Arcane Abatement and other trait concerns — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Arcane Abatement and other trait concerns

The bottom minor trait in the Arcane traitline is a fall damage trait that also heals for ~300 every time you switch attunements (so, at max, ~100 HPS).

Was this trait missed or something? It looks like every classes' 'on fall damage' traits have gotten the 'but also on heal use' treatment - mesmer's Chaos storm, and ESPECIALLY Ranger's mud...field...thingy, which is extremely strong to the point where I'm kinda expecting it to be nerfed soon.

Any chance Arcane Abatement can get the same treatment? The heal's value rounds down to zero in any realistic situation and it's just...plain weaker than the other options, not to mention the consistency issue across other traits of the same type.

It's also a tad painful that Ranger has Bountiful Hunter as a MINOR trait in Nature Magic (1% dmg per boon), whereas Arcane has Bountiful Power (2% dmg per boon) as a GM trait. Double a rather small number is still a pretty small number, especially considering that Arcane's boon generation/potential has kinda...fallen off lately in comparison to the competition. Arcane in general is a bit of a mess - Elemental Surge has the 20% utility skill reduction in GM where most traitlines have the CD reduction in the 1st or 2nd line of options.

I'm not even quite sure how to suggest changes, as I can't really discern what Anet's intent for each trait was - like how Weaver's GM traits are (from top down) - offensive power, utility/mobility, and defensive.

Arcane GMs is a bit of a mishmash of everything with no clear goal, imo, a problem that the rest of the traits also suffer from to some degree.

@Gaile Gray.6029 TLDR please make Arcane Abatement more in-line with other traits of the same type on different classes. Bonus points for considering some minor Arcane changes (maybe even an elite skill?) :D

Happy Holidays o/

Comments

  • MyPuppy.8970MyPuppy.8970 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Best trait is Arcane precision : 33% chance on 55% crit chance (amulet with 1050 precision, without fury, or trait buff) 10s icd.
    Even with 100% crit chance you'd have only 33% chance.

    What part of it is actually precise? It's total randomness. Would be best rename it Arcane Lucky hit.

  • Zunki.3916Zunki.3916 Member ✭✭✭

    @MyPuppy.8970 said:
    Best trait is Arcane precision : 33% chance on 55% crit chance (amulet with 1050 precision, without fury, or trait buff) 10s icd.
    Even with 100% crit chance you'd have only 33% chance.

    What part of it is actually precise? It's total randomness. Would be best rename it Arcane Lucky hit.

    @MyPuppy.8970 said:
    Best trait is Arcane precision : 33% chance on 55% crit chance (amulet with 1050 precision, without fury, or trait buff) 10s icd.
    Even with 100% crit chance you'd have only 33% chance.

    What part of it is actually precise? It's total randomness. Would be best rename it Arcane Lucky hit.

    Yeah the traits dps increase is rather low and this 33% off crits is so 2012 that it's getting obvious the rework is needed here... Is it really op to give it 100% on crits? Really?

    Viable != Optimal

    Not viable = You only get carried, 10 players with a build as "viable as yours" can't properly do it.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The trait is actually pretty decent, I was using it on a core ele build a while back as it's basically a 1.2k+ heal every rotation while allowing you to take falls that would kill other players. Having it scale more with healing power would be nice, I'm thinking 0.1 scaling would be a nice place, 500-1000 healing power gives you 50-100 extra on swap. When you stack this with regen, soothing mists, healing ripple, cleansing wave and signet of restoration it's a lot of sustain.

    The biggest issue is lacking vigor if you pick this trait. As you can see from the build, you only get vigor from the cantrips and being hit in water so it's hard to maintain good vigor uptime without renewing stamina and in such a burst and high damage meta scaling defence > healing vs other meta builds. Switching to cleansing fire means you'll pretty much always have vigor and is nice vs condition builds but the hard mitigation of mist form is too useful imo.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFEQJAoYhcMozhFOwyB0RM0AY0OoG8DkAZAIGWHyb4UA-jVyHQBhb/BAcCAcnqKdTLgCVC2O1KcjOglo8LfPAASBw5yI-w

    I know someone will say how do you deal with pew pews, ring of earth for the most part, it's spammable and blocks projectiles long after it's used. Think it's about 2s block but the build also works with focus now magnetic leap is so good.

