time. Many classes are way better at landing consistent, easy, fast bursts with teleports & stealths than others.

    Random dodging is not the protection that is needed, it's child's play for some classes to burst from a far distance, at any time.

    Again, I don't feel that all the defenses that slower classes have should necessarily be passive, but they need equally strong defenses in place.

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  • coro.3176coro.3176 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 27, 2018
    No because

    @Chaith.8256 said:

    @coro.3176 said:

    @Chaith.8256 said:
    Yes because classes without instant defenses need burst protection.

    I would argue that protection should be dodging. If a burst or cc can't be dodged or otherwise reacted to (eg. moving out of the hit area) but is powerful enough to burst someone for a significant amount of their health, that's a problem with the skill.

    One problem with that philosophy is that there are plenty of skills that are capable of doing a significant amount of enemy health %, but when you combine them with offensive stealth, teleports, or both, this totally prevents any reaction in time. Many classes are way better at landing consistent, easy, fast bursts with teleports & stealths than others.

    Random dodging is not the protection that is needed, it's child's play for some classes to burst from a far distance, at any time.

    Again, I don't feel that all the defenses that slower classes have should necessarily be passive, but they need equally strong defenses in place.

    It's true, and I'd rather those combinations be tuned than keep passive lifesavers around, but it probably is just easier to keep the passives.. It just really sucks having my first Magnet canceled by a passive cc-break every. single. time., or my condi ticking proccing a passive lifesaver every. single. time. giving my opponent the advantage in the fight.

    A teleporting instant unblockable cc-ing burst is bad no matter how you slice it. IMO skills ought to be designed with counterplay in mind with consideration to how they can interact with the rest of the class' abilities as well as sigil/rune options.

    .. but yeah, probably easier to keep the passives...

  • No because

    No, because you don't need passives to survive instant burst. You need good awareness and good positioning.

  • I mean does it really have to be a yes/no question though? Why not adjusted it so its in a median/compromised ground.

    Ofc threshold/amount will need adjustments but if it goes like "Xs Protection at 75%" or "X amount Barrier at 50%" then it can be overcomed if attacker puts a little more effort, while not making complete damage immunity for a period of time. As far as general PvP concerns nowadays not many people complain about Ele's final shielding because it only blocks 3 attacks (and not many eles anyway).

    [RED] Crimson Sunspears...your small family guild since 2015.

  • Flumek.9043Flumek.9043 Member ✭✭✭
    No because

    No.

    But need to nerf damage, CC and healing by 30-50% next patch too. Doesnt matter if its 1shot FPS meta for a while, the game is trash anyway.

  • No because

    @otto.5684 said:
    All passive procs should be removed. No exceptions.

    cant agree more
    nerf isnt the solution here remove is way better
    specialty something as offensive as chill of death
    and that coming from a necro main

  • For as long as there can be 1s bursts from instant teleport or stealth, those are needed there.

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 29, 2018
    No because

    @Flumek.9043 said:
    No.

    But need to nerf damage, CC and healing by 30-50% next patch too. Doesnt matter if its 1shot FPS meta for a while, the game is trash anyway.

    Found the scourge

    EDIT: Holy kitten I was right lmao

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    IT's been said before & it's been said now. Passives that proc's especially for defensive reasons makes poor players with poor skill's.
    & it's been said before & said now. Make them passives clickable skill's or just remove them all.
    & any players saying it's fine & well balance is completely delusional.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Yes because

    cause if we dont have them there would be more power creep in meta than now.And nowdays it is a near oneshot meta

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 29, 2018

    @Pati.2438 said:
    cause if we dont have them there would be more power creep in meta than now.And nowdays it is a near oneshot meta

    It can't be more power creep then power creep played in the meta now...
    If so,... give me an example on how more power creep can it be?
    All you players voting YES are just excusing lazy playing for lazy wins instead of actual skill base playing. & worst part, Most of you love to trash talk peeps too get good when you got them downed.... A lot!

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 30, 2018
    No because

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Pati.2438 said:
    cause if we dont have them there would be more power creep in meta than now.And nowdays it is a near oneshot meta

    It can't be more power creep then power creep played in the meta now...
    If so,... give me an example on how more power creep can it be?
    All you players voting YES are just excusing lazy playing for lazy wins instead of actual skill base playing. & worst part, Most of you love to trash talk peeps too get good when you got them downed.... A lot!

    I am really glad to see players in gw2 who have the same thought and vision in regards for SPvP as mine

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