  • Jski.6180Jski.6180 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It realty should be soft cc not condi dmg. So chill cripal vuabitly and weakness? Condi dmg dose not fit on arcain line at all.

  • Curennos.9307Curennos.9307 Member ✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:
    The trait is actually pretty decent, I was using it on a core ele build a while back as it's basically a 1.2k+ heal every rotation while allowing you to take falls that would kill other players. Having it scale more with healing power would be nice, I'm thinking 0.1 scaling would be a nice place, 500-1000 healing power gives you 50-100 extra on swap. When you stack this with regen, soothing mists, healing ripple, cleansing wave and signet of restoration it's a lot of sustain.

    The biggest issue is lacking vigor if you pick this trait. As you can see from the build, you only get vigor from the cantrips and being hit in water so it's hard to maintain good vigor uptime without renewing stamina and in such a burst and high damage meta scaling defence > healing vs other meta builds. Switching to cleansing fire means you'll pretty much always have vigor and is nice vs condition builds but the hard mitigation of mist form is too useful imo.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFEQJAoYhcMozhFOwyB0RM0AY0OoG8DkAZAIGWHyb4UA-jVyHQBhb/BAcCAcnqKdTLgCVC2O1KcjOglo8LfPAASBw5yI-w

    I know someone will say how do you deal with pew pews, ring of earth for the most part, it's spammable and blocks projectiles long after it's used. Think it's about 2s block but the build also works with focus now magnetic leap is so good.

    It's only decent if you compare it to, well...other things ele has. And ele, (imo), doesn't really have good stuff to compare that trait to.

    If you look at it when compared to other classes, then it's lack of strength becomes more obvious - see my OP and mention of other classes' on-fall dmg traits.

    And yes, you can stack it with Ele's other sources of overtime healing, but that doesn't mean it isn't weak. I think that mentioning it stacking with 5 other things should speak to the relative weakness of the trait.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a total garbage trait and should be nuked or something -just to clarify that in case I was unclear earlier.

    I am totally behind buffing the heal a little, too.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Curennos.9307 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    The trait is actually pretty decent, I was using it on a core ele build a while back as it's basically a 1.2k+ heal every rotation while allowing you to take falls that would kill other players. Having it scale more with healing power would be nice, I'm thinking 0.1 scaling would be a nice place, 500-1000 healing power gives you 50-100 extra on swap. When you stack this with regen, soothing mists, healing ripple, cleansing wave and signet of restoration it's a lot of sustain.

    The biggest issue is lacking vigor if you pick this trait. As you can see from the build, you only get vigor from the cantrips and being hit in water so it's hard to maintain good vigor uptime without renewing stamina and in such a burst and high damage meta scaling defence > healing vs other meta builds. Switching to cleansing fire means you'll pretty much always have vigor and is nice vs condition builds but the hard mitigation of mist form is too useful imo.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFEQJAoYhcMozhFOwyB0RM0AY0OoG8DkAZAIGWHyb4UA-jVyHQBhb/BAcCAcnqKdTLgCVC2O1KcjOglo8LfPAASBw5yI-w

    I know someone will say how do you deal with pew pews, ring of earth for the most part, it's spammable and blocks projectiles long after it's used. Think it's about 2s block but the build also works with focus now magnetic leap is so good.

    It's only decent if you compare it to, well...other things ele has. And ele, (imo), doesn't really have good stuff to compare that trait to.

    If you look at it when compared to other classes, then it's lack of strength becomes more obvious - see my OP and mention of other classes' on-fall dmg traits.

    And yes, you can stack it with Ele's other sources of overtime healing, but that doesn't mean it isn't weak. I think that mentioning it stacking with 5 other things should speak to the relative weakness of the trait.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a total garbage trait and should be nuked or something -just to clarify that in case I was unclear earlier.

    I am totally behind buffing the heal a little, too.

    Thing is all the sources are from 2 trait lines and 1 skill, 1 mandatory to run the arcane abatement and the second almost mandatory to run in and of itself for cleansing and sustain while the heal is extremely common to use though you really could use any heal.

    I keep saying this and I'll keep saying it. The issue isn't with ele being weak, the issue is that everything has been dialled up to 17 when ele went from a 12 to a 14 with PoF.

    It's not just me that shares this opinion, over 200 votes and I hope more people take the time to give ANet the feedback.

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/63078/is-damage-too-high/p1

  • Curennos.9307Curennos.9307 Member ✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Curennos.9307 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    The trait is actually pretty decent, I was using it on a core ele build a while back as it's basically a 1.2k+ heal every rotation while allowing you to take falls that would kill other players. Having it scale more with healing power would be nice, I'm thinking 0.1 scaling would be a nice place, 500-1000 healing power gives you 50-100 extra on swap. When you stack this with regen, soothing mists, healing ripple, cleansing wave and signet of restoration it's a lot of sustain.

    The biggest issue is lacking vigor if you pick this trait. As you can see from the build, you only get vigor from the cantrips and being hit in water so it's hard to maintain good vigor uptime without renewing stamina and in such a burst and high damage meta scaling defence > healing vs other meta builds. Switching to cleansing fire means you'll pretty much always have vigor and is nice vs condition builds but the hard mitigation of mist form is too useful imo.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFEQJAoYhcMozhFOwyB0RM0AY0OoG8DkAZAIGWHyb4UA-jVyHQBhb/BAcCAcnqKdTLgCVC2O1KcjOglo8LfPAASBw5yI-w

    I know someone will say how do you deal with pew pews, ring of earth for the most part, it's spammable and blocks projectiles long after it's used. Think it's about 2s block but the build also works with focus now magnetic leap is so good.

    It's only decent if you compare it to, well...other things ele has. And ele, (imo), doesn't really have good stuff to compare that trait to.

    If you look at it when compared to other classes, then it's lack of strength becomes more obvious - see my OP and mention of other classes' on-fall dmg traits.

    And yes, you can stack it with Ele's other sources of overtime healing, but that doesn't mean it isn't weak. I think that mentioning it stacking with 5 other things should speak to the relative weakness of the trait.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a total garbage trait and should be nuked or something -just to clarify that in case I was unclear earlier.

    I am totally behind buffing the heal a little, too.

    Thing is all the sources are from 2 trait lines and 1 skill, 1 mandatory to run the arcane abatement and the second almost mandatory to run in and of itself for cleansing and sustain while the heal is extremely common to use though you really could use any heal.

    I keep saying this and I'll keep saying it. The issue isn't with ele being weak, the issue is that everything has been dialled up to 17 when ele went from a 12 to a 14 with PoF.

    It's not just me that shares this opinion, over 200 votes and I hope more people take the time to give ANet the feedback.

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/63078/is-damage-too-high/p1

    What're the chances of Anet nerfing everything else so ele can do stuff again vs the chances of ele getting some buffs, though?

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Curennos.9307 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Curennos.9307 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    The trait is actually pretty decent, I was using it on a core ele build a while back as it's basically a 1.2k+ heal every rotation while allowing you to take falls that would kill other players. Having it scale more with healing power would be nice, I'm thinking 0.1 scaling would be a nice place, 500-1000 healing power gives you 50-100 extra on swap. When you stack this with regen, soothing mists, healing ripple, cleansing wave and signet of restoration it's a lot of sustain.

    The biggest issue is lacking vigor if you pick this trait. As you can see from the build, you only get vigor from the cantrips and being hit in water so it's hard to maintain good vigor uptime without renewing stamina and in such a burst and high damage meta scaling defence > healing vs other meta builds. Switching to cleansing fire means you'll pretty much always have vigor and is nice vs condition builds but the hard mitigation of mist form is too useful imo.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFEQJAoYhcMozhFOwyB0RM0AY0OoG8DkAZAIGWHyb4UA-jVyHQBhb/BAcCAcnqKdTLgCVC2O1KcjOglo8LfPAASBw5yI-w

    I know someone will say how do you deal with pew pews, ring of earth for the most part, it's spammable and blocks projectiles long after it's used. Think it's about 2s block but the build also works with focus now magnetic leap is so good.

    It's only decent if you compare it to, well...other things ele has. And ele, (imo), doesn't really have good stuff to compare that trait to.

    If you look at it when compared to other classes, then it's lack of strength becomes more obvious - see my OP and mention of other classes' on-fall dmg traits.

    And yes, you can stack it with Ele's other sources of overtime healing, but that doesn't mean it isn't weak. I think that mentioning it stacking with 5 other things should speak to the relative weakness of the trait.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a total garbage trait and should be nuked or something -just to clarify that in case I was unclear earlier.

    I am totally behind buffing the heal a little, too.

    Thing is all the sources are from 2 trait lines and 1 skill, 1 mandatory to run the arcane abatement and the second almost mandatory to run in and of itself for cleansing and sustain while the heal is extremely common to use though you really could use any heal.

    I keep saying this and I'll keep saying it. The issue isn't with ele being weak, the issue is that everything has been dialled up to 17 when ele went from a 12 to a 14 with PoF.

    It's not just me that shares this opinion, over 200 votes and I hope more people take the time to give ANet the feedback.

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/63078/is-damage-too-high/p1

    What're the chances of Anet nerfing everything else so ele can do stuff again vs the chances of ele getting some buffs, though?

    Look at the poll, it's not a small difference in opinion, it's a landslide saying damage is too high with plenty of people stating everything is too high. Most people I know are sick of the direction PoF took the game with power creep, prominent streamers are also repeating the same stance that everything is too spammy and everything is over the top. The only place where the message is in any way muddied is the forums but then if you look at most people who post, calling them dumb would be an insult to people with learning disabilities and the worst of these is are in the ele forum bar none.

    If ANet won't tone everything down people will stop playing. You can't have not noticed the increased amount of people logging in less and less ever since HoT and even more so with PoF and sooner or later people lose faith and leave altogether.

  • rng.1024rng.1024 Member ✭✭✭✭

    You get 4 different skills with individual cooldowns, which is alot more than the other professions get (which is usually 20 second icd).

    To boot, you get a decent (like life steal) amount of health by using your profession mechanic and helps a ton with your sustain if you run glassy builds. But like stated above it competes with another decent trait, so while I agree it should scale more on healingpower to aid supports, this is one of the better traits atm.

  • lLobo.7960lLobo.7960 Member ✭✭✭

    @Jski.6180 said:
    It realty should be soft cc not condi dmg. So chill cripal vuabitly and weakness? Condi dmg dose not fit on arcain line at all.

    I disagree. Condi dmg is very proeminent on fire/arcane.
    Fire/arcane/tempest was the best condi dps for ele for a while, using arcane precision with elemental surge for tons of burns.
    Other conditions (chill/vulnerability/weakness) also have their place in those traits, with other attunements, but fire in arcane line is all about that burn dmg.

  • Arcan trait line is legendary...... legendary joke. If someone want to tell me that my "super" arcan precision gives me some noticeable condi dmg ... I can only smile then :)
    /It's only little example/.
    And - which make me really sad - I deeply feel that nothing will change. Elementalists always will be d... in a... of our friendly smiling DEVs. To be honest I really can't understand why it's like that. We have no armor (toughness), the lowest health point..... hehe and the middle damage. What is going on with that class. And then DEVs really don't see any problem with that. "everything is fine, what is wrong with you?" - sometimes personnaly I feel that they want to tell us such words. But still I'm too addicted to my elementalist to through him simply. And what left for me....? dreaming... that someday - who knows - DEVs will notice existing of elementalists. To "that day" many of elementalists have to suffer and try to not give up.

    I feel like Boon Master. No! Wait! I'm elementalist...

  • kornfanxxx.9143kornfanxxx.9143 Member ✭✭
    edited January 27, 2019

    ArcDPS estimates that arcane abatement accounts for approx 4-5% of my total healing while in full cele, & closer to 7-9% healing while in a marshal heavy build. I also believe the trait procs an additional heal from signet of restoration as well, for a total of 1 heal from healing ripple, 1 heal from arcane abatement, 2 from signet of restoration, & then you could count the initial ticks from soothing mist & regen as well if you'd like. its not a terrible trait.

    Edit: figured I'd give some numbers to show why I like the trait (Full Cele/834 healing power )

    This is what procs when i enter water attunement:

    Healing ripple: 2136
    arcane abatement: 372
    Signet of restoration: 285 (x2)
    regeneration initial tick: 232
    Soothing mist Initial tick: 163

    total: 3,473 HP heal, swapping into water.

    all those smaller heals add up to a meatier heal.

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